DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum We Miss Vickers

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This thread shows that many on here don't follow the draft process...Marecic was LOVED by every scout in the country.

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Which shows how little all your draft "guru" guys know.
Marecic is a dime-a-dozen player.
Vickers is head and shoulders above him. No comparison.

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and the scouts and gurus loved Brian Robiskie too.wheres he at now?

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The ones I trust didn't, depends who you're reading...but I disliked Robo anyway...there were too many red flags even in positive reports.....big school underachievers NEVER make it in the NFL

I wasn't a big fan of the Marecic pick simply because of value....late 4th was still too high for a FB...but I liked Marecic the prospect, so just switch Pinkston, who was a 3rd/4th round talent with Marecic and I'm ok with it

Marecic will be fine, I'm pretty confident he will impact (and I already saw some nice blocks)....Vickers was not liked very much around here as a rook too

Also, catching 5 out of 7 passes thrown his way is better than 12 out of 28 Vickers put up the past 2 years...I think that along with the salary demands were big reasons why he was let go

Marecic clearly was a LONG TERM move....you know....stuff people on here always whine and moan for...but then whine even louder when a FO has the onions to actually DO IT....Marecic is part of a TRUE re-building...Vickers was a 28yo FA, demanded 3 or 4 times the $ a rook would get and since FB don't really have a long life in this league he wasn't considered a WINDOW FIT for this REBUILD

Sure....if we had Vickers instead of Marecic we would have gotten better production THIS season, and maybe even NEXT season....but would he be better than Marecic in his prime (3rd year +...oh look, that's when Vickers was the board's golden boy) as a 30yo?...and are those our WINDOW years to win? "Highly unlikely" and a big fat "no" would be my answers...so even if Marecic completely busts, Vickers best years left would have come in transition seasons....FB careers are often even shorter than RBs, there aren't many 30+yo FBs around playing at a high level...most are actually 25yo or younger

Why are you guys whining over a backup/part time FB again?

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All I need to know is his college coach didn't care to draft him.

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This thread shows that many on here don't follow the draft process...Marecic was LOVED by every scout in the country.

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Which shows how little all your draft "guru" guys know.
Marecic is a dime-a-dozen player.
Vickers is head and shoulders above him. No comparison.

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All I need to know is his college coach didn't care to draft him.

Vickers was actually a skillful player at Colorado and I thought he'd end up being an ideal WCO FB.

I have no idea what Heckert was thinking with Vickers. Probably his biggest blunder to date.

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Heckert does what he is TOLD to do. This horrible move impacted not only having to waste a pick on a FB. It had a domino of futility. we replace an very solid player with a whiff. Now we have a NEW hole and drastically Diminish the value of Hillis as well and that Impacts the QB as no receiver worries the defense teams stack the run. add to that we wasted several picks to move up to get this mediocrity and did not add to the talent of desperate Need areas.

This is a move typical of the "new Browns" making new holes and constanly devaluing talent on the roster. I expect Cribbs, McCoy and Hillis as New holes that will have to be filled as we try to compete with teams in our division that are run PROFESSIONALLY and COached Professionally. what a buffoon Hire was Pat Shurmur!!!!

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Even more troubling is the fact that he led the league in fumbles in 2010 by a WIDE margin. 9 fumbles by your lead running back is ATROCIOUS.

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Love (most of) your posts, Toad, but lets not let hyperbole get the best of us. Hillis had 8 fumbles last year. Cedric Benson and Ahmad Bradshaw each had 7. Your "WIDE margin" is a whopping 1 fumble, and Bradshaw actually lost more of them than Hillis did (Benson lost the same number).

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My mistake. Had looked it up last year and had recalled 9.

So, let's remove by a "wide" margin and just say he led the league in fumbles.

CribbsHero, singular examples aren't necessarily indicative of what a player can or cannot do. I'm sure we could run a sweep with Hillis 10 times, and he'd get a big gain at least once or twice, but when you look at a players skillset, he isn't a guy who is going to make his money running outside. His footspeed simply isn't that good. It shouldn't be at 250 pounds on a 6'2 frame. So, he more than many backs in the league requires holes to be opened by the line. He cannot create on his own.

