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Unfortunately, QBs like Charlie Frye/Trent Edwards/Troy Smith/Drew Stanton etc, etc, etc will never be able to grow in a city like Cleveland, fans don't have the wits enough to understand the time needed to develop.
Come on Mav. I have been preaching that the smart ones understand ever since Charlie was drafted.
Smart ones? Those are few and far btw...the smart ones realize they know very litle about the situation.
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J/C
As a general question....who the heck is Owens anyway??
He coached Akron.....then was canned from what I gather.
I am not putting the guy down or anything, but something tells me Owens isn't exactly the guy GM's and NFL coaches seek out when they want the skinny on a player.
He coached at lowly Akron, right Ballpeen? He cant know much about football...kinda like your comment that Dorsey is better than Frye because he played at the U. 
I've enjoyed dinner on a couple occasions with Coach Owens, the man knows his football and has good connection with bigger College and NFL people. Very well respected man by his peers.
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That's great man. Maybe they will name a bowl game after him.
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If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Daman that was quoted from Opie's own mouth..they DID NOT WANT A QB controversie..they need not want to pressure him..they wanted to evaluate him ALONE all season to see if he has it..
Man you just aren't hearing me are you... WHAT I'm saying is that Savage and RAC would NOT have even given any consideration to any of that had they not had faith in Frye,,,, No way does any coach or GM say,, we don't want a contrversy so we aren't going to bring in competition,,,,, UNLESS they are confident in the player,, If they don't believe he can develop, then it becomes moot to not have competition.. DUMB DUMB to do it if they don't believe.
I don't believe that either of those two guys are that freakin stupid.. Now perhaps you do and your certainly entitled to that belief but don't use it as a "FACT" when it just plain isn't!
(by the way, I hate hearing people referred to by something other than thier given name, but that's just me.. Things like Opie and Leon are inconsiderate,,, but you do what you feel is right in your mind. You are not alone.. many do it)
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Man you just aren't hearing me are you... WHAT I'm saying is that Savage and RAC would NOT have even given any consideration to any of that had they not had faith in Frye,,,, No way does any coach or GM say,, we don't want a contrversy so we aren't going to bring in competition,,,,, UNLESS they are confident in the player,, U just don't quite get it..and thats not a put down..it wasn't as much a show of faith as much as you may think.. They wanted to evaluate him in every sense of the word..to see if the kid is a vaiable starter... They wanted him to have total confidence in himself ,and not fear if he needed to be taken out, and sat down to learn from the sidelines(which he did need to)... if he failed, they didn't want to have to take that step, of putting in another QB ,and seeing him take over , run the team, and Frye never get the helm back.. (and to insert the Phil -moniker)or have the fans PUSHING for the backup to start.. Now that did happen to a degree when he got injured and DA came in.. In other words they wanted him to play without any distractions that could develope from having a backup who really could start over him. Now supposedly both will battle it out in training camp(?)..interesting..if they had total faith in Frye ..there WOULD BE NO QB battle.. Rac's comment about Frye having a leg up(more like a spud up ) would be .."He's the starter until he's not..o.k?"..Racspeak.. The Opie and Leon thing..well I'm sure the two who thought of the names weren't trying to insult them..lol.. Course I could always say Randy Macho Man Savage.." OHHHH YEEEEAAH"...
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/06/07 08:30 AM.
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U just don't quite get it..and thats not a put down..it wasn't as much a show of faith as much as you may think..
See, I stopped reading right there,,,, you are saying, "it wasn't as much a show of faith as much as you may think" and my first reaction is ,, how do you know that.. what if I'm spot on with my thinking? and what if your NOT?
Do you understand what I'm saying here? Now I'll go and read the rest of what you wrote.
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Now supposedly both will battle it out in training camp(?)..interesting..if they had total faith in Frye ..there WOULD BE NO QB battle..
Here again, you could be right,,,,and you could also be wrong... My problem is that all of us,, me included, sometimes express our opinions as if they were fact.. They aren't.. They are speculation..
I myself have begun to try watch how I post my Opinions so as not to confuse people,, I really want them to know it's just an opinion not a fact.. when indeed it is an opinoin... (sorry peen, I know you are ready to strangle me over this,, perhaps Attack and some others are as well,,,,Sorry, it's JMO )
I didn't always have this impression then the more I got into it, the more I realized that on here,,, Opinion, if expressed by certain very strong personalities suddenly becomes fact... when it reality, it's just opinion.
