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I like Chip Kelly. I think people are getting it wrong when they think they are going to see the exact offense he is running at Oregon. If they just put a little more thought into it. Don't think about what you're seeing in Eugene, and think more about what you are seeing in New England.
I also think he could adapt his philosophy around a QB instead of trying to jam the QB into the philosophy. I think he could do wonders for Brandon Weeden. Lots of shotgun, perhaps some pistol with a healthy T-Rich. Some fast paced no huddle. Play to the guy's strengths.
Why do we want a coach that has to change his system? I just don't get it. Think about it the otherway around. If you had a desire to run the read option at your college program would you hire Nick Saban? Well he can change his system to fit. He's smart. He'll just adjust what he does to fit the style you want. Makes perfect sense right? No! You hire a guy that has a record running the system you want. Why are we all wanting to hire a guy that has to change what he's ALWAYS done?
Weeden can't run the pistol. He's no threat to run. If Kelly is hired who do you have running his gimmick...er...offense? Tebow, Vick, Dixon, or do want to draft Gino Smith? Cuz all those options suck.
New England has Brady. They can do a lot if stuff because he's Brady. Weeden is no Brady. Kelly isn't a miracle worker. He's a coach. Can't even begin to make the comparison.
Manning runs the pistol in Denver. Not every down, but he uses it, and it works well. I don't think you really need to be a running QB to do it. It makes for a different look for a QB, keeping him in shotgun and giving the running back some options as well.
Weeden is no Brady, that's for sure, but they are both QB's who aren't known for running. That's where I was getting at.
I know you're not a big Chip/Oregon fan, but the guy does know his offense. To be honest, his ideas may actually work better at the NFL level, where the talent is even.
I just don't get why people think he's bringing his zone read option to the NFL. I think if he leaves college, he's going to change the way he runs his teams. He will have to. I don't think what he does at the college level would work.
If Bill Belichick is going to you for insight on offense, you must be doing something right.
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I just don't get why people think he's bringing his zone read option to the NFL. I think if he leaves college, he's going to change the way he runs his teams. He will have to. I don't think what he does at the college level would work.
That's my whole point. I don't want someone that has to change everything he's ever done. I'm tired of being the proving ground.
Yes Bilichek went to him for some insight. I talk to my dentist friend for general health concerns. Doesn't mean I want him working on my hemmorhoids!!
Getting input and fresh ideas is what everyone should be looking to do throughout their lives. Growing. Learning. Don't mean I want him coaching my NFL team.
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The pistol,like the shotgun,is a formation,nothing more.
In fact the lowly Browns have used it this year.
It is ideal in allowing the QB and RB to attack the edge in zone read scheme.Or in the case of the pros,the RB can go left or right without crossing in front of the QB for blitz pickup.
Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
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His QBs aren't asked to do a lot. It's a two read passing option, then the QB tucks and runs. The D knows this and breaks down onto a scrambling threat QB. The QB keeps his eyes up and passes to a now wide open WR. Or he runs for yardage if the DB/LB stays with the WR. Watch Duck games. Watch how often this plays out over the course of a game.
Now, you want to play this style? Who's our QB? What's your plan? Cuz Colt and Weeds can't do it. Gino Smith? Vick? Tebow? Who?
So spacing and route combinations only work with a running QB? And the threat of attacking the LOS? Then why would New England even be interested in approaching him about offensive philosophy? They have one of the slowest QB's in the NFL history.
You're not interested (or intrigued) in Kelly's scheme success in producing some rather prolific running backs? And offensive lineman who proficiently execute blocking schemes? The rushing yards come from the RB's in their system, not from the QB. Their signal callers obviously log some yards but he relies on mobile QB's, not running QB's. While there's no argument that Weeds or McCoy are not that guy, there are certainly some short term fixes that could keep the seat warm.
I don't care how simplified his passing attack is, in its' current state, I just am intrigued by a guy who has the ability to evolve an offense and develop concepts that put a defense in bad spots. If you watch New England, their passing attack isn't exactly Chinese. They run rather basic combination routes, most being quick throws and then run the ball against a thinned out front. It's not the exact same thing but there is a lot of cross over. The system is designed to make reads easier, which isn't exactly a bad thing.
