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I am talking about lifetime, Wallace's experience coming off the bench, and that Holmgren has a lifetime's worth of experience with Wallace.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I am talking about lifetime, Wallace's experience coming off the bench, and that Holmgren has a lifetime's worth of experience with Wallace.
yes, Colt doesn't have the lifetime of coming off the bench yet because he beat out Wallace for the starting job 
(he is starting that portion of his career now though)
#gmstrong
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I am talking about lifetime, Wallace's experience coming off the bench, and that Holmgren has a lifetime's worth of experience with Wallace.
yes, Colt doesn't have the lifetime of coming off the bench yet because he beat out Wallace for the starting job
(he is starting that portion of his career now though)
You will NEVER change Ytowns mind on McCoy. NEVER 
#GMSTRONG
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I am talking about lifetime, Wallace's experience coming off the bench, and that Holmgren has a lifetime's worth of experience with Wallace.
yes, Colt doesn't have the lifetime of coming off the bench yet because he beat out Wallace for the starting job
(he is starting that portion of his career now though)
You will NEVER change Ytowns mind on McCoy. NEVER
Only McCoy can change my mind on McCoy.
However, what did I say that was untrue? You pop in with snide comments ... and that's about it. That's pretty lame.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I am talking about lifetime, Wallace's experience coming off the bench, and that Holmgren has a lifetime's worth of experience with Wallace.
yes, Colt doesn't have the lifetime of coming off the bench yet because he beat out Wallace for the starting job
(he is starting that portion of his career now though)
You will NEVER change Ytowns mind on McCoy. NEVER
Only McCoy can change my mind on McCoy.
However, what did I say that was untrue? You pop in with snide comments ... and that's about it. That's pretty lame.
What's lame is your complete and total hate for the kid.. and you can tell me you don't hate him and come up with all kinda bull stats and twist them anyway you want, but when someone makes fun of you, it's snide.
that's what's Lame
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Damanshot
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And what did I say about him that was hateful?
Actually, what have I said about him that's hateful? I have criticized his lack of ability as a QB. I have complimented his desire to do the work to get better, and his willingness to spend his own money to bring about the "Camp Colts" last year.
In the comment that you replied to, what did I say that was incorrect? I said that the Browns, basically, have to determine whether or not they feel that McCoy can come off the bench cold in this system.
Is that somehow incorrect?
I also stated that Holmgren has a great deal of history with Wallace, and he knows that he can come off the bench and be effective, if not spectacular.
Was that somehow wrong and/or hateful?
You spew all of this crap ..... so back it up. Where are all of these supposedly hateful comments? (and just because I argue that he's not a very good QB, and back it up with what I see on the field does not make for hateful comments)
Back up your comments. I'll be waiting. (and probably for a very, very long time)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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You hate him,, it's about as clear as can be Ytown..
You don't have to say "I HATE HIM" for the rest of us to know you do.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Trade Colt and get something for him this year. He has come off as a pouting primadonna since his concussion last year. Just isn't good enough to be any type of distraction. When asked if he was gonna get a fair shot at the QB spot, " I dont know". They were giving him a shot and he was bouncing passes so it wasn't fair. Enough of the whinning.
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You hate him,, it's about as clear as can be Ytown..
You don't have to say "I HATE HIM" for the rest of us to know you do.
Back it up.
If I "hate him" as you say, it should be easy as can be to find all of the hateful comments I have made about him.
I am sick and tired of your crap. Back up what you say or shut the hell up and knock the snide crap off.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I think that the decisions then comes down to which backup QB is better suited for backup duty? While some may disagree, Wallace has shown an ability to play with limited reps in practice as a backup in this system, and McCoy has not.
Well...the one time he had to come in as "the backup" he did pretty darn well...with virtually no reps in camp.
I think Weeden was brought in due to Colt's shortcomings...but Colt did well in the ONE CHANCE he got to play "the backup". To say otherwise is unfair.
Wallace had a major goal line brain fart as "the backup"...one not becoming of a guy with so much "experience".
I'd keep McCoy and decide if I want 'experience' at #3 or 'development'.
McCoy is better than Wallace...I'd keep McCoy.
