DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Free Agency Needs

If we have free agency what needs and players should we target?

1. I want a veteran WR like Santana Moss
2. Another DE opposite of sheard
3. O-line and D-line depth

If Roth walks, I think a LB (hopefully OLB) should be on the list. We don't know if DQ can hold up with 2 pec tears in 2 years. Fujita, Gocong, Bernard and who else? Doesn't look like Bowens or Barton are coming back. Trusnik has heart, but that's about it.

#1 - A top flight RT

I've gotten into disagreements with several other posters about this. So let me enumerate why:

1.) We are not going to compete this year, there is a ton of rebuilding to do, and the Steelers/Ravens are very good.

2.) This is a key developmental year for Colt McCoy - developing quarterbacks are destroyed when they are on their backs constantly. They get happy feet, and never learn to make correct reads. The same goes for our developing WR core - you can't run WCO timing routes if the pocket is continually collapsing.

3.) Tackles are long lived in the NFL. A top flight 4th/5th year tackle that we get this year, will still be at the top of his game in 3-4 years when we are hopefully in the middle of our playoff push.

4.) There are a number of OT FA's who fit the bill this year:

Tyson Clabo
Doug Free

Jared Gaither
Jamaal Brown
Jermon Bushrod
Willie Colon

Alex Barron
Jeremy Trueblood

Clabo and Free will probably be resigned. Gaither/Brown would be my top two targets. Picking Colon from the Steelers would also be great. Barron/Trueblood and a few others (Strief maybe?) represent third options which would still improve over Pashos.

5.) A very minor point, because it's still very early. But there isn't much tackle depth in the 2012 draft. Kiper at this point only lists one OT as a fringe first rounder.

~Lyuokdea

Trusnik should be a DE

I agree. If we can sign one the top FA RTs we would be set at the line for awhile and if Pinkston pans out we'd have some nice depth / versatility along the line as well. Heckert should do what it takes to get this done.

Wouldn't mind seeing us go after Sidney Rice and Nnamdi as well, but those are pipe dreams.

It is a good possibility that Vernon Gholston will be released by the jets, and if that happends I think he could be a good fit. I don't think he is suited for a 3-4 imo, and he would be cheap.

Jets already released him.

Give Kaluka Maiva more time!

re free agency needs

.....WR like ya had to ask Where have you gone Dennis Northcutt, a nation turns it lonley eyes to you.

Suppose there is a very limited time to make a free agent ploy for a grab at a player, it would be nice to have a guy in mind.
Let me stick with my rules, so as not to be a flip flopper, that they shouln't take anyone over 27 and not sign more than 3 free agents.
Well this guy has got to be 30 yrs old but I think we all know, with a change in scenery he still has football in the tank.

The Browns twice passed up a free agency where TJ Houshmanzadeh was a free agent, so it's not a fit. They at least once passed up a free agency where Terrell Owens was a free agent.

( this is going to be a VERY CONTROVERSIAL WANT on my part, no doubt)

Actions speak louder than words, and actions are , The Bengals signed T.O. in 2010,
The Bengals Drafted Jordan Shipley wr, and Germaine Gresham TE in 2010, so they were looking for something on offense.
The Bengals have had a falling out with QB CArson Palmer who plans to retire, so its unstable there..
The Bengals just drafted Andy Dalton QB from TCU, so there is No continuity with the receivers there,

there is no long term teamate love...

The Bengals Just drafted AJ Green, we all know the #1 rated WR, in this draft with the 4th overall pick. These actions cannot , should not be overlooked.

We Know the Browns don't have (a giant amount of) touchdowns, they have no deepthreat beyond ? who has a long term career, there is definetly need for veteran leadership at WR on the Browns...

The Bengals, are looking are looking ahead, not to the past at WR, they seem to have decided to go in a new direction, We See the way the Bengal head Coach relates to some of his players,

It is not hard to imagine it is an unstable enviroment to be a longtime member of the Bengals offense.

