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Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I agree, it will only take our #4 and #22.
Day dream believer....LOL
I don't think it's going to cost more than that either.....maybe at best a later round pick or next years #3.
There is a big difference between dropping to #4 and dropping to #6. The difference is still getting the guy you like and not getting him.
Our first this year (#22) is way more valuable then a future #1....I think those 2 picks trump almost anything anyone can offer unless teams start offering up 2 years worth of #1 picks...I doubt that happens.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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max we'd have to pay would be #4+ #22# + #37....still think our #22 and a 4th will be enough ultimately...we'd still have an entire draft class (pick in every round) and all picks in 2013
Yep. 4 + 22 + 37 beats 6 + 39 + 70 + next 1.
How much would it cost to move from 6 to 4? Then from 39 to 37?
Add in it's the difference between STL getting one of the two players they want vs not getting one of them... I think our offer would be much more appealing
I agree.....if we had to go that high.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Sorry, one other thought.
Let's say we do have to give up both 1st's and our 2nd.
(I almost think we could get a rebate out of them and pick up another 4th or 5th)
All that means is we have to be more active in free agency. We have the cash. Spend it on a few good vets with 4-5-6 years left and we don't need the picks. Just because the thinking is you build through the draft, that doesn't mean you can't improve through free agency.
If you have a chance to get a key position, that is building through the draft. The number of picks don't matter. If you land a super QB, that's the only pick in that draft you need.
As Clevelander's many of you have been conditioned by picks and the draft. But really, how's that worked out?? My theory is maybe we need to forget about picks and start thinking about players who can play.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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What we need to do is let word get out, quietly through back channels that we're willing to sell the farm to get RG3. Both Miami and Wash, knowing they can't compete with our package in the draft go for QB's in FA. Once that's locked Stl no longer has a trading partner except for us, we tell them to pound sand and wait for RG3 to fall to us at 4. 
#GMSTRONG
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I agree, it will only take our #4 and #22.
Day dream believer....LOL
I don't think it's going to cost more than that either.....maybe at best a later round pick or next years #3.
There is a big difference between dropping to #4 and dropping to #6. The difference is still getting the guy you like and not getting him.
Our first this year (#22) is way more valuable then a future #1....I think those 2 picks trump almost anything anyone can offer unless teams start offering up 2 years worth of #1 picks...I doubt that happens.
Ain't buying it Peen.. if I'm sitting there at two and know that I'm gonna have either Luck or more likely RG3 there, I'm thinking I'm in for a deal and a half.
I think that if RG is considered as good by teams as he is by the media and fans, someone is going to give up the ship for him.. and it's gonna be more than our two 1st rounders and a second......
But drafts are really funny.., Remember when it was basically thought to be a lock that Quinn would go in the top 10.. Didn't happen. Or how about (not a qb) But Baba Oshnowa (spelling) remember when he was a sure 2nd or 3rd rounder.., Where did we get him,, 6th round.. and he didn't make it with us and I'm not even sure he's still in the league is he.
All the hype.. and that's all it might be..
Having said that, I really believe the hype on RG.. He really does seem as solid as a rock.. Probably gonna be an outstanding NFL QB...
And I bet teams feel that way as well.. it's gonna take more to get him,, pick values be damned...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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You have to take this with a grain of salt of course, but here is Cabot and manoloff from the combine talking about how the price for RG is going up (among some other things) Again "GRAIN OF SALT" http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2012/02/sunday_evening_nfl_combine_upd.html
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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Was watching NFC sports talk and one of those guys was saying Redskins giving up 1st 2nd this year and 1st and 3rd next.
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Our two firsts and a second should surpass that if we really want RG3.
We have a huge advantage having the 4th pick. That allows them to get one of Claiborne, Blackmon, or Kalil.
The Redskin's pick doesn't give them that guarantee. The 4th pick gives them a shot at one of the top 2 non-QB players of the draft too.
A lot of what we can do is limited by FA. I'm really hoping we can get Pierre Garcon, Stevie Johnson, or Desean Jackson. Possibly a DE too. I really don't see any RT's in FA, so that's gonna have to be our third round pick, possibly moving up into the 2nd to get our guy........
Another year of Pashos or Pashos quality is not really an option (if I was making decisions, of course I've been saying that for awhile)
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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Was watching NFC sports talk and one of those guys was saying Redskins giving up 1st 2nd this year and 1st and 3rd next.
