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Don't see how you can really attribute team stats to a OC ?... Good grief guys, I bet I would look good as the OC for the PATS... or the COLTS.
Oh my.. I coached the QB that was MVP of the league, or I coached the RB that lead the league in rushing. Who gives a hoot.
Did you get the MOST out of what you had to work with ? Are you a motivator ? Can you scheme and make adjustments ?
I just want to see some ass kicking instead of "We need to teach them to stay in their lanes" or "He was going up against some of top receivers in the league when he fell on his face all game long"
I was behind EM for a long while but everytime I watch Clay Matthews JR and know Mangini PASSED on him it makes me think he can't judge talent as well as we can at times. He deserved to get let go JUST for that.
Get the players and the coach will look GREAT.
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If being a great coordinator is all it took to be a good HC, Romeo would still be here.
So tone down the bitching about this hire and wait and see.
you had a good run Hank.
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Legend
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It's not just the Mangini crowd that has concerns with this pick.
I am willing to wait and see ..... but I hold very little hope that this guy will be the coach to turn this team around ..... for a lot of reasons that I have outlined.
I hope I am wrong. Unfortunately, I have the same feeling I did about Frye, and Quinn, and Crennel .........
Maybe you could tell me, besides the fact that Holmgren is going to hire him, the reasons that you like him as a potential head coach.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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It's obvious that no hire is going to make you happy unless Holmgren announces he made a mistake and brings Mangini back.
But here's something you could maybe hang yÕur hat on ... maybe there is more to Shurmur than his OC stats. Maybe he's seen as a great leader, a great communicator, a great teacher. Maybe that's his rep around the league. It's been proven that successful coordinators do not always go onto be successful HCs meaning these great strategists turned leaders of men didn't possess great leadership skills ... but people mistaken that they did because they were great coordinators. Maybe it's just the opposite for Shurmur. Maybe his more natural position is that of leader of men ... and he'll leave the chess match to his coordinators.
I just find it funny that so many people are clamoring for the days of '09 and '10...I just had so much fun through those seasons, I can't believe we made a change.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I just want a guy who is an upgrade.
I hope this guy is. I have some serious doubts as far as whether or not he is. Maybe decades of losing have gotten to me and made me cynical, but I would like a guy with a little more meat on his resume, and some better results to point to.
Hell, the Rams scored exactly 1 TD more than we did this past year. They played the Seahawks, 49'ers, and Cardinals twice each, while we played the Ravens, Steelers, and Bengals each twice. The Bengals were the worst defensive team in our division, allowing 395 points. The Seahawks allowed 407 points. The Cardinals allowed 434 points. The 49'ers were their toughest division opponent. They "only" allowed 346 points. The Steelers, by comparison, allowed 232 and the Ravens allowed 270.
The Rams also got to play Detroit and Denver, hardly defensive powerhouses.
Again, the Rams scored exactly 1 more TD than we did.
Excuse the hell out of me if I have some doubts.
I seriously hope that I am wrong, and will hope for the best from him. He will be the head coach of my favorite football team.
Once more, I will say this ...... the one thing I do NOT want to hear out of this guy at his introductory press conference is "I'll be calling my own plays". If they put him with a great OC and DC, then maybe he'll be OK. If he's a HC/OC .... then I think it's over before we begin.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
We haven't hired him, but it is assumed that he will be named head coach before the end of the week.
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The Cleveland Browns have completed their interview process and are in talks with St. Louis Rams offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur to become their head coach, league sources said Wednesday.
The Browns expect to announce the move Thursday, when Shurmur's agent, Bob LaMonte, comes to Cleveland to finalize the deal. LaMonte's clients also include Browns president Mike Holmgren, general manager Tom Heckert and executive vice president Bryan Wiedmeier.
NFL.com
Two years ago, it was assumed by some that Cowher would be our new head coach. Then it was assumed that Mangini would be fired after holmgren came in.,.
Just saying...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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j/c
Well you can all jump on me if you want 'cause I just don't care... BUT I don't have a clue about this guy Shumur. From what I'm reading, this is a downgrade. I'm not going to mix words, I liked Mangini. His tough nose approach and no BS program changed the tone at CBS. I think he struggled this year, but I also wittnessed the lack of talent, the injuries and TWO of the best butt whoopins the Browns have dished out since they've been back.
