|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
Here is some Gasoline for the Fire... *Cough* Cough to those that passed this news off as petty rumor...  CLEVELAND -- The Cleveland Browns seem to be beating the bushes for a veteran quarterback, after all. Jed Jacobsohn/Getty Images The Browns are looking to add a proven veteran to their stable of young signal callers. General manager Phil Savage confirmed Thursday night that that he contacted Kansas City GM Carl Peterson about Trent Green, a two-time Pro Bowl quarterback, during this week's NFL meetings in Phoenix. "I spoke to a number of teams/GMs about players/picks including KC," Savage said in an e-mail. "Bottom line, due diligence on a player who might be able to help us -- nothing imminent or on the table." Savage reiterated that he "did the same thing" with other teams. However, the fact that he would even approach another team about a proven QB is an interesting development for the Browns, who own the No. 3 overall pick in next month's draft. Savage had said previously that the team would be willing to go into training camp next summer without a veteran and allow Charlie Frye and Derek Anderson to compete for the starting job. There's also the possibility the Browns could wind up taking either LSU's JaMarcus Russell or Notre Dame's Brady Quinn if things fell into place in the first round. On Wednesday, Peterson told The Kansas City Star that Savage approached him at the conclusion of the meetings about Green, whom the Chiefs are looking to trade if they can't restructure his contract. "We agreed to talk some more later this week or the first of next week," Peterson told the newspaper. "He said he wants to talk some more with his head coach and his offensive coordinator. "But he did ask whether this thing was over with. I said, 'No, not at all.' Cleveland would make sense to me because Trent played very well against them last year." Green, who last season missed eight games after sustaining a severe concussion on a hard hit in the season opener, threw a season-high four touchdown passes in a loss at Cleveland on Dec. 3. Miami and Detroit are also reportedly interested in Green, who is signed through 2009. He is slated to make $7.2 million next season, and $7.7 million and $9.2 million in the final two years of his contract. Green struggled after returning from his concussion, throwing seven touchdowns and nine interceptions as Kansas City went 2-3 in its final five games. Green's 74.1 passer rating was his lowest since 2001 -- his first year with the Chiefs. Damon Huard, who filled in when Green was sidelined last season, recently signed a three-year deal with the Chiefs. Kansas City also has Brodie Croyle, last year's third-round draft pick. Copyright 2007 by The Associated Press Linky
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 435
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 435 |
I have a feeling hes gonna end up a Brown. If the Chiefs arent expecting much, which I doubt they are. We have room for his contract, and could negotiate it down.
Id feel alot better with Green/Frye/Anderson...than Frye/Anderson/Dorsey.
JMHO
"I don't remember any of my catches. I remember the drops." - Kellen Winslow II
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Saw it a few minutes ago 'Style. More of the same, but the confirmation from Savage is important.
What we know is that no team is going to pay him 7 million. We know that Miami is his #1 choice. We know that it's going to probably take a 4th or 5th rounder to land him with a different contract.
Now to the speculation part. The Chiefs are saying they'd welcome a competition with him and Huard. I say [censored]. If they don't work out a trade on draft day.........which is what they are angling for...........I'd look for him to be cut directly afterwards, at which point he'll sign a deal with the Fish. Considering where they are picking, Green would have to be packaged with other picks to move up, as he doesn't have 1st day pick trade value.
IMHO our only hope is to work out a trade before he's cut.
I won't go into the ramifications for Frye. We all can read the writing on the wall.
This will be very interesting to see how this plays out. Frankly, I'd be shocked if the Raiders and Lions don't start making a ton of noise, as taking Green gives each team a ton of freedom on draft day.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,165
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,165 |
Quote:
as taking Green gives each team a ton of freedom on draft day.