Not at all sure if that would do it either. I guess it all depends what the Rams want in the draft. I mean, if the guy they covet can be had further down in the draft, then all of a sudden Miami could give them 11, and thier first next year and a second, third this year and a second and third or fouth next year.
that's a 6 for 1 deal.. again, depends on who the rams covet in the first.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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THe vikings got a 28 yr old running back. they also gave up 8 picks and some players as well. We're talking about getting a 22 yr old qb, who has the potential to be great at the most important position in the game. This guy could play for us for the next 10-15 yrs. How many did walker play for the vikings?? Plus we would be giving up maybe 4-5 picks at the most. Your comparison is way off base.
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Which option would you guys rather have
1. RG3
2. Tanehill, Cordy Glenn and Vinny Curry
3 Trent Richardson, Kenny Wright and Stephon Gilmore
4. Claiborne, Michael Floyd, Lamar Miller
Option 1 looks a hell of a lot less appealing to me
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Quote:
Which option would you guys rather have
1. RG3
2. Tanehill, Cordy Glenn and Vinny Curry
3 Trent Richardson, Kenny Wright and Stephon Gilmore
4. Claiborne, Michael Floyd, Lamar Miller
Option 1 looks a hell of a lot less appealing to me
Exactly
~Lyuokdea
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Our two firsts and a second should surpass that if we really want RG3.
We have a huge advantage having the 4th pick. That allows them to get one of Claiborne, Blackmon, or Kalil.
The Redskin's pick doesn't give them that guarantee. The 4th pick gives them a shot at one of the top 2 non-QB players of the draft too.
A lot of what we can do is limited by FA. I'm really hoping we can get Pierre Garcon, Stevie Johnson, or Desean Jackson. Possibly a DE too. I really don't see any RT's in FA, so that's gonna have to be our third round pick, possibly moving up into the 2nd to get our guy........
Another year of Pashos or Pashos quality is not really an option (if I was making decisions, of course I've been saying that for awhile)
It all depends on whether or not Jeff Fisher and the Rams want to lose the opportunity to take Kalil or pass him down to the Vikings. The Rams have many needs like we do, but Jeff Fisher's Motive Operand is to build an OL that can protect Sam Bradford. He has his type of bell cow RB [Jackson] and he is going to have a more conservative offense, then they ran last year, but it's going to be hard to pass on the talent he so covets for his team.
He may settle for another OT, but he never drafts WR's early in the Draft, so I don't think there is much of a chance that he will be targeting Justin Blackmon.
To summarize ... if Fisher falls in love with Kalil, witch is a possibility still (imo), then he will keep the pick and that would mean teams would now be dealing with the Vikings at #3 if they want to trade up.
btw, did anyone else notice the analysis for the Combine participants has the top CB rated as such;
1) Dre Kirkpatrick ~92.0
2T) Janoris Jenkins ~91.5
2T) Morris Claiborne ~91.5
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Having said that, I really believe the hype on RG.. He really does seem as solid as a rock.. Probably gonna be an outstanding NFL QB..
Yet u pass on him because of a few draft picks that noone will give a rats ass about 2 years from now...
Unflippenbelievable...
Just like those meaningless Wins in previous years that put us JUST outta reach of what we needed to do... 
Go Browns!!!
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Yet u pass on him because of a few draft picks that noone will give a rats ass about 2 years from now...
Awesome assumption to make
Yes - if I assume that every player I take besides RG3 will suck -- then I would probably take RG3
Last edited by Lyuokdea; 02/26/12 08:18 PM.
~Lyuokdea
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What you have to understand is they aren't going to draft him, so it's not the same leverage as if we were trying to get them off a player.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I really , really like the young man,,, but would not sell the farm to get him ..
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Quote:
Which option would you guys rather have
1. RG3
2. Tanehill, Cordy Glenn and Vinny Curry
3 Trent Richardson, Kenny Wright and Stephon Gilmore
4. Claiborne, Michael Floyd, Lamar Miller
Option 1 looks a hell of a lot less appealing to me
Option 2) Except you and I know when looking at it objectively NACIH that Glenn is there at 22, and no, I don't want to spend a high first on a QB I don't think is special (Tannehill).
Option 3) I don't want a RB at 4, Kendall Wright won't be there at 22 either, and Gilmore is not that good.