My gut says Holmgren made a mistake and should NOT have fired him. Now that it's done and due to the words Holmgren used in his presser, I expect this new coach to get us to a Super Bowl. In my mind, the minute this becomes official the timer starts. I want a Super Bowl in 2-3 years, period.
If not Holmgren should be run out on a rail!
Do I think Mangini would have got us to a Super Bowl in that tÓme frame... No. But the BIG SHOW said he was going to bring in someone capable of delivering that. So that's what I expect. Anything less is an absolute failure.
AND why I'm at it, I think Mangini got a raw deal. He came to a team that resembled a losing college team because Romeo and Phil sucked. Mangini cut his losses, instilled discipline and brought order to chaos. He wasn't hired as the GM but he inherited it when Kokopuff couldn't cope. Mangini done his best to deaL with it. Randy made Mangini the Man then sucker punched him with the Holmgren hire.
I›personally didn't like the Holmgren hire, at least the way it was done. I knew we needed a GM but felt and still feel we had our coach. This team is three good drafts away from being a consistent threat and 5 away from being a consistent playoff contender. I think Heckert can do that, but he'll be fired way before then... STUPID MOVES AND POOR MANAGEMENT. These are the words that now define the Browns.
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![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/GraffZ06/browns_factory_sig.jpg) Fear us, for we are the BROWNS, led by the mighty BM! Only in Cleveland.
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Practice Squad
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The Cleveland Browns have completed their interview process and are in talks with St. Louis Rams offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur to become their head coach, league sources said Wednesday.
The Browns expect to announce the move Thursday, when Shurmur's agent, Bob LaMonte, comes to Cleveland to finalize the deal. LaMonte's clients also include Browns president Mike Holmgren, general manager Tom Heckert and executive vice president Bryan Wiedmeier.
Looks like they'll need a table for 5 at lunch. Too bad the Theatrical Grill is no longer available.
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Some of what you said was true, but ... Quote:
In my mind, the minute this becomes official the timer starts. I want a Super Bowl in 2-3 years, period.
That is the worst attitude I've heard yet. That says a lot when we all have to put up with Ammo's "Aren't I interesting?" character.
The Browns have gone 46 years without a championship. Now you're demanding one within three years?
It took Bill Walsh three years to win a championship. So your measuring stick for Pat Shurmur is Bill Walsh? That's a healthy way to look at things.
Or how about Bill Cowher? The man who many Browns fans have some pipe dream of actually reeling in. It took him fourteen years to win a championship. Bum. Andy Reid? That fat oaf STILL hasn't won a championship.
Get_Rowdy
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Quote:
I have a serious question.
What happened to the wide ranging search that would involved every level of college and professional football in the search for exactly the right man to be the next head coach of the Cleveland Browns?
I think he interviewed 3 people.  That's searching high and low for the right guy?
I think that Holmgren knew who he was going to hire, and decided before the circus started.
Oh well, I hope this guy can do better than the last 10 or so.
Yeah, I know that we've had a winning coach in there ..... but no one who could win a Super Bowl. That needs to be the question from now on ..... "Can this guy win the Super Bowl if he has talent that is comparable to other coaches in the league?".
Frankly, I have questions, and doubts. I feel extremely let down, and feel that we didn't even look at other candidates who were, at least, deserving of a look.
As Holmgren said. We released information after a person was interviewed.
You are sure Holmgren didn't call up 2-3-4 more people to see if they were interested??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Quote:
Once more, I will say this ...... the one thing I do NOT want to hear out of this guy at his introductory press conference is "I'll be calling my own plays". If they put him with a great OC and DC, then maybe he'll be OK. If he's a HC/OC .... then I think it's over before we begin.
I'm really surprised at you "Y"...
There's alot of "Dumber than the flattest rock on the Beach" types around here...But not you...
I see your concerns but it seems that your biggest insecurity is all based on STATISTICS from an OC...
And the even better one is coming from those who think Holmgren's choice is coming from the fact that Schurmer has the SAME agent as Holmgren...That one makes me roll...
