Quote: No, it's not obvious anymore. It may have and probably was true at one point. But look at what he's shown in preseason. That is no longer obvious.
For me it's still the same...it may be a bit stronger but it's still way below AVG and his timing/decision making is still horrible on any 20+yds throw., to me that is a much bigger concern than his lack of arm....he still lofts the ball, overshoots (missed TD to Benji? Godron? the 1st game) or underthrows by a chunk (big play to Cameron, who had to turn around and wait for the ball, which caused him to land on his back)....in stride it's an easy TD, since he had 2 steps on anyone and Colt had to throw his entire body into that one and it still didn't have the zip other QBs get out of their wrist alone...his deep balls are still inaccurate jump balls at best
Quote: No, it's not obvious anymore. It may have and probably was true at one point. But look at what he's shown in preseason. That is no longer obvious.
Please let me know what type of TV you have so I can go out and purchase it. It must come with the "enhanced Colt View"..
BTW - you cannot say drafting a rookie Rb and a starting a rookie RT, the browns will have a running game!! Maybe next year but not this year.
As far as wanting Colt around, unless we get something we really need for him, he can stay on the bench. But if someone offers better than a 4th rounder or a above average o-lineman and a draft pick, Colt is gone!!
IMO trading McCoy is foolish. He is young and has experience. If most consider him and Wallace pretty equal, then it is a no-brainer, lower cost wins out.
But to me McCoy being the back up is the best idea. He is a team player, even though the media tries to portray him differently at times. He has just stated that he is "committed " to this team, knowing he is not going to be the starter. He has looked decent in preseason, and IMO has shown some growth. But my main reason is, we drafted him. I hate that many fans can't wait to cut or trade many of our drafted players. Yes, many have been bad players, but usually as soon as a better player has been aquired, this fanbase immediately wants to run the draftee out of town. It is no wonder that many players don't want to play here.
McCoy was drafted as a project. It was clearly stated when he was drafted. He was forced to start without preparation, and had some success. Then he is named starter in a season with no offseason and a new system in place. I'm sure if a better option was on the team at that time, McCoy would have been able to go back into developement. Now Weeden is here, and is clearly the starter. McCoy can sit and learn, which IMO was the original plan. He has talent and drive, and now experience. IMO it is a win-win situation for both the player and the team.
He wants to be here, even after being replaced as the starter, to me that speaks volumes of his character. To me. knowing he has improved a little from last year, and is getting time to improve more, makes him more valuable to this team as a back-up than trade bait.
I'd keep him a thousand times over Wallace for more than just the money aspect. He is one of our own, drafted by us. He wants to play here, and is considered by many to be a good back-up option. His work ethic and team loyalty need to be considered. As the team acquires more talent, and the systems on both sides of the ball begin to form roots, I think having a guy like him ready to come in at any time is an asset to the team.
I want players that we draft to want to stay here, because when that starts happening, it means that the team is becoming successful. Many players we have had over the years who were marginal at best as starters, could have realistically become the depth that we have been sorely missing. But over the years, the team and the fans are too quick to run them out of town.
This regime is building the team the proper way, and I hope that they start to keep some of the drafted players even when a better player comes along. Build team chemistry, Pittsburgh has done it for years. They draft guys and keep them in developement for years, then when it is time for them to take the feild, they fit right in. It is time for that to start happening here.
Quote: What if you can get a fourth round pick for him?
4th round is on the bubble for me. I wouldn't take anything LESS than that... and I would almost certainly take anything above that.
Ideally I hope he gets some PT this year (though I'm not hoping for Weeden to get hurt, just sort of expecting it at some point) and I hope McCoy plays well so that we can trade him for a 3rd rounder at the end of the season and not right now. That way we get a season out of him but we still get the pick in the 2013 draft.
Quote: What if you can get a fourth round pick for him?
depends, if you feel better about him going in for Weeden then seneca, you don't take the deal.. You offer up Seneca for a 5th....
At this point, if they thought Seneca was better than McCoy, no way McCoy is the starter last season.. .If that thought holds true, then Wallace would be the one that goes, McCoy stays.
But this is one crazy league.. there is probably no way to accurately guess who, if any would get the boot.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
To me, a capable back-up who can win games is a luxury many teams don't have, and IMO is worth way more than a 4th round pick. If it is me Wallace is gone tomorrow.