Now Chad OchoCinco, is known for talking, and playing football, we know he plays soccer, and has a TV show, ( watched a couple times) on TV.

It is not Hard to See the writing on the wall that the Bengals and Chad Ocho Cinco could very possibly Part ways, and part ways with bad feelings. So

after all of that, ( and save me your snide coments about how collassaly stupid an idea it is, because, take a real honest look at the wr production on the beloved Browns the past 3 years) So
After all of that: in a list of
Pro's and Con's and Everybody on this board will add a list of Con's so here are the Pro's to a look at Chad if he should leave the Bengals on bad terms.

Pros' 1, Veteran, He's an NFL vet who knows what to expect and would be in a new enviroment , with a chance to turn over a new leaf, he will have alot to prove, and we all know vets with alot to prove, look good.

2 He knows the Baltimore and Pittsburgh db's, Chad Ochocinco, couldn't be more knowledeable of our divisions db's ( vs the avg free agent) than if he were a member of their team.

3 You Know EXACTLY and I mean Exactly what you get with this guy, This guy for better or worse is open and visible, there are really no question marks, the plusses and minuses are all out there for everyone to see, You wouldn't have to wonder what you'll get.

4 He's gonna Hate Cincinnati, he's gonna Know the Cincinnati team and Hate the Cincinnati organization for giving up on him, if they do, and that will translate into some inspired performances out of spite.

And the Browns are gonna know what He can do, Being in the division the Browns are going to have studied this player and know what he can offer, and will know what it means to a defense to have to account for him.

Now somebody will probably tell me that he's under contract for the next (x number of) years, Well nobody knows what is going to happen the next 6 month's. ( This is entire speculation on my part that the Bengals will part with Chad, and he'll be signable in free agency, but I can hope.) The enemy of my enemy is my friend.

1) Depth in the trenches at O-line and D-line...

2) Safety help... really surprised we didnt draft a Safety.. maybe we can get Deunta Williams as a UDFA whenever FA starts... I'm sure he'll go to Carolina though.

Wouldn't be surprised though if they brought in a LB..

Wonder if Benard plays DE or OLB.. I'm hoping DE. He can FLY around that edge.

I think that I've got to 100% agree with you here.

We NEED a top tier RT. Pinkston is NOT going to be a RT for us... he's probably going to end up as our RG (at best) or practice squad (most likely).

The defense is gonna be a sieve this year no matter what.... we're just not going to have enough pieces to make it work as well as the coaches would like, but the offense should have everything it needs to click the way it should - except a solid tackle on the right side that isn't a turnstile.

Beyond that, a veteran WR of some sort would be good - or just anyone that will beat it into these kids' heads how utterly important precise route running is so that they all work their butts off at doing just that.

First we need to look at who is gonna b a FA...When this BS is lifted and FA starts with using 2010 rules...Only players with 6+ years will be UFA's...That lowers the total pot bigtime but still lots available...

7) Q: What determines an unrestricted free agent in the Final League Year (2010)?

A: In capped seasons, a player whose contract has expired becomes an unrestricted free agent if he has four or more accrued seasons. In the Final League Year (2010), a player whose contract has expired becomes an unrestricted free agent only if he has six or more accrued seasons. An unrestricted free agent is free to sign with any club with no compensation owed to his old club.

MY 1st 2 I contact are...

Kiwanuka DE Turned 28 in March (Charles Johnson would be RFA)
Johnathan Joseph CB Turned 27 in April

And sign both to 4 or 5 year deals...

Question ......

Shawn Lauvoa played some RT in college. He's short ... but we have a short QB .....(as someone pointed out yesterday)

Could Lauvoa move to RT with Pinkston at RG?

Chad Johnson is 33 years old and a cancer.

I'd wait to see if Pinkston makes the team first... I'm betting that he starts the year on the Practice Squad.