Just as any new HC has statistics from a history of a DC or OC...Those statistics DO NOT dictate whether he's gonna be a successful HC...You KNOW this...HCing is a majorly different animal...
Have your concerns...But let this thing play out...And let us get on the field for a YEAR to see exactly how this dude handles alot of the things many DID NOT like about Mangini/Crennel/Davis etc...
Don't go into panic mode based on less than stellar STATISTICS from his OC days...
Go Browns!!!
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Quote:
Some of what you said was true, but ...
Quote:
In my mind, the minute this becomes official the timer starts. I want a Super Bowl in 2-3 years, period.
That is the worst attitude I've heard yet. That says a lot when we all have to put up with Ammo's "Aren't I interesting?" character.
The Browns have gone 46 years without a championship. Now you're demanding one within three years?
It took Bill Walsh three years to win a championship. So your measuring stick for Pat Shurmur is Bill Walsh? That's a healthy way to look at things.
Or how about Bill Cowher? The man who many Browns fans have some pipe dream of actually reeling in. It took him fourteen years to win a championship. Bum. Andy Reid? That fat oaf STILL hasn't won a championship.
Hey, the measuring stick was designed by Holmgren. Watch his presser after firing Mangini. Then tell me what I should expect. And as for attitude, I really don't care what you think of my attitude. If I can put up with Django's constant rant for the whole two years Mangini was here y'all can hear mine for five minutes!
Don't like what I have to say, block my post.
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I m sure that more input than Holmgrens was considered here. Im pretty certain he has the buy in of ALL his confidants on this decision.
The guys gonna bring something to the table or MH isnt going ALL IN so fast.
I'm very intrigued by the pick and anxious to hear the guy, see what he's about and what he brings to the Browns. Besides, what choice do we have!
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2nd String
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Quote:
Quote:
The Cleveland Browns have completed their interview process and are in talks with St. Louis Rams offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur to become their head coach, league sources said Wednesday.
The Browns expect to announce the move Thursday, when Shurmur's agent, Bob LaMonte, comes to Cleveland to finalize the deal. LaMonte's clients also include Browns president Mike Holmgren, general manager Tom Heckert and executive vice president Bryan Wiedmeier.
Looks like they'll need a table for 5 at lunch. Too bad the Theatrical Grill is no longer available.
Who's willing to bet that Ryan and Seely have recently made a change in agents to Mr. LaMonte as well? I'd be curious to find that out.
Where there is smoke, there's fire.
Not saying Shurmer is the wrong guy for the job, it just looks like his agent connection, and his dad's former relationship with Holmgren may have played a very large role in his selection.
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Just clickin' to post this article from the Plain Dealer...
In Mike Holmgren we trust? It makes the most sense for Cleveland Browns fans:
Bud Shaw
Published: Wednesday, January 12, 2011, 8:08 PM
Updated: Wednesday, January 12, 2011, 8:22 PM
The Plain Dealer By Bud Shaw
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- You know what they say in the NFL. Nothing is official until Deuce Gruden tweets it.
Except when Jon Gruden tells a national TV audience on ESPN he'll return to the broadcast booth next season. Except when there hasn't been one whisper out of Berea that Gruden is a candidate.
Gruden's son, Deuce, raised hopes a month or so ago when he used Twitter to say his father could be coaching in San Francisco or Cleveland in 2011. Instead, dad wants to collect his final year of severance from Tampa Bay while watching his kid play his last season of high school football.
So our attention turns to (gulp) St. Louis Rams offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur.
Not that Shurmur isn't a name coach. The problem is his late uncle Fritz is responsible for making the name as Mike Holmgren's defensive coordinator in Green Bay.
Mangini's supporters are clearing their throats to mention, OK, to scream, "You fired our guy to hire a rookie head coach who's been a short-term offensive coordinator for an offensively challenged team?"
The quick answer is Holmgren didn't believe in the Mangini Way and nothing -- not Gruden's hedging and not even Holmgren's own uncertainty about returning to coaching -- was going to keep Mangini here.
Shurmur, Holmgren and GM Tom Heckert share the same agent, Bob LaMonte. You thought World Wide Wes was positioned to affect LeBron James' free agency decisions? League Wide LaMonte would have the market cornered in Berea.
