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They're saying putting a dome on CBS is ganna cost like 200 mill anyways.
Take that 200 mil (its Jimmy's btw) and double it and you can have a NICE stadium with a retractable dome in a better location.
The stadium in Arizona was almost $600 million, the Colts stadium was almost $800 million... getting to $400 million isn't going to get you a stadium that can compete with those...
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A new stadium worth making the effort for is going to cost half a bil, minimum.
Yeah definitely, CBS cost 395 million ----Lucas Oil Stadium was 777. (wikipedia)
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A new stadium worth making the effort for is going to cost half a bil, minimum.
Yeah definitely, CBS cost 395 million ----Lucas Oil Stadium was 777. (wikipedia)
Theirs came later, but even taking inflation in to account, ours is a bare bones stadium.
(Wait, maybe it didn't)
Now we fast forward almost 20 years... that property on the lakefront is now desired for various development.
Haslam is a forward thinker. My guess is he will pull in several other big hitters to help drive the deal and the Browns will be in new digs somewhere outside of downtown in a domed stadium inside of 10 years.
Heck.....hitters bigger than Haslam may be driving the deal....they want to location.
Face it folks. A open air football stadium in Cleveland is dumb.
Many years ago when I was a kid, Westgate, and Great Northern were open air shopping centers. You had a covered walkway on each side, but in between was landscaping, and by covered walkway, I am talking about covered, not enclosed. It was outdoors between stores.
We are now at the same point with stadiums as were shopping plaza's 55 years ago....if it's outdoors, it's sub-par.
Sub-par only works in golf.
Last edited by Ballpeen; 01/15/13 08:10 PM.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I always rather liked the fact that the stadium was named after the team itself. It was unique in all the league. To me, it was very cool.
Corporate logos are everywhere in daily life. The mute and fast-forward buttons on my remote controllers wear out faster than any other, because I hate most commercials. I'm being sold something from moments after I rise in the morning until I lay my head down at night.
And now, I'm being asked to associate Paul Brown's creation with a corporate sponsor? I'll never call it by its new name. SF fans still call their home Candlestick or "The Stick." I'll do the same here in Ohio.
It can never be Muni, but it will be CBS until they tear it down.
Sometimes, money isn't everything.
.02
Clem
"too many notes, not enough music-"
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Clem, I know your feelings. It's not like they took the Browns name out of it...
I'm actually excited about some new nick names... I mean really, Cleveland Browns Stadium was about as exciting as standing in line to use a port o pot...
some mentioned ...
The Grid ... that sounds bad ass !. we are tail gating outside the "Grid"
I even saw, Browns Energy Stadium....
Jmo...there's some cool, new fun stuff ahead... and I'm going to be apart of it...because the past is done,and it wasn't much fun..
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Peen I agree with everything you said except the location. In my opinion that will be the biggest sticking point in getting anything done.. the City would fight violently against moving the stadium into the suburbs... as they probably should.
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Peen I agree with everything you said except the location. In my opinion that will be the biggest sticking point in getting anything done.. the City would fight violently against moving the stadium into the suburbs... as they probably should.
Don't need to move it to the Suburbs. There are some places around downtown they can put it. Obviously they would need to acquire the land but its the best solution if they want a Dome stadium.
That way the Browns can play at "first energy stadium" while the other stadium is being built. The Sin Tax is up in 2015. Heck put a $.03 tax on pop, that will probably pay for it in a year. 
In the long run if they can get a Wrestlemainia, a Superbowl and/or a Final Four it will be worth it.
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Don't need to move it to the Suburbs. There are some places around downtown they can put it.
Peen had specifically said "move it out of downtown".. that is what I was addressing...
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I was agreeing with you and giving an example of where to move it in the city.
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Don't need to move it to the Suburbs. There are some places around downtown they can put it.
Peen had specifically said "move it out of downtown".. that is what I was addressing...
I understand. But it doesn't have to move out of Cleveland proper to be outside of downtown.
I admit I probably was thinking further outside of town but wasn't really thinking of any place in mind and not thinking about what the city might want.
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We are now at the same point with stadiums as were shopping plaza's 55 years ago....if it's outdoors, it's sub-par.
Then it probably would come as a surprise to you that two of the most popular and high-end shopping centers in the greater Cleveland area are open-air.
But I digress.
I don't care either way about a dome on the stadium. I have no problem at all sitting in the cold for a few hours to watch a game.
I will say that I don't think that there's any way we get a new stadium though. Jimmy doesn't have the money and there's no way the city is going to fund another stadium for a team that's won about 50 games in the past decade.
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I do understand that retro works.
I know Crocker Park is open air.....I don't know if that is one of the top plaza's you had in mind, but it get's lot's of traffic.
All is cool, but you do get to enter a store that offers heat.
