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from what I seen out of McCoy,he basically is that kind of QB that is gonna take
what the defense gives him.
I rather have a QB take off and run or checkdown rather than throw into bracketed coverage.
Major BS alert !
Take what he was given? What games were you watching last season? He had 1on1 on the outside ALL freaking season early AND even some late in games an NEVER threw that way...he still dumped it off into double coverage underneath and got his TEs and WRs concussion killed. He is the epitome of a "not to lose" QB
You want "proof" for his stat accumaltion? Re-watch the games or look at his stats down by 2-3 scores....maybe throwing to Mack's butt on 4th down when your team needs a FG qualifies? Probably not for you, I guess he "took" what the D was giving to him there and "tried" his best to make a play, huh? 
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Philly and Buffalo both used LB spies on our RBs. DeMeco followed them wherever they went and the Bills rotated who they used (but same idea).
What we are not doing a good job at thus far is taking the spies out of the play (either by tricking them into double-covering TRich on a pass or sealing them on runs).
The Ravens have watched 2 teams do this and have good defensive coaches, so I assume we will see more of it on Thursday.
Thanks for the reply it just seems that they are stuffing the middle hard and as someone said bullrushing the QB and taking the RB along the way.
Your are correct the Ravens are not blind on defense and will exploit whatever they have seen on offense to gain and advantage.
Im just not sure or OL is up for the task.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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no problem and the "spies" actually don't bullrush the middle. the LBers who are spying actually sit back and wait for the play to develop while mirroring Richardson. once they see a play developing with him getting the ball they move to the hole and fill it.
we have been TERRIBLE at taking this guy out. sometimes it's been Lauvao not getting off a double-team. sometimes Marecic running right by him and a few times Richardson not reading the blocking correctly and running into a tackle.
#gmstrong
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I won't answer for him.. but I will answer... Quote:
Not that I expect an answer (you never do, that's probably you being smart), but here goes:
Didn't they draft a RB significantly higher (with multiple uptrade picks on top)?
Yes, but only after they failed to give those picks away for the QB that they really wanted.. and the one I wish we had.
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Didn't they draft a RT right after the QB with a top 50 selection?
Yes, with another pick that they tried to give away to get the QB that they really wanted.
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Didn't they invest another high 2nd and most likely Top 50 pick in the Supp Draft on a WR?
Yes, could have been a knee jerk reaction to knowing that they had not yet done enough to spark the offense.
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Do you still think the FO thought it was all on McCoy?
The vast majority of it, yes. Basically everything you say they did, they were willing to give up for ONE QB... but they fell short in that effort. So plan B was to get a second level QB and try to improve the players around him. I'm not saying one is right or wrong, just that based on what we have been told they were willing to give up for a QB, they thought that changing the QB was really all we needed to do at this point.
And just for the record, I agreed with going after RGIII like they did. I thought he would be a franchise QB and if you have to give up a lot for one, it's probably worth it. I thought the difference between McCoy and RGIII would be night and day... I hoped the difference between McCoy and Weeden would be.. you know, like night and early morning, just as the sun is about to come over the trees.... The fact that they settled for the 29 year old Weeden, and may have overpaid for him, is even further proof that they thought that even a small upgrade at QB was better than nothing.... or maybe getting a tall QB with a rifle arm was to pacify an angry fan base..... I don't know... then they tried to upgrade around him.
yebat' Putin
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You just made an assumption that the FO felt they settled and Weeden was just a minor upgrade over your boy. Big time assumption to support your view.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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We've had 6 head coaches in 13 years, 3 games. That'd be an average of 2 years, 3 games per coach. If development is 3 years down the road, maybe we should keep coaches that long.
The problem is if you take a peek at the average Browns coach at the 2 year 3 game mark, his record rounded up would be 11-24 with an 8% chance at making the playoffs in a given year. Maybe the reason we don't keep coaches that long is because they've all sucked. 
That may be the case. However, the point was that if it takes 3+ years to develop the team, give the guys the chance. I honestly think that Mangini was well on his way when he was canned.
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In looking up some coaches who have had long term success in taking perennially bad teams and turning them around, it's usually in about year 3 that things really get going.. now we all know that is based on things done in years 1 and 2... but if by year 3 a coach hasn't made significant improvement, I don't think he will...
yebat' Putin
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Brandon Weeden is not protecting the football. At this rate he will throw for 30 INTS.
You really need to get off the INT. stats. How many of these cost us a game? Most of those came trying to make something happen, or when the game was almost over. You can start harping on it when we start losing because of it, which has not happened yet.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
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#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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Peyton Manning threw 28 his rookie year...