The fraternity feel to such a partnership at the top of the Browns' organization might strike you as disconcerting, but there's merit to the idea of a team president, front office and head coach pulling in a direction they all believe is right-
Providing the coach can coach. To that end, buying into a Shurmur hiring would really be as much about having trust in Holmgren than anything else.
Aston Villa's Randy Lerner, who also owns the Browns, resisted hiring a football man as team president. Some in the media, myself included, kept pointing out that if you're not as immersed in your league as the Rooney family is, for instance, then hire a leader who knows where to look in a coaching search.
Now that Lerner has done that in hiring Holmgren, it's disingenuous to reject Holmgren's choice -- if it's Shurmur -- purely because Shurmur is a first-time coach and isn't Gruden or Holmgren himself.
Gruden would've carried his own stamp, the Chucky brand, as Browns' head coach. Shurmur would wear Holmgren's stamp.
That sound expected to follow the announcement of Shurmur? That will be crickets, but people here will do what they always do and come around to the idea when the calendar flips to September.
In the meantime, because of Holmgren, a head coaching hire in Berea deserves more than blind faith. It deserves some trust.
At least until the next one.
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Quote:
It's not just the Mangini crowd that has concerns with this pick.
No, it's not. But it is you guys that aren't going to give any new guy a chance. Hell, there's already one guy that is demanding a championship within 3 years. Not hoping. Not praying, Demanding. What color is the sky in his world?
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Maybe you could tell me, besides the fact that Holmgren is going to hire him, the reasons that you like him as a potential head coach.
Honestly, arguing the merits of a guy that none of us really knows is kinda pointless. I could say I thought he did a pretty good job with Stl's QB. I could say I think I like his offensive coordinator background. I could say I like his bloodlines. I could say a lot more. But, seriously, would it matter to you?
I'm willing to trust the judgment of the FO in this matter at this time. You're not. You might end up being right. But is that what you really want? I suspect it is. In that I hope I'm wrong.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Packers took a chance on Holmgren, and it paid offGreen Bay Packers took a chance on a coach without previous head coaching experience, and it paid off with a Super Bowl title for the Packers and head coach Mike Holmgren. By CHRIS EASTERLING IndeOnline.com staff writer Posted Jan 11, 2011 @ 07:48 PM Last update Jan 11, 2011 @ 11:30 PM About 18 years ago, an assistant coach with only six years of NFL coaching experience found himself being handed the keys to one of the league’s historically great franchises, a franchise that had fallen on some hard times of late. In his seven years as the head coach, he guided that franchise to winning records in all seven seasons, as well as playoff berths in the final six years. Oh, there were also two Super Bowl appearances, including a Super Bowl championship. That coach was Mike Holmgren. Now, almost two decades after he got his first big break into the NFL head-coaching fraternity with the Green Bay Packers, Holmgren is the president of another of the league’s historic franchises, one which has fallen through plenty of hard times as of late, in the Cleveland Browns. Holmgren is in the process of finding the coach to do for the Browns what he was able to do for the Packers – and later, the Seattle Seahawks – which is to lead them to the Super Bowl. And, despite pleas from fans and media types alike, he has no intentions right now of being that man. The obvious wish list for Browns fans in lieu of Holmgren coming down from the front office to the sideline has centered around the likes of Jon Gruden, or, to a lesser extent, John Fox. Both of those coaches have taken teams to the Super Bowl, and in Gruden’s case, hoisted the Lombardi Trophy. But those haven’t been the names which Holmgren and his general manager compatriot, Tom Heckert, have spoken with thus far. Instead, it’s been the likes of Pat Shurmur and Mike Mularkey and Perry Fewell, with still an outside chance of Marty Mornhinweg in the not-too-distant future.There’s not exactly Gruden or Fox or Bill Cowher among that group. Or is there? Shurmur, who has spent the last two years coordinating the St. Louis Rams’ offense, reportedly has moved to the front of the list if some prominent national pundits are to be believed. Of the group the Browns have talked to — or are likely to speak with — he is also the only one without any head-coaching experience. Mularkey spent two years (2004-05) as the head coach of the Buffalo Bills, going 9-7 his first year before a disastrous 5-11 second — and final — year. Fewell, meanwhile, went 