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The premise of this thread is all wrong. The Browns don't want a GM. If they did Heckert would be staying.
What Banner wants is a Personnel Director. Banner considers himself the GM.
Nobody who aspires to be a GM in the near future will take this job the way it's structured now. That 's why that dope Lombardi's name keeps coming up. He's the only guy who actually wants back into the NFL so bad that he'll be Banner's yes man.
I could be wrong. And I hope I am. But I don't think I'm very far off base in this.
I agree.
And if it wasn't true wouldn't we be exclusively looking for GM candidates so they can have full input on the coaching hire.
Banner just feels like a mistake. I hope I'm wrong.
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Banner just feels like a mistake. I hope I'm wrong.
This feels like 2001 and 2009 all over again.
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Quote:
Quote:
The premise of this thread is all wrong. The Browns don't want a GM. If they did Heckert would be staying.
What Banner wants is a Personnel Director. Banner considers himself the GM.
Nobody who aspires to be a GM in the near future will take this job the way it's structured now. That 's why that dope Lombardi's name keeps coming up. He's the only guy who actually wants back into the NFL so bad that he'll be Banner's yes man.
I could be wrong. And I hope I am. But I don't think I'm very far off base in this.
I agree.
And if it wasn't true wouldn't we be exclusively looking for GM candidates so they can have full input on the coaching hire.
Banner just feels like a mistake. I hope I'm wrong.
Banner made it plainly clear without explicitly stating it during the press conference. He's the GM and he will be hiring a HC who will have control over the roster. They will then hire a guy who is nothing more then a Pro Personel Director to run the scouting dept. They might call this new guy a GM, but that will just set him up to be the fall guy in case they fail.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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I'd slightly disagree, because it sounds like to me that the HC will be a partime GM as well, along with Banner and Pro Personnel Director.
Which is basically how they did it with the Eagles.
you had a good run Hank.
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Hey,
How did that work out for the Eagles?? Oh... Anyway, if they get a prevously experienced coach, then it might work. Someone TOO young from being a coordinator to all that power.. will not work!!
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It worked out really well for a really long time. If we have anywhere near the run the Iggles had with Reid, Heckert, and Banner I will be thrilled. As was stated in the interview hiring the right HC is key
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Here is my take on how the GM search will go ..... for whatever it's worth ....
The head coach is going to dictate what kind of GM we wind up with.
If the head coach wants a strong personnel guy ..... then we'll get a guy like Caldwell, etc.While the head coach would have final authority over the roster, and all of the players ....... the GM would have far more power to set the board according to his own thoughts on the roster, and the head coach would have input more into a broader view of what the roster needs, as opposed to picking specific players to fill those roles.
However, if the head coach wants heavy input into the draft and such, in essence becoming a pseudo GM himself, then we'll wind up with a guy who will simply carry out his wishes, like Lombardi. Lombardi, in a situation like this, would be more foot soldier than general .... and more player personnel director than GM. He would set the board only in broad terms, and the head coach would then "place" players within each category. The "GM" would be more advisor as opposed to actually being the guy to pull the trigger.
The head coach will determine which type we wind up with.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Here is my take on how the GM search will go ..... for whatever it's worth ....
The head coach is going to dictate what kind of GM we wind up with.
If the head coach wants a strong personnel guy ..... then we'll get a guy like Caldwell, etc.While the head coach would have final authority over the roster, and all of the players ....... the GM would have far more power to set the board according to his own thoughts on the roster, and the head coach would have input more into a broader view of what the roster needs, as opposed to picking specific players to fill those roles.
However, if the head coach wants heavy input into the draft and such, in essence becoming a pseudo GM himself, then we'll wind up with a guy who will simply carry out his wishes, like Lombardi. Lombardi, in a situation like this, would be more foot soldier than general .... and more player personnel director than GM. He would set the board only in broad terms, and the head coach would then "place" players within each category. The "GM" would be more advisor as opposed to actually being the guy to pull the trigger.
The head coach will determine which type we wind up with.
I don't know about all that but I do think that Haslam (and Banner) are smart enough to put it out there that they'll give any potential HC that they want to hire that they'll have a lot of input into who makes the team and in who the Browns draft. It might cause a team to either increase the power of a coaching (or even GM) candidate that they are seeking.
That is, a current HC which they might be targeting may currently not have that authority and this would be a 'step up' from their current duties and may even come with a plenary title like 'special asst. to the GM' or '...to the Personnel Director' and a few more coins. Or to force another team to give some of the powers of a GM to the HC so as to give them a better shot at the GM that they really want.
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"The Decider" will be the determining factor in our new Head of Scouting...... I mean GM.
When both Banner and Haslam will be in the draft room and a "consensus" has to be reached, what kind of power does this "GM" have?
None really......
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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It all depends on what the head coach wants.