$th rounders can be good, but more than often they are just guys. McCoy is a very capable back-up
Quote: hope McCoy plays well so that we can trade him for a 3rd rounder at the end of the season and not right now. That way we get a season out of him but we still get the pick in the 2013 draft.
Quote: hope McCoy plays well so that we can trade him for a 3rd rounder at the end of the season and not right now. That way we get a season out of him but we still get the pick in the 2013 draft.
Good GM thinking.
Well I guess that's my point. Look at what happened to GB last week when Rogers came out.. I mean that guy was awful. If Rodgers goes down, they are sunk.
we'll find out tonight if Philly has a reasonable number 2 because Vick isn't supposed to play.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Well I think we found out. The kid looked good. McCoy continued to play in the # 2 role and Wallace looked like crap with the scrubs which is to be expected. I think its now down to Wallace or Lewis, McCoy seems to have cemented his place as the backup. Imho.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
Quote: Well I guess that's my point. Look at what happened to GB last week when Rogers came out.. I mean that guy was awful. If Rodgers goes down, they are sunk.
And if you use GB as your analogy, Flynn was a free agent but if he had NOT been a FA, what could they have traded him for this year? A second?... He comes in and has ONE career game and gets that kind of attention... now he is demoted before ever starting a game for his new team because he got beat out by an undersized midround draft pick...
All we need is for Weeden to go down for one game and have McCoy play really well, not even record-breaking like Flynn, just really well and his stock will rise considerably by next offseason.
Quote: Well I guess that's my point. Look at what happened to GB last week when Rogers came out.. I mean that guy was awful. If Rodgers goes down, they are sunk.
And if you use GB as your analogy, Flynn was a free agent but if he had NOT been a FA, what could they have traded him for this year? A second?... He comes in and has ONE career game and gets that kind of attention... now he is demoted before ever starting a game for his new team because he got beat out by an undersized midround draft pick...
All we need is for Weeden to go down for one game and have McCoy play really well, not even record-breaking like Flynn, just really well and his stock will rise considerably by next offseason.
And if that happens we win two ways. We can either keep him because he's what you want in a Backup or we can trade him for something better than what we'd get today.
It's basically a no lose situation for us.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
Sunday, August 26, 2012, 5:14 PM By Mary Kay Cabot, The Plain Dealer
BEREA, Ohio -- Browns coach Pat Shurmur sounds like he's leaning toward keeping quarterback Colt McCoy as his backup. Before practice on Sunday, he praised McCoy effusively -- the most positive comments he's made about him all preseason.
"I think he's done an outstanding job here in training camp,'' said Shurmur. "I'm very pleased with where he's at. I gained an even greater appreciation of him, the way he's competed, the way he's handled the situation, let's just call it that. I'm very impressed with how he's doing. I think that's good for our team. He understands one of the primary things you need to understand as a backup at this point -- to be ready to play -- because you're ankle injury from being in there, and he's been on both sides of that coin and so he understands it.''
Working with the second-team offense against the Eagles' backups, McCoy earned a stellar 138.0 rating and orchestrated a 15-play 78-yard TD drive in the third and fourth quarters. It ended with a 3-yard TD pass to tight end Evan Moore.
It's evident that the game has slowed down for McCoy and that he's making quicker decisions. He's also scrambled out of trouble on plenty of occasions this preseason and shown his athleticism. He doesn't have the arm strength of Weeden, but it's sufficient to get the job done. Overall, he's earned a superb 119.1 rating this preseason -- although preseason ratings often don't correlate to the regular season.
"He's had a full year now -- a season and a full offseason to get to know our system better and I think it's showing up that way,'' said Shurmur. " so I've got a great deal of respect for what he's done.''
But Shurmur, who's also identified fourth-teamer Thad Lewis as a player "worth developing'' wasn't ready to completely tip his hand. The Browns also have Seneca Wallace working with the third team.
"I think you'll see what I'm going to do with the quarterbacks at final cuts (Friday),'' he said. "I'm going to say that right now. And you can say 'does how things turn out in this fourth preseason game matter?' Yea, everything matters. (Or) "Have you made up your mind you're just not telling me?" Maybe. But I've got a few days until the final cut and then we'll review it.''
Quote: And if that happens we win two ways. We can either keep him because he's what you want in a Backup or we can trade him for something better than what we'd get today.
And I think if he has value at the end of this season you have to trade him... otherwise you keep him as a back-up for one more year then he walks and you get nothing.