3-4 in 2009 as the interim head coach for the Bills after Dick Jauron was fired midseason. And Mornhinweg, well, he’s become the poster child for bad head-coaching tenures. In two years with the Detroit Lions in 2001-02, he was 5-27 and, infamously, took the wind instead of the ball after winning the coin toss in overtime in a game against Chicago. Shurmur, meanwhile, never has had a chance to be a head coach before. Of course, again, neither had Holmgren before the Packers took a chance on him. Maybe that’s part of the appeal the Browns’ president has with the Rams’ assistant. Maybe he sees a little of himself in Shurmur, who is the nephew of Holmgren’s longtime defensive coordinator in Green Bay, the late Fritz Shurmur. Their backgrounds certainly are somewhat similar. Both spent time as quarterback coaches with successful teams — Holmgren with the 49ers and Shurmur with the Eagles — before moving on to become offensive coordinators. In fact, Shurmur’s NFL experience in Philadelphia alone is longer than Holmgren’s was before Green Bay hired him. So it’s not like he’s some fresh-faced young guy who is still learning the ropes of the league. Of course, if Shurmur — or almost any of the known candidates — are the pick of the Browns, it almost will certainly be greeted by, at best, resignation from the fan base, and at worst, outright anger. There’s little doubt the Browns won’t “win the press conference” with the hire. Then again, the NFL is about winning on the field, not at the press conference. And that, in the end, is where whoever the Browns end up hiring will ultimately be judged. Just as the case was for another once-unproven coordinator. And that hire turned out just fine for Green Bay. ––– Chris Easterling is sports editor of The Independent. He can be reached by e-mail at Chris.Easterling@IndeOnline.com, or by phone at 330-775-1129. Copyright 2011 CantonRep.com. Some rights reserved
#gmstrong
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j/c
IF we hire Shurmur, I will go along with it and support him 100%. Because, why wouldn't I? I don't want to join the pessimistic crowd just so I can say "I told you so" if Shurmur falls flat.
Also, what the heck good does it do to be all upset about hiring him? The culture of losing is "this guy sucks, we'll always suck." Instead, maybe we should say "well, I don't care about what he did in the past because it was a different situation. I EXPECT him to come in and be successful and he's going to have my support until I ACTUALLY SEE that he can't do it."
It seems that, starting with Mangini, we're not even giving coaches a chance to succeed. If the media isn't gushing over our new coach, the fans jump on him, expect him to fail, and when he does (which all new coaches do at some point or another), it's "see? see? see how smart I am? I know more than Mike Holmgren! told you so! told you so!"
So, get upset and take a ledge if you must. I just don't see what that accomplishes.
We all talk about the Pats and the Steelers as these rock-solid organizations. But when a COORDINATOR, Mike Tomlin, who had been a COORDINATOR for, what, one year, comes into Pittsburgh, did that organization and fan base say "I don't like this, he's no good, oh God, we're done for and will probably never win another game"? Maybe some of their more Chicken Little fans did, but you know most of them, and definitely their organization said "we're going to win no matter what." (BTW, I understand their player situation was different than ours, but you get my point).
I'm giving Shurmur a chance because, well, what other option do I have? Cry about it? What good does that do?
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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I will support 100% anyone who is coaching this team.. WHY? Cuz the coaches can only do so much...
The real burden is on the GM, who I think is doing just fine..
The other burden is on the players, who have to execute the plays called by the coordinators.
Regardless of who the Browns coach is, I just want to win..
If Gruden was our coach.. I just want to win.
If Lombardi was our coach.. I just want to win.
If Billick was our coach, I just want to win.
I'm just naming coaches randomly, but my point is, I just want this team to win.
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dint want to make a new post.....
Cleveland offensive coordinator Brian Daboll was in Miami on Wednesday to interview with the Dolphins for either their offensive coordinator or quarterback coach job, a league source told ESPN NFL Insider Adam Schefter.
Daboll already knows the AFC East division well, having been a coach in New England from 2000-2006 and with the New York Jets from 2007-2008.
Daboll was hired as Cleveland's offensive coordinator after the Browns hired former Jets coach Eric Mangini. Daboll is still under contract with Cleveland despite Mangini's firing, but is unlikely to return to the Browns once a new coach is hired.