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Three threads, none of them about the Holmgren, Heckert, or Shurmur.

Three posts by Joe, about Holmgren, Heckert, or Shurmur.

Classic OCD.

Let it go, Joe. Each and every thread doesn't have to be about your compulsions with the FO.

I believe the term is "thread crapping."

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Three threads, none of them about the Holmgren, Heckert, or Shurmur.

Three posts by Joe, about Holmgren, Heckert, or Shurmur.

Classic OCD.

Let it go, Joe. Each and every thread doesn't have to be about your compulsions with the FO.

I believe the term is "thread crapping."

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Aren't Cribbs and McCoy under contract through next year?

If they are, you can worry about them walking all you want, it's not gonna happen...

I would tell you to take off the tinfoil hat, but we probably need to progress in baby steps.

Your opinion on Heckert is just plain He's added more talent in his limited time here than the last two regimes combined. I mean, you're criticizing him for his 4th-round picks!? HAHAHAHA! Oh, if only the last several regimes only had to hear criticism of their 4th-round picks! Oh no... he had to give up a 5th or 6th or something (I don't remember) to move up in the fourth!? We could've had our franchise QB with that pick!!

Seriously, there is a laundry list of people that deserve criticism before Heckert. I'd personally start with either Shurmer or Holmgren (and only because Holmgren is ultimately responsible for everything we see on the field on Sundays).

akron, please stop.

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My Opionions on herkert have generally been positive yet I agree at times I do criticize. Sorry I can't wave pom poms for every decision and the one to let Vickers walk had a domino effect that was detrimental to the run blocking and the effectiveness of Hillis and other backs. That is on heckert? Shurmer, whomever made that assessment. Yet feel free to disagree yet i ask stick to one point, and On this point heckert BLEW IT!!!

I won't even go there with this disaster coach and Mr Ego that anointed him and will not tolerate any rebuke of the chronic stupidity the fans must bear witness each week as Einstein manages to limbo UNDER previous lows weekly with mind numbing play calls.

Wave your Pom Poms, I am not stopping you. let me try. That was a Brilliant decision to let Vickers walk as Marecic has had a Monster season and was a steal of a pick as we needed no help and could afford the luxury of drafting a new FB. He was a tremendous run blocker and added an entire new dimension as a receiver that Vickers never did. I think Heckert was lights out with this decision.

sorry can't do it!

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Look where our team's going without him! Not the ceiling but the cellar!

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Look where our team's going without him! Not the ceiling but the cellar!

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Yes, because we won so many games with Vickers on the team!

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Dude... you're certainly entitled to your opinion, but it seems that you've never stop to consider that there might have been reasons behind his leaving other than the stupidity you're so convinced was present.

>>>> DUDE,I JUDGE AN OPINION BASED HOW IT TESTED OUT IN THE LAB(ON THE FIELD) DUMPING VICKERS HAD A WORSE EFFECT ON THE BLOCKING FOR THE RUN GAME THAN I EVEN FEARED. I HEARD THE REASONS YET SEEING HOW MERECIC PANNED OUT THE MOVE DESERVES A CABBAGE NOT PRAISE.


I mean, you've been given several reasons by other posters why this might have happened, yet none of them seem to have had any effect on you. You were told that OM fits the NCO better than Vickers. No change. You've been told he was due for a new contract that we might not have wanted to pay. No change. It's been suggested that he was a Mangini guy and didn't interface well with the new regime.Still...not a dent.

