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I thought all the reports said that the Rams DIDN'T play the two teams against each other?
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Ok, riddle me this. Why are we denying the faulty reports about being in the hunt for Flynn??
Well.....We aren't.........can you find one article where the FO has come out and denied the Florida Paper's report??? It is other sources that are denying it for us...
The FO have come out long before these discussions supposedly took place for Flynn and said we won't be a player for him. that is the only denial from the FO...BEFORE any of this took place.
I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...
What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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J/C I just love how some of you people always seem to know exactly what happened so i want to ask if there is anyway i can get the ok to be in the room when these transactions are made since you people obviously are. 
#gmstrong
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what I don't get is how our #4 and #22 this year and first next year isn't better than what the 'Skins gave up.
I agree. So, if we did offer up 3 1st rounders, were they #4, '13, '14?
#gmstrong
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Why would the Rams have any obligation to tell the media or anyone else outside their inner circle how they run their organization?
I simply think in terms of how the deal went down behind closed doors and how a GM thinks to maximize the future potential of his organization...because trust me that is all the Rams were concerned with..who would give them more...and if the difference between having a great quarterback is only a second round pick, we are going to be a laughing stock for years to come...it's nice to tell ourselves what we want to hear and believe what we want to hear....
but the reality is Heckert was in the driver's seat and we botched the chance at a franchise qb....
Now we have to come up with another plan.
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Isn't this thread about who we will take with the #4 pick?
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Isn't this thread about who we will take with the #4 pick?
apparently we are still hung up on doing something with the #4 pick that is no longer an option (packaging it and much more to move up to #2) that we can't move onto anything else to do with the pick.
#gmstrong
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We could still package all of those same picks and convince Washing to trade the #2 to us.... maybe throw in an extra 1st to boot.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Why would the Rams have any obligation to tell the media or anyone else outside their inner circle how they run their organization?
But apparently they told you? 
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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OK Lets take Blackmon at 4. Everything I've seen has him as at least the THIRD best WR in the draft or maybe Tannehil. Claiborne? Richardson? Pfft no consensus best position players for us. We laugh at risk! Detroit took a lot of WRs and that worked out for them. Eventually  Now that we have a guard for the final preseason game I feel a lot better about this team.
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Told him what? About the fourth pick in the draft? (Which is what this thread is about.)
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Told him what? About the fourth pick in the draft? (Which is what this thread is about.)
Correct.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Why would the Rams have any obligation to tell the media or anyone else outside their inner circle how they run their organization?
OK suppose this situation.....Suppose Cleveland's offer was low... (perhaps it was) after all it was never told exactly what the offer was. It could have been a first and a 3rd for all we know. So now the Redskins put out a deal that no one in their right mind thought they would offer....so...because this story WAS going to get out BEFORE the trade could actualy finalize 5-6 days later. How do you save Washingtons face so that they don't back out of the deal???
Non competing bids sounds like a good story to me...and its sounds so juicy and like such an "insider" wokings kind of story....The kind of thing people just eat up.
Who knows...maybe the Browns offered 3 first rounders...maybe they didn't. Maybe they didn't offer a single thing....But you know what...everything we have heard is what EVERYONE ELSE has had to say and not one word has been what WE have said.
Now you wanted to know why would a story like that get out...well simply because there was no way that the story of the Redskins winning the pick would not get out....and when it was told HOW MUCH the Redskins paid....there had to be SOME face saving to be done in order to keep them from backing out of the deal before it could be done on Tuesday. Because if it got out that Cleveland lowballed and there were no other bidders.....What would you do if you were Washington????
I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...
What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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Blackmon not consensus best WR? I've seen a couple devil's advocate articles about Floyd, but pretty much everywhere has Blackmon up top.
Also, you say top3. Who is the mystery 3rd WR in this discussion?
#gmstrong
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If we made a lower offer than reported, I think Heckert would be all over it saying we didn't offer that much..
Come on man... we've all answered that about a million times and you just don't wanna see it.., Heckert said that "it's Crazy" when talking about the rumors of what we were offering..
I'm not sure what else you wanna hear from them.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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He didn't say he didn't make it, just that it was crazy.
Maybe he made it, then sat back and thought, "damn, that's crazy".
#GMSTRONG
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I was discussing it....
