DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Winslow Recovery will Take Months

wow, Pats just full of good news today isn't he....

I've got a pretty messed up knee - 4 surgeries so far, one being nerve based. 3 of these 4 have had micro-fracture as part of the procedure. While my knee is still messed up, I'm able to do anything I want. I run a lot and play competitive volleyball at least once a week - thats a heck of a lot of pounding and I'm about 15 years older that Kellen without the resources he has.

That being said, he'll be fine unless either he can't deal with pain or there is more there than they're letting us know.

Crazy thread.

I came to two conclusions:

1. I hope K2 recovers. The Browns need him.

2. Total package: 32 out of 32 GMs take K2 over Droughns. And so would I.

Yup

If it was June or July, I'd be concerned, but's it's late february almost early March, I just glad he didnt wait like some players ya see...

I have a bad feeling about this.

That knee has gone through an awful lot of trauma.

It's possible he does not emerge from this even as good as he was last year.

I would not be surprised to be reading an article a few months from now that says the recovery is not going as well as expected.

Maybe I've just grown pessimistic. It's hard not be when you're a Browns fan.

Well, golly gee.

Lookie what we have here.

I was calling for Winslow to go on the IR and have surgery once we were certain we were out of the play-offs.

All of the football "geniuses" on this board argued with me.

That's the main reason I rarely post in Pure Football.....I just read.

All of these self-proclaimed "I coached pee-wee" football gurus don't know their ass from a rat hole.

I don't claim to know all that there is about football, but I also don't pretend that I do on the internet.

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Crazy thread.

I came to two conclusions:

1. I hope K2 recovers. The Browns need him.

2. Total package: 32 out of 32 GMs take K2 over Droughns. And so would I.

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Excellent reply.

Character? I've met quite a few pro atheletes in my time, and high character was not even a thought when considering their talent and accomplishments.

Most of the younger guys I've met in recent years have all been cocky. These guys in this thread talking about character, as if it matters when the whistle blows IMo are rediculous. KW has a big mouth, so what? The kid played at a high level while being injured all year. In my mindf that is all that matters.

Give a 22 year old 13 million dollars for playing a game that requires him to either hit someone as hard as he can or take as many of the same kinds of hits from others, then judge his character? GMAFB! Ever see these guys in public? Most of them are arrogant and act as if they are above everyone around them.

Some of the best players in the history of the league were brash cocky SOBs. But they all had one thing in common, a genuine passion for the game, and an ability to play at a high level. I'll take them anyday over the soft spoken high character guys who perform adequately, but not with the intensity of many of the players the above posters dog because of "character".

I'd rather have a guy who runs his mouth, then performs, then a guy who "alledgely hits his wife, or throws her out the door and gets a DUI, then underperforms all season.

Good players have attitude, something this team lacks big time.

Just another Butch selection that leaves us shaking our heads.

KW2's issues were on the field as well as off the field. Personally, I fall squarely in the shut up and play ball court. There is no need to celebrate a catch as if it was a TD.

With his stupidity he hurt himself as well as the Browns. He may never reach his true potential because of the knee and that is unfortunate.

Just Clicking......I had to look up Autumn's BIG word poltroon and it means coward or not courageous. Well I have to disagree with this. He put a lot of effort to be back on the field and went through a lot of pain to stay on the field. So I'd say he was courageous. Now, has he done some things in his past that were not smart and showed character flaws, absolutely. From the soldja comment, to the motorcycle accident, and the early season comments....all have been questionable behavior, to say the least. However, I really believe he is starting to turn the corner, no problems for the latter half of the season and he is being more serious and humble in his interviews. So I'm alright with KW at the moment and I wish him a speedy recovery and improved health.

Now Autumn, I'm not arguing with you, I simply defined the word at the request for a definition from another member and I bounced my opinion off of that.

never thought of it that way, but you have a point.

I don't care about personal stats. I care about team wins.

Even if he caught 150 passes in a year and acted like a fool, I would still consider him a fool.

