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Quote:
The rest of his performance was weak, ill prepared, and really embarrassing.
He didn't have a teleprompter to fall back on. 
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It was entertaining I though. It seemed like Mitt did better, it was nice that they were allowed to back and forth more. I am also glad that they spent so much time on the economy.
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Hey Mitt, what would happen if we let states have the sole authority back in 1950-1960s with Civil Rights?
As I've made clear, I'm not a big fan of either guy but this is just a stupid statement.
Mitt Romney's father, George, actually was at the forefront of Civil Rights for blacks back in the 1950s and 1960s. That's him on the left in this picture, with the white shirt, tie and no jacket.
Where was Obama's father in the 1950s and 1960s?
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Legend
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Another bold prediction here...fox news will say Romney won and all of the other networks will say Obama did. In reality no one likely won as the just pointed fingers the whole time.
Wow,, that turned out to be wrong LOL
NBC is kicking the Pres this morning for laying down. I thought that Chris matthews was going to blow a gasket.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Yeah, that was way off! O is getting blasted pretty good this morning by some of the talking heads.
#gmstrong
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Yeah, that was way off! O is getting blasted pretty good this morning by some of the talking heads.
Before noon, there will be a large contingent of O supporters that will spin it another way.. have no fear. Axelrod already started that.
But in the end, what little I saw of the debate seems to go in favor of Romney. He did appear more prepared. Obama didn't attack him as I thought he would, not sure if he's saving his big weapons for one of the next two debates..
I thought that Romney showed respect for the office of President and even showed some respect to obama which frankly, I didn't expect. I was a bit surprised by that.
Both guys were calm looking, Romney more so I thought. Obama kept hammering at the 5 Trillion dollar tax cut and Romney kept denying it offering another explanation of it.
But O kept coming right back to it.
this morning, on the fact checking sites, they seemed to lean more toward Obama being more honest about things than Romney. Not sure if that will remain the case.
Haven't had time to really dig in and read all of it, just skimmed it.
Anyway, the spin has begun.
but I'll say it now, if Romney continues to react as he did last night and Obama continues this passive routine, Obama loses the election and Romney takes home the prize.
This from a guy that won't vote for either of them.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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What I thought was the most interesting was the way that the guys spoke.
Romney did a TERRIFIC job talking, hitting his marks, making his statements, and putting Obama back on his heels. Everytime Obama came at him with something, instead of being defensive, he merely defended his point, and then went on the offensive toward what he would do (though speaking in generalities) and what he would do differently.
Obama seemed to be throwing stuff at the wall and seeing if it would stick. He consistently, in a new age media style, throw out an accusation about Romney, to see if he could defend it. If Romney hadn't come so well prepared to speak and play that game he wouldve been destroyed. Since he did come prepared Obama took it on the chin big time.
It's a risky strategy to act like the media and just make claims over and over again, and stick to the one big agenda you're trying to push (the big tax cut and obamacare) and it didnt pay off for Obama.
That being said. These debates, unless there are major landslide victories for one side or the other, wont swing anything. The undecided voter isnt going to determine, because generally the undecided voters will split and cancel each other out.
Romney has a big hill to climb if he wants to make this a race that he can win.
As much as I haven't liked him, or the Republican stance or plans in the past 2 decades, He's starting to seem like a stronger candidate than Obama. I look at it as you have a Socialist (not in the term that has been used to describe him, but someone that uses the strength of society to draw power) versus a business man.
Obama has reflected a society growing indifferent to the strength of ones own country. Pandering to the minority at the expense of the majority. I see it as a teacher, as a coach, and as a worker. Care is at an all time low, about the goings on within our own country. Obama has reflected that in my opinion. The whole concept of handouts is unsettling. Obama has gone the way of if you want something, you should have it. If you cant get it on your own, someone should give it to you. Its a dangerous system. Look at the pattern, it goes the same way everytime.
- Something free?! Wow thats amazing, youre a great person. I cant thank you enough
- This free stuff is great, I want this!
- This free stuff is great, I'm glad I have it.
- It's a good thing I get this free stuff, I dont have to go get it on my own now
- If I dont get this free stuff I'm in trouble
- I need this free stuff
- I better get this free stuff, I cant survive without it
- WHERE IS MY FREE STUFF?!
If you get things you havent necessarily earned, you learn to rely on it.
