DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) 2012 Draft Continued

Like I did in the very next post with Colt McCoy?

For the record.

I would be thrilled with Bradford at QB for the Browns. He's a very good QB and will be a Top 5 QB in a few seasons.

I think people discount what a luxury it is to have an All-Pro at LT. It makes the passing game way easier, which puts our ineptitude in even a worse light.

OK, so I'm glad we lost (draft position), but now I remember what we have in Hillis. No need to blow another hole in the lineup. Just bring him back. The guys who say don't draft a RB early are right. They have a short shelf life. You'd have to agree that Peterson is at or approaching the downside, and that team isn't rebuilt. So no thanks to Richardson. Forget Luck. Get Tannehill with 1B and let Shurmur earn his dough developing him. Let's go: WR (Floyd or Jeffery), QB (Tannehill), DE, RT. Trade down and get more picks. This thing could turn around sooner than people realize.

The Rams are missing like their top 3 WR too.

Forget Luck. Get Tannehill with 1B and let Shurmur earn his dough developing him.

That would be my plan. Hell I might even trade down with the 1a pick. We have a lot of areas to address.

This is how I would rate them
1. QB
2. RDE
3. FS
4. Weakside backer
5. RT

It is really bad when corner and receiver do not make the top 5 Fortunately RT we can get in FA with a guy like Andre Smith of the Bengals or in the 4th round.

FS Might be best to target in the 3rd. George Iloka would be a steal here
WIL Danny Trevathon in the 4th call it a day
RDE 2nd round Montgomery or Mercilus
QB at 1b

1a. ???? Claiborne, Blackmon, Trade down.

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Fortunately RT we can get in FA with a guy like Andre Smith of the Bengals or in the 4th round.

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You've gotta be kidding me....... We are going to either "get a guy like Andre Smith" (who I heard earlier this year was playing very well), do you really think the Bengals are going to let him go? If they do, he's going to demand LT money................

One major thing i've noticed, rarely do good tackles become FA's. That's why we've had bad ones for the past couple years. Plus, remember that the player has to be willing to come to Cleveland...........

I hear this kinda stuff year after year on this board. It drives me nuts! I was so upset about going in for another Pashos this year, I was upset about Pashos last year..... I was upset about St. Clair the past two years before that. We got Kev Schaffer in FA, that really worked out........ He had one good year for us (Joe Thomas' Rookie Year?) and he still wasn't a good pass blocker. It's been a gigantic problem since Ryan Tucker moved to RG

RT needs to be addressed. If we can get Andre Smith (and he's healthy), great! But I seriously doubt it. And June cuts won't produce anyone either, it never does. It has hindered our offense season after season.

If we pick up a FA O-Lineman, get a guard. RT's in FA are generally trash. That's just a position we're going to have to draft. And a 4th round draft pick won't be a starter next year..... If they are, we're prob in trouble.

How bout RT with our 2nd 1st round pick or our 2nd round pick. No later than that. That'll be good for whoever is QB and that'll be good for running the ball. It's like the elephant in the room or something.

HELLO, we overlook it year after year after year, and newsflash, year after year it's a problem. It drives me absolutely nuts

Yes I am kidding you. I wake up in the morning and begin to think of ways to kid you. Here is a snickers bar for the drama queen. Wait I was only kidding.

the Bengals did NOT pick up his option. You dont have to wait for the june first cuts. You sign him at the start of free agency. If you dont get your tackle then you draft one. Just like every other position you wish to fill. Swear half this board acts like they are going through menopause lately.

Bengals also have a good RT in Anthony Collins

My thoughts on Morris Claiborne.

He has a good size for the position. Claiborne has elite man to man bump and run coverage ability that will translate to the next level. He really doesn't give up the big play and he tackles well. He also has good ball skills and a guy that plays with instincts. He was the most consistent CB in CFB this year. The only real play that he got beat that really comes to mind was the SEC Championship Game when he slipped on a double move against Georgia. He is a well-groomed CB and could be a #1 CB for many teams next year. The only thing is, he might have problems to start off playing some zone and off coverage because Patrick Peterson was having the same problems this year. That's really because LSU does not call conservative game plans and they never ask their CB's to play off. All of them are physical and can cover; but Claiborne stands out on the field as a playmaker. Peterson was an elite prospect with his size. They are similar except Peterson is bigger and is way better returner. If Morris can clock in a 4.38< 40, he is worth a top 5 pick in my book. His tools and consistency this year project him as an elite CB in the NFL. We need corners that are playmakers, right now we got a bunch of solid corners, and a guy that has potential to be elite.