Thus the reason I think (notice it reads "I THINK) it's important to seperate the two...
But hey, that's JMO 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Soup and anyone else can bring in all the numbers U like but the kid ranked 26 out of 30 QB's..
You do know there are 32 teams in the NFL, not 30. You keep posting 30 all over this site so it makes me wonder how much you really know about the NFL.
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My problem is that all of us,, me included, sometimes express our opinions as if they were fact.. They aren't.. They are speculation..
Oh really? I don't suppose anyone is ALWAYS going to preface their post by saying:"I guess this is what may be happening, or I shouldn't offer my thoughts because someone else will blast me for projecting it as fact".. There are some things that are posted as fact and truely are..some of it is inside information ..somethings are formulated by what is happening..a lot is speculation but a lot of opinions and speculation can have root in whats been said, what hasn't been said..whats been done.. We are allowed to do that is a message board.. I myself have begun to try watch how I post my Opinions so as not to confuse people U mean ANGER people..  I didn't always have this impression then the more I got into it, the more I realized that on here,,, Opinion, if expressed by certain very strong personalities suddenly becomes fact... when it reality, it's just opinion.
There are two words called logic and discerment which can be applied to any situation to break it into it parts to understand it better.
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/06/07 09:44 AM.
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I'll take you on first..go to NFL.com ..
http://www.nfl.com/stats/leaders/NFL/PRAT/2006/regular
Tell me what they have posted there..and then I'll wonder about you next.
Kid, face it, you were caught trying to make Frye look as bad as possible by dumbing down the # of teams in the league from 32 to 30. But continue to weasle away.
Next time just say Frye ranks 26th out of 26 QB's if you want to show how bad Frye is compared to the rest of the league.
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NFL Passer Rating
Rank Player Team Yds Att Cmp TDs Ints Long Rating
1 Peyton Manning IND 4397 557 362 31 9 68 101.0
2 Damon Huard KC 1878 244 148 11 1 78 98.0
3 Drew Brees NO 4418 554 356 26 11 86 96.2
4 Donovan McNabb PHI 2647 316 180 18 6 87 95.5
5 Tony Romo DAL 2903 337 220 19 13 56 95.1
6 Carson Palmer CIN 4035 520 324 28 13 74 93.9
7 Marc Bulger STL 4301 588 370 24 8 67 92.9
8 Philip Rivers SD 3388 460 284 22 9 57 92.0
9 Tom Brady NE 3529 516 319 24 12 62 87.9
10 Mark Brunell WAS 1789 260 162 8 4 74 86.5
11 J.P. Losman BUF 3051 429 268 19 14 83 84.9
12 Chad Pennington NYJ 3352 485 313 17 16 71 82.6
13 Jake Delhomme CAR 2805 431 263 17 11 72 82.6
14 Steve McNair BAL 3050 468 295 16 12 87 82.5
15 David Carr HOU 2767 442 302 11 12 53 82.1
16 David Garrard JAC 1735 241 145 10 9 49 80.5
17 Jon Kitna DET 4208 596 372 21 22 60 79.9
18 Eli Manning NYG 3244 522 301 24 18 55 77.0
19 Matt Hasselbeck SEA 2442 371 210 18 15 72 76.0
20 Michael Vick ATL 2474 388 204 20 13 55 75.7
21 Ben Roethlisberger PIT 3513 469 280 18 23 67 75.4
22 Alex Smith SF 2890 442 257 16 16 75 74.8
23 Matt Leinart ARI 2547 377 214 11 12 58 74.0
24 Rex Grossman CHI 3193 480 262 23 20 62 73.9
25 Brett Favre GB 3885 613 343 18 18 82 72.7
26 Charlie Frye CLE 2454 392 252 10 17 75 72.2
27 Brad Johnson MIN 2750 439 270 9 15 46 72.0
28 Jake Plummer DEN 1994 317 175 11 13 83 68.8
29 Joey Harrington MIA 2236 388 223 12 15 48 68.2
30 Vince Young TEN 2199 357 184 12 13 53 66.7
Hey how many QB's are listed there?
Speaking of dummie down..they list 30 not me..care to fill in the other two?
if you break it down by each conference they list all 32..but in their total rank they list 30 ..
So if Frye is 26th out of 32 QB's that make you feel much better?
As far as KID goes..you probably weren't thought of when I was in grade school lol..
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 04/06/07 09:26 AM.
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My problem is that all of us,, me included, sometimes express our opinions as if they were fact.. They aren't.. They are speculation..
