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I'm going to come off as sounding rather pig-headed here, but ... she looks like white trash. She's a 6, at best ... the type of girl you find doing internet porn.
JMHO.
Voice of authority speaking?? 
Sadly, no.
I keep hearing about all this internet porn, but I'm never able to find it. 
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she looks like white trash. She's a 6, at best ... the type of girl you find doing internet porn.
What does this have to do with anything???  
I would argue everything.
If she weren't considered to be or portrayed as attractive ... this story would be local only.
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j/c I mentioned earlier about forced sterilization of Casey and DC (rightly I suppose) took me to task about it, but for petes sake man, this woman should NEVER be a care giver to a child again. She should be mentally evaluated and if determined to be psychologically unsound be, at the very least, ordered to have norplant and barred from adopting. I just can't get my head around the thought of her being a mother again. Casey wants more children "I've thought about adopting, which even sounds weird to me saying it, but there are so many children that deserve to be loved," she wrote to inmate Robyn Adams at the Orlando County Jail. "Let's make a deal? Let's get pregnant together?"
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She's a 6, at best ... the type of girl you find doing internet porn.
You need better websites. 
yebat' Putin
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It is a strange world that we live in that I needed to pass all sorts of checks to see if I was fit to adopt a dog but anybody can have a baby... How would you like to be the case worker when you got her application to adopt? 
yebat' Putin
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yes, what you call an embryo, I call a child. therefore, they are the same to me. with me at least, it is that simple.
So in the case of rape. the woman should be force to carry the child to term?
I love when people take extreme instances to make a case for something in general
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It's not extreme, it's realistic. In your one-in-the-same argument you would have to adhere to the same standard. Or is rape victim's embryo not a child?
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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It is extreme because you are trying to use 3% of all abortions in this country to direct the conversation away from the other 97%.... (I believe those are the stats I read a couple years ago on rape and incest abortions)
If you want my heartfelt opinion, aborting a baby, even one conceived in rape, is wrong... but from a popular or political standpoint I fully realize that I'm in the extreme minority with that opinion and would never even try to fight for it... Anybody who wants to reduce abortions needs to start with the convenience abortions and work their way out from there... convincing a woman who was raped that she should have the baby anyway is not a position of mine that I would try to put on anybody else.
yebat' Putin
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I agree. And funny, but I already said basically the same thing in the rest of the post that Florida decided to delete from his quote 
#gmstrong
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I agree with whoever it was that brought up the point earlier (or maybe in the other thread) that a lot of these "convenience abortions" are largely a result of the women feeling as if she cannot handle it alone and being terrified. They argued that if men would step up and be involved and supportive, abortions would plummet. I don't know if that is correct, but it sounds logical to me.
I'd be interested in trying some programs that focused on teaching boys and young men to be responsible when they're still young enough not to have those irresponsible behaviors completely ingrained into them. Obviously teaching abstinence is not working. Teaching to use condoms is only marginally effective. How about we try teaching them to be parents and stick around?
I'm interested in the conservative viewpoint since it is mostly against social programs. Would something like that be worth tax dollars, assuming it was more well thought out and effectively planned than the 2 minutes I just put into it to type that out? Maybe a parenting class in high school?
"All I know is, as long as I led the Southeastern Conference in scoring, my grades would be fine." - Charles Barkley
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I agree with you.
Abstinence works to a degree, but most women don't get pregnant the first time they have sex and most men don't impregnate a woman the first time either.
You usually have to work at it.....and once a kid starts having sex, they aren't going to stop.
"Just Man Up" is what I would call it.
But then again......I am sure there are many cases of the guy not wanting the girl to abort the baby.....if women have the option, men should as well.
If a woman doesn't want it and can get rid of it, men should be able to abort their responsibility....there are two sides to every door I have ever seen.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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If a woman doesn't want it and can get rid of it, men should be able to abort their responsibility....
Really, Peen? REALLY? 
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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If a woman doesn't want it and can get rid of it, men should be able to abort their responsibility....