Obviously he was never able to overcome that...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Can't help it. These are the kind of posts the irk me. He whines and crys about INT.s and he does not like Weeden. Just more fodder to read.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
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The Eagles were 2-0 and Mike Vick was on pace to throw 48 INTs. Then in week 3 he didn't throw any... And they lost. 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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The Browns aren't good enough to overcome a great deal of INTs.
A QBs job is to keep the chains moving and protect the football and find the end zone.
The Browns offense is doing a porous job is most phases of the offense other than pass blocking.
maybe if Weeden could put some drives together and give the Browns
a 10 or 14 PT lead,he wouldn't have to be playing catchup in the 4th.
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Yep, had Weeden played better week 2, we wouldn't have given up a Punt Return for a Touchdown... 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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just face it,Weeden isn't producing out of the gate like people thought.
He's getting outplayed by RG3,Wilson and Luck.
Weeden was a desperation pick by a desperate front office.
he needs to come out and have a good showing vs the Ravens.
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I don't think anybody expected Weeden to outplay Luck or Griffin. As for Wilson...if our QB was putting up his numbers plenty of people would be calling for his benching already.
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Just as an observation.. while I'm watching bspn with all the ref stuff and packers seahacks.. one thing that jumped out at me was a stat that showed that the Browns are NOT in the top 5 of sacks allowed this season.. I admit to being a bit surprised at that seeing as how bad I regard our Oline..
SaintDawg™
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If we had Seattle's Defense and Running game Weeden might be 2-1 aswell... Russel Wilson on this team? No thank you. Dude can barely see over the lineman when they are in their stances 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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He's also got an85 qb rating, experience in the wco, and the ability to get first downs with his feet in addition to his arm. Weeden's rating is60 (30th in the league) and has neither of the other traits. But yeah, at least he's tall.
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How many points do you think Wilson puts up with5turnovers from the defense in a home game?
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With no running game and Little dropping a catch for an INT?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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I don't think it ever occured that while Weeden has a big time arm and frame,can make all the throws, just maybe he's not the brightest QB between the ears?
I mean throwing to Justin Blackmon and Josh Cooper can hide the mental shortcomings of a QB.
having a rocket arm is great to have,but of you don't have the QB I.Q to go with it,you will end up in the same league as
Trent Edwards
Akili Smith
Tim Couch
Ryan Leaf
Patrick Ramsey
Joey Harrington
Chad Pennington
Mark Malone
Steve Walsh
Rick Mirer
JaMarcus Russell
Trent Dilfer
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Yes, Throwing to an UDFA WR who couldn't even make the Browns obviously makes someone look so great. 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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yeah just like Andrew Hawkins,eh?
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yeah just like Andrew Hawkins,eh?
Josh Cooper hasn't played 2 years in the CFL so I don't see your point.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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My point being is that the Browns had Andrew Hawkins and Lance Moore in Berea at one time and let them walk.
both those players could start for the Browns now.
so in some cases, the Browns don't know what the hell they are doing.
but thats been status quo since 1999 hasn't it?
will Josh Cooper end up as a starter..who knows.
but he was a effective WR for the Cowboys.
Like I said, Brandon Weeden may not have it between the ears.
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Well then maybe we should just go searching the nearest Grocery stores for former UDFA QBs so one can win us a Super Bowl?
Seeing as it's so easy to find talent.
You are the king of stating things after the fact.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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why not..I'm sure there is a bag boy at Piggily Wiggily that can throw for more INTs than TDs at a fraction of the cost.
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why not..I'm sure there is a bag boy at Piggily Wiggily that can throw for more INTs than TDs at a fraction of the cost.
ME ME ME. I wil give it a shot I used to play QB and could really sling the ball back in the day. I still have some wheels so why not? 
Just having fun same as you were. 
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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You are the king of stating things after the fact.
Facts?  
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He's also got an85 qb rating, experience in the wco, and the ability to get first downs with his feet in addition to his arm.
What does Seneca Wallace have to do with this?
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He's also got an85 qb rating, experience in the wco, and the ability to get first downs with his feet in addition to his arm.
What does Seneca Wallace have to do with this?
well, it seems he had a kid with a Mrs. Wilson some years back but they ended the affair and never told Mr. Wilson. so, their kid, Russell, ended up never knowing Seneca was his father until years later when he decided to emulate him as an undersized mobile QB whom people think can be better than he really is.
of course, Seneca owes his own success to his father (Russell's grandfather), Doug Flutie.
#gmstrong
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I don't think it ever occured that while Weeden has a big time arm and frame,can make all the throws, just maybe he's not the brightest QB between the ears?