I could just as easily say that since your mind is made up that we botched the deal, then there is no reason to discuss it.
We either did...and chickened out...or someone wanted it to appear that we were in the bidding.
Can you honestly tell me with a straight face that if you were the rams gm, that you wouldn't have been throwing our name out there as a bidder to drive the price up with the skins?
Thats salesmanship 101...
Its entirely possible that we never even tried to get him, and our name was used to get a killer offer from the skins.
Here is a scenario that hasn't been mentioned. Perhaps we talked with the Rams and said:
If the Colts take RGIII then we will give you #4,#22,#37 and next year's 1st (or whatever) because we want Luck but not RGIII. The Rams don't want to wait until free agency starts because if Manning and Flynn sign in the wrong places then the trade value of their pick gets squashed. So they take the Redskins offer which is a little less but not by much. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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300-pound Alshon Jeffrey?
I am not a fan of drafting Blackmon #4 overall because I don't think he is an elite level wide receiver along the lines of Johnson, Johnson, Fitzgerald, Edwards, and Green. And if he's not on that level he's not worth taking that high.
Do we need a wide receiver? Yes. Should we reach for one just because he is the best wide receiver available? No.
If Blackmon was in last year's draft would you have drafted him ahead of A.J. Green or Julio Jones? No. And Heckert didn't want to draft Jones with the 6th pick.
The way I see it, there are only two options: draft Claiborne (which is not a bad option at all) or trade down (which is also not a bad option).
If we draft Claiborne we now have two very good corner backs (in theory) in a passing league. It would also allow Sheldon Brown to move to third corner (or safety?) and Buster Skrine to fourth corner (if we don't re-sign Patterson). That would give us one of the best corner back groups in the league.
There are also several teams that might want to trade up to draft a player. Other teams may covet Blackmon (Rams, Jaguars, Dolphins, and/or Seahawks) or Claiborne (move one spot down and trade with the Buccaneers, Panthers, Bills, etc.)
We have some pretty good options and I see us having a very fruitful draft with Heckert at the helm.
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As much as I like Blackmon, I have a feeling we're going to be getting some trade calls on him. I have to think the Rams will take him at 6, and I think if Claiborne is there, the Bucs take him at 5. So, unless we're totally in love with Claiborne, I can see a team like the Jaguars making us a nice little offer to move up so they can get Blackmon.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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I bet Blackmon will look like a bust here...
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Unless we're able to deal with the QB situation later in the 1st round or early in the 2nd.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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I don't believe anyone would take Blackmon over Green. Green is going to be special. I would however have taken Blackmon over Jones. Just my personal opinion. I would be happy with Blackmon at #4. I would be happy with Claiborne at #4. I would be happy with trading down if we get good value.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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Even if Blackmon is better than Jones (which is an arguable point), how much better is he? Not that much better if you ask me (which no one did). So why would Heckert draft Blackmon 4th when he didn't want to draft Jones 6th? (Not a question directed at you, although you are welcome to answer, but to everyone.)
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Quote:
Even if Blackmon is better than Jones (which is an arguable point), how much better is he? Not that much better if you ask me (which no one did). So why would Heckert draft Blackmon 4th when he didn't want to draft Jones 6th? (Not a question directed at you, although you are welcome to answer, but to everyone.)
because there might not be a team willing to give us the same bounty that Atlanta did last year?
#gmstrong
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It did not last. No wonder people leave.
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And if you are wrong????? What if he turns out to be Michael Irvin like good????
Frankly, I think the kid is a stud....I think he plays bigger than his size...everybody is always surprised to hear his actual numbers...And frankly I don't think you can compare hin with Green as they are 2 completely different receivers....Its like trying to compare Don Hutson and Jerry Rice.....2 completey different receivers who play a completely different game. Blackmons game is not AJ Green's game and vice versa. And Blackmon's game is actually better suited to our offense than AJ Green...I also like the attitude and desire (that can't possibly be measured ) which comes with Blackmon...It's not a me first "Braylon" type of attitude" Its a "I want to be the baddest mo fo on the field" attitude.
I don't think the kid craps out. The kid is a "football player" in the best sense....not a prima dona. And he is a pretty darn good player at that.
Now having said that...I am with some of the consensus that I will be happy if it is one of 3 scenarios at 4....Blackmon, Claiborne, or trade down a few spots.