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Yeah, he did well in the Mangini/Daboll system, coming in as the backup.
He has not shown the same ability in this system though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Yeah, he did well in the Mangini/Daboll system, coming in as the backup.
He has not shown the same ability in this system though.
And wallace HAS?
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Actually, he has shown some ability to come in cold and perform.
Last year he completed 63% of his passes, and had 4 TD to 2 INT. Not great numbers in 4 games, but he's the backup. The year before, in Seattle, he completed 65% of his passes with 3 TD and 2 INT. The year before he completed 58% of his passes with 11 TD and 3 INT.
I'd say that he's shown that he can come in cold and be effective, if not spectacular.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Yeah, he did well in the Mangini/Daboll system, coming in as the backup.
He has not shown the same ability in this system though.
When did Colt come in as a backup in this system?
yebat' Putin
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I said that he hasn't shown the same ability in this system as he did in the Mangini/Daboll system. (not necessarily as a backup)
That's why I said that it's one of the things the coaches must determine is whether he can do that, despite not showing much in this system so far.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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And there's the rub. You are not comparing Seneca and Colt on an even playing field here. You pull-up Seneca and preclude his negative stats while downplaying any positives from Colt. Let's break it down for you: Quote:
Actually, he has shown some ability to come in cold and perform.
Last year he completed 63% of his passes, and had 4 TD to 2 INT. Not great numbers in 4 games, but he's the backup.
Actually, that was in 2010 in Mangini's system. You refuse to acknowledge any of Colt's stats from 2010, so we need to throw out Seneca's too, no?
Last year (2011), he was terrible and put up even worse numbers than Colt's terrible numbers as I posted above (even accounting for schedule strength).
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The year before, in Seattle, he completed 65% of his passes with 3 TD and 2 INT. The year before he completed 58% of his passes with 11 TD and 3 INT.
I'd say that he's shown that he can come in cold and be effective, if not spectacular.
and Colt never got to play with those Seahawk teams, so it's tough to know how well he would have played (or poorly) with them. He has many of the same limitations that Seneca has.
also, it is interesting that you only go back to Seneca's 4th year in the WCO system. if we want to be fair, perhaps we should compare his first opportunity in the WCO to Colt's first? Seneca had a full year as a backup with only 25 attempts in his rookie year, but got the chance to start 4 games his 2nd year.
58% 6.6YPA 2TD 1.75INT 197yds/game 76.2QBrating
Those numbers sure look similar to Colts from last year, don't they? Of course, they came on a team that was the defending NFC Champions that got to the SB the year before largely on the back of their offense, while playing in the weak NFC West.
So, I apologize that in any fair comparative light, I do not see a reason to keep Seneca over Colt based on what they have done on the field.
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I presented another viewpoint, one that the staff may look at things from. Wallace has shown an ability to come in, in this system, and do the job as the backup. They have to project McCoy's ability to do so. That's my point. You may not like it, but taking out the 2011 year, Wallace has completed somewhere around 58% of his passes, with 27 TD passes and 16 INT in his career in the WCO. That's what the front office and coaches have to evaluate. Does Wallace's past performance as a backup outweight whatever McCoy may potentially be able to do as the backup in this system, or not?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Thanks.
It's posts like yours that show ytowns utter disdain for Colt no matter what.
He takes stats from seneca and says "these are good", but disregards stats from colt.
He uses different years, in different systems/teams to imply that seneca is better.
Ytown - it's things like this that make you appear to be a colt hater. Well, things like this, and your utter disregard for anything positive about colt.
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Yeah, he did well in the Mangini/Daboll system, coming in as the backup.
He has not shown the same ability in this system though.