Some head coaches want to be heavily involved in the draft, and others do not. If we hire a head coach who wants a lot of input into the draft, and who wants to do all of the work involved in setting up a board, then that's what we'll get. If, on the other hand, we hire a head coach who wants to concentrate on coaching, making his assistants better, making the team better on a daily/weekly/monthly basis, and have input into free agency only, then that's what we'll get there as well.
It all depends on what type of head coach we hire.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I'm not sure what you missed in this press conference. It was plainly stated that the draft will be built on a "consensus".
Nowhere at any time has either Banner or Haslam indicated otherwise.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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But he's also said that the coach will have the final word .... meaning that he breaks all ties.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Just read Pit's sig, it should tell you all you need to know about his feelings. He has made up his mind that he is right about Banner and to try and discuss anything with him concerning the new regime is worthless.
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Just read Pit's sig, it should tell you all you need to know about his feelings. He has made up his mind that he is right about Banner and to try and discuss anything with him concerning the new regime is worthless.
Doesn't mean he's wrong, though.
If anyone thinks that if there is a tie during the discussions in the Draft room and anybody but Joe Banner is breaking that tie they are smoking crack.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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But he's also said that the coach will have the final word .... meaning that he breaks all ties.
Quote:
Joe Banner
(On the reason for having the head coach control the roster rather than the general manager)- “I just want to be careful that we’re speaking the same semantics. What Jimmy’s referring to and what our plan is, although it could change depending upon the people, relates to when you guys use the term 53-man roster. We’re talking who makes the team at the end of training camp and who is on the team during the season, and then the 46 who dress.
That comment shouldn’t be taken as if it necessarily includes who has the final say on the first round draft pick, on free-agent signings or cap related decisions.
Those are the decisions in which our expectation going into this, that we think in most scenarios depending upon the personalities, are better handled by the coach, who at that point knows better exactly who we’ve brought in, who has the skills to do the things that he needs to do, which people fit together to fill all the different roles that he needs to fill in the different schemes that he may be planning on.”
You really have to brake that one up because he runs 2 thoughts together. If you read the first part then the last then the middle its more clear.
He did say later as you mentioned that if the coach is really good at the personal side of things they may allow him to have those duties.
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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Quote:
Quote:
Just read Pit's sig, it should tell you all you need to know about his feelings. He has made up his mind that he is right about Banner and to try and discuss anything with him concerning the new regime is worthless.
Doesn't mean he's wrong, though.
If anyone thinks that if there is a tie during the discussions in the Draft room and anybody but Joe Banner is breaking that tie they are smoking crack.
But here's the thing you are failing to realize, Otto. Banner has a YouTube app on on his smartphone AND iPad. Let's say there isn't a consensus. He can quickly go to that prospect's YouTube highlight reel and make a call in minutes. I want the guy with the YouTube app breaking those ties.
Here's the bottom line. Haslam feels indebted to Banner because the NFL put them together and Banner is teaching Haslam the ropes of how the NFL works. I am confident that Banner can do at least that. But Banner has parlayed this into his dream job ... head honcho ... shot caller ... will get all the credit if it's successful. People are hugely mistaken if they don't think EGO is playing a huge role in this. Haslam is an idiot when it comes to the NFL ... let's face it ... he is. This isn't truck stops. Banner is smart, articulate, and is telling Haslam how it should be done. Haslam is undboutedly learning a ton from Banner.
Now Banner has sold him on ONE way of doing things. The Philly way. The part I agree with is finding a HC with strong, DYNAMIC, leadership. QB, HC, culture, attitude ... the four key ingredients to winning. But where I believe Banner is being short sighted ... and Haslam as a result ... is there is more than one way to skin a cat. Find a way to make it work with a strong personnel guy that you already have.
Heckert is probably going to have a job within a week. When is the last time we've fired someone and that's happened? Guy is competent all the way. And we just shoved a really competent guy out the door...because Banner is so fixated on two things ... a) the Philly way ... and b) his ego.
Maybe he's writing checks that he can indeed cash. Time will tell.
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Maybe he's writing checks that he can indeed cash. Time will tell.
That's what I'm hoping. I just don't have a good feeling in that regard, though.
That and I guess I'll have to get an iPad..... 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Why can't you just trust this guy Rish?  Have faith !
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Where's Peen? Looks like a rat to me...... 
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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You are such a petty child.
you had a good run Hank.
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Where's Peen? Looks like a rat to me......
lol! Definitely one of the most memorable posts on the board. Something like, "Generally i've found that if a person looks like a rat, they are a rat".
UCONN HUSKIES 2014 Champions of Basketball
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Prediction:
If Chip Kelly comes here our "GM" will be Mike Lombardi. This will result in at least half of the board saying, "I'm done with this team."