That's a very critical point of all this, the ability to "pass" on someone in the draft. Here's what I've decided is going on in Phil's mind and our FO (and yes, of course it's just speculation on my part but it's what I'm taking from a combination of all the comments and actions):
1) Savage has decided that Charlie lacks the arm strength to be great in Cleveland
2) If Super-Arm Russell is on the board at #3 we will take him without hesitation
3) Our FO has doubts about Quinn, I don't understand what those are but I get the impression that we don't feel there are two top notch QB's, just Russell
4) The GM's with interest in C Johnson don't believe Cleveland can draft him at #3 unless they get better at QB before the draft. By signing Green, Phil positions so that other GM's have to consider that we might draft CJ if he's still on the board.
5) If Russell and CJ are gone at #3 Phil is willing to trade down even with Thomas on the board. I suspect he likes Peterson or a defensive player at #4 - #8 or so.
And the lastly a more delusional take to suit my goals: Phil is talking about Green to convince Carr that the job here could go away if he doesn't come to Phil and beg for it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Quote:
I do have to say that it would be interesting picking up a FA QB with blatantly grey hair.
Yeah.....Who's 37 and got knocked out so bad he missesd half of last season.
Behind OUR OL??????
If he comes here? Firstly I'll believe Trent has a death wish. Secondly,I'll think our FO is ran by the village iddiot!
Unless they draft a QB too and Greene was brought in as a mentor. But our STARTER? He won't last a month before he's a customer of The Cleveland Clinic.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554 |
I thought of Kosar...that is why I said it usually doesn't win for you....èipe wasn't as weak armed as some like to think. He threw a tight ball that cut the wind....Chuck doesn't, so comparison between the two doesn't apply IMO.
By and large you can look through the history of the league and most of the top QBs had the physical skills and a mix and match in the brain department.
The commom factor... they had the skill set.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
Thanks for the read DS44,, Quote:
General manager Phil Savage confirmed Thursday night that that he contacted Kansas City GM Carl Peterson about Trent Green, a two-time Pro Bowl quarterback, during this week's NFL meetings in Phoenix.
Remember here people, he confirmed that he CONTACTED KC about Green. He's done that before and either not gotten the guy or was, as he said in another comment in this article:
Quote:
"I spoke to a number of teams/GMs about players/picks including KC," Savage said in an e-mail. "Bottom line, due diligence on a player who might be able to help us -- nothing imminent or on the table."
What I've noticed about Savage is this, you never know what's coming till it gets here.. we thought Bentley might get contacted and we wanted him, but all we heard was, "he's Signed".. Nobody had Shaffer on Radar,,, yet, here he is. Lots of us wanted JJ,,, again, didn't know anything till he signed.. Get the drift.
Savage hasn't told anyone anything about who he targets until they are signed.. Otherwise it's just "doing due deligence" as the previous comment says..
The only reason this particular quest makes the headlines is that it's about a QB.. If it were about a MLB or a DB or a Receiver, it wouldn't hit anyones radar.. But that's just a thought..
But here, in my mind is the Coupe DE Grassi 
Quote:
Savage had said previously that the team would be willing to go into training camp next summer without a veteran and allow Charlie Frye and Derek Anderson to compete for the starting job.
What this says to me is this,,, There is smoke in the air,, nothing is real until it happens,, we can speculate till the cows come home and it still won't change a thing...
God I love this time of year,,,, Don't you?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
I disagree... We shored up our biggest sieve on the o-line by signing Steinbach... We grab Thomas at #3 and that O-line will be not much if any dropoff from what Green is accustom to. It puzzles me that people would prefer someone with LESS talent as our starting QB over a PROVEN vet.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
No prob...
Daman, you cannot deny that if we are "set" at a position, there would be no talk leaked out from the FO to the media outlets....
Example, not ONE person will deny that Winslow is a STUD... There has been NO talk or indication that Phil is looking to bring in someone to fill the TE position... My point being, our TALENT EVALUATOR/GM sees Trent Green as an upgrade over what we currently have... We would be lucky to field a trade with Charlie that would involve more than a pack of Pal Mall's and a case of Natty Light... His value throughout the league would be a 7th rder at best...