I'm not even betting that there will be a year .... let alone who will go where.

The Browns are scheduled to open Training Camp on Jul 23. It's May 1st. We have no movement whatsoever on a CBA. It's T-Minus 83 days and counting .......

If I had to guess, I would guess that Pinkston will make the team just because they gave up 2 picks to move up to get him. If we had stayed with our 2 6th rounders, and taken him with one of them .... then maybe he might be a PS guy. However, I think that he'll get every chance in the world to make the team. (especially if a revised CBA includes an expanded roster)

I guess I have a different opinion of Ochocinco than most. I don't see him as a cancer. I think a player doesn't stay with the same team as long as he has with the Bengals if he is a team cancer. I think he is a goofball, for sure, and he does have some issues with rules at times but that can be managed. I'm not sure what his status is but wouldn't mind seeing the Browns at least take a look.

I think Johnson isn't necessarily a cancer but certainly a distraction. If you're in a playoff run a distraction for the team could be a positive, drawing the media's attention letting everyone else to deal with the task at hand but when you suck, like the bengals often do, it's just a distraction for the teams chances of winning.

i'm with you on Ochocincho (never can spell that name)--- but he has Patriot written all over him!!

I don't hate Chad like some on here do, but I don't think he is a good pick-up for any team. He is too old and his production no longer can excuse his antics.

Basically, Chad is one of those people who likes to bend the rules, and throughout his life, he has been allowed to bend the rules because he was still able to produce--so people accepted his crap b/c they knew they were also getting good value/production.

There are lots of people on this planet that operate the same way--you might work with one. Someone who does their job very well, and so, the powers-that-be are a little more lenient with regard to that persons eccentricities.

With all this said, I think Chads act has worn thin in Cincy, and, his production/value can no longer excuse his behavior.

This is something that always happens with these types of people....at some point, the employer will grow tired of the act, they are no longer willing to accept whatever value the employee has to offer---and the professional relationship ends. Sometimes it is declining performance (as it is in this case), sometimes the behavior is no longer appropriate, and sometimes the balance just faulters and the employee's antics have grown so outlandish that the employer can no longer justify putting up with the bs--despite the great production.


Long story short. Chad is not worth it in Cincy, and he is going to find that he is not worth it anywhere else either. Unless he drastically, drastically scales back his behavior, no team is going to accept him with his current baggage. No gm can justify bringing in this side show b/c his numbers just aren't there--and his age makes him a liability as ell.

Chad is done in the league, but he has positioned himself well for a career after football in the entertainment industry, or possibly media.

The guy I want us to target is Nnamdi Asomugha.That's assuming he'll be a FA.

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I'd wait to see if Pinkston makes the team first... I'm betting that he starts the year on the Practice Squad.

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Pinkston will not be put on the practice squad, because he would be scooped up by another team in an instant.

Here's my list of targets, subject to change. I think we'll be making a lot of moves (including not resigning a lot of current guys, and picking up cheap talent that can fit our system.) I've included two blue-chip FAs in here, both of whom I think are obtainable. Everything else should be relatively inexpensive, and fits our schemes well:


Resign:

Seneca Wallace, QB - Great backup for a WCO
Eric Wright (RFA) - Had a down season, which will cost him in the wallet, still a very talented 2nd/3rd cornerback when his head is in the game
D'Qwell Jackson - It remains to be seen how he will recover from injuries. He's a much better fit in the 4-3 scheme than he ever was in a 3-4.
Chris Gocong - While Roth probably leaves. Gocong could stay at a reasonable price. He has a good motor, and could fit in as an extra DE on passing downs, or even as a situational strong side OLB. Kind of a flex player we can put in for specific packages.