I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...
What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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Right, but if that were the case, wouldn't he just take the best player available. (I am assuming Blackmon is not that player as it seems there is a consensus that the top four players in the draft are Luck/RGIII/Kalil/Claiborne. After that I have seen either Richardson or Blackmon.
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Right, but if that were the case, wouldn't he just take the best player available. (I am assuming Blackmon is not that player as it seems there is a consensus that the top four players in the draft are Luck/RGIII/Kalil/Claiborne. After that I have seen either Richardson or Blackmon.
I agree that if Claiborne is higher on our board, then he should be the pick.
#gmstrong
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I had above Green and Jones last year. The only other WR in college that is close to Blackmon is Woods(usc).
Last edited by Paco; 03/14/12 02:09 PM.
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Wait, you had Blackmon over A.J. Green?
(On a side note, Robert Woods is very good. His current USC teammate and former high school teammate Marqise Lee might be even better.)
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I didn't want to make it its own thread, but here's what I'd like to see us do.
As much as some disagree, I think we're going to stick with Colt McCoy, and although it's not my favorite thing, I think I will be ok with it. You lost out on RG3. Grabbing Flynn would be overpaying, and I honestly don't think Flynn is much of an upgrade over what we have. I think Tannehill is only viable if you can trade back and fall in the perfect position. Pick 4 is too high, and the way quarterbacks are falling off the board, you may have to go 4 to get him. I think anything else they try and do at QB is chasing. If you don't know what chasing is, it's term us gamblers use. It's when you lose one bet, then go and make another to make up for the initial one you lost. You end up worse off then you did after your first wager. I think that's potentially what the Browns would be doing if they throw a giant bag of money at Matt Flynn or draft Tannehill with that first pick. Unless you had those guys that highly rated before you lost out on RG3, stick to your plan. There is no guarantee you aren't a 4-12 team if you grab Tannehill or Flynn anyway.
I know big time spending isn't on our radar, but I would love for them to pursue Winston, the tackle that was just released by Houston. Sell him on playing with pro bowl caliber players like Thomas, Mack, and Steinbach, as well as young players with promise like Lauvao and Jason Pinkston. An added bonus would be bringing back Hillis who has to be a lineman's dream, because of the way he runs, and how he doesn't need time to juke and dance behind you.
Other than that I would really only explore lesser known names at WR and DE. Guys who could blossom into good players, and at the worst, add some kind depth.
As far as the draft goes, my dream scenario would be to try and con St. Louis into thinking they need our pick to grab Kalil or Blackmon (I imagine one will be gone at #3). We switch spots, move back to 6, get an extra 2, maybe take a look
I think if you can get the OL back on track, get Steiny healthy, and have Hillis or Richardson in the backfield, I think Colt can be good. He was actually pretty ok when we had a run game. Remember way back when?
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Quote:
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Even if Blackmon is better than Jones (which is an arguable point), how much better is he? Not that much better if you ask me (which no one did). So why would Heckert draft Blackmon 4th when he didn't want to draft Jones 6th? (Not a question directed at you, although you are welcome to answer, but to everyone.)
because there might not be a team willing to give us the same bounty that Atlanta did last year?
Exactly. You can't compare last years draft to this years draft in this fashion... If you have the #4 pick in the draft then you take approximately the 4th best player in the draft, whether he is better or worse than the 4th best player in LAST YEARS draft is totally irrelevant.
For all we know, Heck might have had Jones's name penciled in on a piece of paper waiting to see if a deal got done, which it did.. could very well do the same thing this year.. pencil in Blackmon and then wait to see if somebody gives us a trade offer that we think has more value... If it comes, great, if it doesn't send up the paper..
yebat' Putin
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Wait, you had Blackmon over A.J. Green?
(On a side note, Robert Woods is very good. His current USC teammate and former high school teammate Marqise Lee might be even better.)
Yep... I think he's a game changer. He's got that football "it" factor...imho
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He didn't say he didn't make it, just that it was crazy.
Maybe he made it, then sat back and thought, "damn, that's crazy".
Wrong.. he was talking about the rumors about what the Browns were supposedly offering, and he said that "its crazy"
and if you read the post you responded to, I am essentially acknowledging that we made an offer,,
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I didn't want to make it its own thread, but here's what I'd like to see us do.