Really, Peen? REALLY?
Why not? I know it wouldn't be that simple, but Peen is right. If the male wants the child, he has no choice. If he doesn't, he has no choice.
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they have "parenting" classes in high school. you have to drag a hard boiled egg around or a doll that cries for a week...
A large part of the problem is that the community most affected by this is the impoverished black community... Having a baby at 16 is almost considered a badge of honor in that community like having a tattoo or having done your time in juvy. It's not like they fear not finishing high school, many of them didn't expect to finish anyway.. and not being able to go to college? that's a joke... and not having the father around? How many of them had THEIR father around or know of any really successful traditional families?
You can't scare them into wearing condoms or using birth control, you can't convince them that adoption is a good option and no amount of "training" is going to convince them that staying home and playing daddy is better than going out and being a player... Basically you have to change the entire culture of failure and government dependence.... You can win small battles but to win the war would take an effort of almost Biblical proportion and it's something no government program could ever accomplish because... well because... because government programs suck and never work..
yebat' Putin
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Oh, I agree that men should have rights...I have always said that...but that isn't exactly what Ballpeen said, imo.
The way he said it seems to be that if the woman wants to keep the child, but the man doesn't, then the man shouldn't have to support the kid.
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I'm pretty sure that is exactly what he meant... but you disagree?
yebat' Putin
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If a woman doesn't want it and can get rid of it, men should be able to abort their responsibility....there are two sides to every door I have ever seen.
I know a woman (sociopath) that has three children from three different fathers and is getting child support from all three. Bar tending under the table (basically) and getting earned income tax credit. Year end and year out
She trapped all three and was said to be on birth control at the time.
Yeah I think that there is a need for the other side of the door you speak of.
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I'm pretty sure that is exactly what he meant... but you disagree?
That is exactly what he meant and I agree completely.
#GMSTRONG
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I'm pretty sure that is exactly what he meant... but you disagree?
Yes, I believe I do. Any man could cry "I didn't want it...I shouldn't have to support it!" and be free from responsibility.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Sorry to all the boys here, but men were blessed with things women don't have, like more strength, etc., and women were blessed with being the one to carry a child. She inherently holds more rights in regards to the birth of the child due to that, regardless of whether she makes the right decisions or not. Cry all you want, that's the way it is.
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She will be free in a week which is sickening. RIP Caylee as you deserved much more better justice.
September to Remember!
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Local news just said BabyMamaKiller will be released on July 17th, not next Wednesday.
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Local news just said BabyMamaKiller will be released on July 17th, not next Wednesday.
In other new ...Lightning strikes tree nearby where Caylee was dumped today.
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She inherently holds more rights in regards to the birth of the child due to that,
That's fine but I believe what is being said is if she decides to have the child the male should have the right to give up his responsibility.
If a guy and a girl have a one night stand and she get pregnant, she has the right to get an abortion even if the guy would want the child.
But if the guy doesn't want the child and she does he is forced to pay for it? That is not right. It maybe the way it is right now but it doesn't mean things can't change.
And that's not crying, I'm not in that situation and I don't ever plan on being in that situation just feel that if a woman wants to have the child and if the male files in court to give up his legal rights as the parent before the child is born then the woman has the choice to keep the child and raise it by herself, give it up for adoption or have an abortion.
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I'm sorry, but all I can say to your post is....
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Oh, I agree that men should have rights...I have always said that...but that isn't exactly what Ballpeen said, imo.
The way he said it seems to be that if the woman wants to keep the child, but the man doesn't, then the man shouldn't have to support the kid.
Yes, that's what I said.
If a woman can abort a child because she isn't ready emotionally or financially to be a parent and raise a child, a man should have the same rights.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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At 52 and married, I'm not likely to ever find myself in that situation, and never having kids of my own, never did find myself in that situation. Even way back when I was young they knew what caused the situation and for the most part how to prevent it. I accepted that responsibility for myself regardless of what someone else told me they were doing. But to your post, sorry, all I can say is... 