I'd rather have an imaginative offensive mind trying to make things work than trying to hire a coach strictly to fit personnel. The second is a losing formula. You hire the best coach and fill in personnel around him. Cleveland doesn't have a QB that looks like he can be successful in any system, so I'm not sure why that would even be a consideration. The new regime is likely going to want to replace a luke warm rookie QB who is already 29, regardless of the offensive philosophy.
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You're not interested (or intrigued) in Kelly's scheme success in producing some rather prolific running backs? And offensive lineman who proficiently execute blocking schemes? The rushing yards come from the RB's in their system, not from the QB. Their signal callers obviously log some yards but he relies on mobile QB's, not running QB's. While there's no argument that Weeds or McCoy are not that guy, there are certainly some short term fixes that could keep the seat warm.
Name the Ducks prolific RBs that went on to similar success in the NFL...
It's a system that Kelly works extremely well in the perfect place for him to do it. Again I ask why not Rich Rod after what he was doing at West Virginia?
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Name the Ducks prolific RBs that went on to similar success in the NFL...
It's a system that Kelly works extremely well in the perfect place for him to do it. Again I ask why not Rich Rod after what he was doing at West Virginia?
Because their systems are not a similar as you'd like to make them out to be.
RR wasn't having QB's throw for 30 passing TD's. He was / is running his QB's at a much higher rate. Mariota had just 4 games this season where he logged double digit carries and his season high was 15. In 4 of his 12 games he had 5 or fewer carries. On the season, he's under 100.
White carried the ball nearly 700 times in his college career under RR. Denard Robinson carried it 375 in two seasons under him. It is just not the same offense. White's biggest passing year under Rodriquez was 1,800 yards and it came as a senior. He averaged 14 passing TD's during his 4 years and only posted more than 15 once, as a senior. Robinson's highest yardage total under him was 2,173 but it came with 15 INT's. Kelly's Qb's are throwing it more and at a much more efficient rate.
I think the NFL production comment is a little premature. Kelly has been there for 5 seasons. LaMichael James was a 3 year player, so that kind of limits the number of opportunities for his guys.
Even so, he did coach Jonathan Stewart...who has 3,836 yards, 4.7 YPC and 27 TD's in 5 timeshare seasons. In 2009 he ran for 1,100 yards on a hair over 200 carries. The jury is still out on Blount and especially James. James is behind an all pro RB, so I'm not sure what you can draw from him not making a huge impact yet.
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1. Lovie Smith
1a. Kyle Shanahan
3. Mike McCoy
4. Jack Del Rio
Give me them.
I second Kyle Shanahan. If not him then I would like to bring back Bruce Arians. And for a third choice I'd go with Chip Kelley, at least the games would be fun/exciting.
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I want a coach who is creative and calls plays to suit his players.
And makes up new stuff change the game!!
Joe Thomas #73
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The guy I think we may end up with is Bill O'Brien. I think the situations seem to match. We need a coach, I think Bill O'Brien needs to get out of Penn State after the harsh penalties were handed down. There was a report out this week that said O'Brien was under the assumption that they wouldn't get hit/get hit hard.
He needs the Browns as much as the Browns need him. They could plug him in, while still keeping power. I also think the guy can coach. He's not my first choice, but he's the guy I think ends up with the job and I'm OK with that.
1. Chip Kelly has never been an NFL coach in any capacity. To walk in here with roster control and picking his own GM could be an absolute train wreck.
2. If O'Brien walks away from Penn State after 1 season, I would not want him. That would just seem sleazy.
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What is sleezy about it? He was hired with the impression that there would be no major NCAA sanctions apparently. That was not the case so thusly circumstances change. He had no part of said sanctions. So where does the sleezy come in? Seems perfectly natural to want out after being lied to in interviews.
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I like most of the prospects everyone on here has mentioned. Question is....who wants to ruin their career in Cleveland?  Seriously, though, it doesn't much matter who is on our list. The problem is probably going to be trying to find someone to commit to our club and team considering the on going train wreck we've been for 13 seasons. I hope that Haslam has a better mind for football then our previous owner and all of the other owners in the league. I hope he brings in a solid man at the GM position. And I hope we can get back into the playoffs or (God forbid I should say this) put a Lombardi Trophy in our case in Cleveland.
Never have hope. You won’t be disappointed.