In the end, I still say a outdoor stadium you can use for 10 football games....I say 10 since I have to pay for the meaningless exhibition games, is a dumb move.
Build a facility you can use 12 months of the year for varied events.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I always rather liked the fact that the stadium was named after the team itself. It was unique in all the league. To me, it was very cool.
Corporate logos are everywhere in daily life. The mute and fast-forward buttons on my remote controllers wear out faster than any other, because I hate most commercials. I'm being sold something from moments after I rise in the morning until I lay my head down at night.
And now, I'm being asked to associate Paul Brown's creation with a corporate sponsor? I'll never call it by its new name. SF fans still call their home Candlestick or "The Stick." I'll do the same here in Ohio.
It can never be Muni, but it will be CBS until they tear it down.
Sometimes, money isn't everything.
.02
Clem
This! I couldn't have said it better.
Let's face it, if Haslam is going to bring us a winner, he doesn't have to re-name the stadium in order to do that and most of the success would be predicated on the talent Heckert drafted anyway.
But in his first presser where he said "marketing is everything", I expected wholesale changes and yes, this was one of them.
There will be a lot more to come. I just think it's kind of funny how so many are willing to give a man card blanche' who hasn't proven anything yet.
Show me you can actually accomplish something first, then I may be more open to change. But to begin changing everything without any evidence you can or will succeed and let's just say I'm a little more than somewhat skeptical.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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In the end, I still say a outdoor stadium you can use for 10 football games....I say 10 since I have to pay for the meaningless exhibition games, is a dumb move.
Build a facility you can use 12 months of the year for varied events.
I get what you're saying about the "12 month a year", but you have late spring to early fall that the current stadium can be used for any event as it stands now.
I do belive your indication of "ten football games a year" is somewhat of a gross understatement of how the stadium is currently used as it has the ability to be used for outdoor venues for much of the year currently.
But I'm not opposed to a dome.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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you have late spring to early fall that the current stadium can be used for any event as it stands now.
That for some reason made me think of the World Series of Rock ! 
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I just think people here are having a blindness problem. Blind faith.
Like the new uniforms.......
Oh yes! Let's break out our wallets and buy all new Browns gear and support the new change when the ownership has proven absolutly ZERO in terms of winning or success!
I'm a "show me" guy. Show me you can actually do something positive on the football side of things and then let's talk about changing other things.
It seems they are about marketing first and winning later. If people wish to buy into that, they can have at it. Only this time, it may cost them one helluva lot more out of their wallet to find out if these guys can do anything.
At least with past regimes, you didn't have to buy all new gear and pay higher ticket prices for a dome just to be diappointed. Sorry if I'm more in a "wait and see" mode about all of this.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Akron-based FirstEnergy Corp.’s stadium naming rights deal with the Browns is worth $6 million a year, sources told the Beacon Journal this afternoon.
The sources spoke on condition of anonymity because FirstEnergy and the Browns agreed the terms of the deal would remain private.
Chuck Jones, president of FirstEnergy Utilities, acknowledged in an interview Wednesday with the Beacon Journal that the contract is for 17 years and lasts for the remainder of the lease the Browns have with the city of Cleveland, which owns the stadium.
So the contract that changed the name of Cleveland Browns Stadium to FirstEnergy Stadium: Home of the Cleveland Browns is a 17-year, $102 million deal.
FirstEnergy Corp.’s headquarters are in Akron. It’s the parent company of FirstEnergy Utilities, which operates the regulated electricity distribution units of Ohio Edison, Cleveland Illuminating Co. and Toledo Edison, and of FirstEnergy Solutions, which offers electricity contracts.
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I'm sure the 142 folks who were laid-off a couple months before Christmas are happy to see that their former employer has, apparently, rebounded from the recessionary pressures that cost them their jobs. 
[color:"white"]"Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
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I'm sure the 142 folks who were laid-off a couple months before Christmas are happy to see that their former employer has, apparently, rebounded from the recessionary pressures that cost them their jobs.
i don't personally think that naming rights to stadiums is a good usage of marketing money, but obviously alot of companies disagree with me.
however, the company cannot just stop advertising because they happened to have layoffs. they are still responsible for every single person working there and need to do what they need to do to keep the company going.
if they feel this naming rights deal will help the company and therefore the employees that work for it have stable jobs, then they have to do it, no?
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I'm sure the 142 folks who were laid-off a couple months before Christmas are happy to see that their former employer has, apparently, rebounded from the recessionary pressures that cost them their jobs.
i don't personally think that naming rights to stadiums is a good usage of marketing money, but obviously alot of companies disagree with me.
however, the company cannot just stop advertising because they happened to have layoffs. they are still responsible for every single person working there and need to do what they need to do to keep the company going.
if they feel this naming rights deal will help the company and therefore the employees that work for it have stable jobs, then they have to do it, no?
