Carolina, Miami, KC, Seattle and Arizona. Next up? Jags?
And yes, at this point who cares if we win again. The Browns desperately need some difference makers so yay! Let's root for a high pick again (and hope we don't blow it).
The reason the KC, Seattle and Arizona wins were big for Cleveland is that it removed some teams (at least temporarily) who need QB's.
Cleveland sits at #7 and the teams in front of them are:
Indy - just slot Luck here. St Louis - Bradford. Minnesota - Ponder looks like a keeper. Jacksonville - Gabbert. Miami - Moore is bordering on a keeper right now. Playing very well. Tampa - Freeman.
Cleveland is in a nice spot to have a pick between Barkley or RGIII. And yes, it's gotta be a QB IMO. If it's not, I would be pretty disappointed at this point.
Atlanta could take a wild swing in either direction. The loss dropped them to (7-5), which could slot it anywhere from 16-25. Next week @ Carolina could be a huge swing game, so go Panthers!
Miami would take one. I don't think Moore is a keeper for one and also that it's Miami. They need a big name to sell tickets (so, slot Barkely in there if he's available).
also, we are rightfully thinking drafting QB for McCoy, but Bradford, Freeman and Gabbert have all played as poorly this season (at least Gabbert is a rookie).
I gotta disagree on Matt Moore. Remember when he looked this good with Carolina and they went into the following season with high expectations?
I think they take Barkley if they have a chance to. We gotta hope the Dolphins continue to play well. They are KILLING people right now. The Raiders did not belong on the same field as them yesterday.
I think if you are a Browns fan that wants a new QB, your best case scenario outside of trading half your team and a bunch of picks for Andrew Luck, is getting Matt Barkley. Worst case scenario you get Robert Griffin III.
People can disagree on that all day, but I think the one thing we should all agree on is this team can't continue to trade out of the top 10. If you're picking in the top 10, it's for a reason, and it's obvious with the Browns they don't have great talent on this team. I don't want to trade back and grab a lineman again.
Trading down is always an option if you aren't happy with your selection where you are picking... It made sense last year because I really think we wanted Green and he was taken... But really theres enough talent at the top of this draft that as long as we're picking top ten there should be a solid solid player waiting. Even if the QB's we like are gone there is still the options of Richardson, Blackmon, and Claiborne just to name a few.
So you're saying that the QB in Miami is not good ....... and that they're winning because of good offensive game planning?
Maybe we can hire their offensive coordinator.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I think part of the reason we made the trade with Atlanta was to get some picks to make a deal to move up to #1 for Luck.
I want to say where we are, and grab Barkley, but I think we do what it takes for Luck.
I read somewhere that we could potentially have an Elway type situation where Luck and his father (who has some NFL pull) pick their team. I really hope he's been talking with Mike.
Somehow I can't see the Colts doing the Luck thing. I think they believe they have a few years out of Manning, and could clean up with someone's ridiculous offer for that pick. They compete for a few more SB's before Manning calls it a day, and they may actually have future extra picks down the line to take another great QB.
I just can't see the Colts wanting to deal with "When does Luck get a shot?" every time the Colts lose a game even with Manning back.
I'm liking everything I read/youtube clips I see (don't get too many App St games on TV here) of Brian Quick WR. 6'5" 4.5 40 time. We can get a player like Richardsond with the first pick, DeCastro (my favorite player in the draft) with our 2nd, then get Quick in the 2nd I think it would go a long way to help improve our offense.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
RB, G and small school size/speed WR with top picks?
Ugh.
1st pick should be QB or DE...a value position, because it's tougher to draft those positions later
2nd pick we're more flexible then too....DE (if QB 1st) or CB, WR, even RT could have value there....maybe your G drops (they always do and I would still not draft him because of it and because I think we're pretty fine with Steiny, Pinky, Lauvao and Greco)
3rd pick (high 2nd) BPA or Weeden if no QB in 1st
I might accept a RB, G or small schooler with the 2nd...barely...but all 3 top picks is low value (low risk picks, little impact)
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Quote: CandyMan:I will be killed for this. I found out who RG3 reminds me of. Aaron Rodgers when he was at Cal. Both played in a similar spread offense.
Just wanted to make a clarification here, CM.
Rodgers played in the WCO in college. RG3 plays in a modern college spread. Two very different offenses.
As for whether or not RG3 reminds you of Rodgers, sure, whatever floats your boat man, hehe.
Griffin actually reminds me of Vince Young with that awkward release, but he's a far more polished thrower of the ball.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
Quote: CandyMan:I will be killed for this. I found out who RG3 reminds me of. Aaron Rodgers when he was at Cal. Both played in a similar spread offense.
Just wanted to make a clarification here, CM.
Rodgers played in the WCO in college. RG3 plays in a modern college spread. Two very different offenses.
As for whether or not RG3 reminds you of Rodgers, sure, whatever floats your boat man, hehe.
Griffin actually reminds me of Vince Young with that awkward release, but he's a far more polished thrower of the ball.