League sources told Schefter on Wednesday that Rams offensive coordinator Pat Shurmur is the leading candidate in Cleveland.
The Browns were the only AFC team to score less than the Dolphins last season.
Miami's offense struggled last season despite an offseason trade for Pro Bowl wide receiver Brandon Marshall. Third-year quarterback Chad Henne threw 15 TDs and 19 interceptions and was benched for Chad Pennington at one point.
Head coach Tony Sparano and offensive coordinator Dan Henning took much of the blame and Sparano was at the center of a messy situation after the season as the Dolphins talked with other coaching candidates while Sparano was still under contract.
Sparano eventually received a two-year extension, but Henning will not return.
At the news conference announcing Sparano's extension, Dolphins owner Stephen Ross said the focus for this season would be squarely on Miam's offense.
"The emphasis is going to be on offense -- an exciting offense, a more aggressive offense, creative," Ross said. "I will deliver a winner. That is my commitment."
Cowboys tight ends coach John Garrett, older brother of new Dallas head coach Jason Garrett, also interviewed for the Dolphins' offensive coordinator position Wednesday.
Information from ESPNDallas.com's Todd Archer and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
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The Browns were the only AFC team to score less than the Dolphins last season.
Dolphins might have a hard time explaining this if they hired Daboll as their OC...they can have him.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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All Pro
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j/c
I would be OK with the Shurmur hiring, as long as Holmgren saw something in him that made him believe he was a good leader and can be for a long time.
You can make up for a lot of a young coach's deficiencies by hiring or retaining experienced coordinators (that the coach can work with, of course) and having a very good front office. The Steelers do this every two decades when they hire a first time coach. The Chiefs paired Todd Haley with Romeo and Charlie Weis. John Harbaugh was paired with Cam Cameron.
Judging by the first draft/FA period, our front office is light years ahead of anything we have had since 99. As long as a few experienced coordinators are hired and/or possibly retained (Ryan) that are willing to work for Shurmur, the base is there for success, IMO.
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The issue I have is that we interviewed 3 canidates, 2 of which I'm not convinvced were even legit options. Farwell was to satisfy the rooney rule, or least seems that way, and Mularky is invested with the Falcons and only interviewed with us as he felt obligated. He came across as not that interested to me, which leaves Shurmur, who it seemed was the guy from the beginning. Much like when Lerner heard of Mangini being fired, you knew right then from the look on his face, that he was the guy.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
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Just clicking WOW,,, Look, I'm no more pleased with this if it's true than some other guys but gees.. I'm not sure I've ever heard so dang much doom and gloom. And the guy isn't even for sure hired yet.... I get the feeling that some people just like to complain....Or maybe they want to say I told you so, which, if you wait long enough,, it almost always can happen. EXAMPLE: shanahan was hired, fans wondered, what? some even said,, he's not going to make it., He took them to two SB's and won both, Elway retires,,, and the team becomes nothing special and eventually, Shanahan gets fired. and the doubters from the mid 90's said,, SEE, I told you so.  If you wanna be a predictor of anyones future in the NFL,, simply predict that they will fail,, then wait long enough and it will come true in about 90% of the cases. Much harder to predict who will succeed... try that sometime....... Predicting success is something that only the brave do... cause all those that think negatively will do whatever they must, twist whatever stat they need to, to show you that you are wrong... then they sit and wait, and eventually,, they can do the  and say I told you so..
#GMSTRONG
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Much like when Lerner heard of Mangini being fired, you knew right then from the look on his face, that he was the guy.
The difference there is that Lerner knows little about football. Holmgren has been in and around coaches and front office circles for better than 20 years. He has a knowledge of these guys that Lerner doesn't. I'm concerned when Lerner doesn't interview a bunch of guys, but not so much when Holmgren doesn't.
Last edited by tjs7; 01/13/11 09:36 AM.
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I get the feeling that some people just like to complain....Or maybe they want to say I told you so, which, if you wait long enough,, it almost always can happen.
Or it could be that some posters aren't doing cartwheels over hiring the OC for a bad Rams offense, because, well.... we never heard of the guy until a week ago.