Romney, represents the business model. He and his family (father especially) have created their own life on the strength of their actions. Everything that they have, they earned through their own volition and hard work. He is representing the do it yourself model. If you want health care, if you want a good job, if you want a good salary. Go get it.
If Romney gets elected he has a very difficult road ahead of him. Government handouts are at an all-time high, and if you take them away cold turkey, people will revolt against him.
This could become one of the most important elections in this country's future.
There will be two VERY different paths taken by the two candidates, and they could have very different ramifications.
I'm nervous about it all.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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I just watched an exchange on MSNBC, where Former Ohio Gov. Ted Strickland was on one side of the argument. (He's a big wig in the Obama campaign) I thought that he was going to shake himself to death. He was literally shaking back and forth, trying to explain why Obama didn't get his rear end handed to him last night. The biggest problem for Obama right now is this: He had really only a lead left in one area ...... that being that people believe that he is "likable", and "cares about people like me" in the polls. The CNN and CBS post-debate polls among undecided voters saw Romney take the lead in "Likability", by 1 point. Romney went from 30% of these voters saying that he "Cares about people like me" to 63%. Obama also picked up support in this area, going from 53% to 69%. However, these were the 2 biggest problem areas for Romney, and he gained huge ground with voters he needs to gain ground with. Evil National Journal Link One other area of concern for Obama and Democrats has to be that AARP has now requested that they be left out of Obama's arguments about Obamacare. They have been a pretty heavy duty staunch ally of the President and Democrats, and this is quite a slap in the face for the President. Evil Fox News Link
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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j/c
O was his usual self when not reading from a teleprompter.
Run-on...rambling partial sentences that become too garbled to follow after about 10 seconds.
Imagine what O's conversations with Republicans in Congress looks like...or his phone calls to foreign leaders. No wonder Hillary met with those foreign leaders at the recent UN Meeting.
O's performance was a disaster...while typical of his non-teleprompter talks.
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Quote:
I was actually pretty surprised about 2 things .....
Romney was incredibly prepared. He handled every issue deftly.
By contrast, Obama looked horribly prepared. He seemed completely incapable of defending anything his administration has done. His only passion was was for Obamacare. The rest of his performance was weak, ill prepared, and really embarrassing.
Agreed.
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Quote:
Quote:
I was actually pretty surprised about 2 things .....
Romney was incredibly prepared. He handled every issue deftly.
By contrast, Obama looked horribly prepared. He seemed completely incapable of defending anything his administration has done. His only passion was was for Obamacare. The rest of his performance was weak, ill prepared, and really embarrassing.
Agreed.
To me I wouldn't say that Obama was weak, but I'll say he wasn't as well prepared as Romney was.
I think Romney surprised him with his level of preparedness. I don't think Obama expected that.
If I'm Obama, I don't let that happen again. If I'm Romney, I don't rest on my performance last night.
Romney has to come back and do it at least one more time, Obama needs a clear win in both the next two debates.
And even with that, I'm not sure what the hell will happen.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/...dential-debate/Quote:
President Barack Obama and former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney traded barbs Wednesday night on taxes, jobs, health care and the economy — and often stretched the facts.
"Mr. President," Romney said, "you're entitled as the president to your own airplane and to your own house, but not to your own facts."
Romney also would have benefited from that advice.
We're combing through the pair's remarks from the University of Denver's Ritchie Center, where moderator Jim Lehrer focused on the economy, health care, the role of government and governing.
Here's what we've checked so far:
Taxes
• Obama said that Romney's plan "calls for a $5 trillion tax cut." The figure accounts for only half of Romney's plan, and it's cumulative over 10 years. The governor says he will offset those lost revenues by reducing tax deductions and eliminating loopholes. However, he hasn't specified what those changes would be. The president made a misleading statement about an incomplete plan, but he did describe what the plan was missing and that Romney would not fill in the gaps. We rated the claim Half True.
• Obama said that "independent studies" looking at Romney's tax plan say the only way to meet Romney's goal of not adding to the deficit is by "burdening middle class families." A reputable study from the Tax Policy Center found that to meet Romney's deficit goal, middle class taxpayers might lose exemptions and deductions worth about $2,000. So we previously have rated Mostly True a claim that Romney is proposing a tax plan "that would give millionaires another tax break and raise taxes on middle class families by up to $2,000 a year."
