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Hi, since I'm new here I figured I would introduce myself first. I'm from ClevelandBrowns.com joined around 2006 and a Browns fan at birth(40 years).
Been reading a lot of the post on this site and I got to say, you guys are a smart bunch and I"m having a ball reading the threads, but I keep coming across people saying how good we will be next year and I got a problem with that.
Fist let me say, I'm a big supporter of the coaching staff,gone is Holmgrens antiquated offense/defense and Pat who had no business being a head coach, anybody for taking TR out on 3rd and 1?
Ok, here are me reasons why IMO we should temper our expectations for next year:
1. They didn't sign Phil Dawson: This was a huge red flag to me, I think even Lombardi knows Phil is the best, no way they let him get away if the planned on making a playoff run.
2. The draft: Trading away picks for next year, IMO this tells me they are stock piling picks, so next draft they will have the ammo to trade up and finally draft a franchise QB and still have some picks to shore up the defense.*Unless Weeden becomes "it".
3. The draft: With D. Milner still available and our defensive backfield being the mess that it is, I was 100% sure they were going to draft him, but they grab MIngo instead who IMO is a tad skinny, it's going to take him a year, maybe more, too do some weight training and add more muscle, so he can be as explosive as we want him to be.
I took a look at next years schedule and it seems we are going to face every elite QB in the league with one cover corner, unless every pick is a stud (YEAH RIGHT!!!) we are in trouble.
I say we win around 5 games next year while we fine tune our pass rush and learn a new offense, of course this all goes out the window if #3 can get it together, which I don't think will happen, he does not seem to me (IMO) to be brightest bulb in the pack.
That said, I'm very excited about next years draft, sad I know, we get our db's in order and get the all important franchise qb.
What do you guys think?
oops out of time, can't proof read, so grammar police, get a life.
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Welcome to you.. enjoy yourself. I really don't see many folks on here talking about how good we'll be so I"m not sure where you are getting that. But be that as it may, you may have read a few positive comments. Anyway, I doubt the Phil Dawson thing is anymore than a desire to get someone that will be here when we turn the corner. Banner and company knew and understood that value of Dawson today, but long term, his time was nearing the end. I can't even begin to find something wrong with stockpiling picks for next season, but I guess you are using it as an example that shows we are essentially looking past this season. I agree to a point. I think we'll be a better team this year. I think we'll win more games than we did last year. But I don't believe that there was anything they could have done to make us a contender in one year. Improve us,, yes, make us a contender, I don't think so. again, you have a point on Mingo but I think I understand the concern with Milliner. Not sure I agree, but injuries may have played a part in passing on him. Anyway, I tend to agree we won't be a playoff bound team next year. I mean, there is always hope, but realistically, no. I think we are at best a 7 win team. We'll see. Again, welcome 
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Getting rid of Shurmur makes us a 500 team.
Joe Thomas #73
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I don't think we sold out on 2013 in lieu of 2014 if that is what you were implying.
I do think apprehension of greatness even from this Homer is far fetched. We got a young team all getting into a new Offense n New Defense - I of course hope for good things but it will be hard to see GREAT things in this first year.
I am confused by your Millner reasoning. Mistake in the draft process??? Possibly we will find out in the future...I hope Mingo's progress eliminates that even if Millner shows Greatness in his career as well.
McFadden hits a need - even a first round rookie its hard to expect them NOT to Struggle so I'm sure he will have to get over the hump. But the kid is a natural...for a 3rd round investment I'm pleased.
The selling of the picks I thought had nothing premeditated as a plan for next year more so as a reaction to the talent that had been picked already...we showed later round grades on what was left n thought we got a steal for upgrading 2014 draft instead. No assurance of talent but this was a weak class which made each round weaker than the one before it.
I think we had a very very young team n outside of the NEW O system n NEW D system holding us back. We are committing to a lot of the youth already here.
Cameron TE (Watson gone) is he more talented?
Skrine, Gipson n Bademosi DBs how will they progress in this NEW D?
Trent, Weeden, Little n Gordan...We know they will get better - how much so will the NEW system actually help or hinder???