Something about that LSU crew and the way they are turning out NFL ready corners. I look at those guys man for man and they have arguably the best secondary in football. They go 5 or 6 deep and everyone has great speed, technically sound, willing and proficient tacklers and most importantly is the fact these guys can cover.

Claiborne is better than Peterson as a pure corner but Peterson has the return ability.

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If you dont get your tackle then you draft one. Just like every other position you wish to fill.

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This is a position that we haven't really attempted to fill, and it's the downfall of our O-Line year in and year out. It's been great having Joe Thomas and Eric Steinbach, but for the past couple years, we either have to have

A) A blocking TE chipping on the right side on most every single play (letting the defense put another guy in the box)

or

B) Our QB watching the right side of the O-Line collapse on every play.

Yet every season people say the same thing, there's some guy in FA. Yet there never is, not one willing to go to the Browns who is any good.

You suggested that if we don't get a good RT in FA, we can draft a RT in round 4 (or later). It's a ridiculous one to me. I'd love to get Andre Smith (and him to check out on a physical, because he has injury concerns that make me nervous), but I'm not holding my breath. And when we don't get him or someone of his caliber (because there won't be many), round 4 is just not a good alternative.

I just don't see how you put RT so far down your "needs" list. People talk about how we should address it, and then it always seems like it ends up getting pushed off. RT is very high on my list (as you can tell). Possibly the number 1 most important thing we have to deal with, doesn't have to be a superstar, but does have to be someone good

It really frustrates me, sorry if my post before seemed ridiculous to you; it just drives me nuts

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It really frustrates me, sorry if my post before seemed ridiculous to you; it just drives me nuts

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And it drives MEEEEEE nuts when people say "Noone wants to come to Cleveland"...

BS...Show em' the damn money and they will be on the first plane landing at Hopkins...It's always this way...Always has been and always will be...MONEY TALKS...

4/5ths of this OL has 4 years or less experience...We've got a solid foundation going...Yeah we need to replace Pashos...And we will...Just a matter of how...And I'd bet it comes from the draft...One thing Heckert totally understands is u constantly hit the TRENCHES...Thank Reid for that...

My biggest concern with Heckert being around Reid so long is him going Corner crazy...

Mour...U r right on with LSU and the Corners down there...It's Corner Heaven...It's sick to see Claiborne and Mathieu next to each other...That right there is the greatest Corner duo EVER...And both will be perenial Pro Bowlers...

If we do not make the move for Luck...Claiborne HAS to be the pick...

What if Blackmon and Kalil are still there at our pick? (RE: Claiborne)

I expect them to be gone and I will be very happy with Claiborne.

I would be shocked if Blackmon is selected before the Browns' pick.

If the Cleveland Browns lose to the Pittsburgh Steelers in the regular-season finale, they are assured of a draft spot no worse than No. 4. Cleveland would move to No.3 if the Browns lost and the Minnesota Vikings beat the visiting Chicago Bears next Sunday.

If the Browns upset the Steelers, they would likely fall out of the top 5.

Here's the projected draft order, courtesy of ESPN Stats & Information:

1. Colts (2-13)

2. Rams (2-13)

3. Vikings (3-12)

4. Browns (4-11)

5. Jaguars (4-11)

6. Buccaneers (4-11)

7. Redskins (5-10)

8. Dolphins (5-10)

9. Panthers (6-9)

10. Bills (6-9)

11. Chiefs (6-9)

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There are cases to be made for a lot of these guys, mainly because of the holes we have. Here's my case for Kalil: OTs have long careers. Get him, and we have OL bookends for the next decade plus. We'd be able to run with any RB and throw with almost any QB. A dominant line would be amazing.
Claiborn: No one would be able to go deep on us with him and Haden. Coverage sacks would skyrocket. Two shutdown corners. Wow.
Blackmon: If he was a Megatron type, I could see it. But he's six feet. I'd rather wait on WR.
Griffin: I have to see what H&H think of him. I'm skeptical. I feel like it's Luck or develop a Tannehill type. And I just don't know that Indy will even put Luck in play.
I'm leaning toward Kalil or Claiborn. Or trade down.

if we end up with the 3rd pick, and indy is 2, I would do anything it took to get Luck with the first pick.

