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I have never heard of fairley being lazy. However he is diiiiirty.

honestly, I don't know much about Prince. because the Husker games I saw, I didn't notice him much on the screen. then again, that was because the QBs never bothered to throw to his side of the field.

so, my question is: do you have coaches tape on him that shows more than the TV games did?

No..No coaches tapes..I can't find the one I was watching in particular..He might be good..who knows. I just wasn't impressed from the stuff I saw. Here is one vs Justin Blackmon.
http://www.youtube.com/v/zVeWn3bwWTg&feature=related

Ok, that's fair enough. And that video shows the main thing that worries people about him. Bigger, stronger WRs able to muscle position from him as you see Blackmon do on a couple of the longer throws plus in blocking Prince couldn't shed him to get to the RB.

I like Peterson too bc he is fearless when it comes to making tackles. He really reminds me of Charles woodson.

here's my mock 1st round. feel free to tear apart




1. Carolina Panthers – Da’Qwan Bowers – best pass rusher in this draft. It is not their greatest need, but I don’t see them taking a DT with the 1st overall pick and I think having 2 good DE’s will help their defense immensely.
2. Denver Broncos – Marcel Dareus – Broncos are switching back to a 4-3 defense. As such, they need DL desperately. Dareus is a fantastic DT who is stronger at the point than Fairley and doesn’t get out of his lane as often.
3. Buffalo Bills – Patrick Peterson – They certainly could go QB with Gabbert/Newton, but I think they pass on less than elite talent in order to get the last remaining elite player in this draft.
4. Cincinnati Bengals – AJ Green – I think that even if they let Ocho and TO leave that they are okay at WR (Shipley, Caldwell, possibly even Simpson), but that the lure of getting the best remaining talent is what will drive this pick. Also, possibly a last ditch effort of trying to keep Carson Palmer happy (I believe they will go through one more year of forced-marriage before separation).
5. Arizona Cardinals – Cam Newton – Max Hall and John Skelton. Unless Philly, Cinci or Washington trade them a starting QB or they decide to go with Vince Young, they almost have to pick a QB even in this weak crop of QBs. They could wait until the 2nd round and pickup Colin Kaepernick, but that might be too risky for them. In this situation, I have them picking who they hope will be the next Vince Young (except without the emotional issues at least they hope).
6. Cleveland Browns – Nick Fairley - I hope I am being pessimistic about the draft as this situation is almost a worst case scenario (only worse would be if AZ passes on a QB as well but then they likely take Von Miller anyway who doesn’t really fit a 4-3). It leaves our options to Julio Jones at WR, Jordan/Quinn/Watt at DE, Fairley at DT, Prince Amukumara at CB. At this point, I would want to trade down if someone else really loves Gabbert and hopefully use whatever we get from that trade to get 2 picks in the 1st round and end up with Liuget (DT) and Martez Wilson (ILB). If we cannot, then I would take a chance on Fairley as he’s the best talent left in the draft but he definitely has some risk associated with him (It would be good to pair a penetrator like Fairley with a stout guy like Rubin though).
7. San Francisco 49ers - Cameron Jordan – Interesting choice as this team has a lot of good talent but hasn’t been able to put it all together. Jordan can make life miserable on OTs though, which Harbaugh knows from having to scheme against him. Having him and Justin Smith as bookends is a pretty good way to start building a DL.
8. Tennessee Titans – Blaine Gabbert – I am not high on Gabbert and think he will be a bust, but Tenn is another team that desperately needs a QB and may reach to get one in this weak class. Again, I think their first route will be to try to trade for a band-aid (Palmer, McNabb) or young starter (Kolb). obviously Vince Young won’t be an option for them. But, if they can’t trade because of a lockout or don’t make one, then they could easily make this mistake.
9. Dallas Cowboys – Prince Amukumara – if you were subjected to as many Cowboy games as I was last year, then you would know that they have to pick secondary in this draft. If Rahim Moore drops to them in round2, they likely take him too. Heck, this might be our trade-down option that no one is talking about. If Peterson falls to us, then Jerry might overpay to get him.
10. Washington Redskins – Julio Jones – they probably should take Robert Quinn with this pick, but they also need a WR and Julio could really help open things up for them. They likely would be disappointed to not be able to grab one of the 2 QBs many have going high in the 1st round, but McNabb