Could it be posturing for the draft? Absolutely but that also doesn't dicatate that Phil isn't atleast interested.. Nothing is a sure thing but I bet for around 4 mil a season and a 4th rder, we could see it happen... JMHO..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,395
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,395 |
4 and 4...I wouldn't mind that.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 192
2nd String
|
|
2nd String
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 192 |
j/c DOLPHINS NOTEBOOK Agent: Green's talks have only been with FinsBY BARRY JACKSON bjackson@MiamiHerald.com The Dolphins are still in contact with Kansas City about acquiring Chiefs quarterback Trent Green.Although Cleveland and Detroit have expressed interest in Chiefs quarterback Trent Green, his representative has spoken only to the Dolphins, and trade discussions are ongoing between Miami and Kansas City, agent Jim Steiner said Thursday. The Dolphins this week have remained intent on waiting out the Green situation instead of making a bid for quarterback David Carr, who was released by the Houston Texans last week. The Dolphins have expressed interest in Carr but have not made an offer or scheduled a visit. Carr is expected to visit next week with Carolina, which also will meet with former Dolphin Joey Harrington, and Seattle. Although Green and the Dolphins have agreed on what he would be paid if he comes to Miami, the Dolphins have refused to meet the Chiefs' asking price of a second-round pick. ''They've had conversations, but it's going very slowly,'' Steiner said of the Dolphins and Chiefs. Unless a team is willing to pay Green's $7.2 million salary next season -- which is unlikely -- then Green hypothetically could dictate where he ends up by refusing to negotiate a restructured contract with a team other than Miami, which is his first choice. But the Chiefs have not received any such ultimatum from Green, who -- with Carr on the market -- appears willing to consider all options. Steiner and the Chiefs also have discussed the possibility of Green being released -- something that could happen by late April if he hasn't been traded. lincoln
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311 |
Quote:
Behind OUR OL??????
If he comes here? Firstly I'll believe Trent has a death wish. Secondly,I'll think our FO is ran by the village iddiot!
Pit, I understand your concern but you act like we have done absolutely nothing to shore up our o-line. If we pick up Green, then we can easily take Thomas at #3 and have him, Steinbach, Fraley, Tucker, and Shaffer protecting the QB. Now, tell me he would still be killed behind that line.
Oh, and then next year, HOPEFULLY, we will have Bentley back in the mix. Green could survive for at least 3-4 more years behind that line.
But if your concern for our o-line's ability to protect the QB is that strong, then does it really matter who we have taking snaps? Frye? Anderson? Quinn? Russell? Green?
If our o-line is as bad as you say it is, then they're all sitting ducks. I'd rather have a proven veteran who can take a hit and not be gunshy than a rookie or a guy who has never tasted true success at this level before. But that's JMHO. Besides, don't you know... 40 is the new 20!! 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
Still doesn't refute the other published sources... The key point being that we haven't spoken to Green's AGENT... We HAVE had talks with KC's GM about Green and that is a big difference because at this point, Green's agent cannot do JACK if KC trades him to the right buyer... Once he is released, that is a different story...
I don't see us getting it done just because too many things have to fall into line to make it work... Salaray negotiation and pick compensation etc...
Sure wish it would happen but not holding my breath...
Last edited by DawgStyle44; 03/30/07 08:26 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
Quote:
Daman, you cannot deny that if we are "set" at a position, there would be no talk leaked out from the FO to the media outlets....
Sure I can,, I can deny it all day long,, doesn't make me right,, or for that matter, doesn't make you right either..
Quote:
Example, not ONE person will deny that Winslow is a STUD... There has been NO talk or indication that Phil is looking to bring in someone to fill the TE position
You are not paying attention DS,,, there WAS Talk just the other day about bringing in a TE.. and as soon as that article hit, BOOM,,, what's going on with Winslow..
I'm rather surprised you don't remember that given that it was about the time a few weeks ago when there was talk that Winslow wouldn't be able to play this year.. it died right down after winslow went to the media and told them he'd be fine and ready to go.. it died another death when Lerner speculated that Winslow would be playing this year,,,and again when RAC said it also..
Quote:
Could it be posturing for the draft?
I have a theory, Can't prove it but I think it's true...
