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Quote:
The problem is that I'm not sure he comes out this year. He's a junior and why would any junior come out in this draft if the labor dispute isn't resolved? they could potentially force themselves to sit out a year (and without $$$ as the draft would occur but no contracts would be signed).
One way to get Luck out of there in a hurry is if Harbaugh is hired away to the NFL. He is one of the big reasons that Luck wanted to go to Stanford in the first place since he's a renowned QB guru so if he leaves, I imagine Luck will leave as well.
We're... we're good?
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Legend
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If you want to go by who was dominant in college we have the winningest college QB in history already on the roster... 
that's true but then again, neither of those players could even win the Heisman.
heck, in VY's year, they didn't even bother to hand it out 
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Let me know when dominance in college at the QB position actually means something 
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Dawsons missed field goal would of had us up a point.. That was`nt fromt he QB`s arm...
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Dawsons missed field goal would of had us up a point.. That was`nt fromt he QB`s arm...
If the AWFUL throw on the pick 6 hadn't been made, we would have been up 6 points. That was from the QB's arm.
Face it. We're 0-2, and if it wasn't for two BONEHEADED throws by TWO DIFFERENT QB's, we'd be 2-0 right now.
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True to a point..some things come to mind....Offensive line...Wide Receivers....Running game...Play calling...
How many QB`s have failed with this team? And we can discuss the facts that it was the coaches fault... the talent around the QB... or the QB himself..
Like talking Politics and Religion... Im right your wrong....LOL..J/k.. U know...
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You are on to something with Matt Flynn. I was watching a preseason game with the pack, might have been against the browns- can't remember for sure. Anyways, the announcers thought he was the best 2nd string QB in the league and better then many starters. They were quite high on him. It seems like he can make all of the throws and he has sat behind a solid QB with no chance to play except for an injury to Rogers. It would be nice to see Rogers miss a game (though this would screw up fantasy football)- just to see how Flynn responds to regular season action. With potentially three quality QB's coming out this year- i am curious how many teams would really be in the market for one. Buffalo, Jacksonville, Cleveland, Minnesota, Oakland maybe, Arizona, Seattle maybe. In my opinion, that seems to round out the list. the rest either have a young QB that may not develop, but need to ride it out a bit longer or a veteran that has proven they can win. Not saying we should just tank the season, but i think the schedule kinds of works out that way. If the browns make a play for Flynn- i would be open to trading down and picking up picks. Kind of sad thinking draft already 
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Legend
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Legend
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j/c Hindsight warning! Anybody else feel we'd be 2-0 or at least 1-1 if Gradkowski were still on the team?
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Depends.. Are you saying we could put him in a better situation... Then the Raiders can ?
I understand he`s been good with making decisions ..But that is with the Raiders..Big Question would be the fit...
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Browns will be average with good-to-great players or horrible with decent-to-good players with no QB. You CANNOT consistently win in the NFL without a big time QB unless you have a once in a decade defense
The days of Joe Smo leading a team to a SB on the back of a defense are over....points win with opportunistic defense
I'm coming home, I'm coming home, tell the world I'm coming home
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Dawg Talker
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Quote:
If you want to go by who was dominant in college we have the winningest college QB in history already on the roster...
We clearly made a huge mistake in allowing Ken Dorsey to leave! 
Last edited by 4yikes2yoshi0; 09/21/10 12:32 AM.
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i dont know about that...
look at last years Jets...look at the 49ers in recent years (yea they havent won in the playoffs, but they contend every year now and they dont have a legit QB)...
If you can get to the playoffs you have a chance, and good defenses get to the playoffs then you can get it done when you get there by not making mistakes.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Legend
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True, but the path to GET to the playoffs is a lot easier when you have above-average QB-ing.
Forget guys like Manning, Brees, Rodgers and Brady... I'd at least like a QB in the Philip Rivers/Big Ben mould. Apparently that's too much to ask for Browns fans.
With all the QBs coming out of college next April, I wonder if we'll see Colt at all this year to see "what we have" (no, I'm not lobbying for it, just asking).
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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I'm not sure how good of an example the Jets and 49ers are to prove your point.
The Jets have one of the best all-around teams in the NFL (#1 defense and #1 rushing game last year), yet are an average 8-8 team if the Colts don't rest their starters at the end of the year (Bengals did as well, but the Jets handled them soundly enough in the playoffs).
The 49ers haven't contended for anything since Jeff Garcia was playing for them at a pro-bowl level. Looking around in their division though, the other 3 teams have all been to the super bowl due in no small part to high level QB play (Warner with the Rams and Cardinals, Hasselbeck with the Seahawks).