11. Houston Texans – Von Miller – they desperately need secondary help. So, why do I have them taking Von Miller who I personally think is more hype than substance? Simply because Wade Phillips has them transitioning to a 3-4 defense and they will need as much QB-pressure as they can get to mask their secondary concerns, which will not all be filled. Mario at DE on one side and Von Miller at OLB on the other will at least keep OLs thinking.
12. Minnesota Vikings – JJ Watt – they pride themselves on their DL, but are getting older and may lose Edwards as well. Watt allows their vets to rotate more often and gives them a succession plan. I know it’s not considered their most urgent need, but their defense revolves around their DL dominance which dropped off last year and I think Frasier goes for the fix there with the best available.
13. Detroit Lions – Tyron Smith – job #1 is to keep fragile Stafford protected. It’s a weak OT class, but Tyron Smith can possibly play either side, which is why I think the Lions tab him.
14. St. Louis – Corey Liuget – Julio Jones is the obvious pick, but he’s likely gone by here. I don’t think they reach to the next tier of WRs. But, what they can do is grab another young DL for what should be becoming the strength of their defense.
15. Miami Dolphins – Aldon Smith - lesser name from a lesser school (Mizzou) but he was really disruptive and can get around the edge with ease. Perfect fit for the Dolphins and I think a more urgent need than RB, which most sites have them tabbed.
16. JAX Jaguars – Robert Quinn – at this point, it should be obvious that this is a deep DL class. Quinn dropped because of his missed year but he fills an urgent need for the Jags as they have unsuccessfully been drafting DL high and still can’t get to the QB.
17. NE Patriots – Mikel Leshoure – I personally think he’s better than Ingram. I realize I am in the minority on that one but if there is one team that would completely go by their gut, it’s NE and so I’ll go by my gut on this pick as well. The Pats definitely need a RB that teams will be fearful of as their hodge-podge allowed teams to just play the pass (see our game for instance).
18. SD Chargers – Akeem Ayers – Local prospect that made play after play after play in college. He doesn’t have all the measurables of Von Miller, which is why he drops, but he has great technique and great football skill.
19. NY Giants – Mark Ingram – well, if they lose Brandon Jacobs and keep Bradshaw, then they just keep on keeping on with this pick.
20. TB Bucs – Ryan Kerrigan – they have a young DL that should only get better. Adding Kerrigan gives them a complete DL of young potential monsters. If they can grow together, then they will be able to get to the QB w/o help from their LB which will be key in a division that features Ryan and Brees.
21. KC Chiefs - Gabe Carimi – there’s actually a lot of directions they could go with this pick. They need a CB, LB, DL too. But, I think they want to show that losing Weis isn’t going to affect them and Cassell is only good when he has time in the pocket.
22. Indy Colts – Brandon Harris - I could see them taking Pouncey here to solidify their line more, but they can’t ignore their defense. Harris is a solid tackler, which is a premium skill in the tampa-2 scheme as CBs cannot afford to miss tackles.
23. Philly Eagles – Martez Wilson – best available talent. He could fill their need at SOLB or takeover at MLB. Either way, it’s a smart pick for Philly.
24. New Orleans – Aaron Williams – CB depth and talent was their undoing last year. Aaron Williams has the best cover skills of those remaining, which is what is needed with Greg Williams gambling style of defense.
25. Seattle Seahawks - Anthony Costanzo – really, they are a prime candidate to trade down because they have many holes to fill and there are no true obvious BPA at this spot. If they could pickup an early 2nd & 3rd to trade down, I think they will.
26. Baltimore Ravens – Jimmy Smith – not really a secret they need secondary help. He’s the BPA there.
27. Atlanta Falcons – Torrey Smith – with Roddy White commanding all the attention, Torrey could be huge for that offense.
28. NE Patriots – Justin Houston – getting to Mark Sanchez is the key to winning their division. Houston will help there.
29. NY Jets – Adrian Clayborn – I am not all that high on Clayborn, but he possesses the build and has shown glimpses of being a good player. He probably fits better in a 4-3, but the Jets show a bunch of 4-3 looks and he can shift on and off the line for them in those.
30. Chicago Bears – Nate Solder – do I really even need to say that they have to grab some OL help?
31. Pittsburgh Steelers – Derek Sherrod – while the OT talent isn’t great in this draft, there are 5 guys all bunched together as being pretty decent. The Steelers get the last of them here.
32. GB Packers – Mike Pouncey – Thompson has been golden with his picks. Here’s another one. Rodgers likes to hold the ball, which puts a lot of pressure on their Ol. Having another upgrade there is just prudent drafting.

