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Instead of using stats, how about, gee I don't know, watching them play?
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now that right there is laughable
So is assuming anyone that wants to upgrade the position is "throwing him under the bus"
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Instead of using stats, how about, gee I don't know, watching them play?
typical,, very typical answer.. instead of trying to understand what i was doing.. you and others take it another direction.. and it's all because someone showed you that things may not be as they seem
but hey,,, if you wanna be blind.. be my guest
what's really funny is,, NOT ONE OF YOU SAW OR ACKNOWLEDGED THAT I USED
FWIW TWICE.. NOT ONE OF YOU.. YOU SIMPLY ATTACK BECAUSE SOMEONE DARED TO DISAGREE OR TO SHOW ANOTHER PATH..
Last edited by Damanshot; 03/01/12 10:32 PM.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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If you don't look at college stats, what the hell else do you look at
Translation to the next level. In regards to NFL projections, stats are pretty much meaningless.
For example, what if I were to compare the passing stats of Timmy Chang from Hawaii to the college stats of the top NFL QB's?
Chang would look like a peer or better.
What happened to Timmy Chang? He couldn't make an NFL roster, and bombed in the CFL.
College stats are predominantly meaningless.
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If I'm reading you correct.
I think that you are trying to say that all we have to go on with Griffen at this point is what he has done at the College level and I would agree with that fact.
That's all we have to go on stats aside It's all projection based.
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typical,, very typical answer.. instead of trying to understand what i was doing.. you and others take it another direction.. and it's all because someone showed you that things may not be as they seem
You're basically trying to do a smear campaign against RG3 using his College Stats...
We are all aware of what your were doing...
Weather you put FWIW, put it in purple font or whatever...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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but, in typical fashion, those that want colt gone and rg here,., anything that shows there may be a weak spot in the armor can't be real..
And you'll go to any length to defend Colt?
Colt's college stats?  you gotta be kidding me. Lets check the high school numbers while we're at it.
No offense met, but since RG3 hasn't played a single snap in the NFL including at the Combine where he chose not to perform in passing drills. His excuse: I don't want to throw to receivers that he's not familiar with. Sounds like the people that he'll be passing to at the NFL level to me.
Besides, the college stats are the only ones you can compare. If you're going to say that they don't tell the whole story, then explain that and how you come to that conclusion. If criticism of that comparison is the only defense of your point-of-view, then it's rather weak.
McCoy ran the 5th fastest time for all QBs at the 2010 NFL Combine with a 4.79 40-yard dash. McCoy didn't throw at the Combine, but that was due to injury.
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Please God, don't tell me you are using stats to evaluate draft prospects. That is just moronic.
And I love you saying RG3 played four years when he had all of 69 attempts a year ago.
You mean Case Keenum wasn't the best QB in college last year?
No Way!
So, RG3 > Kurt Warner (UDFA)? Don't get the sculptor carving that bust of RG3 just yet.
So, RG3 > Joe Montana (3rd Round)? Don't get his ring size measured just yet.
So RG3 = Eli Manning (see suggested trade scenarios). I'm sure he'll be win more Super Bowls! I'm sure he'll win even a single one for sure!
Isn't all that praise being heaped upon RG3 just a tad premature?
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Please God, don't tell me you are using stats to evaluate draft prospects. That is just moronic.
And I love you saying RG3 played four years when he had all of 69 attempts a year ago.
You mean Case Keenum wasn't the best QB in college last year?
No Way!
So, RG3 > Kurt Warner (UDFA)? Don't get the sculptor carving that bust of RG3 just yet.
So, RG3 > Joe Montana (3rd Round)? Don't get his ring size measured just yet.
So RG3 = Eli Manning (see suggested trade scenarios). I'm sure he'll be win more Super Bowls! I'm sure he'll win even a single one for sure!
Isn't all that praise being heaped upon RG3 just a tad premature?
Did you quote the wrong post?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I don't know for sure, but it really looks as if Colts stats trump RG's in college.. more importantly, it makes me wonder, if RG would have come out when colt did, came to the Browns in the exact situation that Colt was in, would he have faired any better.
i really don't know the answer to that, but it's something to at least consider..