As much as some disagree, I think we're going to stick with Colt McCoy, and although it's not my favorite thing, I think I will be ok with it. You lost out on RG3. Grabbing Flynn would be overpaying, and I honestly don't think Flynn is much of an upgrade over what we have. I think Tannehill is only viable if you can trade back and fall in the perfect position. Pick 4 is too high, and the way quarterbacks are falling off the board, you may have to go 4 to get him. I think anything else they try and do at QB is chasing. If you don't know what chasing is, it's term us gamblers use. It's when you lose one bet, then go and make another to make up for the initial one you lost. You end up worse off then you did after your first wager. I think that's potentially what the Browns would be doing if they throw a giant bag of money at Matt Flynn or draft Tannehill with that first pick. Unless you had those guys that highly rated before you lost out on RG3, stick to your plan. There is no guarantee you aren't a 4-12 team if you grab Tannehill or Flynn anyway.
I know big time spending isn't on our radar, but I would love for them to pursue Winston, the tackle that was just released by Houston. Sell him on playing with pro bowl caliber players like Thomas, Mack, and Steinbach, as well as young players with promise like Lauvao and Jason Pinkston. An added bonus would be bringing back Hillis who has to be a lineman's dream, because of the way he runs, and how he doesn't need time to juke and dance behind you.
Other than that I would really only explore lesser known names at WR and DE. Guys who could blossom into good players, and at the worst, add some kind depth.
As far as the draft goes, my dream scenario would be to try and con St. Louis into thinking they need our pick to grab Kalil or Blackmon (I imagine one will be gone at #3). We switch spots, move back to 6, get an extra 2, maybe take a look
I think if you can get the OL back on track, get Steiny healthy, and have Hillis or Richardson in the backfield, I think Colt can be good. He was actually pretty ok when we had a run game. Remember way back when?
Spoke to soon. So much for hoping for a healthy Steinbach.
I'm with the Browns on this building plan but even the blind faith fans have to hate this move. The left side of the line was so solid, all reports were that Steinbach was 100% back. It was a money issue and I hate that.
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Quote:
Quote:
He didn't say he didn't make it, just that it was crazy.
Maybe he made it, then sat back and thought, "damn, that's crazy".
Wrong.. he was talking about the rumors about what the Browns were supposedly offering, and he said that "its crazy"
and if you read the post you responded to, I am essentially acknowledging that we made an offer,,
What he meant was "It's crazy that anyone thinks that we could get the pick for as little as has been rumored ......." 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Quote:
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He didn't say he didn't make it, just that it was crazy.
Maybe he made it, then sat back and thought, "damn, that's crazy".
Wrong.. he was talking about the rumors about what the Browns were supposedly offering, and he said that "its crazy"
and if you read the post you responded to, I am essentially acknowledging that we made an offer,,
What he meant was "It's crazy that anyone thinks that we could get the pick for as little as has been rumored ......."
LOL Believe as you wish my friend..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Well, as it turned out, we couldn't get the pick for as little as was rumored ...... so I'd say it's a pretty good guess ...... much better than yours.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I'm with the Browns on this building plan but even the blind faith fans have to hate this move. The left side of the line was so solid, all reports were that Steinbach was 100% back. It was a money issue and I hate that.
I was under the impression that many people on this board expected the move.
I know that I sure did. Steinbach has been a great guard for us. I wish him well. But I'm fine with Pinkston at LG next year. Our guards are young, affordable, and the position we really need to focus on (on the O-Line) is RT.
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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Well, as it turned out, we couldn't get the pick for as little as was rumored ...... so I'd say it's a pretty good guess ...... much better than yours.
We were RUMORED to have offered as much as 3 first round picks.. there was even one rumor saying we were offering our two 1st rounders this year, our 1st next year and our 3rd and 4th next year. (never thought that was real,,but a rumor just the same.
Bottom line, the only way the Redskins will be able to win is with Free Agents which as you can see, they are doing.
Two schools of thought as to how to build a team
1. Build through the draft, control your CAP, build for the long haul
2. Build using FAs. Lose your mind trying to deal with your cap, can't keep the team together very long because sooner or later, the high salaries will kill ya.
Apparently you subscribe to the latter... I do not, thus the reason for the conflict between us..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Pick #4
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