I'll start with some early drafts I did using player rankings.

6) Von Miller OLB Texas A&M
37) Muhammad Wilkerson DT Temple
70) Sam Acho DE Texas
104) Greg Little WR North Carolina
139) Jalil Brown CB Colorado
172) Chris Hairston OT Clemson
176) Nate Williams SS Washington

Wow, really would hate this draft...your top 3 picks are better fits in a 34 imho...Little is off my board due to obvious reasons

I did say this was earlier..like before I knew the scheme change..it's not like this recent one :


6)-A.J. Green WR Georgia
37)-Phil Taylor DT Baylor
70)-Sam Acho DE Texas
104)- Cortez Allen CB Citadel
139)--Lee Ziemba OT Auburn
172)- Thomas Keiser OLB Stanford
176)-Will Hill FS Florida

The reality is when I selected this group it was before I knew we were switching..would I select these guys today?
No..Miller is that speedy OLB ,but my concern is setting the edge and handling the outside run game.
I still like Wilkerson sitting next to Rubin but Kendrick Ellis is very high..
As far as Little ,I've read some things about his character that might send him dropping on some draft boards past the third round or someone may gamble on him.
Not sure what you meant by short changed on the picks..

I like Miller better in a 43, because he would be better protected by the DL as opposed to in the 34 were he would be up but basically on the line. He is going to have a little bit of a learning curve dropping into coverage in either defense, but he has range and speed that allows him some room for error.

Paired with a pass rushing DE should help him get more one on one opportunities.

Selects (Browns);

6, 37, 70, 101 (104), 134 (139), 163rd & 165th selections.

Unless you know something I don't.

I have no problem if we draft Von Miller.

Did they play a 4-3 or 3-4 at Texas A&M?

Selects (Browns);

6, 37, 70, 101 (104), 134 (139), 163rd & 165th selections.



Oh,I had read those picks might be a tad lower when they do the comp picks for the teams..so the picks might fall a bit later.

J/C

My Browns picks using drafttek.com (only can pick players who are available at each Browns slot or later). I pick round-by-round at whose available without looking ahead to see who I can steal later.

#6 Nick Fairley (they have him dropping to #15?)
alternate: AJ Green, Cameron Jordan

#37 Mikel Leshoure (I highly doubt he's still there though)
alternate: Cameron Heyward, Aaron Williams

#70 Vincent Brown
alternate: Lawrence Guy, Quad Sturdivant

#101 Nate Irving
alternate: Jarvis Jenkins, Greg Jones

#134 Pat Devlin (Holmgren's project)
alternate: DeMarcus Love, Chris Culliver

#162 Joseph Barksdale
alternate: Delone Carter, Chris Rucker

#164 Robert Sands
alternate: Lazarus Levingston, Aldrick Robinson


if done by need, then it might end up this way instead:

Jordan
Heyward
Brown
Irving
Culliver
Barksdale
Sands

This is a more recent addition using CBSSPORTS rankings.
I try not to use the same players in any two mocks I do once a website changes their rankings..just to keep from getting bored.