Ok, I'll consider it.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I don't know for sure, but it really looks as if Colts stats trump RG's in college.. more importantly, it makes me wonder, if RG would have come out when colt did, came to the Browns in the exact situation that Colt was in, would he have faired any better.
i really don't know the answer to that, but it's something to at least consider..
Ok, I'll consider it.
Ok, I've considered it, and consider it to be ridiculous. 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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I looked at it stat vs stat.. nothing more.. I drew no solid conclusions,, just that there is something there that may mean the hype on RG may not be be with sound foundation.., something to look at
What else is new???...YOU...Mac...Never draw solid conclusions...Just long winded posts about nothing at the end...
Thank gawd that the pundits making these determinations about Griffin DON'T look at and compare Collegiate STATS...
Now you're gonna say "How do u know that they don't?"...
Pretty clear cut...Because it's IGNORANT to do so...
Go Browns!!!
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What else is new???...YOU...Mac...Never draw solid conclusions...Just long winded posts about nothing at the end...
DinD...how about this...I'll make is short, too...
...you sire, are blinded by love
...in love with RGIII.
...and for the record, if RGIII falls to us at #4, I have no problem should the Browns decide to draft him.
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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If I'm reading you correct.
I think that you are trying to say that all we have to go on with Griffen at this point is what he has done at the College level and I would agree with that fact.
That's all we have to go on stats aside It's all projection based.
THANK YOU...
that is all we have on RG.. and compared to Colt when he came out, there isn't a significant difference.
THAT was all I was pointing out... but,, the people on here that are desparate for a QB and feel as if we should throw away this draft and perhaps more to get one, see my comments and immediately jump all over me because there COULD be a hole in thier thinking..
just saying,, bring up an alternative scenario and boom.. you get attacked..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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but, in typical fashion, those that want colt gone and rg here,., anything that shows there may be a weak spot in the armor can't be real..
And you'll go to any length to defend Colt?
Colt's college stats? you gotta be kidding me. Lets check the high school numbers while we're at it.
what's funny, you think I'm defending Colt... and that's not the case.. i was trying to demonstrate the similarity between the two of htem
and I showed you that even in the stats it's pretty clear that RG was the far superior College QB....10.7yds/PA to 7.5 is smashing..all that with a better comp % on a team with less comfy leads to "stat whore" (in fact more close games with teams prepared that you'll throw the ball)...it's not even close even in the stats...."trumping it"? You can't even read stats, Jesus
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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but, in typical fashion, those that want colt gone and rg here,., anything that shows there may be a weak spot in the armor can't be real..
And you'll go to any length to defend Colt?
Colt's college stats? you gotta be kidding me. Lets check the high school numbers while we're at it.
what's funny, you think I'm defending Colt... and that's not the case.. i was trying to demonstrate the similarity between the two of htem
and I showed you that even in the stats it's pretty clear that RG was the far superior College QB....10.7yds/PA to 7.5 is smashing..all that with a better comp % on a team with less comfy leads to "stat whore" (in fact more close games with teams prepared that you'll throw the ball)...it's not even close even in the stats...."trumping it"? You can't even read stats, Jesus
Again, pay attention.. I don't care what you showed me,, it doesn't matter..
AS I SAID,, it was a FWIW kinda exercise...but like so many, you are only interested in belittleing people,, not reading what they say
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I read what you wrote and disputed it showing that it was wrong...YOU said Colt's stats were as good as RG's, even going overboard with "trumping it"
I showed that a closer look to the meaningful stats shows what the eyes see: that RG was a clear better CFB QB
Hey Keenum and K.Moore have great CFB stats too...why don't they get drafted in the 1st?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Other than watching a few highlight films on RGIII I have not seen him play (I work every Saturday and don't get to see college games) The biggest problem I have with him from the highlight films I have seen is just like most College QB's his receivers are WIDE OPEN, which does not give me much of an idea how he will do in the NFL when the QB's have a very small window to complete the passes in. I would love to see footage of him making the pass BEFORE the receiver makes his break, or squezzing in some passes in a small window. Unless or untill I can see plenty of film of that I can not get excited about the idea of giving up mutiple high picks to draft a QB when we have so many holes that still need filled on the roster. I have always been one of those guys who believes you build your O-line, defensive front seven, then add your skill players, before going after the crown jewel (a great QB) because without the other pieces in place your never going to be successful.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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GM, that is one of the toughest things to evaluate when looking at QB's in college. Brady Quinn is a perfect example of this. Many loved the guy. I didn't. Like most top-rated QB's these days, he had big windows to throw through. The reason I along with others didn't care for Quinn revolved around how inaccurate his throws were even though he completed a bunch of passes.
