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well 3 seasons later and I think the we can conclude that the 2010 Draft and Tom Heckerts 1st as Browns GM did not work out.
The only player that has really panned out is Joe Haden.
but with the drafting of Brandon Weeden and Trent Richardson,that says the drafting of Hardesty and McCoy were failures.
Both do not feature to be in the Browns future plans.
Even if Hardesty sticks around,when is he gonna see the field?
There isn't one thing that he does well or even average.
Basically the drafting of McCoy and his 20 something starts have accomplished nothing.
Brandon Weeden is the Fat Walrus's 3 starting QB in less than 5 years.
how do we know he got it right this time?
so in 2 years if the Browns win 9 games under Weeden,does he gets the heave ho?
If Shaun Lavaou doesn't get his head together and learn to use pad level,leverage and how to pick up stunts etc....Richardson will be making guys miss in the backfield.
Carlton Mitchell has shown nothing 7th RD pick or not.
the drafting of Weeden and Richardson is reflective of the 2010 draft class failure
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Our 2nd 2nd rounder and 3rd rounder are no longer starters. Whooptie do - the show goes on. Heckert IS great with first rounders though, and we just drafted two very good impact football players in the first round. I'm excited. 
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I have a rule that has served me well. Never make any decisions whilst drunk, hungover or emotional. McCoy was a 3rd rounder. he has proven he is a marginal starter but looks to be a good backup. For a 3rd rounder, that's pretty good, especially for a QB. Hardesty is a busted pick, in all honesty. However, I like most of all other picks made by Heckert, including Weeden. He may be 29 but he also hasn't had 5 years of building up bad habits, etc that most 29 year old QB *may* have. He needs athelticism but he will be around as long as Richardson will, and if he can give us good QB play for 2-3 years, that will be 2-3 more than we have had. I'm looking forward to next season 
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Don't get me wrong, but people harp on him not being able to move around much. Neither did Bernie. Neither does Peyton Manning. Weeden may not be their caliber, but let's not make it sound like you have to be Michael Vick in order to be a great QB.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Haden, TJ Ward, and Lauvao are all still starters. We'll see how they play in 2012 before writing the memoirs on this draft.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Don't get me wrong, but people harp on him not being able to move around much. Neither did Bernie. Neither does Peyton Manning. Weeden may not be their caliber, but let's not make it sound like you have to be Michael Vick in order to be a great QB.
Sorry, that's what I meant. A QB needs mobility but will last longer as the physical demands in that respect are less That's why I like the Weeden pick.
I think the Tanehill pick by the Fins @ 8 is way more risky. Tanehill has arguably more ceiling but Weeden showed far more in college than Tanehill and he is still relatively inexperienced. The missing 5 years would be far more of an impact at a physical position but not at a cerebral position IMHO.
Last edited by drobs; 04/27/12 10:12 AM.
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Haden-Awesome player.
Ward-Good starter
Hardesty-He's a back up, not a good pick.
McCoy-was great value in the 3rd, no longer a starter. Solid back up, could be traded
Lauvo-Looks to be a starter this season
Asante-Not on team
Mitchell-Still on team
Geathers-Not on team
This is a solid draft. Haden and Ward are great picks for us.
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It's not exactly three seasons, saying that is stretching the truth. We have played the 2010 season and 2011 season. I would say TJ Ward has worked out. Hardesty is hard to judge,he could be a complete bust but I think he could still develop into a quality depth which would not be a total failure.Lauvao has had one full season, he was essentially a rookie last year with no training camp to speak of so I think it is still too early to know. We ended up with three starters Haden, Ward and Lauvao.
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I'll take a QB who knows how to feel pressure and step away from it over a guy who runs around like his neck has a recent and gushing wound where his head used to be.
There were many times last year where McCoy could have taken a step up int the pocket, but instead moved back away from pressure, and in doing so moved into pressure. He also sometimes rolled away from pressure, but again, into a rusher. He seemed to have no concept of what the defense looked like in his head so that when he ran, he ran blindly. He merely ran to escape the pocket, and that's never a good plan.