6)- A.J. Green WR Georgia
37)- Jabaal Sheard DE Pitt
70)- Mason Foster LB Washington
104)- Joseph Barksdale OT LSU
139)- Cortez Allen CB Citadel
172)- Terell McClain DT S.Florida
176)- Jeron Johnson FS Boise St


or:

6)- Cameron Jordan DE California *this is a reach.
37)-Torrey Smith WR Maryland
70)-Jarvis Jenkins DT Clemson
104)-Kelvin Sheppard LB LSU
139)-Derek Newton OT Arkansas State
172)-Ryan Hill CB Miami
176)-Cliff Matthews DE S.Carolina


The two players I just can't seem to gavitate to are Fairley and Robert Quinn.
I did a fresh one today but I won't post it for several days..I won't post my fianl mock till a week before the draft. By this time I'll have a tip as to several players the Browns are targeting..I do know Mason Foster is one right now.,

First here is how I think the first 5 picks pan out:

1. Panthers -Cam Newton –QB
2. Broncos – Nick Fairley - DT
3. Bills – Marcell Dareus - DT
4. Bengals- A.J. Green – WR
5. Cardinals - Von Miller- OLB

and then the Browns draft....

1. Patrick Peterson – CB - LSU
2. Brooks Reed – DE – Arizona
3. Marvin Austin – DT – North Carolina
4. Greg Romeus – DE - Pittsburgh
5. Deunta Williams – S – North Carolina
6. Noel Devine – HB – West Virginia
7. Aldrick Robinson – WR- SMU

Peterson really shouldn't fall to 6 talent wise, but very possibly could just b/c of his position.

J/k

Lets not forget to draft a young O-Lineman in the 3rd or 4th round We need to keep fueling the O-line with youth & talent every year, wish we could take one in the 1st or 2nd but we need other areas D-Line bad.

Looks good turk, man if we can get a Marvin Austin in the 3rd round I would be so happy.

He had the best 10: split (1.64) of any DT including Fairley or Dareus.

1) CAR -- Da'Quan Bowers
2) DEN -- Patrick Peterson
3) BUF -- JJ Watt
4) CIN -- Nick Fairley
5) AZ -- Von Miller
6) CLE -- Marcel Dareus DT
7) SF -- Cameron Jordan
8) TEN -- AJ Green
9) DAL -- Prince Amukamara
10) WAS -- Robert Quinn
11) HOU -- Tyron Smith
12) MIN -- Cam Newton
13) DET -- Anthony Castonzo
14) STL -- Julio Jones
15) MIA -- Blaine Gabbert
16) JAX -- Aldon Smith
17) NE -- Ryan Kerrigan
18) SD -- Brandon Harris
19) NYG -- Mark Ingram
20) TB -- Jimmy Smith
21) KC -- Muhammad Wilkerson
22) IND -- Corey Liuget
23) PHI -- Gabe Carimi
24) NO -- Akeem Ayers
25) SEA -- Jake Locker
26) BAL -- Mike Pouncey
27) ATL -- Stephen Paea
28) NE -- Adrian Clayborn
29) CHI -- Nate Solder
30) NYJ -- Phil Taylor
31) PIT -- Aaron Williams
32) GB -- Derrick Sherrod

2nd) CLE -- Cameron Heyward DE
3rd) CLE -- Colin McCarthy MLB
4th) CLE -- Vincent Brown WR
5th) CLE -- James Brewer RT
6a) CLE -- Brian Rolle OLB
6b) CLE -- Byron Maxwell CB

not trashing your mock (and anything that lands us Dareus is great by me), just wanted to know the reasons for some of the outliers from the common mock positions.

3. Buffalo - Watt - as a 3-4 DE, what traits do you have making him better than Jordan?

15. Miami - Gabbert - Do you think NFL teams will be smart enough to stay away or is this just how you would draft?

Watt
Well, to me Buffalo is the classic "IDGAF about others' opinions" team when it comes to drafting (see Donte Whitner, John McCargo, etc.) I think they'll see Watt as the tough guy that plays angry and would be happy in a cold-weather city. He's as athletic as any DL in the draft (at least based on combine workouts). He dominated in big games (TCU, OSU.) His measurables are essentially the same as Jordan. When it comes to 5-tech, he's as good as it gets IMO.