Quote: How about Blackmon with the 1st pick, and RG3 with the 2nd?
I'm not taking RG3 in the top 10, but in the 15-20s maybe... Dunno if he'll fall that far though...
I just REALLY want Justin Blackmon... I think him, Little, and Norwood would make a great 3 WR set going forward...
I'm getting 2nd thought on Blackmon...I think he'll be good, dont get me wrong and he'd fill a need but the more I see him the more I see a Crabtree...would you draft Crabtree at, say, 5 overall again? This could be a Mack type pick, not as bad value because he's a legit #1 at value position where you need 2.5 starters (C there only 1 needed right?)
In combination with Weeden I'd do it
Hearing a lot of good things about RG 3 but haven't seen enough of him to have an own opinion....gotta watch him
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
RB, G and small school size/speed WR with top picks?
Ugh.
1st pick should be QB or DE...a value position, because it's tougher to draft those positions later
2nd pick we're more flexible then too....DE (if QB 1st) or CB, WR, even RT could have value there....maybe your G drops (they always do and I would still not draft him because of it and because I think we're pretty fine with Steiny, Pinky, Lauvao and Greco)
3rd pick (high 2nd) BPA or Weeden if no QB in 1st
I might accept a RB, G or small schooler with the 2nd...barely...but all 3 top picks is low value (low risk picks, little impact)
Glad you're not the GM since you don't want to take players from smaller schools.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
Quote: Rodgers definitely did not run a pure WCO then.
Jeff Tedford has made a career out of incorporating WCO concepts into his offenses. That's the offense he used at Oregon, when he had Akili Smith and Joey Harrington. He brought those concepts to Cal.
Is it a "pure" WCO? No such thing anymore, but what Tedford ran was a pro-style offense loaded with WCO concepts. It was anything but the spread. That was the great debate when people were talking about whether Alex Smith or Aaron Rodgers would be the #1 pick: Smith came from the spread, Rodgers came from the pro-style WCO.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
No problems with small schollers later....liked the Skrine pick but Top 50? Too risky (maybe guys like Flacco or Jenkins this draft that played at big schools before and only transfered)....ask TB how their 2nd investment of their Appa St WR in the 2008 draft turned out...he was all speed too and is now out of the league
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Quote: No problems with small schollers later....liked the Skrine pick but Top 50? Too risky (maybe guys like Flacco or Jenkins this draft that played at big schools before and only transfered)....ask TB how their 2nd investment of their Appa St WR in the 2008 draft turned out...he was all speed too and is now out of the league
You're comparing Brian Quick to Dexter Jackson? lol. Not even close. Quick has 202 catches to Jackson's 110. Quick has 71 catches this year, 1000 yds and 11 TDs. Jackson only had over 500 yds once in his career.
You going to bring up Amanti Edwards next?
Edit: Dexter Jackson was 5'9". Quick is 6'5". Not even close to the same prospect.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
I'm not saying he's garbage, just that I would not draft a small school only player in the top 2 rounds probably
Who was the last small school WR drafted in the 1st 2 rounds?...before or after Jackson/Edwards if you want...who? and what was his career like? Drafting is a game of odds...and I prefer to have them on my side
Also, I said I'd be "barely" ok drafting 1 of either small schooler, RB and G in the top 50...that was my point....as the top 3 picks they don't represent much value....Quick would have to develop into a Colston (7th rounder remember?) THEN it would be worth it...but again: what are the odds?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Who was the last small school WR drafted in the 1st 2 rounds
That logic is idiotic. Might as well say you wouldn't draft Demarcus Ware because the DPLOY hasn't come from Troy before. Wouldn't want TO, Randy Moss because they played at small schools?
Who cares that Colston was drafted in the 7th, Quick isn't falling to the 7th. You don't like Quick that is fine, but your logic behind it doesn't make sense and is full of holes.
"The medium for the bad news was ESPN, which figured. The network represents much of what is loud, obnoxious and empty in sports today."
Quote: That logic is idiotic. Might as well say you wouldn't draft Demarcus Ware because the DPLOY hasn't come from Troy before. Wouldn't want TO, Randy Moss because they played at small schools?
It's not...and you're comparing apples and Oranges as Troy is 1 school only and and playing Div 1A...there are dozens "small schools" out there....much bigger player pool
and 1 last time: I didn't say I wouldn't draft him if he was graded that high...I would consider it, esp. if he does good in the SR Bowl week...I just would not do THAT in combination with a G and RB pick before
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
You are backpeddling. Every person reading this thread understood that you meant you thought it was too risky to draft a small school player in the first couple rounds.. it wasn't an "if" or an "and".. you were pretty absolute about it.
Quote: Who was the last small school WR drafted in the 1st 2 rounds?...before or after Jackson/Edwards if you want...who? and what was his career like? Drafting is a game of odds...and I prefer to have them on my side
Small school WR's taken in Rounds 1 or 2 of the last 30 years, with career stats:
Kevin House, S. Illinois
Two 1,000 yard seasons, one second team All-Pro selection. 5,169 yards and 34 touchdowns over an 8 year career.