• Romney said six tax studies look at a study that Obama described and "say it's completely wrong." Previously, Romney has claimed that five studies back his tax plan. We found that Mostly False. We saw no more than two independent studies out of the five claimed.
• Obama said he "lowered taxes for small businesses 18 times." When we examined his claim last summer that his administration had "provided at least 16 tax cuts to small businesses," we rated it Mostly True, noting that conservative tax specialists say the statistic ignores proposed and enacted tax hikes on small businesses.
Deficit
• Romney claimed that Obama had said he would "cut the deficit in half." That's the case. It's right there on YouTube. True.
• Obama said he put forward "a specific $4 trillion deficit reduction plan." We found he was cherry-picking some numbers to include savings from last year's budget and his deficit reduction agreement with Congress. Half True.
Jobs
• Romney said part of his plan to create jobs includes North American energy independence. He said that while oil and gas production might be up, Obama shouldn't get credit — the increase was on private lands, not public. We have previously found that oil production on public lands dropped 14 percent in one year, but that's not the whole story. It was small snapshot, and partly because of hurricanes. We rated a claim from Crossroads GPS that oil "production's down where Obama's in charge" Half True. Our reporting confirmed Romney's claim that Obama shouldn't get credit — but neither, perhaps, should President George W. Bush.
• Romney said half of college graduates can't find a job. We've previously rated that Mostly True — about a quarter of recent college grads can't find a job, while another quarter found jobs that don't require college degrees.
Medicare
• Romney claimed "on Medicare for current retirees, (Obama is) cutting $716 billion from the program." That amount refers to Obama's reductions in Medicare spending over 10 years, primarily in what's paid to insurers and hospitals. But the statement gives the impression that the law takes money already allocated to Medicare away from current recipients. We rated Romney's claim Half True.
• Romney also claimed that Obama used those Medicare savings to pay for his health care law. We've previously rated Romney's claim that Obama took that money from Medicare "to pay for Obamacare" Half True. The new health care law uses a number of measures to try to reduce the rapid growth of future Medicare spending. Those savings are used to offset costs created by the health care law — especially coverage for the uninsured — so that the overall law doesn't add to the deficit.
• Obama claimed that the "essence" of Romney's plan for retiree health care was to "turn Medicare into a voucher program." Romney would give seniors a premium support payment toward private insurance, to replace the current system of government payments to doctors and hospitals. Generally, we think "voucher program" is a fair way of describing to voters the vision for Medicare under a Romney-Ryan administration. We rated Obama's claim Mostly True.
• Obama recycled an outdated number about vice presidential candidate Paul Ryan's original Medicare proposal, saying that "because the voucher wouldn't necessarily keep up with health care inflation, it was estimated that this would cost the average senior about $6,000 a year." That ignores a more recent Ryan proposal that pegs the size of the voucher to the second-cheapest plan available on a Medicare exchange. We rated the claim Half True.
Health care
• Romney said that Obama failed to cut health care premiums by $2,500. That's true. On our Obameter, which tracks Obama's 2008 campaign promises, we've rated that a Promise Broken.
• Obama said that Romney used the same advisers to create his Massachusetts health plan that Obama later did for his health care law. Rick Santorum once claimed that a "Romney adviser admits Romneycare was the blueprint for Obamacare." If Santorum's ad had said "former adviser," that would have been True.
• Obama claimed that Romney said his Massachusetts law was a "model for the nation." Romney later fired back that he said it was a model "state by state," not from the federal government down. We've previously found that an early version of Romney's book No Apology did advocate the Massachusetts model as a strong option for other states, as Romney said.
• Politicians often cite the Congressional Budget Office, the nonpartisan research arm of Congress, to back up their claims. Romney used that tactic in a claim that CBO "says up to 20 million people will lose their insurance as Obamacare goes into effect next year." We found that was a large exaggeration and rated it False.
• Romney said that Obama "put in place a board that can tell people ultimately what treatments they're going to receive." Romney avoided the more inaccurate and harsher wording of some other critics, who have falsely described the board as "rationing" care. But Romney's claim can leave viewers with the impression that the board makes health care decisions for individual Americans, and that's not the case. We rated his statement Mostly False.
We'll update this story as we post new fact-checks.
