DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Protesters storm U.S. Embassy in Cairo

Quote:

---

The President also needs to make a speech saying that we respect Islam, but that we have freedom of speech in this country, and that freedom sometimes results in things that are not kind, polite, nice, or even rational being said. It's time for the Middle East to grow up, and to understand that words are words. The President needs to say this in no uncertain terms. If he doesn't then who will?

---

That's what we do need to make clear.

These people need to grow up. No one saw this movie anyway. Even if people actually watched this movie, there's no reason to apologize for it. And with what these crazy people do, they're just making the movie's point clear.

Heck, the government tries to put anti-christian art in its museums this country sometimes, yet a lynching never seems to occur. It frustrates me, I find it very distasteful and it drives me nuts when the government tries to put it in the Smithsonian or some other museum receiving government funding, but you never see an angry group of hardcore catholics get out there and start killing people over it.

Why is it that with this religion this kind of stuff is such a problem. It's very frustrating. These nut jobs need to grow a spine. Talk about intolerance. Burn a koran or depict Muhammad in a bad way and people are going to die? Give me a break.

People say that there's nut jobs in every religion, and this is true. But these Muslim nutjobs really take the cake......

Petey:

At this point, it should probably be noted that the vast majority of Muslims are just as appalled at this behavior as are you and I.

I live in a town with a substantial Middle-East populations, and I can tell you this: most of them are horrified at this kind of stuff, and a good number of them emigrated here to get away from it.

In other words: there's a reason you see it in international news feeds, but DON'T see it happening here in America.

When the Florida "pastor" threatened to burn the Korans a couple years ago, where were the protests? Over there- not here.

Since this latest flap occurred, have ANY of us heard from the U.S. Muslim community? I know I haven't. There certainly haven't been mass gatherings of rock-throwing hotheads, or burnings of Christian churches upon our shores.

These types of situations need to be viewed in the context of the whole. If we do that, we'll see them for what they are, and not brand an entire culture for the actions of a few.

Mind you- I'm not accusing you of doing that at all.... I just wanted to drop into this thread with a POV that comes from having a few Muslim friends and acquaintances.

And while we're talking about violence and atrocities: let's not forget the "ethnic cleansing" of over 8,000 Muslim men and boys in Bosnia (over the course of just 2 years), just 2 decades ago.

What I'm really saying is this: no dog in this global arena can state that he has totally clean hands, when it comes to behavior like this.

It's all too easy to point fingers at "others," but such has been the state of Mankind since time immemorial. The Old Testament is filled with stories of similar atrocities, and history records this behavior for thousands of years predating Christ's short 33 years on this planet.

To quote Shakespeare: "What a piece of work is Man".....

j/c

At what point do these attacks become an election issue?

The incidents are not isolated.

When will people see that our standing overseas has been seriously compromised?

Obama now waffling on whether Egypt is an "ally" is as weak as him grading himself with an "incomplete".

Where is the leadership?

The movies are obviously a scapregoat.

The real reason is a mix of delusion, despair, and the fact that we're pretty much terrorists when it comes to that region.

Violence begets violence. One can argue chicken or egg ... but there's a reason we're not liked there. It's not the fault of your average Middle Easterner, nor is it the fault of your average American.

Fox News now has an "update" at the very bottom of the story, which notes that the Marines themselves have said the story isn't true:

http://nation.foxnews.com/us-embassy-attack/2012/09/13/reports-marines-not-permitted-live-ammo

You'd be surprised as far as the movies go. People in Islamist based governments find those types of things pertaining to Muhammad to be extremely offensive. Look at the reaction of the Danish artist who depicted Muhammad several years ago.

On the other hand, no or at least very little protests took place over the deaths that occurred in Afghanistan i believe in April. Cultural priorities are vastly different between Islamist and Western thought.

And this is where the US needs to step up and tell these countries that they need to grow up and act like adults. We need to make clear that it is inappropriate to resort to violence every time you are insulted. Face it, if we, the US, did that, there wouldn't be a Middle East left, because we constantly turn the other cheek on every insult. If we acted like the Middle East acts towards us, we would have nuked them flat the first time they burned an American flag. We have taken it all ...... but there may come a day where we are pushed just that one inch too far, and we may not turn the cheek at that point.

We should also be drilling like crazy here at home, so that we don't need a drop of oil from anyone. We could do this if we want to. I understand that people want alternative energies and such, and I understand that. I want to travel in cars that float and don't need roads, but that doesn't mean that I'm not buying tires ever again. We need to be realistic about this stuff. Our economy is impacted by fuel prices, and fuel prices are largely impacted by events we have no control over. When we had to keep pseudo friendly dictators in power, then it made sense to buy oil from them. This is increasingly not the case, so it's time to pull our money out of the region completely, time to take our money away from Communist states like Venezuela, and to use our money at home, producing our own oil and refining our own gas, and creating jobs here at hme in the process.

You also have to realize to there people their religion is much more than how we here in America practice our religion. It is ingrained in every moment of their day, for most it is their very existence.

It's a different mindset, not just thin skin or lack of ability to turn the other cheek. It's how they are raised, their culture.

But in all, it is a small group of people preforming these acts, not the entire population. Not much different than the idiots rioting after a jury verdict or a sports loss/win.

I understand that it's their religion. Regardless, the message needs to be delivered, because their leaders, religious or otherwise, are not going to communicate it.

It is also their government. It is difficult for them to comprehend how the government can't just shut this obscene thing down and put the maker in jail...

That free speech thing does not work always in ones favor...

We complain about big government, yet in comparison we have little government.

Well, we certainly don't have a government that is as oppressive as theirs.

Regardless, if they don't hear the message about what free speech is from us, then who are they going to hear it from?

Quote:

---

Well, we certainly don't have a government that is as oppressive as theirs.

---

Not yet

j/c

I don't usually agree with her , but I listen to what she has to say.

This article is spot on:

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/09/14/president-obama-stop-blaming-victim-for-mideast-violence/

EDIT: Should have been in the other thread...my apologies.

Good article! I thought it was very well written and spot on... I agree with her that at times our Government should own up to our mistakes... but this was not one of them... we did not ask to be attacked, we should not be going after a film maker, we should be going after those that attacked our embassy and thus attacked american soil.

If American protestors attacked a soverign state's embassy here in the US there would be major recourse... I guarantee you there would be no apology from the country protestors attacked.

Quote:

---

Lets face it. The whole Middle East is pretty much unfriendly territory for Americans. Not saying that everyone in the Middle East is unfriendly towards the US, but there is a big enough of a concern to arm those guarding the Embassies over there.

---

Exactly. Let's be honest, if you are forced to walk through a real bad neighborhood at night... you know not EVERYBODY is going to attack you and the majority will barely even notice you, but the odds that ONE person is going to attack you is greater than in other neighborhoods, so you need to be suspicious of everybody and protect yourself.

Quote:

---

Especially when people could be outraged supposedly from a film that happened to be produced in the US and blame that on the country as a whole.

---

Ah yes, the irony. A nameless small group of people in the US makes a film and they attack our embassies thousands of miles away that had nothing to do with the film killing innocent people who probably didn't even know the film existed.. and we are told to not blame their country for the actions of a few... yea, I get it.