DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cavaliers ....

ratings are fine and dandy, but i think there is going to be a huge problem.

while new york will be good, boston is good, los angeles, chicago, etc... those markets need the smaller ones. they need cleveland, milwaukee, minnesota, etc.

those teams could be in serious trouble down the road when attendance drops because ticket prices are expensive, and you get a weak product because all these players are controlling where they want to go.

anyone listen to bill simmons' bs report last week? he had stern on. stern had no problem with lebron leaving. after 7 years the guy had a right to choose.

ok that's fine, but what he doesn't point out is how these lower market teams will bottom out. and if that happens, the big markets will also bottom out. the league could be in a bind.

see, with baseball, it is brutally unfair, but the only people who take any abuse are small market fans. they get their teams broken up, and their players ripped. but the teams themselves are still banking cash. because attendance is still ok in most places. baseball is a better draw for the average fan, still the cheapest ticket of the 4 major sports, and with summer and nice weather and being outside, it helps.

even the smallest markets in baseball, their owners bank money. revenue sharing, tv contracts, in stadium revenue, they are fine. the only people who get stabbed are the fans in small markets.

the nba has half the home games, is an expensive ticket even in the worst seat, and is during cold winter months. good luck with that.

i love the nba, but i am not going to be much of a fan if this trend continues.

like i said before, people who want to talk curses for cleveland, that's fine, but right now even beyond that our hands are tied as fans. we can't win with anything. we can't spend money and nba players want to leave. what's the freaking point

and there is nobody to go to bat for us. i feel like we're the washington generals. we're just around so the big fat bloated markets have someone to play.

The only reason people have to go see small-market cellar dwellers is a young star, but people are only going to get excited over watching Blake Griffin, John Wall or Kevin Love for so long if the teams continue to win 20 games a year. We saw it here in Cleveland...good players aren't champing at the bit to go play in a small market (or the town's second fiddle, in the case of the Clippers) with a rising star. They'll go to lousy teams in desirable locations before they'll do that.

I agree with that. Teams like the heat, celtics, maybe even the knicks bring in the casual fans of the league. Nobody cares about the cavs, bucks, kings.

But it's not all about ratings. when half your league is sucking, the revenue goes down as a whole for the league. Just look at the shrinking cap the past few years. that has everything to do with the smaller markets not generating enough cash. The large markets will always bring in their fair share, but if the others aren't the league will eventually crash and burn. At the very least teams will be contracted.

you are right about baseball sir. Even the sorriest team like the pirates still bring in good crowds during the summer months. Baseball's revenues are soaring each year, while the nba has been going down the past few years.

i think contraction is probably a good idea for the nba, but like i said, they still need some of these small markets to be able to run a league.

i have said it a million times, but i can't say it enough. as much as i love the nba, when i see things and consider cleveland sports, i think the city would be better off with an nhl team + an owner like dan gilbert.

the league is set up for more teams to win, the players are far less self centered and egotistical, and you still get the same amount of home games during the same period of the year as the nba. so it wouldn't affect the city any differently in terms of the other teams in town.

i love the cavs, i think the organization is top notch. i think they opereated as well as they possibly could during the lebron years, especially the last year, but i just don't see us ever having a realistic opportunity to win a championship. and for fans, that's the bottom line. and i think that will wear this fan base down.

it's better than nothing, but it's not better than having a hockey team.

i know cleveland isn't into the nhl, most people don't give it much of a chance, or will watch for a few minutes and not enjoy it, but trust me, all it would take would be one playoff series to change people's opinions. the hockey playoffs are by far the best post-season of any sport, and when it's your team that you're watching, it's incredible. there is no playoff crowd like an nhl stadium.

i get chills thinking about 21k cleveland fans during a hockey playoff series, it would be incredible.

I say the cavs and blue jackets trade straight up.

The bluejackets have sucked worse than the cavs and I am tired of hearing about hockey.

i would take the jackets in a heartbeat. they at least have a chance at winning. they're not great now, but they have a superstar player and a few nice pieces.

the cavs won't win anything being in a small market and cold weather.

zero chance.

zero chanceionships?


BTW I disagree.

you can disagree all you want. it's just my opinion.

the only way we are going to build a team is through the draft, which means our star player will be young 20-21 yrs old. everyone knows that if you build a team with young players and don't go via free agency, it's gonna take 6-7 years for that player to learn how to win (unlike kobe and wade who had talent around them while they were young)

by the time said player is ready to win, he'll be able to take his talents to a bigger market and/or warmer weather.

we went through it, denver is going through it, new orleans will go through it, as will utah.

simmons has a theory that the hornets, who right now are owned by the league, will lose paul. and stern will show the others the power of contraction by doing it to the hornets.

the way i see it, chicago is a mega market. it's the third largest in the nation, and probably the second biggest sports market (since LA sucks as a sports town)

and in the gigantic groundbreaking historic, free agency bonanza, they came out of it with carlos boozer and kyle korver.

I actually think that, regarding the have's vs. have not's winning it all, you have a much better chance in baseball than basketball.

I'm a Pirates fan, so I'll use them. You have a 50 round draft plus the ability to sign international free agents, say it takes a kid 4 years to get to the bigs through the draft, the MLB team then has that player under their control for 6 years. So last year the Pirates drafted Jamison Taillon and Stetson Allie in the first 2 rounds - both premier pitchers that they'll have under their control for roughly a decade. Clearly if they both end up to be Roger Clemens in his prime they'll both probably be gone at the end of that decade - but it is what it is. So if a crap team such as the Pirates drafts well - which they have for the past 3 years - their's a good shot they should at least be a competitive team at some point in that decade. If you have enough quality young talent - especially pitching - who's to say you couldn't shock the world at some point in that timeframe?