~Lyuokdea
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They certainly like the half truth thing don't they..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Which candidate is going to give me a free hot water tank? Mine is leaking all over the basement floor, so I have to replace it. Whichever candidate will cover the cost of my water tank gets my vote. 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Dawg Talker
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This is comical. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/04..._n_1940297.htmlAl Gore Blames Denver's High Altitude For Obama's Dismal Debate Performance The Huffington Post | By Cavan Sieczkowski Former presidential hopeful and environmentalist Al Gore is coming to President Barack Obama's defense and blaming Denver's high altitude for the president's dismal debate performance. By most accounts, Obama lost the first presidential debate, held Wednesday night at the University of Denver in Colorado, to Republican nominee Mitt Romney. Pundits said "he choked," and some went so far as to question whether his performance will cost him the election. Many noted Obama's unorthodox demeanor. Chris Matthews asked, "Where was Obama tonight?!" Still, Gore does not think Obama should be to blame for his lackluster debate. He thinks it may have been the altitude. During a post-debate analysis on Current TV, Gore went out on a limb and questioned if Denver's environment had something to do with the president's flop. “I’m going to say something controversial here,” Gore started, “Obama arrived in Denver at 2 p.m. today, just a few hours before the debate started. Romney did his debate prep in Denver. When you go to 5,000 feet, and you only have a few hours to adjust. I don't know... Maybe." Current TV host Cenk Uygur interjected saying he came in from Los Angeles and just guzzled some coffee. Comedian John Fugelsang did not think Gore's theory was that far-fetched. "It's really different. The first time I ever did stand-up in Denver I had the same exact effect," Fugelsang said. "I flew in that day and when your lungs aren't acclimated to that kind of air, yeah, it makes you drawn, it makes you off. The president had an off night." Altitude sickness is a proven illness. Denver, nicknamed the Mile High City with an altitude of 5,280 feet, does have 17 percent less oxygen than cities at sea level, the Denver Post reported in a piece about preventing altitude sickness. Symptoms of altitude sickness include shortness of breath, throbbing headaches and fatigue. Many people, however, are unaffected by altitude changes. Is Al Gore's altitude theory poppycock, or is it possible?
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I can't believe that people are just now realizing the guy is a crappy speaker when he doesn't have a teleprompter. He is and always has been awkward and stumbling without being able to read from a prompter. I personally think it is because he has absolutely no idea what he is doing and is very nervous. I know that is how I would be in that situation.
#gmstrong
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Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
“Obama arrived in Denver at 2 p.m. today, just a few hours before the debate started. Romney did his debate prep in Denver. When you go to 5,000 feet, and you only have a few hours to adjust. I don't know... Maybe."
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Why is this comical? He didnt say it IS the reason Obama was off, he just threw out a possibility. I have heard other people talk about how the high altitude has effected them.
I am not saying this is the reason O was off, but there was something that just didnt seem the same with him compared to how he has been in the past, teleprompter or no.
It will be interesting to see is more his normal self at the next debate.
King
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Which candidate is going to give me a free hot water tank? Mine is leaking all over the basement floor, so I have to replace it. Whichever candidate will cover the cost of my water tank gets my vote.
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Oh good grief.
If Obama does indeed have a problem with altitude, then God help us all if he has to make any decisions from Air Force One in the event of an unthinkable crisis.
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Oh good grief.
If Obama does indeed have a problem with altitude, then God help us all if he has to make any decisions from Air Force One in the event of an unthinkable crisis.
Air Force One would have oxygen pumped into the cabin. There is no altititude sickness on a plane
Just sayin.... 
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Why is this comical? He didnt say it IS the reason Obama was off, he just threw out a possibility. I have heard other people talk about how the high altitude has effected them.
I am not saying this is the reason O was off, but there was something that just didnt seem the same with him compared to how he has been in the past, teleprompter or no.
It will be interesting to see is more his normal self at the next debate.
King
Are you serious? This is the dumbest thing I have ever heard. Yeah, he was off. It probably had more to do with him not preparing for the debate. He always goes on and on when speaking without a prompter. He will answer 3 questions in a half hour press conference. The fact that he actually spoke for 5 more minutes in the debate was a bad thing. Btw, if memory serves me Hillary beat up on him as well.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Why is this comical?
Did he run a marathon during the debate?? because that's the only way I see the altitude affecting him... seriously... this is why I think Al Gore is a complete idiot...