OL...Pinkston health??? Lava has gotten better with each season. Schwartz as good as he was as a rookie he will be that much better this season.
We have a lot of young players that can n will step up...we don't know exactly who n how many until the season enfolds.
Actually the trade for Bess was a NOW thing.
The Dawson thing...everyone makes mistakes it was a 3 year contract that he wanted n we just didn't want to give it...me in charge n probably 99% of the Browns fans here...would give it. They for some reason didn't wish to. Graham??? Only if we have it bite us in a Playoff game...which I would be tickled pink if we got there. But I don't have an answer but don't put it in some giving up on 2013 theory??? Not quite sure if that is what you implied.
We will see how fast we learn n believe in the new systems...that will be key. The beauty of it is - we get success out of it this year Man o Man what we have to look forward to as we will only get better as we have CONTINUITY!!!
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
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First off, welcome to the board. To your post, I disagree. There's no reason this is only a 5 win team. This team won 5 games last year, pretty close to the same roster. Yes, we're thin at corner, and that's a very serious concern, but is losing a 34 year old corner going to kill us the way everyone seems to think? I find it unlikely. With the new attacking defense we are going to run, and constantly bringing in fresh guys in the front 7, our secondary won't have to cover as long. Yes, it's an area of concern, but it's not the death sentence for this team the way some are saying. Add in that we got better at receiver adding Nelson and Bess, a new coaching staff whose philosophy better fits our offense (especially Weeden) and I think you're going to see a much improved offense. Also, looking at the schedule, it sets up pretty nicely for us. Miami in Week 1, at home, is a VERY winnable game. In fact, we're only a 1.5 point underdog in that game. Week 2, a Baltimore team who will be trying to find themselves after the departure of Ed Reed and Ray Lewis, is also a winnable game. Week 3 against a one dimensional Vikings team (our biggest concern is our secondary -- No need to worry about that with Christian Ponder under center) Week 4 against Cincy -- Best team in the division this year. However, you know how those games are, it doesn't matter how good/bad each team is, it's usually a split. Week 5 against a bad Buffalo team. That's a "should win" game. Week 6 against Detroit -- Which Detroit team shows up this year? Who knows, but take the Over in that game LOL I'll stop there, you're looking 6 games into the season, and 6 winnable game. Are we gonna start 6-0? No, but would you be shocked to start 3-3 or even 4-2 in that span? I wouldn't. Give a young team like us the confidence going forward, and you never know what will happen.
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Quote:
1. They didn't sign Phil Dawson: This was a huge red flag to me, I think even Lombardi knows Phil is the best, no way they let him get away if the planned on making a playoff run.
Welcome aboard. Phil didn't want to be here. I don't think we just let him walk, takes two to tango. I'm sure the cost to keep him outweighed the possible 1-2 years we would have kept him.
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2. The draft: Trading away picks for next year, IMO this tells me they are stock piling picks, so next draft they will have the ammo to trade up and finally draft a franchise QB and still have some picks to shore up the defense.*Unless Weeden becomes "it".
They need time to evaluate what they have, what they need and what they can get out of some of the guys under the radar. They don't know what they have until they see it work within their systems (both O&D). They obviously didn't see value there in the 4 & 5th rounds, so I applaud their ability to turn those into higher round picks for next year. It does give them options should they need to move up to grab a player, or just want to add extra guys, even if Weeden works out or not.
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3. The draft: With D. Milner still available and our defensive backfield being the mess that it is, I was 100% sure they were going to draft him, but they grab MIngo instead who IMO is a tad skinny, it's going to take him a year, maybe more, too do some weight training and add more muscle, so he can be as explosive as we want him to be.
Don't worry about Mingo being "Skinny". He'll bulk up and get to the weight he needs to be to play. There are many successful OLBs who play in the 230-240 range and right now Mingo is at 237. This is really a non-issue, way overplayed by fans and media. He's already very explosive, and will be a factor this year, with plenty of upside ahead of him.