In games you would see him throw to a receiver who had a 3-yard window. The receiver would make the catch, but the throw wasn't in-stride or on his numbers. That was the tell on Quinn, and it's largely why he's failed as a pro.
It's even harder to evaluate with the spread QB's. McCoy is a perfect example of that. Mac Brown at Texas has done a masterful job of tailoring offenses to suit his QB's. He built the offense around Vince Young, then when Colt came in, he retooled the offense to fit what he did well. Those offenses did a good job of hiding those players weaknesses.
So you're afraid of Griffin because of the spread and the windows. Get in line, brotha 
When scouting these spread guys you have to absolutely ignore the fact they complete passes. That's a given. What people need to do is see how accurate the throws are when they are completed. With Griffin, unlike most QB's in college spreads, he hits his receivers largely in-stride or right on the numbers. But more importantly, when watching the games or replays, there are just a few throws per game where these spread guys attempt to make NFL throws. That's where guys like Griffin separate themselves from the rest of the pack.
There are several throws per game where Griffin finds the 1-1 coverage and makes an NFL throw down the field that's right on the money. If you go back and watch the TCU and A&M games, you'll have to wait for them to happen, but you'll see those throws and how accurately Griffin nailed them.
Really, to me, the concern about Griffin isn't his arm. The vast majority of scouts all admit he has a special arm. The biggest concern is gonna be whether he can learn to avoid the big hit, which is something he hasn't shown at the college level. That lack of instinct has cost Vick in his career, and if Griffin doesn't learn how to just go down, he's going to miss a ton of time as well.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Translation to the next level. In regards to NFL projections, stats are pretty much meaningless.
Then why are RGIII and Andrew Luck both in the top 5 in college QB ratings? and Mercilus and Jarvis Jones are both in the top 5 in sacks? and LeMicheal James, David Wilson and Richardson are all in the top 6 in rushing yards? Kendall Wright and Justin Blackmon are both in the top 5 in receiving yards.. Claiborn is top 6 in interceptions....
Stats obviously aren't EVERYTHING because there are players in the top 5 of all of those categories who will never play, much less succeed, in the NFL.. but they aren't meaningless.. Great players put up great numbers typically...
Scouts work to understand the numbers, but they don't totally discount them.
yebat' Putin
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Friday March 02, 2012 - 11:51 AM Clark Judge Redskins' choices: Manning, Griffin or new coaching staff in 2013 By Clark Judge | CBSSports.com Senior NFL Columnist If there's someone I would want to be today it's the St. Louis Rams. If there's someone I wouldn't, it's the Washington Redskins. They absolutely, positively, must have one of two quarterbacks, and there's no guarantee they get either. But they must ... or else. Essentially, the Redskins' options come down to this: 1) They sign Peyton Manning if/when he is released by Indianapolis; 2) They acquire the Rams' first draft pick -- second overall -- by snowing St. Louis with an offer it can't refuse and drafting Robert Griffin III; or 3) Their coaching staff gets fired after the season if the team fails at 1 or 2. Yep, it's as simple as 1-2-3. The Redskins can't win with Rex Grossman, and they can't win with John Beck. They discovered that the hard way last season. So they better find a quarterback, and soon because Mike Shanahan's past two seasons -- a combined 11-21 -- are the worst back-to-back finishes of any coach in the Daniel Snyder era. That means the heat is on Shanahan to win and win now, and he won't ... he can't ... without a serious upgrade at quarterback. The Redskins thought they solved the position two years ago when they acquired Donovan McNabb, but they were wrong. They can't afford to be wrong again. Shanahan's choices are clear: Manning, Griffin or a realtor. General manager Bruce Allen said last week that the club has "a game plan" for its next move, and it doesn't take a genius to figure out that it must include Manning and RG3. In fact, defensive coordinator Jim Haslett allegedly said as much in a chance encounter with a fan, who blogged the information for public consumption. I don't know if Haslett did or didn't say it, but I do know Washington has one decision, and it's a Sophie's Choice: Do you take the risk and gamble on the four-time MVP in Manning when he becomes a free agent? Or do you mortgage the future for Griffin -- overpaying for the next-best quarterback to Andrew Luck? Me? I think the decision is easy. There's no guarantee Manning can play again, and there's no guarantee he doesn't