>NEVER SUGGESTED HE WAS A MANGINI GUY THAT IS YOUR MAP NOT MINE. WE NEVER EVEN OFFERED THE GUY A CONTRACT. IT WAS OBVIOUS BY THE WAY THE FRONT OFFICE WAS TALKING THAT VICKERS, ROTH AND WRIGHT WERE ALL GONERS. ROTH WAS BETTER THAN MITCHELL{ANOTHER CABBAGE}
SHELDON BROWN IS A HUGE LIABILITY AT THIS STAGE. BUT LETS STICK TO VICKERS. HOW HAS MERECI WORKED OUT[YEP THE MOVE IS STILL CABBAGE WORTHY}

I'm going to suggests something entirely different.... the difference between short-term thinking and long-term thinking. If one is to employ stt, keeping Vickers would be a no-brainer. It would trump ANY or ALL the aforementioned mitigators, and the man would have been paid. If one employs ltt, it's conceivable that what looks like a mistake this year might look like a good decision next year or the year after that.


> FINALLY WE AGREE LONG TERM THINKING MEANS YOU DO NOT WASTE PICKS FILLING NEW HOLES YOU MAKE ON THE ROSTER9WASTEING A#4 PICK ON A POSITION YOU HAVE A SOLID PLAYER AND DEPRIVING SO MANY SWISS CHEESE FILLED POSITIONS THAT NEED THAT PICK. WE FINALLY AGREE THIS CHOICE DESERVES A CABBAGE BOTH FOR SHORT TERM INCOMPETENCE AND LONG TERM INSTABILITY.
WE ARE IN A DIVISION WHERE THE OTHER THREE TEAMS ARE VASTLY MORE TALENTED. YOU THINK YOU CLOSE THE GAP BY CREATING EVEN MORE HOLES TO FILL. STEELERS, RAVENS, BENGALS(GOT A #1,#2) FOR CARSON PALMER ALL ARE WAY AHEAD OF US AND THE GAP GETS EVER WIDER WHEN STUPIDITY LIKE THIS IS PERPETRATED. HIRING SHURMUR SEALS IT.


I mean, look at this from a different vantage point: in all the scouting reports, war room meetings, college game tape, draft board manuvering, and review process, there must have been something they saw in Marecic's play that made them see a place for him going forward. They didn't just blindfold Heckert, give him a dart, and tell hm to go "pin the tail on the dionkey." Since you weren't part of that process, watch the tape, or check him out in combines, you (and me, for that matter) can only guess why they did what they did.


> AGAIN WE AGREE, THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT THEY MUST HAVE SEEN YET I HAVE NOT SEEN THAT ON THE FIELD OF PLAY. THE DEVASTATING BLOCKS OF VICKERS HURT THE RUNNING GAME ONCE THEY WERE SUBTRACTED.
MY BIGGEST BEEF WAS WITH THE GAPING HALES IN THE SECONDARY AND OLINE
WASTING A #4 ON A FB WAS EXTREMELY WASTEFUL. I WAS NOT IN THE ROOM, I DO NOT KNOW WHY THE DECISION WAS MADE YET IT HAS WORKED AS WELL AS TRADING MANGINI FOR SHURMUR.

My guess is that we'll see over the next couple years... when Marecic is more intergrated into the game plan and gets his rookieitis out of his system, and when Vickers will possibly be slowing down, losing a step, and not blowing up LB's like he did in his time here.


>>MAYBE SOMEWHERE DOWN THE LINE HE WORKS OUT YET WE WILL BE ON OUR NEXT HC BY THAT TIME

You just see it as a mistake.

There's a possibility that Marecic might not work out for us, but to already be calling his drafting a mistake is woefully premature and myopic, imo. Let us not forget how lost and ineffective Vickers was during his first full season onfield. It wasn't until he was into his secon full year that he began to hit his stride, and display the kind of play that we all loved to watch. So... to answer the thread's initial question: Do we miss Vickers?" I say:

COMPARED TO VICKERS MANNING THE POSITION AND THE RESULTS ON THE FIELD AND HOW IT AFFECTED THE RUNNING GAME, YEAH IT WAS A MISTAKE. MAYBE DOWN THE LINE MARECIC IMPROVES, THERE WERE BIGGER MORE PRESSING HOLES TO FILL.

"Yes- at present... but maybe not in the long run."

Long view/short view.... up for consideration- and only time will tell which view was right.

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