Pass rusher was obviously the FO's pick of choice, and they got the rusher they wanted. If Milliner were 6th pick material, and if his medical question weren't an issue, he wouldn't have fallen to the Jets. Had he got past them, who knows how far he would have fallen. We don't need another #1 CB, we need a solid #2 and McFadden may be exactly that. He has the tools and a good eye for the ball.
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I took a look at next years schedule and it seems we are going to face every elite QB in the league with one cover corner, unless every pick is a stud (YEAH RIGHT!!!) we are in trouble.
I wouldn't worry about that just yet, we'll field two decent corners and the pass rush should make the secondary look good. We just need to score enough points to win.
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I say we win around 5 games next year while we fine tune our pass rush and learn a new offense, of course this all goes out the window if #3 can get it together, which I don't think will happen, he does not seem to me (IMO) to be brightest bulb in the pack.
Maybe. That's my take on paper too, but a good D and an O that get's on track could easily turn that to 7-8 wins, which would be a huge step in the right direction. What we need to see this season is Weeden putting up strong numbers and Chud out-coaching the competition so we know going forward that we have the right pieces in place.
JMHO 
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/hfMNC7T.jpg) "I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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Welcome.
I stopped reading at playoff run. I suspect 6-8 wins this year, no playoffs. Next off season I suspect is where we will see a real difference. I believe the regime even said they were going to build slow.
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Quote:
There's no reason this is only a 5 win team.
I can think of one. . .
Although I don't think the new coaching staff will allow him to submarine our season. They will have a quick hook if he craps the bed and Campbell can at least keep or head above water.
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I don't understand the Weeden hate.
Is it just that Browns fans are never going to be happy with a Quarterback?
Is it that they hated the pick to begin with, and refuse to have an open mind about his performance?
Is it that he's constantly being compared to a Quarterback class of RGIII, Luck, and Wilson who had ridiculous, not normal for a Rookie type success? And that he had a pretty "typical" Rookie season.
Is it that Browns fans don't see that Weeden was put in a system last year that made him destined to fail?
Or is it that I simply don't know much about football, and I'm the one in the wrong thinking Weeden can be a solid Quarterback in the NFL?
I don't know, I just don't see Weeden failing in this system.
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He's old...we hate old people
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I am optimistic about Weeden's prospects in this system with these coaches. But there is a non-zero chance that he is just not good and kills us with a few clunker games.
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Quote:
I don't understand the Weeden hate.
Is it just that Browns fans are never going to be happy with a Quarterback?
Is it that they hated the pick to begin with, and refuse to have an open mind about his performance?
Is it that he's constantly being compared to a Quarterback class of RGIII, Luck, and Wilson who had ridiculous, not normal for a Rookie type success? And that he had a pretty "typical" Rookie season.
Is it that Browns fans don't see that Weeden was put in a system last year that made him destined to fail?
Or is it that I simply don't know much about football, and I'm the one in the wrong thinking Weeden can be a solid Quarterback in the NFL?
I don't know, I just don't see Weeden failing in this system.
He didn't lead us to a 10 win season, so he stinks LOL
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Even the most ardent Weeden supporter has to admit there were times when his performance was abysmal, where he made mistakes that had nothing to do with the system and caused us to question his ability to play at this level. He does have the tools, and I (personally) want him to succeed, but I certainly don't feel the criticism is unfair or unwarranted. Bottom line, he needs to get his $#!% together.
"I am undeterred and I am undaunted." --Kevin Stefanski "Big hairy American winning machines." --Baker Mayfield #gmstrong
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He was a Rookie who made mistakes. You're right.
I also saw a guy who, for the most part, learned from those mistakes, which is really all you can ask from a Rookie QB.
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I don't disagree that there were times he made stupid mistakes. But they were Rookie mistakes.
I don't disagree that he needs to get better.
I just don't understand the thought that a lot of our fans have that he can't and/or won't get better.
He improved a lot from Game 1 to Game 15 -- That gives me reason to think he'll make a big step from Year 1 to Year 2.
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Just answering this for myself personally. Quote:
I don't understand the Weeden hate.