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Agreed. Bill has every right to leave that train wreck of a program. He was neither aware PSU was about to get nuked by the NCAA nor was he responsible for the lack of institutional control that lead to the nuking. IMO the smart career move is to leave while he's still a hot name.....three years from now when they are losing to the Hoosiers he might not be getting these type of looks. Besides, he's the guy I want. 
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Bring back Bruce Arians and then also bring in Marinelli as defensive coordinator. (assuming that he is let go along with Smith in Chicago)
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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A serious question:
Didn't everyone hate Arians when he was the offensive coordinator in Cleveland?
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Everyone always hates the OC ....... everywhere.
They're always idiots when your team isn't scoring enough points ..... or when they run a play that doesn't work.
Arians, like most Browns coaches, had nothing to work with at the QB spot. He would now.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Didn't everyone hate Arians when he was the offensive coordinator in Cleveland?
I'd put him on a list with the following as far as hatred around here:
Carmen Policy
Dwight Clark
Butch Davis
Eric Mangini
Mo Carthon
He WAS below Modell!
I for one couldn't wait to see him go. I will say, he seemed to improve in Pittsburgh and has done nice things in Indy. I'm not sure I want him here though.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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Arians was in Cleveland from 2001 to 2003. He had Couch during that time. I would say Couch at that point and Weeden now are very similar (only couch was 6 years younger).
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J/c
The Browns need to avoid the rookie coaches, like the plague. How many rooks have we had since 99? Whatever the number, it's way too many. I want someone with a history of building teams and getting them to the SB. Don't think he's interested, but my finger is pointed at you, Bill Cowher.
I'm so done with being the trial ground for new coaches to cut their teeth. It's been nothing but a failure here.
![[Linked Image from i75.photobucket.com]](http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i302/lrhinkle/d5eaf0b9-e429-4211-b53f-b843bfcf6aa9_zps2ac17420.jpg) #gmstrong
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you have to remember they (banner & haslam) are thinking long term though..
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Four out of the five have been first year head coaches.......the exception being Mangini
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Personally I don't want another Rookie head coach. Especially with that much control.
I would love a proven winner who has had experience in the NFL. I have a very short list. I'm tired of losing and want someone to change the culture around here. Hell, bring Marty back if that would do it. /sarcasm.
KeysDawg
The fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. - Carl Sagan
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Don't think he's interested, but my finger is pointed at you, Bill Cowher.
I wouldn't totally rule him out. Here is why. The past couple months Cowher has been quite effusive pouring praise on the Browns. And somewhere in the Haslam and Banner press conference today one of them says something along the lines of "bring him back" when referring to the HC search (sorry I can't finr the exact quote, I can't get the transcript to load). So who would fit that statement? Who out there would be coming back to the Browns? Cowher, Saban, Arians. Anybody else? I guess you could count Josh McDanials. Not coming back to the Browns but coming back to Cleveland. Would Chud be a candidate? Anyone else?
Am I perfect? No
Am I trying to be a better person?
Also no
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Damn, those comments under the McDaniels article are hilariously brutal.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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http://www.rotoworld.com/playernews/nfl/footballBrowns Offense - TM - Browns The Sideline View's Adam Caplan reports that Oregon head coach Chip Kelly is the Browns' "clear No. 1 choice" for the team's head-coaching vacancy. Browns owner Jimmy Haslam is ready to spend big and is willing to give the next head coach "final say" over player personnel decisions. That is exactly what Kelly has reportedly been seeking if he makes the jump from the college ranks to the NFL. This would seem to be bad news for Brandon Weeden's future in Cleveland as he doesn't seem to fit Kelly's mold for an athletic quarterback. The Browns roster is also viewed as one of the best - if not the best - among the teams with vacancies at the top.
Last edited by Referee 3; 01/03/13 09:58 AM.
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The "source" for both stories you linked seem to be Adam Caplan.
To give Kelly total control of the roster and first time HC in the NFL???? My God . . .
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Chip Kelly makes me really nervous. We'd need a new QB, and Richardson isn't really a fit for the offense either (he'd have to fit, given where he was picked, but his talents would be underutilized).
It's a big jump to NFL HC (with GM responsibilities) -- brings back memories of Butch Davis.
Last edited by Lyuokdea; 12/31/12 10:26 PM.
~Lyuokdea
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http://www.rotoworld.com/playernews/nfl/football
Browns Offense - TM - Browns
The Sideline View's Adam Caplan reports that Oregon head coach Chip Kelly is the Browns' "clear No. 1 choice" for the team's head-coaching vacancy.