Oh really?
Yes,,, Really,..... Dress it up anyway you want,, Fact is fact,,, speculation is what people do when they have looked at circumstances and develope a theory,,,, But until proven, it's speculation... I didn't make that up Attack,,, really I didn't! I swear I didn't!
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There are some things that are posted as fact and truely are.
Yes, like Dilfer is no longer a Brown, he's been traded... That's a fact... But before it happened,,, anyone who said it, was speculating,,, as it turns out, it became fact
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somethings are formulated by what is happening..a lot is speculation but a lot of opinions and speculation can have root in whats been said, what hasn't been said..whats been done..
Ahh,, you do understand,, you just want to argue with me,,, I'm happy you think enough of me to argue your point,, THanks man!
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I myself have begun to try watch how I post my Opinions so as not to confuse people
U mean ANGER people..
Well Duh,,, of course,,, do you think I wake up every morning and say,,, who can I tick off today,,, hmm, I'll go Dawgtalkers.net and see whos around...
I don't purposely try to anger people, (lately, I've been very successful at it however) but I'm not afraid of them either... But I have to admit, some are more fun that others to discuss (read that as Argue) matters with... You for instance, are fun to disagree with... My guess is that if we ever sat down and had a beer together,, it would be lively at the very least!
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There are two words called logic and discerment which can be applied to any situation to break it into it parts to understand it better.
True enough, but it still doesn't turn speculation into fact....
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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Yeah , oh really..I forgot to expound on that..  Yes, like Dilfer is no longer a Brown, he's been traded... That's a fact... But before it happened,,, anyone who said it, was speculating,,, as it turns out, it became fact
Some people do know about things before they happen and sometimes the writing is on the wall.. Ahh,, you do understand,, you just want to argue with me,,, I'm happy you think enough of me to argue your point,  You for instance, are fun to disagree with... My guess is that if we ever sat down and had a beer together,, it would be lively at the very least!
I hate BEER so now U ticked me off!
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Some people do know about things before they happen and sometimes the writing is on the wall..
LOL,, totally true,,, still doesn't make them fact till they actually happen,,,,
Why do you suppose this and many other boards have a rule about posting information without a link or some other way of verifing it's more that someones opinion? There is a reason for that rule Attack,,,
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I hate BEER so now U ticked me off!
Well, I'll have the beer and we'll order you a pink lady!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I don't understand why we have to wait for a QB who has to "develope". There are plenty of QB's who didn't have to "develope". Carson Palmer didn't take that long to "develope". Ben Roethlesberger didn't take that long to "develope". Peyton Manning didn't take that long to "develope". Drew Brees didn't take that long to "develope". Donovan McNabb didn't take that long to "develope".
There are plenty of QB's who didn't take time to "develope". Why do we have to wait on a QB to "develope"? Why can't we find a QB who is ready to get the job done? Why do we have to be one of those teams that takes five years to determine that the QB we have can't handle the job. Sports is about WINNING. If our QB can't get it done now, then find someone who can!
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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Oh I'm sure that will go over well 
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I don't understand why we have to wait for a QB who has to "develope".
Frustrating isn't it Tenn? I know,, I feel that way sometimes, then I think of all the QB's out there that have won superbowls and I find that the list includes guys that were much more highly thought of than Frye for instance and still took time to develop...
Like Bradshaw, Elway, Manning (I know you don't think it took him time to develop, but look back and you will see it did,,,).. Aikman took several years to get to a place where you could call him accomplished. Oddly enough, in Aikmans case, they didn't have much of a team surrounding him when he got there,, so it could be said that his development was somewhat stunted by those around him.
Then you have a guy like Ben Rothlesburger (sp) who walked onto a team that was dang near perfect in it's make up.. They just had some good players surrounded by outstanding players.. Ben came along at the perfect time.. That's all that was in my eyes.. (i'm not knocking Ben here, but I really believe that had he gone to a lesser team, he wouldn't have been the success he was with Pittsburgh. At least not as quickly)
But that's just how I see it,,, I have been known to be all wet..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I know. I'm not from Ohio, so I don't look at the fact he's from Ohio. I've been BLASTED on the Browns Crapass board. At least here, people will make intelligent comments and won't result to name calling.
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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I disagree about Ben. That Squeeler team wasn't that good. They INCREDIBLY overachieved when they won the SuperBowl (oops, I hope the NFL won't come after me for using their trade mark name without paying for it! ). Really, that team won because Ben had poise and ability. They could not have made it without him.