Option 4) This is probably the best option you've presented, but Floyd, after running a 4.4, could go #10 to the Bills or possibly even #7 to the Jags.
Why not just say "wouldn't you rather have Justin Blackmon, Riley Reiff, and Janoris Jenkins?"
None of those options are happening.
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I really , really like the young man,,, but would not sell the farm to get him ..
that's the point,, but some folks just don't get it. it has NOTHING to do with the player., It's what you gotta give up to get him that makes it hard to swallow,.,
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Robert Griffin III keeps NFL draftniks buzzing with 4.41 in 40-yard dash at NFL Combine Published: Sunday, February 26, 2012, 8:00 PM Updated: Sunday, February 26, 2012, 8:03 PM Mary Kay Cabot, The Plain Dealer By Mary Kay Cabot, The Plain Dealer INDIANAPOLIS -- As Robert Griffin III's stock continues to climb, apparently so does his price tag. At least one NFL analyst heard rumblings at the NFL Combine that it might take as much as three No. 1s to trade up to No. 2 with the Rams to select Baylor's Heisman Trophy-winning quarterback. "From what I've heard, the Rams could be looking for an exchange of firsts this year and two other firsts," said NFL.com analyst and longtime Cowboys personnel executive Gil Brandt. With the way things are going, that might not be as farfetched as it sounds, especially for teams lower in the round. CBSsports.com reported on Saturday that at least three teams are seriously considering deals to move up to No. 2: Washington (No. 6), Miami (No. 8) and Seattle (No. 12). It said the Browns (with the fourth and 22nd picks in the first round) are interested in trading up, but not as much as the other teams, and that the Redskins are the front-runners. Howard Eskin of WIP Radio Philadelphia reported Sunday that Redskins sources told him they're prepared to offer their 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round picks this year and at least a 1st next year. That's not to mention the Chiefs at No. 11, whose new coach Romeo Crennel on Saturday described Griffin as a "person you go up to get." Griffin's combine performance only boosted his stock, despite the fact he didn't throw. On Sunday morning, he ran a 4.41 40, which was the fastest time for a quarterback since Reggie McNeal posted a 4.35 in 2006 and second-fastest since Mike Vick's 4.33 in 2001. Stanford's Andrew Luck turned in a 4.67, fourth among quarterbacks. "I knew he was going to fly," said NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock. "I didn't care if it was 4.31 or 4.41 or 4.51. Fast guys run fast." Mayock and Browns quarterbacks coach Mark Whipple tried in vain to prod Griffin into throwing, but he resisted the temptation. Instead, he'll do so during his Pro Day March 21. "I really did [want to], and I kept inching forward," Griffin said after his workout. "The Cleveland coaches were telling me they could see it in me -- they saw I wanted to be out there throwing. I tried to come out and show that I'm a competitor with the running and the jumping so they know I'm either as athletic as they thought I was or even more." NFL Network's Mike Mayock recaps the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis NFL Network's Mike Mayock recaps the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis NFL Network's Mike Mayock discusses Robert Griffin III, Andrew Luck and others during his press conference at the NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis on Sunday. Watch video Griffin also finished first among quarterbacks with a 39-inch vertical leap and third with a 10-foot broad jump, a mark he was disappointed in. Luck finished first among QBs in that category with a 10-4. Still, Griffin's 40-time, along with his measured height of 6-2 3/8 and sterling interviews made for an impressive showing. "He had a spectacular combine," said Nfldraftscout.com draft expert Rob Rang. "You can make the argument that he's been the most impressive player in terms of the intangibles he's demonstrated as well as the athleticism of any player so far at the combine." He said the 4.41 "just legitimizes what we've seen on tape and puts a number to the highlight reel that was his career." Overall, he thinks Griffin is worth trading up for. "He possesses two extraordinary skills that are a combination I've never seen before: absolutely spectacular accuracy on the deep ball and elite straight-line speed. Then of course the intangibles make for a pretty impressive combination." Mayock came away convinced that both Luck and Griffin are of the franchise quarterback variety. "They're two special ones I think," he said. He also thinks there's a chance that the No. 3 quarterback, Ryan Tannehill from Texas A&M, could go in the top 10. Tannehill, who's recovering from foot surgery, played in a West Coast-style offense and might be an option for the Browns if they decide not to trade up for Griffin. "The Browns are just going to have to decide if they want to pay to move up to get the guy," said Brandt. "I think they're building the team the right way. They're not mortgaging the future. I thought they made a great trade last year -- and so does everybody else." But will they make another one this year? On Twitter: @marykaycabot web page
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I've warmed to the idea of giving up some picks this draft. But, I'm still not comfortable with giving up picks next year, too. I want to be able to put pieces around him if we can. Now, if we have a stellar free agency class, that could change things.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Quote:
Which option would you guys rather have
1. RG3
2. Tanehill, Cordy Glenn and Vinny Curry
3 Trent Richardson, Kenny Wright and Stephon Gilmore
4. Claiborne, Michael Floyd, Lamar Miller
Option 1 looks a hell of a lot less appealing to me
Let's look at previous drafts with QBs going high .......