Browns owner Jimmy Haslam is ready to spend big and is willing to give the next head coach "final say" over player personnel decisions. That is exactly what Kelly has reportedly been seeking if he makes the jump from the college ranks to the NFL. This would seem to be bad news for Brandon Weeden's future in Cleveland as he doesn't seem to fit Kelly's mold for an athletic quarterback. The Browns roster is also viewed as one of the best - if not the best - among the teams with vacancies at the top.
Last edited by Referee 3; 01/03/13 09:59 AM.
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Allowing that type of "power" to the head coach tells me that we are going to go after a high profile name coach. I'm not saying Chip Kelly is a high profile name coach, but he definitely has some momentum building for what he has done at Oregon.
IIRC, didn't Belichick seek out Kelly during this past off-season for advice???? I'm not 100% sure if that was this year or last.....or why Belichick did this, but like him or not, Belichick has done a hell of a job in New England over the past decade.
Also, coincidence or not, if Kelly is the hire, I would love for him to follow in the same footsteps of Harbaugh or Carroll, both of those coaches came from the Pac-10 and are now experiencing success in the NFL...
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Hiring Kelly would go completely against all they are looking for. Time to go five million steps back, tear apart a budding offense (that only needed a QB and a lineman or two....), and switch to some offensive system that won't work in the NFL.
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Hiring Kelly would go completely against all they are looking for. Time to go five million steps back, tear apart a budding offense (that only needed a QB and a lineman or two....), and switch to some offensive system that won't work in the NFL.
Rocket"Optimist"
Joe Thomas #73
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Hiring Kelly would go completely against all they are looking for. Time to go five million steps back, tear apart a budding offense (that only needed a QB and a lineman or two....), and switch to some offensive system that won't work in the NFL.
Actually, that's quite true.
In addition ...... what has Kelly really done?
Here is his career:
1990 Columbia (DB/ST)
1991 Columbia (OLB/SS)
1992 New Hampshire (RB)
1993 John's Hopkins (DC)
1994–1996 New Hampshire (RB)
1997–1998 New Hampshire (OL)
1999–2006 New Hampshire (OC)
2007–2008 Oregon (OC)
2009–present Oregon
There's not a lot of high power assignments in there. He's had a very strong run at Oregon ..... but he had never even been a position coach in the NFL. That is a huge concern for me. He doesn't have a traditional foundation. I look at his resume, and it would be impressive for a medical student, but for a head football coach .. maybe not so much.
I strongly prefer a guy who has shown ability to lead an NFL team or unit. I really want a guy who has shown that he can handle the pressure of the NFL game. Kelly has never had anything to do with the NFL except when he has had a ticket.
I much prefer a guy like Arians. He led his team under some of the toughest of circumstances. He had to step in for a sick head coach and lead a team with a rookie QB. His team was 1-2 when he took over. He turned it into a 10-5 team, that wound up 11-5 on the year. Arians truly should be coach of the year.
I think about teaming Arians with a DC like Marinelli out of Chicago, and it just makes me smile from ear to ear. We would have an attacking offense, and an attacking defense. I just hope that Haslam and Banner can make something like this happen.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Also from the college ranks...Ive read Doug Marrone is going to interview here...
Cuse head coach...im in. Former OC in NO. Has NFL and head coaching experience...was an SU player and went back...im in on this guy. Seems to have the right mentality for us. Would be a great Cleveland fit.
"It has to start somewhere
It has to start somehow
What better place than here?
What better time than now?"