That doesn't mean Shurmur won't be a success - I'm taking a wait-and-see approach - but there's nothing wrong if a poster is skeptical about this supposed hire.
It doesn't mean they're all Chicken Littles.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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see your concerns but it seems that your biggest insecurity is all based on STATISTICS from an OC...
And the even better one is coming from those who think Holmgren's choice is coming from the fact that Schurmer has the SAME agent as Holmgren...That one makes me roll...
Just as any new HC has statistics from a history of a DC or OC...Those statistics DO NOT dictate whether he's gonna be a successful HC...You KNOW this...HCing is a majorly different animal...
Have your concerns...But let this thing play out...And let us get on the field for a YEAR to see exactly how this dude handles alot of the things many DID NOT like about Mangini/Crennel/Davis etc...
Don't go into panic mode based on less than stellar STATISTICS from his OC days...
I certainlt can't say too much because I don't know much about him.So it is a wait and see thing for me..regardless I trust they bring in a experienced coordinator.
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Quote:
Quote:
I get the feeling that some people just like to complain....Or maybe they want to say I told you so, which, if you wait long enough,, it almost always can happen.
Or it could be that some posters aren't doing cartwheels over hiring the OC for a bad Rams offense, because, well.... we never heard of the guy until a week ago.
That doesn't mean Shurmur won't be a success - I'm taking a wait-and-see approach - but there's nothing wrong if a poster is skeptical about this supposed hire.
It doesn't mean they're all Chicken Littles.
I already said I'm not doing cartwheels on this hire.. But clearly, you didn't read my entire post... or you'd know that.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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J/C I wish that just one time we can talk about a new coach because our past coach rode off into the sunset instead of being fired. 
#gmstrong
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Actually I did read your entire post and never suggested that YOU were doing cartwheels.
Last edited by lampdogg; 01/13/11 09:58 AM.
gmstrong -----------------
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Quote:
Actually I did read your entire post.
You are probably the only one. Sorry, I couldn't help myself.
#gmstrong
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I'm feeling good about it. MH is NOT going to set this guy up to fail!!!
Let's see what they surround him with before going off the deep end!
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We all talk about the Pats and the Steelers as these rock-solid organizations. But when a COORDINATOR, Mike Tomlin, who had been a COORDINATOR for, what, one year, comes into Pittsburgh, did that organization and fan base say "I don't like this, he's no good, oh God, we're done for and will probably never win another game"? Maybe some of their more Chicken Little fans did, but you know most of them, and definitely their organization said "we're going to win no matter what." (BTW, I understand their player situation was different than ours, but you get my point).
Their fans were upset with the Tomlin hire but the Rooneys basically told the fans "This is your coach and you're gonna like it. If you don't like it, leave."
Lerner needs to do the same.
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Gil Haskil is on our staff already. Maybe he will be the OC?
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IF we hire Shurmur, I will go along with it and support him 100%. Because, why wouldn't I? I don't want to join the pessimistic crowd just so I can say "I told you so" if Shurmur falls flat.
79...me too.
I have no reason, not to trust the judgement of those hired to run the franchise. If they believe Shurmur is the right guy, I will support the decision and those who made it.
All of us need to keep this mind...we need to be patient because it will take a few more years (2 or 3) to complete the rebuilding process.
The Saints might be a good example of the time frame needed to turn a franchise into a playoff caliber team, after a hiring a young offensive minded HC. The Saints hired Sean Payton in 2006 and it took the Saints 4 seasons to make it to a Super Bowl...
Shurmur will have the advantage of a strong support team in the front office to help him build the Browns into a playoff caliber team...something that should not be overlooked.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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j/c
Shurmur may bring in an offensive coordinator, but he will call his own plays. Most WCO OC's-turned-head coaches call their own plays.
I'm more interested in who the DC is.
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It isn't worth getting upset at this point to me. What is done is done.All this talk about him hiring people who have the same agent is silly. The guy might have sucked as a OC. I really don't know.
The way I have decided to look at is MH sees something in this guy and he is around to help him as a new head coach.
I'm choosing to believe that MH decided that hiring an established coach would have been a difficult situation when it comes to drafting and direction of the team.
#gmstrong
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