<><
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Quote:
“Obama arrived in Denver at 2 p.m. today, just a few hours before the debate started. Romney did his debate prep in Denver. When you go to 5,000 feet, and you only have a few hours to adjust. I don't know... Maybe."
Homie don't play dat!
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Now people want to debate me on whether altitude sickness was why he was off. I never said it was the reason, i am just saying it was thrown out there as a possibility and from what I have heard from others who have suffered from it, it is plausible.
I tend to agree that Obama didnt prepare well, he took Romney lightly while Romney was off in a bunker somewhere rehearsing his "zingers"
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Obama did worse last night than he did against Clint Eastwood.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Quote:
Quote:
Why is this comical?
Did he run a marathon during the debate?? because that's the only way I see the altitude affecting him... seriously... this is why I think Al Gore is a complete idiot...
well, if there is anyone who should know it would be someone who won a Nobel Peace Prize for his environmental work
#gmstrong
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I just thought that it was kind of ironic that "Environmentalist Al" was on TV ....... blaming the environment in Denver for the President's performance. I also wonder how NFL players (and other athletes) ever manage to perform in Denver. I mean, if it takes more than 8 hours to be prepared to stand at a podium and talk for an hour and a half, then how long does it take for an athlete to adjust? How about when the teams show up in Denver. Maybe the coaches can't coach because the adjustment to the altitude would just flatten them. Of course, that wouldn't really matter, because, obviously, their players would be flat on the practice field when they tried to do anything.  Obama's problem is that he couldn't give a canned response. He didn't have a teleprompter there, and Romney challenged him as the debate went along instead of standing meekly by, allowing him to say whatever he wanted. If someone watched last night and had no idea which man was the President, and which man was the challenger, I bet that most would have said that Romney was the President. Maybe that was Obama's strategy ...... make Romney look like the President so people would blame him for the mess Obama has created? 
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Obama did worse last night than he did against Clint Eastwood.
Now thats some funny stuff 
Thats going on my Facebook status,right now
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Quote:
Obama did worse last night than he did against Clint Eastwood.
That's pretty good. 
About halfway through, I would've called it even. Romney pulled away at the end.
Obama's detractors will and have act like it was complete ineptitude ... it wasn't. The guy got lazy at the end and Romney stepped up. It wasn't a bloodbath (most debates aren't), and it's not going to do much for Romney's slim chances...
...but it was helpful for him. He could see a bit of a shift if he keeps winning debates.
I cannot understand why Obama didn't hit him hard on his '47%' comments (which I feel many will list as the catalyst when/if he loses).
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,643 |
I think he didnt hit the 47% thing because its pretty incriminating as is. Why give him the chance to explain what he was really trying to say?
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
Quote:
I think he didnt hit the 47% thing because its pretty incriminating as is. Why give him the chance to explain what he was really trying to say?
Good point.
I also understand being ahead on points and just making sure you don't get knocked out...but it was a passive performance.
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,643
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,643 |
For sure. I expected more "shipping jobs to China" talk, or closing factory jabs.
Bottom line IMO, BO wasnt ready.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
JC.
I've never gotten the impression that Obama is an off-the-cuff speaker, so debates would be a point of weakness. Romney on the other hand seems quick to respond in an impromptu discussion.
Does that mean Romney woul dbe a better president? Hardly, but debates are a known part of the process, and if it's a weakness, you need to spend a little time working on it. Kind of like Greg Little needs to work on catching the football.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,218
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,218 |
Holy crap.... I just realized: The U.S. has B.O.
This makes me very sad.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,088
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,088 |
Oh brother  the guy did a lousy job of debating.. that's all there is too it..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,955
Hall of Famer
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OP
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,955 |
Yes...and let's blame Denver, not the guy that should have planned better. If you know you are going to be that high above sea level, wouldn't you arrive earlier to adjust? To me, that's a big ole DUH. Either way, it really makes the POTUS looks silly.
#gmstrong #gmlapdance
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,088
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,088 |
Quote:
Yes...and let's blame Denver, not the guy that should have planned better. If you know you are going to be that high above sea level, wouldn't you arrive earlier to adjust? To me, that's a big ole DUH. Either way, it really makes the POTUS looks silly.
Obama looked silly because he did a lousy job, I have a ton of doubt being in Denver had anything to do with it. I've flown into Denver and within hours made a presentation to a customer. We got the work.
The one who looks silly for the Denver comment is Gore.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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