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I figure this fits here as well as anywhere ....... With Jimmy Haslam and Joe Banner in charge, this Cleveland Browns purge has a promising vibe - Bud Shaw | cleveland.com http://www.cleveland.com/budshaw/index.s...t_river_defaultBEREA, Ohio - One reason to embrace what Jimmy Haslam and Joe Banner have in mind is they've had it in mind for some time. Don't be fooled by the claim they reached a decision on Pat Shurmur and Tom Heckert in the last two weeks. The "succession planning" they admitted to was not merely a just-in-case insurance policy. Their hire-the-coach-first thinking is a plan, not an impulse. Any attempt to connect Randy Lerner's succession "strategy" after firing Romeo Crennel and Phil Savage to what Banner and Haslam see as smart organization building ignores the depth of Lerner's Eric Mangini fixation. It also ignores two other major differences: Banner and Haslam. Haslam is a dynamic owner looking for a dynamic head coach. Lerner was always looking for a fix, something to get people off his back, anything to loosen the knot in his stomach. Those searches were built on flimsy ground. The implosion of the coach-as-king approach starring Butch Davis blew Lerner in the direction of shared power. Lerner plucked from the garden of Bill Belichick here (Crennel and Mangini), borrowed from other successful organizations there (Savage and Kokinis from Baltimore), then hoped for the best. Banner and Haslam know where they want to go. Their direction is well considered. They're talking about identifying the traits of head-coaching success. They're looking for greatness if possible, not small degrees of separation from it. These are two professional businessmen trying to find the same complement between coach and GM/personnel department that they already found in each other. Banner's business is football. That's much different than Mike Holmgren's business being football coaching. It was refreshing to hear Banner address whether his organizational plan by nature will limit the candidate pool for Heckert's replacement. "Yes," he said. So why do it? Because, Banner said, he feels it's more important not to limit the head coaching search by doing the reverse -- bringing in a GM and giving him powers that might give pause to HC candidates. Is he protecting his own power base? We'll see. Lerner could've used a strong GM to vet head coaching candidates. Banner and Haslam are already the chief vetters in Berea, with Haslam clearly leaning on Banner's league experience. If their execution is as sound as their approach, it will certainly be new and different. It might even produce a head coach to rally around instead of the media and fan base groundswells we've seen for Heckert and Phil Savage based primarily on them bringing improved talent evaluation to town. Banner and Haslam didn't see a dynamic leader in Shurmur. No surprise there. Shurmur wasn't built that way. They didn't see a guru in Heckert either. They saw, in Banner's words, evidence of a "foundation" with a "long way to go." Heckert did fine. He also had three drafts to do it in during a transition that guaranteed starting spots for many of his selections. If the message Banner and Haslam sent in the firing of the Browns head coach and GM is that "progress" and "battling" are not enough, it's refreshing. If their part in Black Monday was only about their belief they can speed the ascent of a championship organization, that's good enough. "You are looking at two of the most impatient people in the world up here," Haslam said at one point. For too long, whatever the rung is above "terrible" has been accepted as a significant step around here. That's no longer the case. While it's too early to applaud that change, it's not too early to say there's something more promising about the latest of these regularly scheduled beheadings in Berea.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Posts: 2,030
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,030 |
On top of that anytime he has played one of the big schools with a solid D (tOSU, Auburn, LSU, etc.) his offense has got its collective ass handed to it. As much as I love the Buckeyes, if a college team can stop that nonsense I guarantee you that NFL teams will kill it.
The Offense is predicated on running a ton of plays in a no huddle fashion so the other teams can utilize depth. This will not work in the NFL with elite athletes (not to mention the number of TV timeouts), and quite frankly hasn't worked in the NFL since the Kelly Bills of the early 90's.
He is by far the worst candidate not named Josh McDaniels I have heard. Hopefully this is just nonsensical bull crap like the Josh stuff turned out to be.
Against logic,the most effective armor is willful ignorance.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,882
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,882 |
^^^^
This!!!
Thank you! Another voice of reason.
Please people don't drink the Kelly Koolaide.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 12,065 |
Quote:
^^^^
This!!!
Thank you! Another voice of reason.
Please people don't drink the Kelly Koolaide.
What koolaide?
I have ZERO input on who the next Browns HC will be.
I have people that I think would do well. But I could also be wrong.
What it comes down to, is that whomever they hire, I will support 100%, because based on their own words, that person is going to be here for a lengthy time.
It just seems like some people (not specifically you) would prefer the new HC to fail (aka the Browns to continue to suck) if its not a HC that the poster likes.
I get what your saying. But just because you don't think it'll work, doesn't mean it won't. And I'm not saying it will, cause that wouldn't mean it would.
My overall point is that being 100% one way on any subject only leads you to probably being upset for some reason.
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,802 |
Noted: Arians is your new coaching man-crush. I get that he did a splendid job filling in for Sparano in Indy, but A.) Who else is going to be beating down his door? and B.) He's 60 years old- going against the new brass' idea of an energetic, strong leader who will be around for the long haul. How does he fit?
I'd be okay with him- don't get me wrong- but why build up that excitement over the guy considering how unlikely he seems?
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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