If the Browns like RG3 ...... and this is only an "If" ..... I wonder if the Rams would trade down from 2 to 4 for the #4 pick, a 2nd, and a 4th? I would have to think that would be a very tempting package to just drop 2 spots. (especially since, I would assume, that they feel they need a lot of help around the QB they already have)

Let's say your projected draft order is correct:

1. Colts (2-13)
2. Rams (2-13)
3. Vikings (3-12)
4. Browns (4-11)
5. Jaguars (4-11)
6. Buccaneers (4-11)
7. Redskins (5-10)
8. Dolphins (5-10)
9. Panthers (6-9)
10. Bills (6-9)
11. Chiefs (6-9)

If RG3 is a hot commodity when our pick comes around how far would anyone be willing to trade down. The Redskins, Dolphins, Bills and Chiefs could be interested. Let's say one of them offers us their #1 in next year's draft. How far down would people be willing to drop to get it? (Obviously if you say 11 the Chiefs that presumes that none of the teams above them offer equivalent value) Or do you just take RG3?

what if we traded back to 8-10 and take either Alshon Jeffrey or Michael Floyd...thatd give us our 6'3 fantastic wideout.

Both had numbers suffer slightly because of poor poor QB play...none more than Jeffrey and i think we'll see their stock re-rise during the combine.


I'd love to see us grab Jeffrey (preferably) or Floyd, and then grab Jarius Wright or Marquis Maze later in the draft to fill our slot...preferably Wright cuz he is faaaaaaaast

Looking...

The Dolphins, Chefs, Cards, Seahawks, and Jags could all look for a QB. Someone that would be willing to move up and go get an RG3 or Landry Jones if someone like the Rams went rogue and tried to take one...

What are the chances the Colts think Orlovsky is good enough? He's played damn well.

http://drafttek.com/CMDRound1.asp

Let me post what Drafttek.com is saying about Landry..

A shake-up in our Quarterback rankings has Landry Jones tumbling out of Round 1. Once Ryan Broyles went down to injury Jones hasn't been the same. His last 2 games (Iowa State, Oklahoma State) have produced no TD passes, and the worst QB ratings since his freshman year. Brandon Weeden and Robert Griffin have jumped ahead. Our staff is divided on RG3. We do think he'll be drafted in Round 1, but the past 20 years is full of smallish, athletic Heisman QB's who have underwhelmed at the NFL level. Andre Ware, Troy Smith, Charlie Ward and Jason White - to name names.

If I'm the Browns, I take RG3 and never look back.

If I'm wrong, then I have blown a single 1st round pick. If I'm right, then I have the most important position on the football field handled for the next 12-15 years.

It's more than worth the risk.

I agree. I didn't watch much Baylor football this past year. I only caught the whole game against Oklahoma (good one to catch I suppose). With how he played there, I would want him. However, I don't know enough about his stinker games or general knowledge about his mechanics, accuracy, arm strength, speed, height and injury history. I'm sure all that will be discussed at length over the next 3+ months, so I'll thank you all in advance for providing.

Picking RG3 versus Luck isn't a comparison we can make because we don't own the #1 overall pick. It would cost us some crazy amount to get to the #1 position and like I clearly discussed much earlier in this thread, there's no freaking way Indy passes on Luck no matter what the offer is. So yes, using ONE pick on RG3 is so much better than using 3 first and 2 second rounders. If he doesn't pan out, we still get to pick 5 more times in the first four rounds this draft (as well as the picks next year).

It seems like this draft is going to force us into what we really need.....infuse our team with a good amount of young top-of-the-draft talent and hope we hit on a few (or all, of course). We need playmakers.....in more than just the QB position. I don't want to trade up at all. In fact, I'd trade down if I could (to get more bodies and like Peen said, maybe more ammunition for next years draft to get Barkley*).