I honestly believe that McCoy had real problems seeing over the OL from the pocket. This is absolutely not a slam on him, just a fact of life. He's a 6' QB. It's hard to see over guys who are 6'4" and taller. I think that this impacted his ability to move as much as it did his ability to see open receivers from the pocket. I just don't think that he could see all of the field from the pocket, and never learned how to find throwing lanes in the NFL. .
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Haden, TJ Ward, and Lauvao are all pretty good and I'm still holding out hope for Hardesty... if he can be a good 2nd back for this team then I'll be very happy.
Colt was shown to not be the man... for a 3rd rounder I'm ok with that... I still think he could be a good QB but I'm happy that the FO has shown that they have no problem replacing someone they picked if they think there is someone better.
<><
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Since McCoy is packing his bags right now..what did Holmgren see in him in the 1st place that merited drafting him in the 1st place?
I might be the only one that raises a red flag when it comes to Holmgren and the QB revolving door in the last 3 years
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Quote:
Since McCoy is packing his bags right now..what did Holmgren see in him in the 1st place that merited drafting him in the 1st place?
I might be the only one that raises a red flag when it comes to Holmgren and the QB revolving door in the last 3 years
Holmgren saw a winner.. simple ...
but..
Holmgren to me is the offensive equivalent to Bill Parcells and his famous defense.
Parcells got famous b/c of his journey with the Giants and his loud mouth.. After he left New England.. he didn't do jack..
Homgren is the same.. He rode the coattail of Brett Favre and became the man. He made it to the Super Bowl with the Seahawks b/c the NFC was so weak.
Holmgren hasn't showed me much... He's just a popular name.
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McCoy won at Texas also.
I find it funny that it took the Browns 4 draft picks over 2 years to figure out one spot ..running back.
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Quote:
Since McCoy is packing his bags right now..what did Holmgren see in him in the 1st place that merited drafting him in the 1st place?
I might be the only one that raises a red flag when it comes to Holmgren and the QB revolving door in the last 3 years
He saw a guy who was worth a 3rd round chance.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Quote:
Since McCoy is packing his bags right now..what did Holmgren see in him in the 1st place that merited drafting him in the 1st place?
I might be the only one that raises a red flag when it comes to Holmgren and the QB revolving door in the last 3 years
He saw a guy who was worth a 3rd round chance.
Bingo.
It's astonishing that people don't understand this. The other thing to consider is that Colt McCoy didn't get drafted to start like he is today. Him starting now has more to do with Jake Delholmme (sp?) and Seneca Wallace than with McCoy. They sucked and got injured, he looked like the light could come on at some point. Lesser of 2 (or 3?) evils, and nothing more.
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
-Ballpeen
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I wouldn't simplify Holmgren's career success to being "he road Favre's coattails" but... okay.  Nor would I say "Parcells didn't do jack after NE". Not sure why you see it that way. As for the lambasting of Holmgren on taking McCoy in the first place, I love how indignant and concerned people sound when talk about Holmgren "pulling rank" in the war room to take McCoy, as if he literally pulled down his pants and laid his set on the table. It was a third round pick. Was that DT from San Jose State the next decade's Richard Seymour? No. Getting just a solid back-up QB out of that is acceptable to me. If people really were expecting a starting QB from that then they need to check their expectations at the door. I'm not sure about Weeden but I don't blame them for taking him. They can't treat this like the NBA and try to go into next year with an arrow in the foot so they know they'll get that one more piece to put them over the hump (this case a QB) or bank on a third round, smallish QB with marginal abilities to be good enough for them not to get fired. End of the day, HotB, even if Holmgren is Parcells' equivalent, I think we'll be just fine. Tom Heckert > Kevin Ireland. 
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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Quote:
Holmgren to me is the offensive equivalent to Bill Parcells and his famous defense.
Parcells got famous b/c of his journey with the Giants and his loud mouth.. After he left New England.. he didn't do jack..
Homgren is the same.. He rode the coattail of Brett Favre and became the man. He made it to the Super Bowl with the Seahawks b/c the NFC was so weak.