I mean throwing to Justin Blackmon and Josh Cooper can hide the mental shortcomings of a QB.
having a rocket arm is great to have,but of you don't have the QB I.Q to go with it,you will end up in the same league as
Trent Edwards
Akili Smith
Tim Couch
Ryan Leaf
Patrick Ramsey
Joey Harrington
Chad Pennington
Mark Malone
Steve Walsh
Rick Mirer
JaMarcus Russell
Trent Dilfer
Did you really just wing out Pennington as an example of "big arm, no IQ". He was the exact opposite and a decent QB before injuries took their toll.
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My point being is that the Browns had Andrew Hawkins and Lance Moore in Berea at one time and let them walk.
both those players could start for the Browns now.
so in some cases, the Browns don't know what the hell they are doing.
but thats been status quo since 1999 hasn't it?
will Josh Cooper end up as a starter..who knows.
but he was a effective WR for the Cowboys.
Like I said, Brandon Weeden may not have it between the ears.
Your point can be recited for virtually EVERY team in the league at one point or another. EVERY team misses....otherwise you wouldn't have late round draft pick gems, first round blunder, UDFAs that explode.
I remember lots of people wished Lance Moore could have stuck around but he didn't and is now doing an nice job with the Saints. As for Andrew Hawkins, let's wait to annoint him the "next big thing" quite yet.
Your point is just ridiculous.... "sometimes the Browns don;t know what they're doing". Thanks for the insight. What's next... "half the time you flip a coin its going to be heads"
Bow down to the guru.
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Well...
guys going from nothing to something can be explained with a number of variables.
The only thing that you could say is that the other coaching staffs that have these guys now have done a much better job developing their talent and molding their system to fit their talent...or run a system that suits their talents better...Thats the only thing you could say that would sound logical in terms of a guy like that.
What of a guy like Andre Brown who has been cut by 5 different teams? including the one that brought him back? Did they make a mistake? Did the rest of the teams?
It's just about development...perhaps those guys got in camp and wanted to earn it and put in extra work after being booted from Cleveland...thats how it goes. You just have to work to earn it, and these guys did, and their coaches helped them in a way ours didnt, or didnt have time to. It happens.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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Pushing agendas in general seems to be the joie de vivre lately on this board. Everyone here is so afraid to admit they are wrong and take such a hardline stance that it becomes bickering and nitpicking over words and intended meaning so as to provide an out in case they get caught it's becoming exhausting reading through threads. It's becoming increasingly difficult to believe we are actually fans of the same team! Weeden, McCoy, Wallace, Delhomme all the way back to Couch, Detmer, Kosar, Testaverde and Zier, the name on the back shouldn't trump what the name on the front is in order to further ones agenda, and by extension, sense of self aggrandizing.
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/\ This. Exactly.
^ This. Exactly
It's the reason I haven't posted much at all for a long, long time. Actual football conversations rarely exist anymore.
#gmstrong
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Your point can be recited for virtually EVERY team in the league at one point or another. EVERY team misses....otherwise you wouldn't have late round draft pick gems, first round blunder, UDFAs that explode.
Your point is just ridiculous.... "sometimes the Browns don;t know what they're doing". Thanks for the insight. What's next... "half the time you flip a coin its going to be heads"
Bow down to the guru.
Well something is clearly different.. if it wasn't, teams would rise and fall relatively consistently.. instead we have teams that have been really good consistently for decades and teams that have been pretty bad consistently for decades... so somebody is doing something right and somebody is doing something wrong.
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
Your point can be recited for virtually EVERY team in the league at one point or another. EVERY team misses....otherwise you wouldn't have late round draft pick gems, first round blunder, UDFAs that explode.
Your point is just ridiculous.... "sometimes the Browns don;t know what they're doing". Thanks for the insight. What's next... "half the time you flip a coin its going to be heads"
Bow down to the guru.
Well something is clearly different.. if it wasn't, teams would rise and fall relatively consistently.. instead we have teams that have been really good consistently for decades and teams that have been pretty bad consistently for decades... so somebody is doing something right and somebody is doing something wrong.
When a team is good, they can bring in a young player, give them time to learn, and give them leaders to look up to and learn from.
When a team is not good, the young player is thrust out there, with little time to develop, with few people to look up to and learn from.
Look at the Packers WR situation, they have a solid young core with Jennings, Nelson, and Jones, who all got to learn from Driver.
Who do Little, Gordon, and Benjamin get to learn from, Massaqoui? Cribbs?
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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the Browns had opportunities to bring a vet FA WR on board.
part of the problem is what I can see that these WR's aren't getting coached up.
thats stunting their development.
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Will you stop with the Vet FA gimmick?
Who were they ganna bring in?
Do you want to pay big money to guys like Vincent Jackson or Robert Meachem?
What are they going to be able to teach our young guys? They are young guys themselves.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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ask the Ravens how Anquan Boldin is panning out.
I have yet to see the Browns be able to draft and develop a WR since 99 thats worth a damn.
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