Totally agree with what you said, however, how does a company like First Energy benefit from buying these rights? What exactly is the gain when they are kind of the only thing in town. It's not like people really have a choice, right?
I honestly thought we'd get a bigger name to come in. I figured Progressive didn't want to spend even more money on naming rights, and maybe just a huge out of town name would want the rights. I know it's the Browns but it's still the NFL.
I'm no business/marketing expert, so I don't know how First Energy benefits other than getting to brag about it.
I honestly don't care though. I figured it would happen anyway. It's a pretty easy trade if you ask me. Owner who seems very committed to winning, versus giving up having a non corporate type name for your stadium.
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Conspiracy theory: 142 workers. If they average 42k a year... Makes 6 mil! 
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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At least with past regimes, you didn't have to buy all new gear and pay higher ticket prices for a dome just to be diappointed
Uh. I'm pretty sure every regime has brought on new players for people to buy gear for.
Some of them brought Orange jerseys, Some brought back Brownie the Elf, whatever they could throw brown and orange on for people to buy.
Browns fans are going to buy Browns gear regardless, and if this is what the team is going to wear going forward? Then what's wrong with it?
Just because someone will have a brand new Richardson jersey in 2014, doesnt make them MORE of a fan than someone who is wearing the 2013 version, or if they are wearing a 2007 Winslow jersey... Or even a 2005 Droughns jersey!  (Seriously, someone needs to rock 34 again)
And it doesn't make you any better just because you "waited" to see if the team won...
Am I the only one that pronounces hyperbole "Hyper-bowl" instead of "hy-per-bo-le"?
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It seems they are about marketing first and winning later.
What steps, other than changing coaches and GMs like we did, have any other teams made since last October to win? Other than hiring a coach and a GM, there really isn't anything they could do or for us to talk about...
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I'm a "show me" guy. Show me you can actually do something positive on the football side of things and then let's talk about changing other things.
That's like saying an overweight person shouldn't buy new clothes until they lose weight.... the two have nothing to do with each other... it's his business. If a guy buys a restaurant, he's going to put his own flare into the menu... I especially love the "then we'll talk" part... Like he's got your number on speed dial. 
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Sorry if I'm more in a "wait and see" mode about all of this.
You seem to be in more of a "wait and whine" mode... They fired the coach and the GM.. by most peoples opinion, the new hires so far have been pretty solid... those are the only decisions they have made but you have used every article written about them to complain about what they are doing wrong... If you are really in a "wait and see" mode, then stop complaining about everything they do until you SEE SOMETHING.
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I get what you are saying, but any way you cut it the outdoor stadium is useless 4-5 months a year. Even ALL year for that matter.
No matter the time of year, you want to know the planned event is going to be able to be held......be it rain or cold with snow.
Who is going to schedule a convention in July where the delegates might get rained on?
These things are scheduled years in advanced, not a week before.
Time for Cleveland to be a player on a national scale.
'
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Who is going to schedule a convention in July where the delegates might get rained on?
Those conventions are serious moneymakers too.
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I don't particularly like it, but again, I didn't put up a Billion dollars to buy the team So he has every right to and a responsibility to get as strong an ROI as he can. With this deal, he just paid for 10% of the team initial costs.
So let's see what we have so far,
New Owner
New CEO
New President
New GM/Dir of Player personnel search continuing
New HC
New OC
Some new Offensive Coaches
Retained at least 2 current coachs
Changed the name of the stadium
Talk of changing the Uniforms next season
More coaching changes coming, most likely on the D side of the ball
I'll tell you what, say what you will about the choices made, but you can't say that Haslam sits on his hands and does nothing. That man has been busy. not to mention he bought and moved into a house here in Cleveland as well.
Yup, that's one busy guy.
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Who is going to schedule a convention in July where the delegates might get rained on?
These things are scheduled years in advanced, not a week before.
Time for Cleveland to be a player on a national scale.
The big DNC functions this past year were scheduled for the Panthers stadium, due to weather they had to be yanked back inside to a much smaller facility and many many people could not attend the President officially accepting the nomination, a ton of money had to be refunded, people were ticked off because they had traveled to Charlotte.. It was costly and embarrassing... So if you can't trust the weather in Charlotte, NC in September, can you trust the weather in Cleveland?
yebat' Putin
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Who is going to schedule a convention in July where the delegates might get rained on?
These things are scheduled years in advanced, not a week before.
Time for Cleveland to be a player on a national scale.
The big DNC functions this past year were scheduled for the Panthers stadium, due to weather they had to be yanked back inside to a much smaller facility and many many people could not attend the President officially accepting the nomination, a ton of money had to be refunded, people were ticked off because they had traveled to Charlotte.. It was costly and embarrassing... So if you can't trust the weather in Charlotte, NC in September, can you trust the weather in Cleveland?