Wallace is a career back-up who, in 7 years most of which was on teams better than ours, put up very pedestrian numbers even for a back-up.. his stats, on a better team, aren't all that much better than Colts in his first 2 seasons on a crappy team... Wallace hit his ceiling years ago, Colt is just as good, much younger and much cheaper... and with greater growth potential. I see absolutely no reason to keep Wallace over Colt unless the FO is trying to insulate Weeden, which would be a shame.
yebat' Putin
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Wow ....disdain, huh? I stated what Wallace's numbers were. In the 2 years prior to coming here he threw for 14 TDs and 4 INTs in backup duty. That's pretty effective backup play, however, as you say, with a different team. Maybe McCoy could do that. Maybe not. There is no way of knowing with absolute certainty. I know ... I'm a hater.  We have NO way of knowing how McCoy will function as a backup in this system. None. He did OK in Mangini's system, but struggled badly last year. His numbers were even worse when you take into account the last minute drives at the end of 4 or 5 lost games. That's not hate, disdain, or anything else .... it's fact. Frankly, I don't think that we'll win many games if either McCoy or Wallace are forced into duty. Neither is a particularly good QB in my opinion. Not hate, not disdain, just what I have seen with my own eyes. Wallace has shown that he can be somewhat effective as the backup in the past. I would hate to have to try and win games with him, but he's shown that he can beat some bad teams if forced into duty. McCoy still has question marks as to whether or not he can master this offense. Further, does he know the offense well enough this year to be able to more effectively run things than Wallace? Chances are that we'll have either Wallace or McCoy as the backup for 2 more years and that's it. If Wallace is seen as better this year as the backup than McCoy, then who should the team keep? I know ..... they should keep McCoy, or else they're just haters.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Dude - give it up.
You use a 10 year backup player's stats - and compare them to a guy that was a back up (3rd string back up at that - never expected to see the field his first year)...........and you conclude that the 10 year backup is a better backup............because..........why, again?
And further - why would we care what the numbers were for EITHER of them from a different team?
Look - just look at the numbers from last year. Seneca had plenty of starts, didn't he? With all of his experience - he should've at least been better than the 2nd year player that had no off season - wouldn't you think so?
Never mind - no, you wouldn't think so.
Yes - I don't know the reason - but it is so damn obvious you can't stand mccoy it's pathetic. Seriously - if the backup spot was between mccoy and me - you'd pick me.
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I just care about seeing the team I love put the best players on the field. You think that one of those players is McCoy. I don't. It's got nothing to do with hate, disdain, or anything else. I just don't think that McCoy has, or has shown the ability to get the job done. I have outlined, many times over, why I feel that way. The team has used many of my exact reasons to explain why they drafted Weeden to replace McCoy. I guess that makes them haters too.  Whatever.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I just care about seeing the team I love put the best players on the field.
You think that one of those players is McCoy. I don't. It's got nothing to do with hate, disdain, or anything else. I just don't think that McCoy has, or has shown the ability to get the job done. I have outlined, many times over, why I feel that way. The team has used many of my exact reasons to explain why they drafted Weeden to replace McCoy. I guess that makes them haters too.
Whatever.
Oh.
You want the best players on the team.
And no logo has shown stats, and shot your stats down..........but you still want colt gone. Yup - sir, that classifies as a hater. A 2 faced hater based on the fact you try to say you want the best backup...........then ignore the numbers.
And, pretty soon you're going to call me a colt boy. And you'll look like an idiot if you do.
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Oh - I should add this: The discussion is not about Weeden and Mccoy. So drop that from your replies. Weeden is the starter. We're talking about who the backup should be.
Stay on track................unless the track you've led yourself down doesn't work for you when you see real numbers..........then I guess you need to do something else.......like talk about the f.o. drafting weeden to replace mccoy.
Holy cow - it just hit me - the f.o. OBVIOUSLY didn't think wallace was the answer, did they.............
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There were stats presented ..... but I look at more than stats. Now, with Wallace, in his Seattle days, that's largely all I have to go on. As for McCoy, last year I have almost an entire year's worth of play to evaluate. I remember 4 or 5 games where we scored with little or no time left in lost games when the opposition went into prevent mode, trading time for yards, and even a score. I remember more than one game where McCoy wound up throwing his only TD for the game in such a circumstance, and where he forced his completion percentage back over 50% only because the other team backed off, allowing completions trying to run the game clock out. This is one reason where McCoy's stats don't carry as much weight for me as they obviously do for you.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I don't give a rip about Seattle.
Wallace has had 2 years here. McCoy has had 2 years here.