THERE IS NO TRUTH TO ANY RUMOR THIS TIME OF YEAR!
Like I said, it's a theory!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160 |
Behind OUR OL??????
Well yeah the same Oline Frye will be taking snaps from...if you don't want Green taking snaps, then you don't want Frye taking snaps behind it either..works both ways...
And yes our line is being upgraded so I am not gonna sweat it right now.
It should be obvious several things are in play..
Get a vet who can take the helm if the Browns go with Frye/DA..or if they take one of the two QB's in the draft..it's really that simple..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
As evidenced by my post counts, I read more than I post and find myself busier now than I used to be... I guess that the TE thing slipped by me... I pick and choose my arguments but your opinions/stance on Frye raise serious doubts if you pay attention to anything other than the scoreboard... Not meant to be an insult so please do not take it that way but some diehards couldn't tell you the details of a players strengths and weaknesses but that doesn't make them any less of a fan.. Just makes them blind to positional needs... I will not waste anymore of my time trying to convince you otherwise... Just don't hide when he does get bumped back to clipboard duty because he sucks... I will be one of the first to remind you... 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
Quote:
I pick and choose my arguments but your opinions/stance on Frye raise serious doubts if you pay attention to anything other than the scoreboard
Wait a freakin minute,,, I disagree with your assessment of a player and suddenly I'm a casual fan that only sees the scoreboard,,, Look man, we are all human and we all see different things.. that's what makes the world go round. So I have no problem that you and I don't see the eye to eye.. NONE.
And maybe I should be insulted by your comments, but either I'm too stupid to know I'm being insulted or I just don't care enough to worry about it.. you choose!
And here is the really funny thing,,, I am NOT totally disagreeing with you on FRYE... I've maintained from the very beginning that I am NOT 100% sure Frye can get the job done.. and nothing has happened to change my mind on that.
But the difference between us (I can't believe I'm actually stating it AGAIN) is that you think he's as good as he can be... and I say he can get better..
Its an OPINOIN,,, one we don't agree on!
Oh, and I told you a while ago, you would not be able to convince me otherwise at this point,,,so I'm glad you have decided to stop trying! You have no idea how happy that makes me!
As for being around if he flops,,,I'm not going anywhere.. I supported Couch and to an extent, still wonder what would have happened had he had a better line and a better supporting cast,,, and he got kicked to the curb and guess what,,,
I'M STILL HERE! I'll be here to accept your groveling when Frye gets us to the playoffs also!
Enjoy your day!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 601 |
Quote:
I pick and choose my arguments but your opinions/stance on Frye raise serious doubts if you pay attention to anything other than the scoreboard... Not meant to be an insult so please do not take it that way but some diehards couldn't tell you the details of a players strengths and weaknesses but that doesn't make them any less of a fan.. Just makes them blind to positional needs...
There is the rest of the quote as you obviously read the first sentence then went off into a terrets moment... 
I haven't seen you this fired up since Verse had you going a few months back... Hopefully you still have some of those chill pills left from back then...