Who would have thought that NJ was ever a target for something like Superstorm Sandy or for that matter, lower Manhattan either.
Your point is well made,, you can't rely on the weather.
So you take a domed (enclosed facility) then you can at least say the chances are way better that you won't have a weather issue to contend with.
I've never been in favor of domes but I see the value. From a financial perspective, they make sense.
And if you do it right, you can mantain the natural grass field.
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Even if you can't maintain the natural grass field, synthetic fields have come a long way in the last 40 years from carpet on concrete..
I remember some events/games at the old Houston Astrodome being cancelled but that was because of regional flooding and if that happens, playing the game or holding the event becomes secondary any way.
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Pretty simple DC, some put marketing first and winning later I guess. I think it would be much better to win first and then address the marketing part. So far, we have seen nothing on the field one way or the other to base anything on. It would be nice if they had decided to show us what type of product they were going to put on the field first before going all crazy with the marketing concepts first. So if you're not looking for some accountability on the field first, that's fine. But trying to devalue someone's opinion that does want to see what they can actually do with "the product on the field first" doesn't really make any sense. If you haven't had your fill of empty promises yet, more power to you. New uniforms and a corporate sponsor has nothing to do with winning football games. For some reason I would like to see that as priority one, not the marketing before the results on the field. Sorry if you find that too unrealistic. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I really have no issue with the dome idea. I was simply pointing out that outdoor events such as concerts and other things can be done there that would acceed "10 games a year" as it seemed you were descibing it in your above post. A dome would be an advantage to openning up the stadium to year around events and make it a better environment for a verticle type passing O I would think. So I'm not really against the idea at all. I did however think your "10 football games a year" was a bit of a stretch though.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I think it would be much better to win first and then address the marketing part.
People act like there's one person that works for the Browns or something. You can do all these things simultaneously. The Browns employ hundreds (thousands?) of people and all of them have different jobs. It's not just Haslam going around checking off things like it's housework that needs to be done by one person on the weekend.
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How could Haslam have made the team better this year and this offseason so far, so as to put a winning product on the field?
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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I find it funny that a fan base that has so loudly exclaimed "win first" is now so openly accepting of "marketing first/win later".
Hey, but to each their own.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Pit - what "changes on the field" did you expect to see this past season?
You don't like the "marketing" aspect of what they are doing now......but, how can they "win first, then change" when they haven't had time to make changes on the field? Or, did you want everything to stay the same until they win?
How was Haslam supposed to change the "on the field" product in the short time he's owned the team?
New uni's and a corporate sponsor have nothing to do with winning. They also have nothing to do with losing.
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How could Haslam have made the team better this year and this offseason so far, so as to put a winning product on the field?
Why the sudden need for uniform changes and worrying about "the fan experience"?
Would that be something that must be done now, or could you actually show the fans a product on the field this coming year and then worry about the marketing side?
To me it would resemble running commercials for a car you haven't even began developing yet. I would think people would want to see the car and see how it performs before you go advertising it.
From 1999 until now we have seen nothing to be excited about. Yet so many always simply buy into things. So I guess none of this surprises me.
I remember posting how all of this would most likely occur and I took flack for that too. Now that it is happening, people wish to justify it. But that doesn't really surprise me at all.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,831
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
I find it funny that a fan base that has so loudly exclaimed "win first" is now so openly accepting of "marketing first/win later".
Hey, but to each their own.
Because that's what I said. 
Which part of "You can do all these things simultaneously" are you not comprehending? You keep framing it as we can either focus on marketing or we can focus on winning which makes absolutely no sense. You can do all these things at the same time. How can you improve the team in January? Draft is months away, as is Free Agency. And I would argue we've done the improvements possible: new coaching staff, front office, etc.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,246 |
I guess I just kind of see it as they're doing things now that they can do now, and hopefully they'll address the product on the field when they can address the product on the field.
The whole marketing side of the Browns doesn't matter one iota to me. What matters is the play of the team.
If they want to sell the rights to the stadium because there's nothing they can do right now about the players, then go right ahead. I don't care about that.
And, frankly, even when free agency hits and the draft, so long as the football people are concentrating on football, I don't care what the marketing team comes up with.
JMHO
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Joined: Jan 2007
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I am glad to have an owner that is doing stuff, and trying to renew the team. Maybe some of these changes will help break the losing attitude and mentality. Maybe a dome and nicer uni's will help attract players. Maybe nice facility's will boost some player's egos...
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,999 Likes: 369
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 49,999 Likes: 369 |
Haslam said that he wanted to make the fan experience better from the moment he bought the team. It wasn't something thrown in at the last second.
I don't see why the team can't work on more than one thing at a time. The team has departments handling football, and handling stadium matters ... uniforms ...... and so on. Why should it be assumed that they can only do one thing at a time?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Cleveland Browns Stadium could be
changed to First Energy Field
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