get hurt again. I understand he has a glittering résumé, is one of the best at his position and, at 36 (his birthday is later this month), could have two or three more quality years left in him. But that's provided he's the Peyton Manning of 2010, and after four surgeries -- with another possible -- I don't know what he is anymore. Plus, as I said, he's about to turn 36, and is someone who has spent most of his career acting as his own offensive coordinator -- lining up receivers and running backs in practices and calling his own plays in games. That's fine, only I don't know how it would go over with Shanahan's son, Kyle, who happens to be Washington's offensive coordinator. All I know is that the last time there was a decorated veteran at the position he and McNabb clashed, with McNabb cashiered at the end of the season. What matters most, of course, is what Manning has left, and I don't know anyone with that answer. There are conflicting reports about his last workouts with the Colts. Then there's his future, and, frankly, I'm not sure there is one. He might be a descending player at or near the end of his career. But remember this: When Hall of Fame quarterback Steve Young was at the end of his career in San Francisco, the 49ers gave him permission in the spring of 2000 to seek a deal with any team that was interested. And somebody was. It was Mike Shanahan in Denver. Shanahan wanted to make him his starter, even though Young had a history of concussions, and Young seemed intrigued. In the end, however, he decided against the idea and retired. Griffin is not Steve Young, and he is not Peyton Manning. But he might be. He just turned 22 and is the second-best player in the draft. As many scouts declared during last week's scouting combine, he's "the complete package" -- a quarterback who can run, is accurate with his passes, is a leader, is smart and wins. In short, he's just what Washington is looking for. Of course, it will take a king's ransom to acquire him, but the Redskins are where San Diego was in 1998 when there were two must-have quarterbacks on the board. Like San Diego, the Redskins aren't in a position to negotiate on a price. They must ... absolutely must ... do what's necessary to acquire St. Louis' first-round pick. The Chargers paid two first-rounders, a second and a three-time Pro Bowl player to move one spot, from third to second, to take Ryan Leaf, and that's what you do when you have a conviction about someone. They believed they had to have Leaf or Manning, so then-general manager Bobby Beathard did what was necessary to acquire one of them. So the Chargers overpaid. But that happens when you're desperate, and color Washington desperate. The Redskins haven't had a top-10 quarterback since Mark Brunell in 2006, and look where it has gotten them. There was talk in Washington this week that the Redskins are poised to make a run at a high-profile wide receiver in free agency, and that's understandable. The club needs playmakers. But you don't spend big bucks on a veteran wide receiver unless you have someone to throw him the ball. The Redskins do not -- not now they don't -- but that can and must change. They don't have a choice. Then, again, they do. Manning or Griffin. web page
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I read what you wrote and disputed it showing that it was wrong...YOU said Colt's stats were as good as RG's, even going overboard with "trumping it"
I showed that a closer look to the meaningful stats shows what the eyes see: that RG was a clear better CFB QB
Hey Keenum and K.Moore have great CFB stats too...why don't they get drafted in the 1st?
Oh Shut up already. until you grasp what it was I was saying, anything you say is totally meaningless...
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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There are several throws per game where Griffin finds the 1-1 coverage and makes an NFL throw down the field that's right on the money. If you go back and watch the TCU and A&M games, you'll have to wait for them to happen, but you'll see those throws and how accurately Griffin nailed them.
Hell Colt has several throws a game where he does that IN the NFL  Like I said I really don't get to see the college games and I am not qualified to open my big mouth one way or the other then it comes to RGIII, so I'm going to keep my big mouth shut and trust in the front office to make the right choice.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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I'd make sure Griffin knows how to slide.
College baseball seasons are over when camp starts. I'd bring in a baseball coach for a few weeks as a special coach to make sure Griffin knows how to get down in a safe way..
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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how much is too much to give up in your guys opinion?