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 513
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 513 |
If we get Green, do you guys think he'll be able to audible?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,567
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,567 |
CLEVELAND (AP) - The Cleveland Browns seem to be beating the bushes for a veteran quarterback after all. General manager Phil Savage confirmed Thursday night that that he contacted Kansas City GM Carl Peterson about Trent Green, a two-time Pro Bowl quarterback, during this week's NFL meetings in Phoenix. "I spoke to a number of teams/GMs about players/picks including KC," Savage said in an e-mail. "Bottom line, due diligence on a player who might be able to help us - nothing imminent or on the table." Savage reiterated that he "did the same thing" with other teams. However, the fact that he would even approach another team about a proven QB is an interesting development for the Browns, who own the No. 3 overall pick in next month's draft. Savage had said previously that the team would be willing to go into training camp next summer without a veteran and allow Charlie Frye and Derek Anderson to compete for the starting job. There's also the possibility the Browns could wind up taking either LSU's JaMarcus Russell or Notre Dame's Brady Quinn if things fell into place in the first round. On Wednesday, Peterson told The Kansas City Star that Savage approached him at the conclusion of the meetings about Green, whom the Chiefs are looking to trade if they can't restructure his contract. "We agreed to talk some more later this week or the first of next week," Peterson told the newspaper. "He said he wants to talk some more with his head coach and his offensive coordinator. "But he did ask whether this thing was over with. I said, 'No, not at all.' Cleveland would make sense to me because Trent played very well against them last year." Green, who last season missed eight games after sustaining a severe concussion on a hard hit in the season opener, threw a season-high four touchdown passes in a loss at Cleveland on Dec. 3. Miami and Detroit are also reportedly interested in Green, who is signed through 2009. He is slated to make $7.2 million next season, and $7.7 million and $9.2 million in the final two years of his contract. Green struggled after returning from his concussion, throwing seven touchdowns and nine interceptions as Kansas City went 2-3 in its final five games. Green's 74.1 passer rating was his lowest since 2001 - his first year with the Chiefs. Damon Huard, who filled in when Green was sidelined last season, recently signed a three-year deal with the Chiefs. Kansas City also has Brodie Croyle, last year's third-round draft pick. ------------------------------------- Hmmmmmmmmmmm  I hope we get him, our QB situation would be really solidified in Green.. Refs, if this could go in the other Green thread, and merge it, that's perfectly fine by me 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Kardiac & 44
You seem to be making assumptions as to what we "will do" or predicting what we'll "be able to do" in the draft. And I mean that's fine if you wish to add pieces to the puzzle that simply don't exist.
The fact is,severe head trauma leaves you VERY suceptable to future head trauma. It's just a simple fact. And let's face it,your run of the mill minor concussion doesn't take you out for 6-8 weeks.
I'm not going to "presume or assume" that Joe Thomas will be our starting LT,are you? I'm not "presuming or assuming" we'll get a high quality G in round 2,are you?
I see ONE serious upgrade on our OL from last year. Steinbach. IF Thomas is available at the #3 and we DO take him,this move wouldn't look "as bad".
But do you seriously think a 37 year old QB who spendt half of last year hearing the phone ringing in his head while on the bench a sound and logical answer to our QB position?
I mean many here talked about Carr being damaged goods? Jeesh...........
Do you grasp how much his contract numbers are? I mean he's not a FA you know? So we give up what? A third rounder and pay his contract this year for a 37 year old who had a concussion half of last season?
I don't see it as a smart business move. It's a fine move to have a veteran QB to mentor a rookie QB,but to pay Greene's numbers for a mentor? To pay Greene's number on a guy with a big risk of future concussions? It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
If you want to invest THAT KIND of cash? At least get somebody with future upside,not downside. Make an investment that actually adresses the future for big bucks.
If you want a mentor? You get a Bledsoe or Testiverde. You want a possible "future" for real money? Get a Carr. Greene? A VERY expencive,short term band aid.
Or? Maybe Phil and RAC are that desperate to try to use patchwork and throw out big $$$ to attempt to save their jobs with short term band aids rather than think long term for the betterment of the overall good of the team. You tell me?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 513
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 513 |
Quote:
If you want a mentor? You get a Bledsoe
Charlie doesn't need help throwing INTs, fumbling, or choking in big games.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Quote:
Miami and Detroit are also reportedly interested in Green, who is signed through 2009. He is slated to make $7.2 million next season, and $7.7 million and $9.2 million in the final two years of his contract.
Green struggled after returning from his concussion, throwing seven touchdowns and nine interceptions as Kansas City went 2-3 in its final five games. Green's 74.1 passer rating was his lowest since 2001 - his first year with the Chiefs.
Let's see...................Green was 2-3 in starts after his concussion "recovery".
Charlie was 3-4 in his starts under Davidson after Mo left.
Yeah,that's an upgrade worth BIG BUCKS!!!
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
Quote:
The fact is,severe head trauma leaves you VERY suceptable to future head trauma. It's just a simple fact. And let's face it,your run of the mill minor concussion doesn't take you out for 6-8 weeks.