*Why would I want to trade up next year and not this year? Because this team isn't ready to mortgage lots of picks for one player, no matter how important the position is. Next year we'll hopefully have a better right side of the o-line, another DE, a true MLB, more youth in the secondary and some skill guys on offense for a QB to get the ball to).

Y, you posted a column today by Terry Pluto saying that the AFC North requires a QB of a certain size and arm strength to play in bad weather, and to compete with the likes of Roethlisberger, Flacco, and Dalton. Now you want us to take a smallish QB from a spread offense in a conference that doesn't play defense? Was the Pluto column what you think, or just posted to spur discussion?

That was just to spur conversation.

I think that RG3 has the necessary arm strength to make every throw in Cleveland in winter.

From what I have seen, the Rams could desperately use everything except a QB and RB.

They did wind up with 3 receivers on IR, so I don't know how WR slots into their needs.

I can't see this regime spending a high pick on receiver unless he is AJ Green/Megatron type skill set. So Blackmon fans, it doesn't look good.

I also dont believe we will have a high first round grade on Griffin. Heckert just has his own way of thinking and it usually doesnt involve hype.

Claiborne wouldnt be the greatest need but he would be the best player but again, trading up or trading down seems much more likely.

The value chart isn't Golden but teams rarely tread to far from it. In order for us to not be completely fleeced trading up, we need that 3rd overall pick in order to accomplish it. At #3, two firsts and our fourth is slightly overpaying. Probably take a little more but not much more. Blackmon would be a really good replacement for Reggie Wayne

Trading down with tackle needy teams chomping at the bit again only works if the Vikings win and we lose. Get that 3rd overall pick and dangle Kalil like a piece of liver in a catfish pond. Cards, Bills, Chiefs, Vikings, Rams are all in DIRE need of a starting LT. Let the bidding begin.

Is Blackmon good enough to overcome NOT being taller?

I think that most shorter #1 types - like Steve Smith - are fast and shifty enough to overcome their height. Blackmon seems a lot like Boldin...and I think we have our slightly-better "Boldin" in our own G Little.

If Kalil is there when we pick...I just might take him. He will want to be paid like a LT, but WILL get paid according to his slot. I probably would not pick him...but I would think long and hard about it.

Could you imagine him and JT as bookends? Anyway...

I think we take Claiborne at 1A. He's likely the BPA and plays a position of need for us.

I'm not sure what we take at 1B but I'd bet it's a WR. I am liking Cunningham from Michigan State here.

I think we "overdraft" a guy like Adcock at 2...and I am ok with that.

Heckert must continue to earn his money at #3 and with our two 4ths. No head scratchers like Marecic and Cameron.

At 5-7 I am looking for DL & OL depth and/or speed at LB.

Unrelated:

Could Skrine play FS?

I think we might go QB w/ that first pick.. if we go Blackmon.. that means Colt gets another year.

Landry Jones IMO is not worthy of a first round pick and I think he will be a bust in the league.

I like Tannehill and Foles, but wouldn't touch them until the 3rd round.. even then though.. not sure if they are starters..

Not forgetting the FA market and Flynn.

We should get a good dose of him next Sunday when the Pack plays the Lions. The Pack has nothing to play for at this point, and Rodgers has said he thinks Flynn should play. Luckily for Browns fans who are interested they moved the Browns game to late Sunday so we should be able to see both games. Flynn against the Lions D should be a decent barometer.

The only QB I'd want in 1st round is Luck. Assuming that won't happen, and assuming we retain Hillis, with 1a, I'd go either DE (Coples) or CB (Claiborne). If we lose Hillis, I take Richardson. With 1b, I'd be looking for my WR - Alshon Jeffreys, Michael Floyd, or Kendall Wright. With our 2nd rd, best OT or LB. With our 3rd, best LB or OT. After that, I'd hand off to Heckert, because I have no clue.

Hillis is the key, imo. If he stays, we go DE or CB with 1a, and fill the other from FA. If Hillis goes, we take Richardson @ 1a, and look to free agency for DE and CB.