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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well we do disagree to a point, but I will concede that Ben was probably the final piece of that puzzle,, But I'll stand by my belief that had he gone to a lesser team, he'd still be developing.. I had a similar converstion with either Peen, Attack, Toad or Vers,, don't remember which it was.. but whoever it was felt that guys like Big Ben, Manning (payton), Aikman and a few others showed the talent,, they had the big arms and they demonstrated the smarts required to lead a team.. It's really hard to argue with that because I didn't pay that much attention to it back then,, They may be right,, but I still don't see how it means anything without a supporting cast... I'd say that Archie Manning had all those great QB skills,,, but no supporting cast,, look where that got him. Jim Kelly was totally talented.. Got to the superbowl 4 times, lost 4 times,, something was missing and it wasn't his skills that's for sure. Warren Moon was way off the charts when he played for Houston, still he couldn't get over the hump with his supporting cast. NFL History is awash with stories like that.. You just have to believe what you believe I guess.. (note to attack: See how tactfully I did that,,, it was an effort not to tick Tenn off ....Clever huh? ) Tenn, did that work for you? 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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SIGH, at least you admit you don't understand.:) Seriously, Carson sat an entire year and then had an incredible running game and tremendous OLine. Big Ben had a great running game and great OLine to play behind (the Super Bowl performance was one of the worst ever by a winning QB). Drew Brees took three years to break out and the Chargers acquired Rivers because they had doubts about him. I could go on and on and on. Your blanket statement really isn't an accurate description on how these players "developed". Look at the pattern of those described, strong running game, strong O Line.
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Hey, don't blame me for answering your question. You acted like Coach knows nothing about the game because he was fired once, and the only time in his career, I might add. You asked who he was, I answered and Maverick elaborated. He is a very well respected coach. Of course, he doesn't agree with you about Frye, so you disrespect him. 
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Look at the pattern of those described, strong running game, strong O Line.
Odd, I thought I was the one that was supposed to say that
Really Coach, you are correct,,, they all had those two things in common!
Last edited by Damanshot; 04/06/07 12:24 PM.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I don't understand why we have to wait for a QB who has to "develope".
Years it took to get a 80+ QB Rating
6 - Terry Bradshaw - (4 Super Bowl Rings)
5 - John Elway - (2 Super Bowl Rings)
5 - Bob Griese - (2 Super Bowl Rings
3 - Troy Aikman - (3 Super Bowl Rings)
3 - Roger Staubach - (2 Super Bowl Rings)
3 - Steve Young - (1 Super Bowl Ring as a starter)
But hey, if you want a guy that doen't take time to develop and can come in and have a 80+ QB rating as a rookie you can always have Dan Marino and Jim Kelly and their zero Super Bowl wins.
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But hey, if you want a guy that doen't take time to develop and can come in and have a 80+ QB rating as a rookie you can always have Dan Marino and Jim Kelly and their zero Super Bowl wins.
 Now that was just mean
But funny
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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I don't understand why we have to wait for a QB who has to "develope"
trying to develop a qb in cleveland would be like trying to develop film with no darkroom....
we've even had qb's that were developed like garcia and dilfer, and they still didn't succeed....
there is alittle more wrong then just the qb play around here...
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We just need more consistency out of Frye, and consistency comes with experience.
Frye had 6 games with an 80+ QB Rating in 2006
Win over Kansas City - playoff team
Win over Oakland
Win over New York Jets - playoff team
Win over Atlanta
Loss by 1 to Baltimore - playoff team
Loss by 4 to Pittsburgh
Frye had 7 games with a QB Rating below 80 in 2006
All losses
In 2005
- Frye had 1 start with an 80+ QB Rating - (0-1 in that game)
- Frye had 4 starts with a QB Rating below 80 - (2-2 in those games)
2005 - 20% of starts with 80+ QB Rating
2006 - 46% of starts with 80+ QB Rating
Hopefully Frye can get above an 80+ QB Rating 70% of the time this coming year.
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If Frye even gets the start this year, he can't afford to have anything less than a rating in the 80's. Developemental or not, it's his 3rd year and it's time to put up or shut up.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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toad...i get what you are saying, but aren't you forgeting one thing...
the new offense? if edwards didn't know where to line up mid-season last year, what makes you think he'll come out fine day one?
is there no learning curve for the rest of the offense? or just charlie?
this is what i don't get...the offense has been in a constant state of flux for years, and guys are just supposed to step right in and run it without thinking...
now i will give you that frye has been around for a few years, and while i don't consider him a vet like guys like dilfer, garcia, green....he should have a general idea how an nfl offense operates...he should be able to pick it up quicker...
hopefully they give him something to work with...and this goes for whatever qb is in there...cause i'm tired of the chaos...