The Cavs or teams like them have 2 rounds to work with in the draft. You take a kid 19-21 years old that may not be ready for the NBA but they have to play. At the end of their 5-6 years they're 24-27 and hitting the road if they're any good to join one of these super teams. If you have the luck of drafting a LeBron, you'll have a decent shot in that time... if you draft a Darko as much of the picks are you have no shot - ever.

I feel much, much better about being a Pirates fan than I do about being a Cavs fan right now - and that's with the Pirates not having even finished at .500 since 1992.

I enjoy watching the Cavs and I love it when they pull off a miracle like they did against the Lakers - but honestly if they went away I'd survive. David Stern, ESPN and these players have taken the fight out of me for that sport. As soon as LeBron and the Heat came together the attention turned to Carmelo. After this week it will turn to Paul and Howard. After them it'll be Durant, then Griffin. It's a never ending disgusting cycle.

lebron was just the beginning. wait til this super team in new york happens.

boston will be next. the big 3 are getting ancient. they'll rip a player from a smaller market. just watch.

I've been saying that for some time now. baseball by just the numbers, your team has a chance of getting a few superstars on your team. Like you said in basketball they may get 1-2 new rookies a year.

I'm so excited for the indians. I really believe by 2013 we will be contending for the world series. You could see it all coming together. our 2 biggest weaknesses are 2nd and 3rd. By next year those 2 positions will be filled by lonnie chisenall, and jason kipnis. Throw in alex white into the rotation. he may be our ace by that time. he has been a stud at every level since being drafted a few years ago. Our bullpen looks to be solidified for the first time in the last 7 or 8 years. Chris Perez seems to be on the verge of becoming the next great closer in this league.

People have been saying the royals have the best farm system in the game. in 2 years it may be the indians and royals battling it out for the central. Maybe your pirates will be in the mix as well.

Melo is a knick

it's amazing how much the nuggets got for melo. on the other hand we got a few draft picks for the best player in the game. Lebron really screwed the cavs.

Bet they're high-fiving in Bristol tonight.

I give this till Friday morning, then the ESPN machine turns it's full attention to Howard and Chris Paul.

The NBA is doomed.

Would anyone else just laugh their asses off if Melo played in NY for the next 3 months ..... then left for Utah or something?

It would be hilarious. Too bad there's virtually no way it happens, because I'm pretty confident that playing in a system where he can run and gun and put up tons of points is a lot higher on Melo's priority list than actually winning is. It'll be the same situation as it was in Denver; he'll just be getting more media attention in New York. The Nuggets of the past few years may have been one of the biggest wastes of talented players ever.

Kinda feel bad for Chauncey Billups...by all means a totally stand-up guy, gets traded to his hometown team, one that has a bunch of talented guys (Melo, Nene, Kenyon Martin, JR Smith, then later young guys like Aaron Afflalo and Ty Lawson) and has a legit chance of contending in the West, but the team just could never get it together, and just when they might've, George Karl takes his leave of absence. I think he wanted to retire in his hometown and probably isn't to psyched to be sent out east as a pawn in this far-too-drawn out saga.

denver had every chance to beat La in 09. team just didn't have the mental toughness to get over the hump.

Derron Williams or Cp3 will be a knick by next summer.

Yep. Nuggets were my mid-season pick to come out of the West last year. They were a team who averaged 98+ ppg from its starting five plus sixth man. This was, of course, very much prior to George Karl's bout with cancer. They just totally folded after he left, which isn't good for a team that, like you said, isn't very mentally tough as it is.

I remember reading that Denver was trying to involve Cleveland with their trade exemption....but with the Melo deal done, who else will get that moving?

I was hoping the Cavs could get another 1st rounder.

Oh well.

TWolves are the 3rd team in the Melo trade.

It'll probably be something pedestrian, like taking Troy Murphy's expiring deal off of the Nets' hands plus whatever else can be thrown in to sweeten the pot a little.

the cavs just don't have the players do get another 1st rounder. Varejo would probably get you one, but the cavs aren't interested in trading him. Jamison is too old, and has another year on his deal. Guys like parker and moon, probably only get you a 2nd.

The only way we get a 1st this year is if we were a 3rd team and used the trade exception. We could possibly get a lower 1st rounder if someone really really wanted Sessions. We can possibly get one next year for Jamison since he'll be an expiring contract next year. I think next year might be Mo's last year in his contract too, but I'm not 100% sure on him.

I'm curious to see what the Cavaliers will be able to get for Parker, since there appears to be a bit of competition for him. The Knicks making a big move should grease the way for other teams to make "big" moves ..... even if they aren't big moves. lol

There really don't seem to be a lot of experienced wing type players available ..... so hopefully that drives the price of a guy like Parker through the room ..... just this side of total insanity so that someone bites. (something like Parker and a 2nd we get from Miami for a 1st and a young big would qualify as just short of total insanity) Maybe we can get a 1st for Jamison next year ..... and be sitting pretty in a few years, with a young and talented team ready to win.

Young players need a veteran leader to teach them how to win, though. Probably one of the biggest differences between Kobe and LeBron...Kobe learned how to win. You can't really fill that role with a mercenary-type player that you bring in to push your team over the hump, like what the Cavs tried with Shaq last year.

The Blue Jackets...hmphhh...

I'd rather watch college water polo.