Give it up Pit,, I brought this up yesterday and not ONE person acknowledged it.. They don't GET IT!
Quote:
I'm not going to "presume or assume" that Joe Thomas will be our starting LT,are you? I'm not "presuming or assuming" we'll get a high quality G in round 2,are you?
I never brought it up, but another excellent point,,, you should probabably forget getting a response from anyone on this one also...
Quote:
If you want a mentor? You get a Bledsoe or Testiverde. You want a possible "future" for real money? Get a Carr. Greene? A VERY expencive,short term band aid.
You'll get plenty of remarks about Vinnie and Drew,,, be prepared,,, They won't be positive,, but I'd rather have either of them.
Quote:
Or? Maybe Phil and RAC are that desperate to try to use patchwork and throw out big $$$ to attempt to save their jobs with short term band aids rather than think long term for the betterment of the overall good of the team. You tell me?
Holy smokes,,,, Someone will say it's true.. Doesn't matter if it is,,, but they will believe it anyway... Mostly because they either don't like Phil or don't like RAC or both
Overall Pit,, I like your thinking... Love this post man!!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Thanks Daman. I'm just trying to be realistic here. I mean renegotiating his contract would be a MUST! We haven't even contacted his agent. His price tag PLUS a possible third round draft pick just don't add up to a signing. And that last part? I had to throw that in just to stir the pot a tad............
Last edited by PitDAWG; 03/30/07 11:17 AM.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554 |
I understand his situation.
If he is brought in, it seems likely a qb is our target.
They aren't going to bring in a vet for frye.....he is past the point of needing a mentor....you don't mentor guys who have starting experience 3-4 years into their career.
And he isn't being brought in to take over only to hand things back to Frye somewhere down the road.
I am beginning to think Frye is a draft day trade if this Green deal happens.
He might be part of the key in trading up 1 slot with the Lions.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,160 |
He might be part of the key in trading up 1 slot with the Lions.
U lost it there..No way should Opie even consider trading up..but going down I can something like that going down..several teams below us can use a backup QB..
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 786
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 786 |
He might be part of the key in trading up 1 slot with the Lions.
I think i would then resign my card holding status at that point.  That would be the the absolute worst case scenario that could happen on draft day IMO.  OHH....sorry...Howdy Peen!!!! 
You dont have to win every game just the next one!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554 |
It isn't a matter of losing it....it is simply a matter of possibilities.
There has been talk of us getting a qb....some as pointed as the owner instructing us to get one. Now I don't if that is true or not, and also know some statements made by the parties involved deny that has been said.....but I think we are all smart enough to know that people don't always tell the truth in such matters.
Any way we cut it, if Savage has been ordered or has a deep desire to bring in one of the top 2 qbs, the only way to make certain is to get into the #1 or #2 slots. Stay at 3 and you might get snookered.
Actually, Frye might make sense in Detriot.
This is all just a big if.....but if we did trade Frye to move up one slot, I don't think we would have to package much else.
I think the Lions want a qb, but not really one of the top rookies at a top pay rate. My feeling is a guy like Frye is perfect for them as they try to work down the board even further.
Who knows...it's all a big guessing game in fun.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311 |
Like I said Pit, I see your point unless your point is that we have a horrible o-line. If so, then how does it matter who we have behind center? If our line is truly as bad as you say it is, then how does anyone stand a chance back there? I guess if we're gonna get killed anyway, I'd rather take my chances with someone who has some experience winning in this league, regardless of how he got banged up last year. Look at McNair and Brees and 80-year old Brett Favre. They all have taken a likcin and keep on tickin'. But because Green was out for half of one season with a severe concussion, he's done being a QB in this league. Oh and remember that although Green is 37, he didn't even play until later in his career. But yes, I am "assuming" that we will make further upgrades on our line through the draft. How can we not?
Follow me on Twitter <a href="link" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/CoachA12</a>
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,253
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,253 |
BTW, I was just watching NFL channel on TV and they were showing the top defenses. Naturally a good part of their highlights were against the Browns O. If you get a chance watch it and see Charlie getting handed his ass. Most of the time the defense was back there waiting on him.