Browns draft wish list: RG3, LaMichael James, Devier Posey, Bruce Irvin
FA Wish List: Mike Tolbert, Pierre Garcon, Mario Manningham, Demetrius Bell
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There are several throws per game where Griffin finds the 1-1 coverage and makes an NFL throw down the field that's right on the money. If you go back and watch the TCU and A&M games, you'll have to wait for them to happen, but you'll see those throws and how accurately Griffin nailed them.
Hell Colt has several throws a game where he does that IN the NFL Like I said I really don't get to see the college games and I am not qualified to open my big mouth one way or the other then it comes to RGIII, so I'm going to keep my big mouth shut and trust in the front office to make the right choice.
If you saw him, you'd like him GM,, it's not him that has me questioning anything,, it's only what it appears we have to do to get him that bothers me..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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There are several throws per game where Griffin finds the 1-1 coverage and makes an NFL throw down the field that's right on the money. If you go back and watch the TCU and A&M games, you'll have to wait for them to happen, but you'll see those throws and how accurately Griffin nailed them.
Hell Colt has several throws a game where he does that IN the NFL Like I said I really don't get to see the college games and I am not qualified to open my big mouth one way or the other then it comes to RGIII, so I'm going to keep my big mouth shut and trust in the front office to make the right choice.
By that line of thinking, GM, Frye made those throws as well.
You talked about those open college windows and how they pertain to scouting Griffin. Most college QB's get those windows. It's how well they make the throws when those windows aren't as open that makes or breaks them.
As for trusting the front office...phooey. Couch, Holcomb, Frye, Anderson, Quinn, McCoy...I reserve the right to question the FO 
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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There are several throws per game where Griffin finds the 1-1 coverage and makes an NFL throw down the field that's right on the money. If you go back and watch the TCU and A&M games, you'll have to wait for them to happen, but you'll see those throws and how accurately Griffin nailed them.
Hell Colt has several throws a game where he does that IN the NFL Like I said I really don't get to see the college games and I am not qualified to open my big mouth one way or the other then it comes to RGIII, so I'm going to keep my big mouth shut and trust in the front office to make the right choice.
By that line of thinking, GM, Frye made those throws as well.
You talked about those open college windows and how they pertain to scouting Griffin. Most college QB's get those windows. It's how well they make the throws when those windows aren't as open that makes or breaks them.
As for trusting the front office...phooey. Couch, Holcomb, Frye, Anderson, Quinn, McCoy...I reserve the right to question the FO
Come on toad.. My goodness man.. The ONLY player this front office had anything to do with was McCoy.. in fact, they got rid of anderson and quinn.. so please.. every front office of every team makes a mistake..
IF McCoy is indeed a mistake, it will be thiers to own..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Horsefeathers.
The tongue-in-cheek definition of insanity is doing the same action but expecting a different outcome. I'm not about to "trust" any front office just because they aren't the old front office's. I wasn't about to trust Savage just because he was the GM. For God's sake, that idiot loved and wanted Jamarcus Russell, gave Derek Anderson a big, shiny new contract, and traded up for Brady Quinn. 
But wait, this time I feel lucky! Yeah! I'm gonna blindly trust THIS regime. I just KNOW they are gonna get it right THIS time!
Yeah, it's over-the-top and I am NOT mocking GM (the poster, not Heckert ) but I am making a point.
I'm not going to blindly trust any regime just because they are the regime.
Policy, Davis, Savage, Mangini...Fool me once, shame you you. Fool me four times...
I'm making my own opinions.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Legend
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Legend
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how much is too much to give up in your guys opinion?
We can make up crazy numbers....5 1st rounders...sure, that's to much.
I am not going to try to say what would be to much, I'll just say we aren't near that point so it doesn't matter. Whatever it is, it really is only to much if the guy doesn't work out....then a 3rd rounder is to much, but you don't go in to trades if you are worried about the guy not working out, do you??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Thank You ! My sediments exactly ..
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Horsefeathers.
The tongue-in-cheek definition of insanity is doing the same action but expecting a different outcome
No argument from me,, I'm only saying, it wasn't this front office that had anything to do with any of those players you mentioned other than mccoy..
So,, take that horsey 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Shall I agree? Naaay.
Even in that vacuum, I'm not handing blind trust over to Holmgren, not again.