Mark Duper, Northwestern State University
3 time Pro Bowl, 2 All Pro selection. 8,869 yards and 51 TD's over an 11 year career
Pete Mandley, Northern Arizona
2,370 yards, 12 TD's and 2 punt return TD's over a 7 year career.
Jerry Rice, Mississippi Valley St.
G.O.A.T.
Chris Burkett, Jackson St.
4,352 yards and 19 TD's over an 8 year career
Stacy Robinson, N. Dakota State
749 yards, 7 TD's over six seasons. Caught 3 passes for 62 yards in Super Bowl XXI.
Shawn Collins, Northern Arizona
1,433 yards and 5 TD's over 7 NFL seasons
Jimmy Smith, Jackson St.
5 time Pro Bowl selection, 2 time All-Pro selection, 12,287 yards and 69 TD's over 13 seasons
Vincent Brisby, N.E. Louisiana
3,202 yards and 14 TD's over 7 seasons.
Sylvester Morris
678 yards and 3 TD's in one NFL season
Tyrone Calico, Mid. Tenn. St.
501 yards and 4 TD's in 3 NFL seasons
Vincent Jackson, N. Colorado
Active. 1 time Pro Bowl selection. 4,120 yards and 31 TD's over 7 seasons
Jerome Simpson, Coastal Carolina
Active. 856 yards and 5 TD's over 4 seasons. Currently has 577 yards and 2 TD's on the year
Dexter Jackson, App. St.
No career receiving stats. Currently a member of the Jets practice squad.
Taking a look at the odds:
1 in 14 (7%) chance of drafting the greatest WR of all-time
4 in 14 (28%) chance of drafting a WR who will make the Pro Bowl
5 in 14 (35%) chance of drafting a WR who will have a 1,000 yard season
(For the record, Armanti Edwards was a third round pick.)
I have also seen Django make the argument that you couldn't judge Colt because he was never challenged, he went to a big school that had so much talent and his receivers were always open, etc...
Maybe the only way to judge a player is if he goes to a big school that sucks... maybe that's how Maryland puts so many guys in the NFL.
jango makes a lot of posts that he forgets - i.e. how to judge a qb. One week it's this stat, the next week it's that stat. Of course, when it comes to the Browns, we constantly hear how the O line did a good job - right up until we're told he re-watched the entire game focusing soley on the line, and they played a really good game.
(speaking of which - anyone else see pashos totally, 100% fall down, untouched, on a screen pass? Gosh - I think it was the 3rd quarter - maybe late 2nd quarter. Ball is snapped, he back pedals and 100% falls on his butt - untouched. He got up in time to see his guy make the tackle for a loss.)
I just wanted to point out that in the old thread, I did my brief pros and cons on the QBs and accidentally said release point as a pro for Griffin. That was meant to be quick release.
Did you also accidentally say his arm strength is a "con"? He has unlimited velocity when he needs it. I have seen five or six throws from him in the 5+ games of his I've watched this year where he was extending the play and improvising and threw passes on the move >10 yards that were absolute ropes to avoid sacks. He doesn't put more on it than needed because he has really good accuracy, but when he needs to squeeze one in to a wideout on the sideline he will absolutely dislodge the receivers intestines.
Griffin really doesn't have a rocket arm. He doesn't use his lower body much when he throws and just has decent arm strength. His deep ball is still fantastic though.
I might accept a RB, G or small schooler with the 2nd...barely...but all 3 top picks is low value (low risk picks, little impact)
So, where do I say I wouldn't take a small school player? Backpeddling, huh? Why should I? For what? and what's your gain anyway IF I did? I saw you guys do a 180 on opinions as if you forgot about your backbone
What I said ws clear as day, I wouldn't spend my 3 top 50 picks on the combination of RB, G and small schooler as he suggested...it's bad value
It depends on the player of course and the list posted by PDR doesn't impress me, there are as much duds as decent ones and 1k seasons for WRs are as easy as for RBs nowadays...Braylon Edwards had a 1k season...do you want him on the Browns? Would you draft him in the top 2 rounds again?
Also, the best players on that list are from way back...since CFB commercialized the best players don't go to their neighbourhood College anymore
and ProBowls? DA made one too, so he's an above AVG QB?
and for the Colt-Texas comment I supposedly made (can't remember honestly): what's the point? What does that have to do with ANYTHING we're discussing here?
And since you're trying out hard as my proctologist please tell me how's it looking there? Everything fine?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
One thing that impresses me is that he graduated in 3 years with a double major ........ much like a Browns QB of legend did. (One that I went to High School with)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
One thing that impresses me is that he graduated in 3 years with a double major ........ much like a Browns QB of legend did. (One that I went to High School with)
It was the Bowl game from 2010, not even a full year ago...
I don't see why that matters?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
(One that I went to High School with)