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lol! Definitely one of the most memorable posts on the board. Something like, "Generally i've found that if a person looks like a rat, they are a rat".
Mother Teresa looked like a rat, imo, and she's about to be sainted. Enough with the physiognomy; it's frigging medieval.
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Prediction:
If Chip Kelly comes here our "GM" will be Mike Lombardi. This will result in at least half of the board saying, "I'm done with this team."
YEP, anyone with any 2xl gear or merch for my den that they dont want anymore PM me for my addy, or depending on what it is I'll come pick it up.
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Prediction:
If Chip Kelly comes here our "GM" will be Mike Lombardi. This will result in at least half of the board saying, "I'm done with this team."
I have no real issues with Chip Kelly coming here. Lombardi being hired will renew my faith that Banner is going to destroy the Browns while singing Frank Sinatra songs. 
If you need 3 years to be a winner you got here 2 years to early. Get it done Browns.
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Thats it .... You have crossed the line .. On body picks on Frank 
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Quote:
San Francisco 49ers director of pro personnel Tom Gamble remains one of the most sought after general manager candidates, and the Cleveland Browns became the latest team to request permission to interview Gamble, according to a report from Albert Breer of the NFL Network.
Link
Very interesting. Our head guys said we would not interview our new GMs until the coach was on board. That means we are probably done looking for coaches.
It's going to be Kelly, Whisenhunt, Marrone, or Horton.
Maybe my prediction of Kelly and Lombardi was delightfully wrong.
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Yeah, I have to agree. It makes me think too, based on the rest of this thread and the convo about if it is a GM or a "GM"...obviously it is a GM and either the candidate they've chosen isn't a strong personnel guy, doesn't want to be one, or they don't expect him to be once he's been interviewed (Kelly). It makes me wonder if Whisenhunt is off the list.
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Since there are exactly 2 people who know where the team is in the process, who they may have eliminated from their list, who they may have moved up or down on their overall list, and so on. I would guess that once we find out who the coach is, then we'll have an idea what kind of GM we'll look for. Kelly has already been identified as a guy who wants to be more of a head coach only ...... at least from one report I read ...... Other head coach candidates may be stronger in the personnel area, and depending on who the head coach is, their preference may be identifiable. If we go through this weekend without an announcement, then it increases the odds that an assistant still in the playoffs may be the preferred candidate, and the team has to wait till they can interview him. Or I could have it entirely wrong.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Very interesting. Our head guys said we would not interview our new GMs until the coach was on board. That means we are probably done looking for coaches.
Or it means they weren't being honest.
Or it could mean in fact they're clueless.
Quote:
It's going to be Kelly, Whisenhunt, Marrone, or Horton.
Since Kelly hasn't even been interviewed yet, according to your own logic, you can take him off of your list.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Our head guys said we would not interview our new GMs until the coach was on board.
Did they say that they wouldn't interview or wouldn't hire a GM before the coach was hired?
You can't teach someone something they think they know
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And that stance may have been posturing only to see WHO might come forward and say theyre interested.
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Make room for Reid and Heckert!
Peoli WAS Bill B. Nothing more.
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Or it means they weren't being honest.
Or it could mean in fact they're clueless.
They've only requested permission to interview.
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Since Kelly hasn't even been interviewed yet, according to your own logic, you can take him off of your list.
No. I think they are just getting their ducks in a row, so once they hire the new coach all the hoops have already been jumped through.
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I think they are just getting their ducks in a row, so once they hire the new coach all the hoops have already been jumped through.
Metaphor overload; 5 yard penalty; 1st & 15.
Carry on.
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Make room for Reid and Heckert!
Peoli WAS Bill B. Nothing more.
I always figured Heckert would go where Reid went, then I heard Reid to KC was almost a done deal, but they kept their GM.
Another tumbler just fell into place.
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Tumbler?
Like a gymnast? I don't understand.
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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Quote:
Quote:
San Francisco 49ers director of pro personnel Tom Gamble remains one of the most sought after general manager candidates, and the Cleveland Browns became the latest team to request permission to interview Gamble, according to a report from Albert Breer of the NFL Network.
Link
Very interesting. Our head guys said we would not interview our new GMs until the coach was on board. That means we are probably done looking for coaches.
It's going to be Kelly, Whisenhunt, Marrone, or Horton.
Maybe my prediction of Kelly and Lombardi was delightfully wrong.
Not saying you're wrong, just offering a change in perspective...
The rules that govern a teams ability to interview personnel on teams who are currently in the playoffs changes the dynamic of how and when the interview can happen. Also, asking permission doesn't mean an immediate interview. The permission just sets the stage for a potential discussion while also informing the potential hire that we're interested, so that if he happens to like our situation but gets offered another job, he may wait to see what we have to say.
Lots of moving parts with all this.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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