#GMSTRONG
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I understand you all think that would be "fair". I would argue two wrongs don't make a right. Also, the burden would get bigger for society as a whole because these things happen: 1. Many more people enter the welfare system because LOTS of guys are going to walk away from this obligation. 2. Guys who, right now, don't sleep with every woman they come across due to the possible financial burden will go after everything they see. So, you have an increase in pregnancies, abortions, people on welfare, more kids without fathers. Yeah, that seems "fair". 
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There are already tons of kids who are born to guys who cannot, or will not take care of them.
There are kids who have fathers who do a little towards their support ...... but ultimately, the state (and taxpayers) really "father" these children. I had numerous child support orders for young kids when I ran my restaurant. These kids worked 20 or so hours/week ..... and paid a minimal amount towards their child's care.
There are kids who have no idea who their father is ..... because their mother has no idea who their father is ...
Maybe the answer is to require responsibility ...... not escape from responsibility. Abortion truly is an escape from responsibility on the part of the woman. If a woman is sexually active, then she should be on birth control if she doesn't want children. If a woman is truly concerned about being pregnant as a result of a "lost night", or some other BS .... then she can go get a "morning after" pill. But no ...... instead we wait ...... and postpone ...... and delay .... until the child is identifiable as a child ...... then kill it.
That's deplorable.
Anyway ..... I think that any woman who is on welfare should have to be implanted with a birth control devise that is completely automatic. It may not be 100% foolproof .... but it's better than people having child after child for the taxpayers to support. If a woman wants her check ..... she gets an implanted birth control device. Don't want to do it? No check. pretty simple.
There is progress towards a male birth control system as well. When it is available, then those who have children in the welfare system should be required to take it as well.
I am just sick to death of people not taking responsibility for their actions. If people are going to have sex, then they have to understand that there are potential consequences for that act ..... just like there is for every other action. Unfortunately, we spend massive amounts of time and money trying to absolve people from their responsibilities. It is probably the biggest problem we face as a society today. No one is responsible for what they do ....... and it's never their fault. There are societal pressures, and parenting issues, and on and on and on ...... but in the end, it is a lack of personal responsibility that defines far too many today. Abortion is just one symptom ...... but it is a big symptom.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I understand you all think that would be "fair". I would argue two wrongs don't make a right.
Also, the burden would get bigger for society as a whole because these things happen:
1. Many more people enter the welfare system because LOTS of guys are going to walk away from this obligation.
2. Guys who, right now, don't sleep with every woman they come across due to the possible financial burden will go after everything they see.
So, you have an increase in pregnancies, abortions, people on welfare, more kids without fathers.
Yeah, that seems "fair".
Thanks for the breakdown, Jules. 
Guys can choose to wrap it up. There are several lines of defense to avoid pregnancy.
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Well I could argue that you might actually see a reduction in pregnancies. There are women that get pregnant on purpose to keep/trap a man. If they don't have the ability to do that then perhaps they won't get pregnant in the first place.
I know there are extreme cases but for the most part the average woman getting pregnant in today's day in age IMO is either on purpose or willful negligence (on both the man and woman). She can be on the pill and should know about which time of the month she is ovulating, he can wear a condom and forgive me for the graphic mental image, he can pull out. I know that is not 100% full proof but it will be high 90% effective.
I would rather have two people committed to each other raise the child. I don't want any abortions. But I do feel that as a man I don't have the right to tell a woman what to do with her body. However I also feel a man's life is his own and a woman shouldn't have the right to choose his life for him.
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should know about which time of the month she is ovulating
Sadly, most women have no idea how their cycles really work. All you have to do is peruse a "trying to conceive" message board to know this is the case. There is really only a week during the month when we can get pregnant....and it would be really easy to abstain for that week.
Anyway, back to the prior discussion...isn't there some other way to make it all "fair" without letting the men get out of responsibility? I think there is. I'm just wondering if anyone else has ideas. I'll share mine after work.