Would you rather have:
2011:
Cam Newton
Or
4) AJ Green
22) Anthony Castonzo
37) Jabaal Sheard
Man .... that's actually a tough one.
2010:
Sam Bradford
Or
4) Trent Williams
22) Demaryius Thomas
37) Nate Allen
Even with his problems, I think I'd go with Bradford.
2009:
Matthew Stafford
Or
4) Aaron Curry
22) Percy Harvin
37) Alphonso Smith?
I'd take Stafford in that case, every time.
2008:
3) Matt Ryan
Or
4) Darren McFadden
22) Felix Jones
37) Curtis Loften
Well, McFadden had one good year, and has been injured ...... Jones is ... meh ........ but Loften has been very good. I still think that I'd go with Ryan, even though he hasn't become an elite talent yet.
2007:
1) Jamarcus Russell.
Or ...... a box of doughnuts ....
Gimme the doughnuts, or whoever was taken with the picks.
Well ..... anyway ....
4) Gaines Adams
22) Brady Quinn
37) Eric Weddle
Even with Quinn deleted, it's a clear win for the "other" picks. Adams is one of the best in the NFL.
2006:
3) Vince Young
Or
4) D'Brickashaw Ferguson
22) Manny Lawson
37) Jimmy Williams
Ferguson makes this a win for the picks, but it's not a slam dunk otherwise
That's as far back as I have the patience for.
Anyway ....... Jamarcus Russell "should have" been better than he was. He had a lot of successful starts in college, and did a nice job completing passes. He had a nice TD to INT ratio. He should have been able to make the leap, but he just seemed to disappear once he got paid. Well ..... not disappear so much as eat himself into the 400# range ....... and never did much on the football field at all.
Vince Young was a running QB. He put up 1000 yard seasons running the ball. He also only threw 44 TDs to 28 INTs in his 3 years of college.
I would take Newton, Bradford, Stafford, and Ryan ...... and pass on Russell and Young, taking the other picks instead. Even flipping Newton into the other camp only makes it a 50-50 proposition.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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NACIH that Glenn is there at 22
Well according to the Combine analysis Glenn might go as high as round 3. 
(your buddy lol)
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4) Gaines Adams
22) Brady Quinn
37) Eric Weddle
Even with Quinn deleted, it's a clear win for the "other" picks. Adams is one of the best in the NFL.
Didn't Gaines Adams get traded for lack of production, then ya know die...?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Quote:
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4) Gaines Adams
22) Brady Quinn
37) Eric Weddle
Even with Quinn deleted, it's a clear win for the "other" picks. Adams is one of the best in the NFL.
Didn't Gaines Adams get traded for lack of production, then ya know die...?
Oh God yeah ...... who was I thinking of?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Good comparison, I'd take the picks in 2011, 2008, 2007, 2006, and with the QB in 2010 and 2009 -- I'll give you 2008 as being close-ish.
~Lyuokdea
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THe vikings got a 28 yr old running back. they also gave up 8 picks and some players as well. We're talking about getting a 22 yr old qb, who has the potential to be great at the most important position in the game. This guy could play for us for the next 10-15 yrs. How many did walker play for the vikings?? Plus we would be giving up maybe 4-5 picks at the most. Your comparison is way off base.
The Cowboys turned that trade into Aikman, Irvin, and Smith and won 3 Super Bowls.
What players could St. Louis grab to make them want to trade? We have a lot of the same needs as they do on the offensive side of the ball. Receivers and OL. On defense, they probably need even more than we do.