Attitude is everything....FEAR THE ELF!!!
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Hey, don't blame me for answering your question.
I don't blame you.
The guy talks about Frye working under 3 different systems when it is really two makes me wonder about the guy.
That's all.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Hey, don't blame me for answering your question.
I don't blame you.
The guy talks about Frye working under 3 different systems when it is really two makes me wonder about the guy.
That's all.
Actually, Davidson had a different "system" First and foremost - he called correct protections for plays. He had the same playbook - but added the elements he could. You can debate semantics, but not 3 OCs.
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well what really sucks is that its more than 1...
they need to pick something and leave it alone...all this changing can't be good...
its almost like what came first...the good offensive scheme, or sticking with an offense long enough to make it good...
seems like we are always starting over...
Attitude is everything....FEAR THE ELF!!!
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If Frye even gets the start this year, he can't afford to have anything less than a rating in the 80's. Developemental or not, it's his 3rd year and it's time to put up or shut up.
Oh bull
You can win a Superbowl using a QB with a rating in the 70's, It's just a number,,,, one that don't mean squat..
And while it's his third year, please try and remember he didn't start until later in that first year,,, so technically, his next start will be I think his 21st.. if this was his true third year, he's have started 32... he didn't.
We keep referring to YEARS of experience.. We shouldn't be talking about years, we should be refering to GAMES.. Frye has 20.. that's it! In realtime experience that's just a shade over 1 year of experience....
He's had 2 OC's, and possibly the second worst Oline performance
in the last decade. ( I kinda think that Houstons may have actually been worse) He's had receivers that can't hang onto the ball and an inconsistent running game in those 20 games...
The only thing debatable in that statement is whether or not you believe he had a bad Oline. That always seems to be up for debate anyway so nothing new there. Everything else can be proven by looking at the stats..
This is one of the many reasons I stand firmly behind the notion that Frye needs more time... He needs another shot.
Notice, I didn't say I stand firmly behind FRYE,,, I stand behind the Notion that he needs more time,,, I'll say it again, I'm not 100% sold on Frye,, but I want to make sure now... while the team isn't ready to challenge,, now is the time to find out..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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No It's not funny. It's actually lame. When did I EVER say we shouldn't develope the team? NEVER! Yes Dan Marino did not have the supporting cast (really he had no real running back later in his career [see Mark Higgs])
The question is not about the supporting cast. It's about finding a QB who can get the job done. Frye cannot. A bad QB hurts the offensive line.
Frye's problem is two fold. He has bad vision. He does not do a good job finding the open receiver. I've seen several times where we had a receiver open but Frye threw into tight coverage instead.
Secondly, Frye's timing is bad. He waits too long when a receiver gets open to throw the pass. The longer he waits to pull the trigger, the more able the defenders are to catch up to that receiver. If the QB has a cannon arm like Elway or Farve, then they can afford to wait a little longer. FRYE DOES NOT have the cannon arm. In order for Frye to be successful, he must find the receiver the instant he gets a step ahead of the defender. This would allow the receiver to catch the ball and still have time to look upfield and find the defenders coming at him. Frye has not demonstrated the ability to do this.
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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Legend
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Oh lord,,, what have I started Tenn,, it's only a matter of opinion man,, you don't think he has it, I think he could develop it.. it's really that simple,,, well, to me it is anyway.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Dawg Talker
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Quote:
No It's not funny. It's actually lame. When did I EVER say we shouldn't develope the team? NEVER! Yes Dan Marino did not have the supporting cast (really he had no real running back later in his career [see Mark Higgs])
The question is not about the supporting cast. It's about finding a QB who can get the job done. Frye cannot. A bad QB hurts the offensive line.
Frye's problem is two fold. He has bad vision. He does not do a good job finding the open receiver. I've seen several times where we had a receiver open but Frye threw into tight coverage instead.
Secondly, Frye's timing is bad. He waits too long when a receiver gets open to throw the pass. The longer he waits to pull the trigger, the more able the defenders are to catch up to that receiver. If the QB has a cannon arm like Elway or Farve, then they can afford to wait a little longer. FRYE DOES NOT have the cannon arm. In order for Frye to be successful, he must find the receiver the instant he gets a step ahead of the defender. This would allow the receiver to catch the ball and still have time to look upfield and find the defenders coming at him. Frye has not demonstrated the ability to do this.