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Quote:
True, but the path to GET to the playoffs is a lot easier when you have above-average QB-ing.
Forget guys like Manning, Brees, Rodgers and Brady... I'd at least like a QB in the Philip Rivers/Big Ben mould. Apparently that's too much to ask for Browns fans.
With all the QBs coming out of college next April, I wonder if we'll see Colt at all this year to see "what we have" (no, I'm not lobbying for it, just asking).
I agree, but asking for a Philip Rivers type is honestly a lot to ask for. He has put up better numbers than Peyton the last two years who somehow luckboxed his way into two MVPs. But that's a different story
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Take Phillip Rivers off San Diego, they are still a good football team. Take Peyton Manning off Indianpolis and they are a 2-3 win team. That's how Peyton Manning got his two MVP's If the MVP was TRULY the Most Valuable Player to his team, no one would EVER win it other than Peyton Manning...
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Take Phillip Rivers off San Diego, they are still a good football team.
Take Peyton Manning off Indianpolis and they are a 2-3 win team.
That's how Peyton Manning got his two MVP's
If the MVP was TRULY the Most Valuable Player to his team, no one would EVER win it other than Peyton Manning...
I agree - will be quite interesting to see what that team looks like post-Manning era.
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It's kind of crazy when you think about the numbers... 32 NFL teams 32 NFL starting QBs 307,006,550 people in the US* In the entire US population, we need to find 32 guys that can play the QB position and you simply cannot do that. There's 5-10 people alive right now that can perform this job at a high level. It's just crazy when you think about that - so few can play this position at a high level in existence today. You can argue that just about any other position has more than a handful that can perform this job but only at QB do see such a shortage. Which I guess stresses why you have to hit a homerun in the draft and why teams constantly take QB prospects at the top - the fact is, there's so few that might be able to do it and even fewer that actually can. * data
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Take Phillip Rivers off San Diego, they are still a good football team.
Take Peyton Manning off Indianpolis and they are a 2-3 win team.
That's how Peyton Manning got his two MVP's
If the MVP was TRULY the Most Valuable Player to his team, no one would EVER win it other than Peyton Manning...
I wasn't saying that Rivers should have won it the last two years, just making a point on how underrated he is.
Last year's MVP was Drew Brees (and that's just the regular season). He had a QB rating 10 points higher than Manning, who wasn't even in the top 5.
Yes I understand that Manning had some comeback wins and unbelievable media hype and all that. And his team started 14-0, but the Saints started 13-0. Not that it really matters because 2 seasons ago Manning also won it when his team was a wild-card that got bounced in the first round.
Take away Drew Brees off the Saints, Rivers off the Chargers, Manning off the Colts, etc., and none of those teams are super bowl contenders. Not even close. I think most people just get caught up so much in the Manning media love that they don't realize how much *ALL* high-end QBs help their team.
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When have the 49ers contended? lol
Their best record in the past 8 years (counting this year, when they are off to an 0-2 start) is 8-8.
They reside in a HORRIBLE division. The get to play the Seahawks and Rams twice ... along with the Cardinals who have talent, but are inconsistent.
I bet that you could make the Browns a 8-7 team just by putting them in the NFC West.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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With all the QBs coming out of college next April, I wonder if we'll see Colt at all this year to see "what we have" (no, I'm not lobbying for it, just asking).
If we end up 0-8, 0-12 - somewhere in there, my bet is we do see McCoy. For the exact reason you allude to.
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If I was McCoy, I'd run for the hills at that point.
If we want to "test" McCoy, then put him in now. It's the same mistake that was made with Quinn -- who WAS drafted to be a franchisee -- but held out.
I don't believe CM was drafted to be The Franchise,...he is an experiment to possibly find a low-round-Brady.
What happens when Wallace gets hurt ?
I'm hearing JD is "feeling better." What does that mean ? Wasn't he just a Band-Aid anyway ?
Playing McCoy now wouldn't break my heart.
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I totally agree with you, I'm tired of year after year with two or three quarterbacks at the helm and finishing 5-11. We need a quarterback desperately and until then we'll never smell the playoffs. I think a guy like Ryan Mallett would be perfect, he's 6-6 and has a cannon, unfortunately i felt the same way about DA.
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Legend
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he's 6-6 and has a cannon, unfortunately i felt the same way about DA.
Yeah, and we got to see that same cannon on every deep pass, medium pass, and screen pass.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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You are on to something with Matt Flynn. I was watching a preseason game with the pack, might have been against the browns- can't remember for sure. Anyways, the announcers thought he was the best 2nd string QB in the league and better then many starters. They were quite high on him. It seems like he can make all of the throws and he has sat behind a solid QB with no chance to play except for an injury to Rogers. It would be nice to see Rogers miss a game (though this would screw up fantasy football)- just to see how Flynn responds to regular season action.