Targets:

Jared Gaither, RT (Ravens) - I go back and forth between Gaither and Jamaal Brown - but Gaither's pass blocking ability from the right side puts him over the top. Steeling talent from the Ravens is an added bonus. Any effort issues will be taken care of when you're lining up opposite Joe Thomas and Alex Mack. The only question is whether he will voluntarily play on the right side, or whether he still thinks of himself as an LT. I suspect if we offer the best pay - he won't reject it.

Mathias Kiwanuka, DE (NYG) - I think we'll target two high priced free agents this offseason, especially after saving $20M+ by dropping out of the top of the draft. Kiwanuka is a perfect fit schematically into the Jauron offense, and should provide us an instant upgrade in pass rush. He's a veteran pass rusher with a multitude of moves, and should be a great mentor for our younger DEs.

Gabe Watson, DT (Arizona) - Massive 2-Gap NT has gotten very little burn in Arizona the last few years, and could come very cheaply. Effort/conditioning has always been his problem, but can effectively spell Taylor/Rubin, giving us a solid rotation of 3 2-gap DTs. Some worry that his lack of effort could become problematic... Another option (albeit more expensive) is his teammate Alan Branch.

T.J. Houshmandzadeh, WR (Bal) - A wily veteran wideout who could teach our talented core a lot about getting open against zone coverage and exploiting matchups. Not the most physically gifted or quick receiver, especially now. But has perfected the details and taken himself from a low round pick into an above average receiver. Still shows enough flash to spread the field a bit, and has great timing for WCO routes. Other options would be Mark Clayton, or Santana Moss, depending on the level of interest.

Thomas Davis, OLB (Carolina) - This is a little hard to predict - because I have a hard time figuring out what the demand for Davis will be after two ACL surgeries. He's a perfect fit for our scheme, which requires a lot of persuit speed from the weak outside linebacker, where he'll be slotted. A former safety, he excels in coverage and will help offset our strong LB situation, which will likely be a 3-4 OLB convert.

Ernie Sims, OLB (Philadelphia) - Another talented, if undersized LB who may come cheap, and would yield a perfect match to our system. Sims has been productive when healthy, and will get a second chance as a full time starter in our system.

Chinedum Ndukwe, S (Bengals) - I'm having trouble guessing what safeties best fit our scheme here. I'm not quite sure I know enough about it. We can get a little younger at this position, and get a more physical player than Elam, at a very reasonable price.

Jerious Norwood, RB (Falcons) - A change of pace back who is a good pass-catcher out of the backfield, and will come quite cheap. Look for a UDFA to also possibly take this place. A much better (but possibly more expensive) fit would be Brian Westbrook, who, while on the downside of his career - would provide an important release route for Colt McCoy.


~Lyuokdea

I believe that Jauron's defense plays more of a true SS/FS than Mangini did. If that's the case, then we would almost certainly be on the lookout for a true center fielder type Safety, unless they think that Piscatelli could be that type of player, and they re-sign him.

I really don't see us adding any veteran WRs. The team is supposedly happy with Robiske and Massaquoi, and think that they will fit the WCO, they like Carlton Mitchell. I have heard a lot of talk about Jordan Norwood, and he looks the part of a perfect slot WCO WR. They just drafted Little, and they still have Cribbs (who almost certainly makes the team) and Demetrius Williams. (who Heckert was reported to think highly of) That's 7 guys competing for a maximum of 6 jobs. I suspect that they'll add some UDFA to round out a camp roster .... if we ever get to camp ..... but I don't see any big names being added here.

I also don't see them adding any big name OL. They like 4/5 of their OL. They just drafted a guy to be their RT. They still have last year's RT as a backup/competition. I take Heckert at his word that they're not going to be big shoppers in free agency.

If they do any shopping, I could see them looking for an impact MLB, a speedy OLB, and maybe another DT who would come fairly inexpensively, but would fit the system. If they found the right FS they could pull the trigger there too. They might re-sign Piscatelli. I'm not sure if he can, but he has the speed at 4.47 to play a classic FS position.