Holmgren hasn't showed me much... He's just a popular name.
Totally disagree. Parcells was an awesome coach for the NY Jets and he did a great job with the Pats. I think he was only with the Pats two years when he got them to the superbowl.
And Parcells took a 1-15 Jets team and brought them within an inch of the playoffs his first year (if only Miami and NE or Buffalo, don't remember who) didn't tie and James Stewart of the Detroit Lions didn't run all over my Jets in the final game of the season! After that he did a fantastic job for the Jets. Had the Jets not been stuck playing against comeback John Elway, they would have won a superbowl that season that Bellicheck was D-Coordinator and Vinny was QB and they were leading the AFC Championship at half-time.
From what I remember, he had success in Dallas too. But not the same as NY, NE, or NY. But man did I love Parcells. Awesome coach. People in NY regarded him totally different than how we regard our coaches around here, lol
Tom Coughlin and Bellicheck both came out of Parcells' coaching tree ya know.
As for the Packers. Holmgren brought along various QBs, Mark Brunnell, Hasselback, Favre, Aaron Brooks, Brett Favre. Those guys all came from Holmgren's team. Four of those five are excellent QBs. And Aaron Brooks wasn't that bad either. I never realized how good Hasselback was until we played the Titans last year. That guy LIT US UP.
But yeah, he was a few crappy Pass Interference calls of another superbowl. That woulda made two or three for him. I'm not sure...... But man, the refs sucked up that game.
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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Quote:
Haden-Awesome player.
Ward-Good starter
Hardesty-He's a back up, not a good pick.
McCoy-was great value in the 3rd, no longer a starter. Solid back up, could be traded
Lauvo-Looks to be a starter this season
Asante-Not on team
Mitchell-Still on team
Geathers-Not on team
This is a solid draft. Haden and Ward are great picks for us.
I wouldn't say this is a "great" draft but it's definitely no disaster. The book on McCoy will be closed soon. It didn't work out but I won't fault them or Colt. It wasn't a high pick and he played like a 3rd round QB would play if he didn't have a bunch of great players around him.
Ward needs to step it up, I think this is a big year for him, he needs to show his value.
Lauvao still has some promise, plus he's a starter, nothing wrong with that.
I think we should hold off on Hardesty and see what he gives us this year in spot situations. I like our RB depth. Richardson, B-Jax, Chris O (should he stick around) and Hardesty to me is a wild card.
Colt looks like a pick that didn't pan out, but at round 3 we got about round 3 type value. The Hardesty thing is going to look bad if he doesn't do anything. Haden is an all-pro type player, and TJ Ward is a good starter who still has somewhat of a high ceiling. Like I said, not a great draft but definitely not horrible. 2011? Much much better. Especially when you consider that Heckert added a first round pick for 2012 all while still drafting a really good DT.
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This thread is a joke. We got 4 starters out of that draft. Even if McCoy gets traded it is still a good draft.
I would like guys like Kendall, who sob and whine about everything, show me where a team's draft get instant starters out of the majority of their picks.
I can't understand why some even follow this team with the distaste they have for everything the team does.
If you can come out of a draft with two solid starters, that is a good draft..
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And we have at least 3 so far this year
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what has this franchise done right since 1999?
Its a punchline of the NFL. The Browns are irrelevant to the NFL.
how can you say the 2010 Draft is a good draft?
Tom Heckert just drafted 2 guys in the 1st RD cause 2 guys at the same position in the eyes of the managment did not pan out from that draft.
I could care less the Browns got 4 starters out of that draft...where as it gotten the Browns since 2010? 9-23 in 2 years. thats unacceptable.
I count 3..Haden, Lavaou, Ward. I don't see a All-Pro or Pro Bowler in the lot...Haden maybe.
when this team does something instead of getting swept in the AFC North,I will give them props.
cause you start for the Browns doesn't make you good.
yeah good enough to start for a franchise that has one playoff appearance since 1999.
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In defense of Mitchell...
As a late round rookie you usually don't play much. Last year he broke his hand (or was it his wrist?) practicing with Colt during the lockout. This will be his make or break year.