I hope he gets his head on straight and stops acting like a spoiled brat.

It hurts me to watch the nonsense.

It doesn't seem like anyone has given any thought to the fact that this 'minor' surgery could turn out to be way more than that.

DC...You say future as bright as the sun...I'm not so sure. I'm not an expert, and I'm not a doctor, but this microfracture surgery is really no joke. As the article states, some come back, some don't.

I guess I'm a doom and gloomer. I think we are going to get some bad news in the next few months regarding Winslow. Or if he makes it back to the field, I don't think he'll be even the same as he was this past year.

I think there has been too much trauma to the knee. Unfortunately, I think his best playing days are now behind him.

who thinks he is better than everybody else

He may be smug, but on this team he is better than everybody else......

GM...

and of course you have evidence to back up such a statement...no wait, let me guess...'it's obvious by just watching the guy'...

just clicking on your post...

Browns make 'simple' tricky
Microfracture done on Winslow
Friday, February 23, 2007
Tony Grossi
Plain Dealer Reporter
Indianapolis- Kellen Winslow Jr. had the delicate microfracture procedure on his right knee on Jan. 30, a Browns spokesman confirmed on Thursday.

Winslow spoke frequently of having his troublesome knee "cleaned out" after the season, but it was assumed he would have simple arthroscopic surgery.

Winslow said he elected to have the delicate surgery to alleviate pain in his knee, which he first injured crashing his motorcycle almost two years ago.

"It was really up to me," Winslow said Thursday in a phone interview with the Associated Press. "I just wanted my knee to be as pain-free as possible. I know my body and I know what I can take."

Winslow said the prognosis is a four-month recovery, but that he's already ahead of schedule with his rehab. He expects to be fully recovered by June.

Winslow's publicist, Denise White of Entertainers and Athletes Group, downplayed the procedure.

"It was very minimal and his doctors have told him that he's way ahead of schedule," White said. "He's barely on his crutches anymore and he'll definitely be ready for the season. It's not a big concern of his because he's doing absolutely fabulous.

"He has no thought that he won't be 100 percent for next season."

Developed in the late 1980s, microfracture promotes new cartilage growth by drilling holes in adjacent bones in the knee.

On Tuesday, Browns General Manager Phil Savage said Winslow will be on crutches for a few more weeks. He made no mention of the surgery procedure.


We expect him to be back and ready to go sometime in June or July," Savage said.

He missed the 2005 season after hurting his knee in the motorcycle accident, but came back last year to lead all NFL tight ends with 89 catches for 875 yards and three touchdowns. The catches matched Ozzie Newsome's franchise record.

But the season was physically grueling for Winslow. He was in obvious pain after games and needed extra days during the week to recover.


Among other things, the motorcycle accident tore Winslow's anterior cruciate ligament, shattered the kneecap and bruised a bone.

"You guys have no idea," Winslow said in August of the severity of the injuries.

The latest procedure gives Winslow something else to recover from in 2007.

Plain Dealer reporter Mary Kay Cabot contributed to this story.

To reach this Plain Dealer reporter:

tgrossi@plaind.com, 216-999-4670


lincoln

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Autumn .. what does that word u called him mean??

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Meaning #1: an abject coward
Synonyms: craven, recreant

your vocabulary never ceases to amaze me.

Thank You for the info ..

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Here's where I'm at with that. Maybe he has changed, but it'll take more than a few months worth of silence to prove it. Pacman went a few months without screwin' up, yet here he is again.

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I'm glad I finally read this thread...

NO WAY Toad...Not even close to a comparison...

Jones is a THUG...And always will be from HISTORY...

When and where has Winslow done ANYTHING even remotely close to what Jones has???

NEVER...

I really hope this story has a happy ending. We need his talents on, and off the field.

I do too, Winslow may have had his issues and may still have. I still believe he's going to continue to mature and he has a fire that has been sorely lacking on this team. I want him around for a long time.

I hope that maturing doesn't mean he quits daring opponents to stop him, unless they start doing it. I like that in an athlete.