With potentially three quality QB's coming out this year- i am curious how many teams would really be in the market for one. Buffalo, Jacksonville, Cleveland, Minnesota, Oakland maybe, Arizona, Seattle maybe. In my opinion, that seems to round out the list. the rest either have a young QB that may not develop, but need to ride it out a bit longer or a veteran that has proven they can win.
Not saying we should just tank the season, but i think the schedule kinds of works out that way. If the browns make a play for Flynn- i would be open to trading down and picking up picks.
Kind of sad thinking draft already
Bigf00t you just made my day! I am glad to see someone else here who sees what I see out of Matt Flynn (An above average NFL quality Starting QB)
This team "should" make a run for Flynn this offseason...i would take Matt Flynn over ANY QB coming out of the NFL Draft this year...Flynn will be a good QB when he gets his chance to play...
We may be able to get Flynn for a 2nd or 3rd..or a 3rd and a player/swap of picks...Flynn will not cost us nearly as much in terms of a high draft pick and money a 1st rd drafted QB will...and I bet we get simliar if not better production.
I think our best plan is:
1. Get Flynn (he isn't a stop gap, he is a starter to build around)
2. Add more pieces to the D via Draft and FA
3. Fix the Right side of the OL
4. Add another receiver
we do that...things will start looking up...and the following year we may actually really be able to talk about playoffs...I see Flynn like Schaub..he is a good QB..good enough to win game with..the kid can make every throw, he is young, and he has had the privledge to sit behind Rogers and actually see what a Pro Bowl Qb actually does.
Whatever team takes a chance and trades for Flynn (hopefully us) will get themselves a real gem....
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Quote:
I'm not sure how good of an example the Jets and 49ers are to prove your point.
The Jets have one of the best all-around teams in the NFL (#1 defense and #1 rushing game last year), yet are an average 8-8 team if the Colts don't rest their starters at the end of the year (Bengals did as well, but the Jets handled them soundly enough in the playoffs).
The 49ers haven't contended for anything since Jeff Garcia was playing for them at a pro-bowl level. Looking around in their division though, the other 3 teams have all been to the super bowl due in no small part to high level QB play (Warner with the Rams and Cardinals, Hasselbeck with the Seahawks).
The Jets also were desperate to trade up to get their QB.
Whether or not he becomes a franchise QB remains to be seen.
But the bottom line is we need to keep trying until we hit on one. Money and high draft picks tied into QB's be damned, we have to get it done.
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The Jets also were desperate to trade up to get their QB.
Whether or not he becomes a franchise QB remains to be seen.
But the bottom line is we need to keep trying until we hit on one. Money and high draft picks tied into QB's be damned, we have to get it done.
I am not disagreeing with you on the need for a QB...I just don't feel its our biggest priority right now...I don't believe our Qb are as "bad" as they have looked.
QB can only be as good as the players that are around them..the Qb can't catch his own throws..
our WR are not very good...Jamal Lewis and Droughns were our last 1,000 yard rushers...the right-side of our OL is a sieve(putting it nicely, St. Claire anyone)
This team lacks talent at key positions (WR, RB, RT, and possibly RG depending on if Lavaman pans out) So we really don't tell for certain how good or how bad things are until we fix those 3 positions...not to mention our D Front 7...we need a consistent pass rush and a Hammer in the middle.
I really don't feel drafting a QB is going to change anything until we fix the RB, RT, and WR spots..folks can pump Jerome Harrison and Hillis up all they want, but until either one of those guys sniffs or surpasses at least 1,000 yards rushing (which is mediocre in a 16 game schedule) or 1,200 +(bona fide RB) then we don't have a RB
How did Phil Simms say it: "when you got 3 Qb you really don't have one"..the same is true of our RB..we don't have a proven RB...you have to sniff that 1100 to 1200 yard mark before your taken seriously...and Harrison and Hillis haven't came close in their careers and may never do it.
If we do end up drafting a QB..I guess we will ahve to live with it, and I hope it works out...i just don't think its the best course to go...you ahve to put a QB in a situation where has has players around him to make him successful and we don't have that.
At least Tim Couch had Kevin Johnson...we got NO ONE...I would take KJ over any of these bums we march out at WR....and thats sad...
Now if we trade for Kolb or Flynn, great..and if we used our 1st on a WR or RB..i'd understand..but im really hoping for Front 7 help....big time...we need it..
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The importance of the QB position.
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