My comment about Pop Warner teams being able to beat ND was not ment to be taken seriously. Just to point out Russell beating ND was nothing special. Sure the kid has great arm but what separates him from guys like Omar Jacobs, Spergeon Wynn and that guy everybody was so excited about last year, McPherson ( not sure thats his name).
On Russell's com %, I'm getting my info from ESPN Draft Magazine. $7.00 at your local news stand. They could be wrong. Probably not the 1st time.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,877 |
I know you've written Charlie off. So what makes you think that the Lions are gonna want a guy that you and many others have classified as mediocre? I mean Millen's not the brightest bulb in the chandelier but I don't think he's the moron that some on here see. So why would he, or anyone for that matter, trade for Charlie? Sorry, I just don't see it.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 42,858 |
Quote:
I understand his situation.
If he is brought in, it seems likely a qb is our target.
They aren't going to bring in a vet for frye.....he is past the point of needing a mentor....you don't mentor guys who have starting experience 3-4 years into their career.
And he isn't being brought in to take over only to hand things back to Frye somewhere down the road.
I know your not gonna tell me that it can't happen, and I know your not gonna tell me it hasn't happened....
I got two words for you
Hassleback/Seahawks
They got a Superbowl winning coach who made the exact move you say the Browns probably wouldn't....
I"m kinda thinking that as always, being certain about anything in the NFL can make us look silly!
But that still leaves us with the injury he suffered last year.. actually the more I think about it, the more it scares me,,, I'm not scared of bringing him here, I'm actually more afraid for him,, that could be an injury that puts him down forever.. I don't want to see that.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311 |
I saw that last night. They showed the Ravens game that we ALMOST won and then the 30-0 drubbing by the Bengals. And you're right, Charlie was being beaten to a pulp. But that's part his fault, and part the fault of the 0-line.
Simply put: In order to end our perpetual existence on the wrong side of a highlight reel, we need to upgrade BOTH positions.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Quote:
Like I said Pit, I see your point unless your point is that we have a horrible o-line. If so, then how does it matter who we have behind center? If our line is truly as bad as you say it is, then how does anyone stand a chance back there? I guess if we're gonna get killed anyway, I'd rather take my chances with someone who has some experience winning in this league, regardless of how he got banged up last year.
I guess if you feel a 37 year old QB with major head trauma last season will hold up better than QB's 10-12 years younger who DIDN'T have severe head trauma lsat year under the same abuse,we simply disagree here. Also,he has little to NO mobility. So if you feel the lack of mobility isn't a plus in avoiding more abuse as a QB behind a poor OL,once again we disagree.
Quote:
Look at McNair and Brees and 80-year old Brett Favre. They all have taken a likcin and keep on tickin'. But because Green was out for half of one season with a severe concussion, he's done being a QB in this league.
So you're comparing Favre's (furure HOF) mobility and skills to Trent Green? To Green? Baltimore's OL to ours? Interesting.......... Once again we disagree. And N.O. revamped their OL last off season. And uh,Brees didn't have severe head traums,Green did. Different animals entirely if you wish to look at the history there.
Quote:
Oh and remember that although Green is 37, he didn't even play until later in his career. But yes, I am "assuming" that we will make further upgrades on our line through the draft. How can we not?
Firstly,37 is 37. Are you saying he is mobile and can help himself avoid hits? Can you,from any type of factual data,consider severe head trauma with bones and cartelidge?
How can "we not" make further upgrades on the OL? I've been asking that same question since 2000. If you figure it out,let me know will ya?
I don't know that Thomas will be there at #3,do you? If he is,I can't garuntee Phil will take him,can you? And what if the G's left at our pick in round 2 simply don't measure up from a BPA standpoint?
You see,I'm not making assumptions here. Green is 37 and NOT mobile at all! If our OL is seriously upgraded in the draft,it's not as "much" of an issue.
But please answer me this. A QB who missed about half the season due to severe head trauma,went 2 wins and three losses upon his return.