This is, of course, all based on the fact that Weeden has solidified himself as the starter.... I really hope they aren't in a competition again next year... a REAL competition.
hairs just stood up on my arms with that gooshy feeling inside.
miava mvp... yeah ok. colt throws winning td with little catching it and they didnt get it.
whats funny is little and wallace are on the platform to get the trophy. why is wallace taller then little...lol madden needs to do their homework better.
The best is this NFL football game I have for my phone. I always play as the Browns because I always chuckle when I see how they rendered MoMass (white as snow).
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
they need to keep McCoy as backup cause I really doubt that Weeden lasts a full season behind this bargin bin o-line. McCoy at least will be able to extend the play if the pocket eradicates around him.
Yeah I didn't get that at all. We have drafted our entire O-line, 3 out of the five are high picks and that's bargain picks???? Kinda a reach of an argument if you ask me.
Quote: Yeah I didn't get that at all. We have drafted our entire O-line, 3 out of the five are high picks and that's bargain picks???? Kinda a reach of an argument if you ask me.
Absolutely.
I have broken down OLs throughout the league in the past as far as their draft statuses, and many of the really great OL in the league have 1 or 2 low round picks, and even UDFA.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: Yeah I didn't get that at all. We have drafted our entire O-line, 3 out of the five are high picks and that's bargain picks???? Kinda a reach of an argument if you ask me.
Absolutely.
I have broken down OLs throughout the league in the past as far as their draft statuses, and many of the really great OL in the league have 1 or 2 low round picks, and even UDFA.
You can look back and see for yourself if you don't believe me.
Many of the better OL in the NFL have lower round picks and even UDFA starting. I have broken down the players by draft status. I see no need for your response.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Quote: I have broken down OLs throughout the league in the past as far as their draft statuses, and many of the really great OL in the league have 1 or 2 low round picks, and even UDFA.
I have done the same thing, looked up draft status of some of the better starting OLs and by pure draft slot, we probably have more invested in our OL than most..... the two things every really good OL seemed to have in common... 1. Continuity, most had played together as a unit for several years in the same system and 2. they almost all played in front of a good QB.... coincidence?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I should clarify my statement. Mack and Thomas are high draft picks under different regimes. Bargin bin I meant as far as talent level and depth goes overall. Scharwtz is the big unknown. It takes RT's a awhile before they get up to the speed of the NFL. But I'm not sold on Lavuao and Pinkston. Both guys played OT in college. but have struggled making the transistion to OG. It wouldn't have hurt for Heckert to add a piece or 2 for depth or even challenge Lavuao or Pinky for a starting role. even going out and trying to land a Eric Winston or Anthony Collins to play RT would have gave the o-line another play thats played alot of snaps. but it doesn't make sense to me to add a rookie QB and give him a rookie RT to protect him. its a recipe for diaster. If anyone on the o-line goes down,thats not good.The depth is down right poor. At best overall this is a very average oline.
Ryan Miller has been looking pretty dang good so far. He's a depth piece that Heckert added in this last draft (and potentially a starter).
Other than that, we don't have alot of depth (Gerhart has actually looked okay too though). But, not many teams do.
Winston - you haven't been seeing the reports out of KC then. Winston is either not healthy or over-the-hill as there have been nothing but complaints about his play and talk of him losing his starting RT slot (to Barry Richardson).
I saw an above AVG OL in the 2nd half of last season, I saw a good OL vs GB in preseason game 2 and I saw a stinker OL vs Philly, probably the best DL depth league wide, in pseason week 3
Hmm, let's see...where's the trend and where's the exception?
Why do I suspect that if I mention some positives that I'll get the "it's just preseaon" smashdown argument but on a, not even trending, negative it's all doom and gloom
Why do you you think is that? I think I know why
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
Quote: Bargain Bin of 3 top-40 draft picks, a third round pick, and a 5th round pick?
It could be a third round pick, a fifth round pick or a seventh round pick.
But the bottom line is.... they have to be able to play the G position at the NFL level. We don't have anyone on this roster that can really do that.
You don't need world beaters by any means. With Thomas at LT, Mack at C and Shwartz starting to look like "he gets it" on some level, I think with that supporting cast you only need "adequate" G's.
But for those who believe Pinston, and to a MUCH greater extent Lauvao provide that, I think you're in for a rude awakening. And where or even if they were drafted has nothing to do with that.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Quote: Why do you you think is that? I think I know why
So do I. Because any time the people we have playing at the G position face any stiff competition, they start making mistakes, silly penalties and look like tackle dummies.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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