I'm referring to the thrill seeking off the field antics and maybe some of his soldier type comments, although if he performs on the field I don't mind him being cocky and a little mouthy, as long as he isn't a distraction to the team.

I figured that was what you meant. I hope he doesn't feel part of the maturation process is to clam up.

Cocky is NEVER GOOD .. Confidence is GREAT ... theres a thin line .. but its there ... but MOST IMPORTANTLY ...

there is never ever a need to go ANNOUNCING IT TO THE PRESS ... if your good .. YOUR GOOD .. and no amount of SELF BOASTING will change that ... its a NEGATIVE ...

if someone called him out .. U stick up for yourself .. but what he said prior to the KC game was HORSECRAP and doesnt help the team one little bit .. all it can do is HURT THE TEAM ..

even chad Johnson has MATURED and has toned it way down .. like u I hope he continues to mature (as hes all ready taken some steps .. ) and produce .. and I hope brey joins him .. cause your right he has a fire and competitive edge this team hasn't had since our return ... now lets hope he starts taking FULL ADVANTAGE of it instead of allowing it to be a negative ...

I agree there is a very fine line and it can be crossed easily with the kind of person Winslow is. I just hope he can harness all that desire and confidence/cockiness and use it for good, not evil.

Personally, I think Chad tuned it down because he had some weeks of mediocrity this year and he was embarrassed to shoot off his mouth. He'll start pulling his crap again next year.

just clicking....

Kw2 had surgery....and glad he did it early....Seems like he was thinking ahead...to be ready for the season....And if not ...that gives the coaches time to prepare.....

Why or how his character has anything to do with his recovery is beyond me....

Whether you like him or not...He`s wearing the Browns colors.....And he did a damn good job in "06".....

The board judges the players characteristics...Remember grown men of all back grounds....on one team....I just want to see a winning season......

Look into the mirror....If you want to judge a guy for his surgery.....Then judge yourself.....Are you perfect?

I agree.

Some people get a burr up their butt and can't seem to push it out.

Winslow has made some good strides and he has also backed things up on the field.

I wish we had more like him

Peen the guy comes back and ties a record....Think if he never had any problems...Guys like him will help this team win.....Thats what we all want....isn`t it.?

Sure it is...at least me.

I am to the point I don't pay much attention to the goofballs who have negative stuff to say about a player who might be the best player on the team and a player who stacks up against the best players around the league.

They don't know what they are talking about.

micro fracture surgery...greaaaat. That surgery is done usually as a last ditch effort. I just hope the browns atleast get kellen to fufill his contract at the level he played at last year before his abilities completely diminish.

j/c

lincoln

Winslow's knee raises a red flag
Microfracture procedure delicate, but Browns downplay seriousness
By Patrick McManamon

INDIANAPOLIS - A friend from the NBA e-mailed when he read that Browns tight end Kellen Winslow had microfracture surgery on his right knee.

``The word `microfracture' is the most feared in the NBA,'' he wrote. ``No NBA player has been able to successfully return without a full season off. Players who have come back early have almost always had more problems.

``This is what cost Amare Stoudemire all of last season and Jason Kidd months a few years ago. Of course, both came back and have become All-Stars.''

The Browns, of course, would prefer to stress the latter half of the statement.

There is no getting around the delicate and serious nature of microfracture surgery -- a procedure that involves drilling small holes into the bone around the knee to promote the growth of scar tissue that replaces cartilage.

Some guys come back; some guys don't.

Winslow told the Associated Press last week that it was his decision to have the surgery, and that it was done to alleviate pain in his knee.

Browns General Manager Phil Savage said the microfracture process of Winslow's surgery was not as drastic or serious as it might sound.

``When you hear microfracture, there's a lot of negative connotations to that surgery,'' Savage said. ``I don't think this was quite as extensive as some of the others that have gone on over the years. He did have some scar tissue cleaned out and the cartilage part involved the microfracture.

``From what I understand, it was not as extensive as other players have had in the past.''