Gabbert
I think that there are so many questions with this guy, as well as learning curve, that the bad teams could think "We're going to have to throw him in right away, and that's not going to be good. If we're going to be crappy with him anyway, we might as well wait till next year and take Luck or Barkley or someone else we think is better." Miami on the other hand has a mediocre starter and could push through one more year with Henne but know he needs to be replaced. Plus, they won't be bad enough to land an elite QB next year.

That's what I was thinking anyways. Do I really think we're going to get Dareus? Probably not. I mainly wanted to post this for the two picks you asked me about, actually (as well as the Newton pick.)

Thanks. That makes sense.

Draft Prospects on my radar:

» 1-6, CB Patrick Peterson,
DT Nick Fairley, DE Da'Quan Bowers, LB Von Miller, DT Marcell Dareus and WR AJ Green. Or
Trade down for
DE Cameron Jordan or
OT Gabe Carimi.
(Pick up another 2nd round selection)


» 2-37, DT Stephen Paea, OL Ben Ijalana, DT Marvin Austin, CB Aaron Williams and WR Torrey Smith, (DE Jabaal Shear, DE Brooks Reed and DE Sam Acho).


» 3-70, OL James Carpenter, DL Allen Bailey, WR Titus Young, DT Kenrick Ellis and DT Jarvis Jenkins.


» 4-101, WR Tandon Doss, DB Chris Culliver, OT James Brewer, CB Jalil Brown, CB Marcus Gilchrist, DE Pierre Allen and DE Ugo Chinasa.


» 5-134, QB Greg McElroy, LB, Casey Matthews, RB Delone Carter, OG John Moffitt and WR Austin Pettis.  


» 6-163 & 165, DT Martin Parker, OT Chris Hairston, DE Greg Romeus, DT Terrell Mcclain, OG Keith Williams, DT Cedric Thornton, WR Greg Salas, FS Deunta Williams and WR/TE DeA Brown.

Solid list overall, I don't like the idea of Carimi in the 1st, even after a trade down....it would be the same mistake we made in 09 with the Mack-trade down pick....ending up with a C or RT holding a Top 7 pick is horrible draft day position-value management

Other thoughts on your list:

- DE Bailey is off my board no matter what, just punt him and maybe pick him up as a FA when you have little invested and hope for his EGO to prove everybody wrong...how many athlete-prospects with bad film have succeeded lately? See...wouldn't even waste 1 of our 6ths on him

- would not touch Fairley, Bowers, Quinn or Von Miller with our pick and even anywhere in the Top 10-15...for different reasons

- like your 5th round list best, would be very happy with any of those guys in the 5th

- big DT Parker pimp myself, but I guess his East-West MVP award has opened some eyes and being a DT I suspect he'll go earlier

- for me I'd be ok with any of Gabbert, Peterson, Dareus, Green or Jordan at 6...anyone else I'd cringe....Gabbert and Dareus have biggest upside/ceiling compared to their position-value but are the riskiest of those 6 (lowest floor) imho. Safest bet from a mix of need, position value and high floor is DE Jordan imho....he's not an elite pass rusher but a 3down DE lock, he can play outside on 1st and 2nd and move inside replacing Rubin on passing 3rd downs, making room for a situational pass rushing DE like Benard outside...never underestimate scheme versatility with DL...Dareus offers similar versatility, whereas Quinn and Bowers are DE-only...they better get you 10+ sacks annualy or they're busts, since they never will be known to be good run defenders....think Gholston, Maybin, Anderson busts...and those are just from recent drafts

- I like Paea at #37 a lot....if he's gone, that is the perfect spot to trade down, since it's a big tier of similar talented prospects reaching into the 3rd, where team specific scheme and preference will dictate who will come off earlier....pick up some more 4th-5th rounders, that's where the best value in this draft is imho

- like Carpenter and Young and Gilchrist as a FS

Quote:

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Solid list overall, I don't like the idea of Carimi in the 1st, even after a trade down

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I agree with this unless there's no franchise tag in the new CBA and Thomas walks, then it's no longer terrible as he'd be our starting LT. I'm just hoping Solder falls all the way to GB so they don't have a 'need' there when Joe T. can hit the market.

i meant after this season. sorry for not being clear.