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Guys can choose to wrap it up. There are several lines of defense to avoid pregnancy.
But, in Peen's ideal world (as well as several others, it seems) there is no reason for the guy to wrap it up because they can just say "eh, didn't want it" and they are free.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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I completely disagree with your assertion that there would be less pregnancies. It is my belief that there are far fewer women getting pregnant to "trap" a man than there are just plain irresponsible people, and your wish would allow them to be even more irresponsible. It would make things far worse. I'm rather surprised that some of the men on the board are so interested in promoting selfishness and not holding people responsible for their actions. All in response to the fact that the opposite sex gets to do it.  Let's try to fix the first problem without creating more issues just to be "fair".
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Another thing that happens are the people who get pregnant to collect a check. When my mom was still teaching Kindergarten int Toledo city schools she had a boy say something along the lines of "mom is having another baby so that we can get more money". That is the mindset that is being taught to some of our children by their parents - how is a 5 or 6 year old supposed to know that is wrong? How do you think they are going to grow up thinking about the responsibility of raising a child?
#gmstrong
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I agree.
And funny, but I already said basically the same thing in the rest of the post that Florida decided to delete from his quote
you mean this part? Quote:
On my personal stance: I would believe that in this extreme case that you bring up that the woman should view this as a beacon of light in an otherwise terrible situation. That despite how terribly it began there is something positive that can come out of it, and that if it is too much of a weight to bear that she can at least adopt the child out so that she can know she positively affected the lives of others.
So a woman that has been through a terribly tragedy, should "look at the bright side" and spend the next 9 months being reminded daily of the events, not to mention the expenses of childbirth, the people constantly asking about the baby during the pregnancy, and/or having to explain it's a child from a rape?
Be hopeful your mother, sister, wife are never sexually assaulted and left to burden a child from the event.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Guys can choose to wrap it up. There are several lines of defense to avoid pregnancy.
But, in Peen's ideal world (as well as several othes, it seems) there is no reason for the guy to wrap it up because they can just say "eh, didn't want it" and they are free.
Aids is a good reason.
I only bring this up to point out the inequities that one class of citizen has rights where the other has none.
We can talk about wrapping and all sorts of birth control methods but it really doesn't address the issue of rights.
It's my opinion abortion shouldn't be allowed except in cases of verified rape or the mothers life is endangered by carrying the baby.
But, that is just my opinion which doesn't follow the law of the land, so my next option is to grant equal rights.
Is anybody on this board against equal rights for all citizens no matter their sex, race, religion, or any other class??
It's really that simple.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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There was a time, not too long ago, where a woman considered her partner's long-term ability to be a parent and provider with great seriousness.
We, as a society, have removed that burden and obligation by being willing to assume that duty for both parents. It was an essentially good idea with some very bad unintended consequences.
You want people to get a job? Made the decision between getting a job and starving to death. REMOVE the possibility of the individual to place this basic responsibility on someone else.
You want people to have fewer neglected babies and fewer abortions? Stop paying for it. Be willing to severely punish those who neglect their children.
As for the man just walking away, this would be acceptable to me ONLY if by mutual agreement. Otherwise, this is a shirking of one of the most basic human responsibilities there is. IMO, a culture that promotes or even allows this is doomed.
Both parties know the possible consequences of the act, but they are not equal in how the resulting burden is born. IT IS NOT POSSIBLE for the woman to just "walk away". There is real risk in both having the child, or having an abortion. The man bears none of this risk.
I look at this like a business deal, where the man has a 10% equity for putting up the seed money and the woman has a 90% equity for building the enterprise brick by brick over several months. The man has no vote but is required to continue to put up operating capital once they have established a going concern. He agreed to this implicitly during the initial transaction. Over many years, his equity position will increase until they are equal partners.
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j/c
Not germane to this current discussion, but I have heard - more times that I care to count recently, that my little girl looks like Caylee Anthony. It's kinda freaking me out.
RIP My Love
1969-2025
20 years was not enough
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Casey Anthony found NOT GUILTY
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