I love posts like this. First - you called Droughns "good" - that in itself is funny. A better WR core? Again - funny. Northcutt played for all of them, JJ is an upgrade - Cribbs is still too young at the position, BE WILL be a stud - but he lapsed on concentration the first half of the year because of worry about his knee. K@ - obviously he's above.
IF you pay attention to the site you'll notice it's well documented that WR and TEs were running the wrong route.
My favorite part is where you saw open WR that he didn't - please explain how exactly you did that? Was it on TV? Was it in your seat above him? How did you see them - please be more specific.
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Agreed.
One thing I do with young players is to look at a skill set. Each position has a certain skill set that you can evaluate. I will use Willie Green. I was one of the first to get onto Willie. You could tell right away that he did not have what it takes to be an NFL running back. HOW? Look at the skill set necessary to be an NFL runningback. The first is Burst to the line. The second is vision to find the hole WHILE you are bursting towards the line. Willie could not get past this point. Willie would stop and dance behind the line. Indecision.
With the QB there are certain intangibles. Arm strength is the first. If your QB has great arm strength, then he will be able to compensate for other weaknesses. That is why teams drool over college QB's with rocket arms.
If your QB does not have great arm strength, then the next two intangibles that make up the skill set. Vision and timing. If the QB does not have great arm strength, then the vision and timing must be impecable (i.e. Joe Montana).
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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Quote:
I love posts like this. First - you called Droughns "good" - that in itself is funny. A better WR core? Again - funny. Northcutt played for all of them, JJ is an upgrade - Cribbs is still too young at the position, BE WILL be a stud - but he lapsed on concentration the first half of the year because of worry about his knee. K@ - obviously he's above.
IF you pay attention to the site you'll notice it's well documented that WR and TEs were running the wrong route.
My favorite part is where you saw open WR that he didn't - please explain how exactly you did that? Was it on TV? Was it in your seat above him? How did you see them - please be more specific.
I'm sorry, but I did not say any of that! I never mentioned Droughns! I never mentioned WR's! Quit putting words in my mouth!
As for seeing open receivers, watch the TV. That's all you have to do. I don't have to be in some magical seat above the QB to see an open receiver the QB didn't see. I JUST WATCH THE TV! I saw many times ON THE TV that they would show the replay and low and behold, someone was open.
Upgrade does mean that things get better.........RIGHT?
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All Pro
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Very good analysis of the Qb. You get one with all three.....your all set. IMO...Chucks Biggest weakness is timing , of which part is his ability to recognize the route and throwing into that window. Its like he waits to find the receiver having beat the receiver before making the throws. That works some of the time but the other times you must inticipate the routes and where you put the ball. Can he learn? YES! Have we the time to let him learn as our starter? NOPE! Bring in Green or even Rattay and let Chuck learn and settle in a few more years and then evaluate him a little more to see if he is in the curve yet or not. Quinn is still a good pickup IMO even IF we sign a Veteran Qb. Really to me....it makes MORE sence. 
You dont have to win every game just the next one!
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Quote:
Quote:
I love posts like this. First - you called Droughns "good" - that in itself is funny. A better WR core? Again - funny. Northcutt played for all of them, JJ is an upgrade - Cribbs is still too young at the position, BE WILL be a stud - but he lapsed on concentration the first half of the year because of worry about his knee. K@ - obviously he's above.
IF you pay attention to the site you'll notice it's well documented that WR and TEs were running the wrong route.
My favorite part is where you saw open WR that he didn't - please explain how exactly you did that? Was it on TV? Was it in your seat above him? How did you see them - please be more specific.
I'm sorry, but I did not say any of that! I never mentioned Droughns! I never mentioned WR's! Quit putting words in my mouth!
As for seeing open receivers, watch the TV. That's all you have to do. I don't have to be in some magical seat above the QB to see an open receiver the QB didn't see. I JUST WATCH THE TV! I saw many times ON THE TV that they would show the replay and low and behold, someone was open.
Holy crap! MY APOLOGIES!!!! I've got horrid poison ivy -I have to take prednisone and it's messing with my brain. I swear to you I read a post talking about everything I said- but obviously it was someone else as I just re-read yours - I am SO SORRY!!!! I feel like a complete idiot. Please accept my sincere apology
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