Let's deal with the here and now. Let's deal with the BROWNS.........not some dumb Seattle team.
Oh wait - if we do that - it makes wallace look...........um..........not so good.
Got it. I understand why you're bringing seattle stats into it........
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Again, like I said, I would hate to have to rely upon either McCoy or Wallace to win games for us.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I remember more than one game where McCoy wound up throwing his only TD for the game in such a circumstance, and where he forced his completion percentage back over 50% only because the other team backed off, allowing completions trying to run the game clock out. This is one reason where McCoy's stats don't carry as much weight for me as they obviously do for you.
Seneca's record as a starter is 6-15
Colt's record as a starter is 6-15
my guess is that both have had plenty of garbage time stat situations to fluff things up a bit.
also, I provided the divisional stats above that showed Colt was better in those games as well against equal opponents.
-------------------------------------------
you know it's July when we are spending this much time debating which cruddy QB is more worthy of QB2 status. this will all sort itself out in a month either way.
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You hate him,, it's about as clear as can be Ytown..
You don't have to say "I HATE HIM" for the rest of us to know you do.
Back it up.
If I "hate him" as you say, it should be easy as can be to find all of the hateful comments I have made about him.
I am sick and tired of your crap. Back up what you say or shut the hell up and knock the snide crap off.
Me thinks you protest too much.
You don't like him,, it's clear as a bell.. Look around at those besides me that know it..
I don't owe you an explanation. and I'm not going to bother giving you one.
Your tired of my crap.. LOL that's funny,, most of us are tired of yours on the subject of Colt McCoy.
On most any other subject, you seem pretty even keeled.. bring up Colt McCoy and you go completely blind.. Totally blind..
#GMSTRONG
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And what did I say about him that was hateful?
Actually, what have I said about him that's hateful? I have criticized his lack of ability as a QB. I have complimented his desire to do the work to get better, and his willingness to spend his own money to bring about the "Camp Colts" last year.
That's what I've said too and I actually like the kid! But it is what it ius....
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In the comment that you replied to, what did I say that was incorrect? I said that the Browns, basically, have to determine whether or not they feel that McCoy can come off the bench cold in this system.
That's exactly what you said. While I think as with any corperate entitly, it runs a little deeper than that.
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Is that somehow incorrect?
No, you are correct.
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I also stated that Holmgren has a great deal of history with Wallace, and he knows that he can come off the bench and be effective, if not spectacular.
Yes they do have a long history. He knows exactly what he has in Wallace playing off the bench from their history together.
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Was that somehow wrong and/or hateful?
Not that I can see.
Come on Damon, it's football. Not a political debate!
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Gotta ask If holmgren and wallace have such a great history, and wallace is such a spectacular qb...........................why didn't he beat out the 3rd round draft/project pick last year? If holmgren and wallace have such a great history..................like, who the hell cares anyway...................why did one qb have better stats last year than the other? If wallace is so great - why has he been a career backup? If wallace was such a great backup - why did he say "I'm not here to mentor colt"? Oh - why has wallace said, this year "hey, pick me, pick me - I'll educate Weeden with my experience"? Wanna know why? Because wallace knows this is his last shot at making 2.5 million. Wallace and his experience are both jokes. All his experience and.............look what he did at the goal line last year. That passes as "experience"?? As no logo stated - wallaces numbers were less than colts. But, get rid of the best backup, right? 
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It seems rather funny. One QB was the starter. He starts every game he's healthy. He works with the #1 WR's all week. He prepares to start every game. He's "game ready" come game day.
The other is the back-up. He practices with the second team squad almost all week. He is not supposed to be the starter. He has limited access to the coaching unlike the starter.
One comes in a moments notice, while one is fully prepared to play every down.
But you can't see how either may not be best suited to do the other ones job? There's a stark difference between the preparation and game readiness of a starter, verses a back-up. Not everyone can just jump up and come off the bench and not everyone is suited to be a starter. Some really can't do either.
That's what YTown was trying to say and ir is a valid point. Wheather Colt is suited to fill a back-up role is yet to be determined by this FO and I'll trust their judgement either way.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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You don't see that seneca had.........what.......the last 3 games for sure - 4 games? With all his "experience" I would've guessed he would have at least been decent, with all that experience and what not.