Quote:

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Solid list overall, I don't like the idea of Carimi in the 1st, even after a trade down....it would be the same mistake we made in 09 with the Mack-trade down pick....ending up with a C or RT holding a Top 7 pick is horrible draft day position-value management

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I totally agree (if we are picking 2 3rd round prospects in the 2nd round).

I think that there is still good value on the DL in the 2nd round or I would not approve of a trade down for RT Gabe Carimi in the 1st round. Even still it would still be considered some what of a reach, because I don't see us drafting down out of the top 10 picks. We could probably trade down again and pick up even more draft picks and still have the chance at Carimi in the 1st round.

Carimi isn't a LT imho, not even sure he'd be more than an AVG to ok RT...profiles best to G imho...I don't consider him 1st round talent but since there aren't 32 prospects this draft that I'd rate as such but much more 2nd to 4th round guys I understand that some get hyped to be bottom 1st rounders and if anyone thinks he can play LT then he should be 1 of the guys that fills this 1st round talent void

Quote:

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I don't consider him 1st round talent but since there aren't 32 prospects this draft that I'd rate as such

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Well, this I agree with all the way, especially on offense. I think the D pulls its share of 1st round talents (4 corners, 3 DTs, 7DEs [I'm leaving out Clayborn], a couple LBs) but the O is very weak behind 2 wideouts, 2 OTs, maybe Pouncey, and that might be it. Everyone past that to me is pushing it just to fill in the space.

I agree, we will lose value if we move down, just because the gap between the top 7 and the rest is large, as is the top 15 from the rest. Best case trade down scenario I could see is a move down to one of the sucker teams in need of a QB like WAS or TEN or SF or MIN wants to give us a 2 to move up and we can still get Watt. After that, we could possibly get Sherrod or Carimi for free in the 2nd. I would only consider this if Dareus, Peterson, and Green were gone.

I agree on not trading down if one of the elite guys is still there. I would add Bowers to your list, but that's just me.

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for non-1st round offensive talents, do you not consider either of the RBs a 1st round grade? I think Ingram is over-hyped, but I would think LeShoure would be a 1st round pick most years.

I think its getting tougher and tougher to justify RBs as 1st rounders unless they are very special players. Rashard Mendenhall nearly beat an incredible USC team by himself, and he went #23. Felix Jones was a terrific running back in college. He went #22 and has to be considered a bust. It was a shock to most everybody when Reggie Bush wasn't taken #1 overall. He's considered a bust after going #2 (that sounds really bad.) Mario Williams went #1 instead and nobody considers that a bad pick.

Spiller, Matthews, and Best all went in round 1 last year and none of them (at least for year 1) justified that pick. Blount was easily the best rusher among rookies.

Arian Foster was undrafted. Jamaal Charles was picked in the 3rd round. Michael Turner in the 5th. Chris Johnson was taken in the first. MJD was taken in the 2nd round. Right there are your top 5 rushers (in terms of total rushing yards) for 2010. Only 1 player picked before #60. Which of these guys is a better runner than one of them?

Adrian Peterson was definitely worth a first. Rashard Mendenhall, Steven Jackson, Darren McFadden, yes. They were all worthy of a 1st rounder. I don't know that I'd put Leshoure or Ingram quite in their class. I do love the way Ingram breaks tackles, but I think the blocking on the line and on the perimeter he got from the likes of James Carpenter and Julio Jones (two guys I've been pushing for for a while now) made his numbers significantly better.