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Great illustration YTown, but I still have to think that we might have made different choices all things being equal, meaning Heckert might have made better choices.
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It could have been Samuel,John or John Quincy Adams.They all have that death thing in common.
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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Quote:
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THe vikings got a 28 yr old running back. they also gave up 8 picks and some players as well. We're talking about getting a 22 yr old qb, who has the potential to be great at the most important position in the game. This guy could play for us for the next 10-15 yrs. How many did walker play for the vikings?? Plus we would be giving up maybe 4-5 picks at the most. Your comparison is way off base.
The Cowboys turned that trade into Aikman, Irvin, and Smith and won 3 Super Bowls.
What players could St. Louis grab to make them want to trade? We have a lot of the same needs as they do on the offensive side of the ball. Receivers and OL. On defense, they probably need even more than we do.
That's not entirely true. Aikman was drafted in 89, and Irvin in 88. Walker was traded in the fall of 89. They did use one of those picks on Smith.
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The posters who think we are getting for only our two first rounders and a mid-round pick are living in a dreamworld.
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Watching All bets are off, and just heard that washington is offering the rams their 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and next years number 1 to move up......I really like RG3, but not for that price. I woul of been ok with both of our number 1s this year and thats it. If this is true then we need to go hard after Matt Flynn, draft Richardson, then get Michael Floyd at 22, and snag a RT in round 2. Still think we should take a look at LaMichael James in round 3
#brownsgoodkarma
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Quote:
Our two firsts and a second should surpass that if we really want RG3.
We have a huge advantage having the 4th pick. That allows them to get one of Claiborne, Blackmon, or Kalil.
The Redskin's pick doesn't give them that guarantee. The 4th pick gives them a shot at one of the top 2 non-QB players of the draft too.
^^^^^^^^^^^ This is exactly why I think we're going to end up with the winning bid on RGIII at the end of the day.
People can crunch the draft value chart until they're blue in the face but if I'm St. Louis, getting a couple hundred or so extra points out of Washington isn't going to mean anything if they trade down to #6 and see RGIII/Kalil/Blackmon/Claiborne go off the board right before they pick. They have crap at OT, WR and CB... picking at #4 allows them to take the best player in the draft at one of those positions. To me, trading down to #4 and STILL getting an elite player easily trumps trading down to #6 and praying someone falls. Oh, and we can also give them 2 firsts NOW versus a Washington forward loaded deal.
Unless Washington actually pulls the trade off or we say we're not trying to trade up, I'm going to assume they're being used by the Rams for leverage to squeeze more out of us... it just doesn't make sense for St. Louis to pull a trade off with them if they can pull one off with us for a similar return... we're holding all kinds of ammo that Washington just doesn't possess.
We're... we're good?
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
i guess all the draft talk was starting to slow down, so someone decided to throw a little gas on the fire...
Gatta put all those Blogs and Articles out somehow...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532 |
Bruce Drennan's "source" was MKC....so I take it for what its worth. All I was saying was if that is true, then we need to pass. Not throwing fire on anything...just giving my opinion. Or are we not allowed to do that anymore?
#brownsgoodkarma
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
I didn't mean you, i meant the people that put out stories they heard from "unnamed sources"
It's the one media tool I think I hate the most...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,532 |
Oh alright, I thought you was talking about me.....yeah I think by the time the draft comes around we are going to hear talk about Indy taking RG3, and Luck slipping out of the 2nd round lol.....gotta hate how the media puts fake stories out there.
I say stay at 4, get Richardson, then Floyd at 22....if not Floyd then that kid from GT/
#brownsgoodkarma
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Part of me is ok with drafting Richardson...
Part of me thinks its somewhat of a "waste"
I'd rather go Claiborne...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,590
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,590 |
I am looking at the #22 as a bonus of sorts. If we aren't set on using it then why not let some other team who wants to trade back into the first nab it? Grab a high 2nd rounder and a first in 2013. OR ... pick up a third to drop down a few spots ... then use that third with a 5th or a 4th and move back up into the 2nd. We do have leverage and if Heckert wheels and deals we COULD walk away from this draft with another bounty of maybe 5 starters with a few more developmental players. I'd hate to waste a lot of that on one guy ...
"Believe deep down in your heart that you're destined to do great things."
@pstu24
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) RGIII part 2
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