Charlie,after Mo left and Davidson took over,was 3 wins and 4 losses in his starts. Charlie is mobile,Green is not. Charlie's contract is 5 years,5 million. Green's is 7.2 mil for one year. And 9 mil the next. Charlie is MUCH younger and less suceptable to injuries than a 37 year old Green and can scramble his way out of at least SOME of the abuse.Considering those factors,how smart of an investment do you consider this?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,740 |
Quote:
But that's part his fault, and part the fault of the 0-line.
Simply put: In order to end our perpetual existence on the wrong side of a highlight reel, we need to upgrade BOTH positions.
Really? How do you know? Maybe we should fix the SAME PROBLEM we've had since our teams return and see how things shake out? I mean we've already tried "revolving QB's" how many times now? From everything I've seen,that hasn't been ANY part of the answer! Because we keep doing it with zero results.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 39,554 |
Quote:
So what makes you think that the Lions are gonna want a guy that you and many others have classified as mediocre?
Because he is good enough to be a solid back-up and maybe a decent starter in time.
He can go to Detroit and sit a year or so and still work out for them. It is alot harder to do here since he is the starter.
It usually doesn't work out for a guy to be a starter then go to the bench, then hit the field again with the same team as the starter a few years down the road.
I know you know that.
At any rate, it doesn't matter what I think. Time will tell how all of this settles.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,882
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 13,882 |
Quote:
Quote:
Miami and Detroit are also reportedly interested in Green, who is signed through 2009. He is slated to make $7.2 million next season, and $7.7 million and $9.2 million in the final two years of his contract.
Green struggled after returning from his concussion, throwing seven touchdowns and nine interceptions as Kansas City went 2-3 in its final five games. Green's 74.1 passer rating was his lowest since 2001 - his first year with the Chiefs.
Let's see...................Green was 2-3 in starts after his concussion "recovery".
Charlie was 3-4 in his starts under Davidson after Mo left.
Yeah,that's an upgrade worth BIG BUCKS!!!
Not to mention that it will cost of a draft pick to get him too. Booooooooo!!! Giving up draft pick(s) and paying a big salary for an old concussion prone QB is a bad, bad choice for this franchise. I will be severly upset if Green is a Brown.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,311 |
Okay Pit. You win. We'll just have to see what happens. Regardless of what we do, I'll be happy as long as we're winning. I just hope Frye can be our man.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 8,015 |
Pit, I think you've exhagerated points because you don't want Green. Or perhaps, you've simply validated them in your own mind because you're afraid of him.
You say this O-line is still a disaster. I vehemently disagree. The biggest failure of this O-line last year was our guard play. 'Druzzi is done and he's been replaced by a pro-bowl caliber player.
That's Ryan Tucker at right tackle, not Kelly Butler.
That's Seth McKinney at right guard, not Cosey Coleman.
And this is Fraley's 2nd year with the team. He's no Bentley, but he's been a viable starter in his career.
The only real weak-link on this team is Shaffer. Now I'm not going to assume that we're taking Thomas. But guess what? It doesn't matter We're NOT the crappy O-line that we've been in the past, and at some point, you MUST upgrade the QB unit because this one sucks.
Now it's time to get off the "major head trauma" kick here dOOD. It's not like he was knocked out for the entire year and has still been undergoing tests to determine if he can play again. This isn't Dan Morgan who's missed time every single year with concussions. This is a QB who's had ONE concussion. He was cleared to play DURING the year, and in this day and age, they won't let players out there if there are any reasons why they shouldn't.
I get your fears, but I find them to be unfounded. Frye was knocked senseless last year as well and it wasn't a problem for him. If Green has a history of concussions, then yes, it's a concern. He doesn't, and it's not.
You can't be afraid of a pocket-passing QB because the line isn't as bad as you make it sound, with or without Thomas. Hell, if the line is still that bad, who cares what QB is back there. It won't matter  In the end, you STILL have to march out a good QB, one who can get it done.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns interested in Trent Green
|
|
![[Linked Image from damontech.net]](http://www.damontech.net/bedatd.gif)