I think they'll address a "3rd down" RB in the UDFA class, and probably backup DT as well. There is still a ton of talent available at those 2 position. The draft was extraordinarily weak at 4/3 OLB and MLB ... so if they find a great fit they might make a move there. If not they may be content to play out this year and find some LB early in next year's draft.

From everything I have heard come out of Heckert's mouth since the end of the season, it would surprise me greatly if we spend big on any more than 1 or 2 "special" free agents, or a really cheap guy to fill in for a year. Who knows though .. maybe it's all a smokescreen? lol

Yeah, probably the Steelers,....

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Seneca Wallace, QB - Great backup for a WCO
Eric Wright (RFA) - Had a down season, which will cost him in the wallet, still a very talented 2nd/3rd cornerback when his head is in the game
D'Qwell Jackson - It remains to be seen how he will recover from injuries. He's a much better fit in the 4-3 scheme than he ever was in a 3-4.
Chris Gocong - While Roth probably leaves. Gocong could stay at a reasonable price. He has a good motor, and could fit in as an extra DE on passing downs, or even as a situational strong side OLB. Kind of a flex player we can put in for specific packages.

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Just a heads up. We already re-signed Wallace and Jackson.

Also, Gocong played in the Eagles 4-3 and was awful.

Jared Gaither would be awesome. But it seems like some team would be him to be a starting left tackle. Something I wouldn't be willing to do to have him play on the right side.

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T.J. Houshmandzadeh, WR (Bal)

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Are we sure he's still alive. He was pretty bad for the Ravens last year.

I think a lot of the guys you mentioned would be restricted free agents.

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I think they'll address a "3rd down" RB in the UDFA class

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Just curious, why can't Hillis be our 3rd down running back? He has the hands for it and he can block.

The idea that drafting a RT/OG hybrid in the 5th round somehow clears up our hole at RT for this year is laughable...

There's a 50/50 shot he doesn't even make the team. Of our three 5th round and later picks last year, only one made the final cut. One out of three the year before too.

~Lyuokdea

True ... but to be fair

Mitchell: Us
Geathers: Cut then signed by the Dolphins, then cut and signed by the Cowboys
Asante: Us then signed by the Bucs ... where he finished the year with playing time.

Year before:
Francies: Was with us? Not sure ... either practice squad or whatever, he's currently in the UFL though.... I think we waived him Sept. 3rd from what I could find.
Davis: Currently with the redskins ... you know how Shanny loves to hoard late round running backs. He had time in 7 games once we cut him with Washington ... but had a few rushes, receptions and kick off returns as well...
Carey: Scooped up by those #$%@^'s the jaguars. He played 15 games for them at FS and started 10. 55 tackles, 1 int ... not eye opening but wouldn't be bad to have here. Could have at least been a replacement for Elam?

So while they might not be pro bowlers, it's not like they were all wasted picks either. They could all have been special teams players and back end of the roster back ups.

oh - I agree, they weren't wastes of a draft spot...but they aren't doing any good for us either.

I'm just making the point that - you shouldn't factor in our 5th+ round daft picks, when you decide where our needs are for free agency.

Francies was re-signed by us late last year.

Obviously Heckert thinks a lot of the kid. He gave up 2 picks to trade up to get him.


I suspect that he'll make the team.

I do not think that we're going to go signing any OL in free agency. In fact, I don't think that we'll sign much of anything in free agency. We'll see what happens.

Every team in the league would love to have Asomugha. That's the problem. He will have his choice of what team he goes to because all of them will be offering ridiculous contracts.

We're going to let upwards of 10 people go....we're going to have to get somebody....

Mike Bell
Lawrence Vickers
Chansi Stuckey
Alex Smith
Jayme Mitchell
Robaire Smith
Matt Roth
Jason Trusnik
Abram Elam
Sabby Piscitelli

Are all likely gone - just as a numbers game, we'll be picking up a few players.

~Lyuokdea