The Browns initially released that Winslow had surgery to ``repair cartilage damage,'' but had they explained the microfracture procedure in full initially, some of the negative connotations might have been avoided.

That being said, the team insists that it is not worried about Winslow's return.

``Joe Andruzzi had a microfracture surgery in his career,'' coach Romeo Crennel said. ``Hey, he plays pretty tough. I know that guys have had it. They've come back from it. I don't see any reason why any other player couldn't come back from it.''

Taking responsibility?

One of the more intriguing things to come out of the NFL Scouting Combine last week took place at a ``power lunch between commissioner Roger Goodell, players union director Gene Upshaw, two owners and several players.

The topic: Players' personal conduct. And apparently players who don't find trouble are weary of those who do.

Upshaw has revealed that players want a three-strikes-and-you're-out policy, the thinking being that it's pretty tough to be in the wrong place at the wrong time three times.

``There comes a time when maybe you need to look at saying, `OK, that's enough, you did it three times, you should be out,' '' Upshaw told CincinnatiBengals.com. ``You have to look at each circumstance, but they're saying there has to be some penalties for your actions.''

Imagine that. Accountability for actions.

Among those spearheading the effort is players union president Troy Vincent, one of the league's real good guys. Too, Goodell has taken an active role. He has increased fines for on-field problems and is genuinely concerned about off-field problems.

The meeting took place in a climate where sordid details were revealed about an incident involving Adam ``Pacman'' Jones of the Tennessee Titans in a Las Vegas strip club. Jones was present and threw thousands of dollar bills on stage. A brawl ensued that went outside, and a security guard working part time was shot in the spine and reportedly is paralyzed for life.

Jones has been involved in several incidents.

As have the Bengals, who have had nine players arrested in the past year. Bengals coach Marvin Lewis was among those at the luncheon.

The Competition Committee will discuss the policy at the league meetings in March.

No increase

The Browns have resisted the pressure from others in the league to raise ticket prices. The cost will not go up this season.

Owner Randy Lerner does not believe that he should raise prices until the product on the field improves, if then.

The Browns ranked 29th in the 32-team league in average ticket cost last season, lowest in the AFC North.

Brownies . . .

• Every team will have a ton of salary-cap room when free agency starts Friday. The Browns will have somewhere in the neighborhood of $30 million with which to work.

• The team cleared out the training facility the past few days to put a glaze of some kind on the facility -- locker room, training room, weight room -- to try to prevent future staph infections. At least five players have had staph infections in the past 18 months, including center LeCharles Bentley, whose career is hanging in the balance.

• One prominent and well-respected agent said the fear of staph infection would not preclude him from sending a free agent to the Browns, but the turmoil surrounding the team might. That's if all is equal between the Browns and another team. If the Browns offer the most money? ``No problem,'' the agent said.

• ESPN draft guru Mel Kiper Jr. had this to say about the Browns' draft and Oklahoma running back Adrian Peterson in a conference call last week: ``Adrian Peterson would be an ideal Cleveland Brown. If they trade back and miss Adrian Peterson, that could be something they live to regret.''

• Savage on the perception that Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn did not play well in big games: ``I think it's unfair, quite frankly.'' He added: ``this draft process is interesting because whoever's wearing the crown, everybody tries to knock the crown off his head.''

• There's a lot of thought, though, that drafting Quinn seals Crennel's fate, because quarterbacks are drafted for the future and Crennel needs to win in 2007. He said he wants the guy who gives the team the ``best chance.'' Best chance for when, he was asked? ``Why do you think that we are in this game?'' he said. ``As Herm (Edwards) used to say, you play to win the game. We take them so we can have a chance to win the game. Now, I know that rookie quarterbacks, they say that they struggle and all that good stuff. There's some of them that can come along pretty quickly.''


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regarding NBA and Microfracture Surgery...tough to comeback without a years rehab. Of course NBA's season is how long...thats a lot of games running up n down courts with Cement foundations. Not saying NFL is easy...but 16 games...hopefully more is different than 100 something.

JMHO