Look folks - the "seneca has experience" crap has to stop. He has experience at never being a starter - that's all his "experience" is.
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..why did one qb have better stats last year than the other?
If wallace is so great - why has he been a career backup?
I think I've already addressed that. 
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If wallace was such a great backup - why did he say "I'm not here to mentor colt"?
Because at the time Wallace was competing with Colt for the starting job. As such, Wallace was here to try to win the starting job rather than be a mentor for Colt.
What people fail to do when they "use this line" is put it in the context of when it weas said and the situation surrounding the statement.
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Oh - why has wallace said, this year "hey, pick me, pick me - I'll educate Weeden with my experience"? Wanna know why? Because wallace knows this is his last shot at making 2.5 million.
Yeah, it couldn't possibly be that Weeden wasn't the 85th pick in the draft and everyone already knows he will be our starter, unlike the sutuation with Colt. It couldn't be that Weeden sees the talent in weeden that he didn't see in colt. Maybe that's why Colt was drafted at #85 and Weeden was drafted at #22? Nah, couldn't be....
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Wallace and his experience are both jokes. All his experience and.............look what he did at the goal line last year. That passes as "experience"??
As no logo stated - wallaces numbers were less than colts.
But, get rid of the best backup, right?
Colt has never played back-up. He's never worked with the second team all week, not prepared to start and have to come off the bench on a moments notice.
So who knows if he can fill that role or not? I certainly don't and neither do you......
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Oh, as far as "coming in"...........do you remember last year, when seneca sucked coming in?
Do you remember the year before? Think "Colt" Saints, etc.
Colt came in as the THIRD qb - no reps at all in practice.
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Look folks - the "seneca has experience" crap has to stop. He has experience at never being a starter - that's all his "experience" is.
And Colt doesn't have that experience. Like I said, I'll let the FO decide if they feel Colt can fill that role. And if they feel he can, I'll trust their judgement.
But I certainly don't plan to trust you assertion that a starter will certainly be a better back-up. That remains to be seen.
I don't have a horse in this race. I do however know that being a starter and being a back-up are definatly very different things. If you can't see the difference, that's not my fault.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Look - to you, and everyone - I don't have a damn horse in this race either, okay?
I get damn sick and tired of hearing about senaca's "experience". I truly do. He couldn't beat out a damn third round "chance" pick last year. When he did start, his numbers were LESS than colt's.
It really is that simple. Seneca's "experience" didn't do him jack squat. And people want a career backup to be our backup, when it has been proven that Colt had better numbers last year? I don't give a flying rip about what seneca did 5 years ago, or 8 years ago - he's not on the same team as he was then.
This whole "Colt must go" crap is nothing but idiots spewing idiotic vitriol.
Let the damn front office decide. Don't give me stats from one year for seneca...........and a different year for colt.
If the front office decides to keep one or the other, I'm good with it...........but this whole "seneca has experience being the back up".........seriously - read that. Experience as a back up..............what the hell does that tell you? It tells me that in 10 years, the guy wasn't good enough to start.
Wow - that's a medallion in his pocket. "hey, I ain't good enough to start, or even beat out a third round draft pick..............."
Hell, I could use that job.
Honestly - I laugh outloud at the people that say "keep seneca, he's a career backup....he knows how to suck enough to not start.." It's funny.
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The sooner we cut Colt, the better it will be for everyone.
I can't believe we haven't already done that since it's pretty clear we won't get a pick for the kid.
It's Chuck Frye all over.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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The sooner we cut the kid that, with no experience, no off season, the kid that had better numbers than the career backup that couldn't beat him out - the better we'll be?
I just don't understand.
You do realize seneca would get about...........oh, 3 seconds on the waiver wire before every team said "eh, 11 year career backup, he's short, not a team player, and he's no good", right?
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The fact that you guys are still arguing about, and actually still care about, who is the better backup kinda proves the point that I made a few days ago.
BW will never get a fair shake from the Coltites as long as McCoy is here.
I like the guy but he's gotta go.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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