Like others have said Haden is a stud. TJ was a good 2nd round pick. With his injury last year we were not able to see how much he has progressed. Colt was a later 3rd round pick. Generally QBs taken that late are career backups. Assante was a 5th rounder who was picked from our PS and had starts for Jax. Pinkston was a 5th round pick forced into starting duty due to injury..Lavaou was a 3rd round pick. His 2nd year he became a starter, albeit a sub par one.
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I agree. I give that draft a C at best.. Butch Davis had most of his draft picks start, doesn't mean they're any good.. I always go on, could our starters start for playoff teams at their position.?? Most of the time, it's been no..At the end of the day it's about winning football games..The Brandon Weeded pick will determine if this regime is successful in my opinion.
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This entire thread will be irrelevant if Weeden performs somewhat "good" for a rookie.
The better your QB plays, the better the entire team looks. We all know that. If Weeden has a good year next season, we'll all look at the 2010 Draft with more hope and satisfaction.
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Quote:
As for the Packers. Holmgren brought along various QBs, Mark Brunnell, Hasselback, Favre, Aaron Brooks, Brett Favre. Those guys all came from Holmgren's team. Four of those five are excellent QBs. And Aaron Brooks wasn't that bad either. I never realized how good Hasselback was until we played the Titans last year. That guy LIT US UP.
Two of the five guys are Favre and Brett Favre?
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So you're holding second and third round players to first round standards?
Hardesty got his chance, he missed his rookie year due to injury and last year when he had the opportunity to make his mark he underwhelmed. Hillis' drama added on and I can see why Heckert wanted Richardson, especially after Hillis signed with KC.
McCoy got an opportunity he likely would not have gotten from another NFL team, and he underperformed. Period. There's no spilled milk over a 3rd round pick not being starters material.
Haden is a top 5 NFL CB.
Ward is a good starter.
Lauvao is at most, a spot starter at guard and at worst a decent backup guard.
Mitchell is still on the squad.
I don't know why this draft is a writeoff. If anything, the drafting of Weedon and Richardson is significant only to show that both McCoy and Hardesty were given their opportunities and the team is ready to move on from that.
If Haden was a flop (like so many of our past first round picks) then maybe you say this draft is a failure but I think the 2010 draft was anything but a failure.
Last edited by Enigmatic Evil; 04/29/12 02:12 PM.
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Haden Top 5....hmm.....who's better.....
Carlos Rogers, Darrel Revis, Asanaugh(sp) Patrick Peterson, Johnathon Jospeth.
Ward is a good starter..I guess..he knows how to lay a kill shot.but is very so so in coverage.
Lavaou is a spot starter but a liability. Very dumb and can't pick up d-line stunts.
for someone who apparently has a "nasty streak" he gets backup alot in the QB's facemask.
see the Browns cannot afford to be writing off their mid RD picks after 2 years ,3 years when the rest of the AFC North is getting solid starters and Pro Bowlers in the same RDS.
When you have to draft the same positions such as QB and feature RB after a couple years,you fall behind.
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Quote:
Since McCoy is packing his bags right now..what did Holmgren see in him in the 1st place that merited drafting him in the 1st place?
I might be the only one that raises a red flag when it comes to Holmgren and the QB revolving door in the last 3 years
Well this is just my opinion... but he saw a roster in 2009 that had DA and BQ and he knew that neither of them were the long term answer.. In the 2010 draft, he also saw Bradford as the only legitimate starting QB in the draft... so he didn't want to reach.... He probably also saw a team that wasn't just a QB away from being really good.. so he took a 3rd round flyer on a very good college QB who was a winner but was lacking in some of the measurables.... he took a chance on a 3rd rounder, it didn't work out but it allowed us to fill a few holes in the last coupole years... evidently he now feels that we are ready for a QB..
That's just my opinion..
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In a good draft you get 4 players that are productive 5 years later,
Haden and Ward will probably fit.
Too soon to tell about the rest, and I discount McCoy.
An average draft is 3, a poor draft is 2. There are 22 players on the team, so that works about right.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!…. That did not age well.
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