When we drafted McCoy, I said I didn't like the gamble, but would sit on my proverbial hands for no other reason than it was Holmgren, who had a spotless track-record of knowing QB's. Well, at least with me, his one mulligan is gone, and so is my one personal offer of blind trust.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Moving up for Quinn was a gamble, taking McCoy in the 3rd wasn't much of a gamble. Now if you'd said Hardesty, well...
#GMSTRONG
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By that line of thinking, GM, Frye made those throws as well.
Your right Toad and how do we know RGIII won't be another FRY  or any of the other dozen sure fire can't miss prospect who have missed. IMO we still have to many holes that need fixed first before we trade away the farm for ANY QB, but like I said I have no clue if RGIII will be good or a bust and I defer that decision to the guys who know WAY MORE than I do about him
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Shall I agree? Naaay.
Even in that vacuum, I'm not handing blind trust over to Holmgren, not again.
When we drafted McCoy, I said I didn't like the gamble, but would sit on my proverbial hands for no other reason than it was Holmgren, who had a spotless track-record of knowing QB's. Well, at least with me, his one mulligan is gone, and so is my one personal offer of blind trust.
so let me be sure I have this right.. you won't trust any team exec if they made one bad call?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Moving up for Quinn was a gamble, taking McCoy in the 3rd wasn't much of a gamble. Now if you'd said Hardesty, well...
This is something that people seldom take into consideration. They look at where a player is drafted and correlate the production to the draft position and base the ultimate judgment on that.
But there's a problem with that line of thinking.
In fact, Tulsa, I would turn that around and say taking McCoy was a bigger gamble than Hardesty.
Huh?
Here's why: It isn't the money we invested in McCoy. It isn't the 3rd round selection. The gamble and what appears to be the ultimate loss comes in the form of the time invested into him as the starter.
Think about it.
We didn't just waste a 3rd rounder on a QB. We also lost two full seasons on a guy when we could have...should have...gone in another direction.
Savage did the exact same damned thing with Frye.
So how can I make an argument that the 3rd round QB was a bigger gamble than trading some picks for a 2nd round RB? Because RB's are interchangeable, and if we never heard from Hardesty again, we can plug in someone very easily and never miss a heartbeat. Meanwhile, Here we are again, two years later, trying desperately to find a QB.
We've wasted the last five seasons on 3rd round QB's. The ultimate cost of those two failures is FAR greater than just two 3rd round picks...
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Legend
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Whoa there's some serious straw grasping in that logic. Most at the time thought there was good value in McCoy in the 3rd. He was never intended to even see the field two seasons ago, injury forced that decision. With the off season such as it was and a new offense being installed I can hardly agree with the fact last season was gamble as we didn't have too many other options available and trying to draft someone new last year to install them as qb would have been beyond moronic. We didn't even know at the time of the draft if there was going to be a shortened season or a season at all but things were bleak on the negotiating front. I love the spin though!
#GMSTRONG
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Shall I agree? Naaay.
Even in that vacuum, I'm not handing blind trust over to Holmgren, not again.
When we drafted McCoy, I said I didn't like the gamble, but would sit on my proverbial hands for no other reason than it was Holmgren, who had a spotless track-record of knowing QB's. Well, at least with me, his one mulligan is gone, and so is my one personal offer of blind trust.
What QB(s) did he draft in Seattle that did anything?
He drafted several late .... maybe Wallace .....?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Who, exactly, saw value in the pick? What difference does it make whether or not he was slated to sit for a year? What If McCoy had been taken in the 5th round? How about as an undrafted free agent? "Value" at the time is absolutely and utterly meaningless if the player doesn't pan out.
None of that matters. The only thing that matters is whether or not the player became a good player at the most important position on the field.
The ultimate viewpoint that matters is whether or not he became our QB of the future. Whether or not he was considered a "good value" is utterly and totally meaningless. The only thing that matters is whether or not he became a good starter. He didn't. We wasted two years on a "value" player.
Passing judgment on a player no longer takes "value" into consideration. The only thing that matters is whether or not it worked. It didn't. So it's not the 3rd round pick thrown away which represents the ultimate failure, but the two years of not having a QB.
That ain't spin. That's a fact.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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