Is it just that Browns fans are never going to be happy with a Quarterback?
I'll be happy with a QB when he proves to be capable of being a franchise guy. I don't see that in Weeden. If I'm wrong and he lights it up, I'll happily eat a plate full of crow.
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Is it that they hated the pick to begin with, and refuse to have an open mind about his performance?
I hated the pick to begin with because he was going to be a 2nd year player turning 30 and was doomed from the start. I have an open mind about his performance... but man was it bad last year.
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Is it that he's constantly being compared to a Quarterback class of RGIII, Luck, and Wilson who had ridiculous, not normal for a Rookie type success? And that he had a pretty "typical" Rookie season.
He's not afforded a "typical" rookie season at age 29. His development window is insanely shorter than the guys you listed there so for him to underperform thus far is really bad. He's not going to get 3-5 years to get good like most rookies are given because of his age... fair or not this year is it for him.
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Is it that Browns fans don't see that Weeden was put in a system last year that made him destined to fail?
Or is it that I simply don't know much about football, and I'm the one in the wrong thinking Weeden can be a solid Quarterback in the NFL?
I don't know, I just don't see Weeden failing in this system.
Everyone keeps saying this but while I think a vertical system is best suited for his talents, it also exposes him a LOT more than the WCO did last year. My main problems with Weeden are his random bouts of inaccuracy and how much he turns the ball over. Now... take a QB with those flaws and ask him to air it out.
Yes, he's going to be using his arm more in this system but there's a legitimate chance that those mistakes are magnified. You might see a guy who thrives in a vertical attack. I see a guy who is mistake prone being put in many, many more situations to make those mistakes.
I hope you're right and he thrives but at the end of the year, I don't see Weeden looking so good that we're not going to go after a QB hard in 2014. Personally, I think they would've moved on from him already if they had a legitimate 2nd option.
We're... we're good?
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I'm not sure if it is unfounded or not, but isn't it a popular opinion that Weeden regressed as the season progressed?
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Quote:
Even the most ardent Weeden supporter has to admit there were times when his performance was abysmal, where he made mistakes that had nothing to do with the system and caused us to question his ability to play at this level. He does have the tools, and I (personally) want him to succeed, but I certainly don't feel the criticism is unfair or unwarranted. Bottom line, he needs to get his $#!% together.
Absolutely. he made a lot of mistakes. His 1st game, in particular, had me wondering (to myself) if McCoy might have been a better choice.  However, then he bounced back to have a nice game in week 2. he had ups and downs, and made some mistakes repeatedly that drive me crazy. He also learned and grew. He still needs to learn how to look off a Safety better, and must speed up his reading of the defense. He was a rookie though, and far from a finished product.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I have to admit , I had a another post written up and it just disappeared on me, so I rushed that one out,I think some of you are taking it out of context.
@Damanshot , We are in 100% agreement about Phil, my only point is, if they wanted to win now, they would've done whatever it took to sign him.
Not sure where I said stock piling picks is a bad thing, I"m quite impressed with the forward thinking and as I stated I"m quite excited about next years draft.
@eotab, I'm implying they consider this year to be a rebuild and a evaluation of our QB and nothing more.
Milner, my concern is we have only one good corner in a league where you need at least 3 and it's one of the hardest positions to fill,possible shut down corner in our reach and we pass?, I too hope we forget about him and MIngo becomes a beast.
The selling of the picks I was speculating but so are you. I really think they plan on drafting our franchise QB next year since this crop was so weak.
As for Bess it reminds me of when we acquired Joe Jurevicius, not saying he is as good but a decent possession receiver.
I"m not saying they are giving up on the season, just looking at it as a rebuild with realistic expectations.
@Topdawg, Don't know who said losing Sheldon Brown was big, I"m only saying we need 3, we have one, it's a huge concern I applaud them for getting younger at the position, I just don't have much faith that late round draft picks will turn out to be studs,if history teaches us anything.
I do look at pittspuke and see that they have average corners and I also hope our pass rush will negate the difference, just not sold on the ones we have now.
As for the schedule, I thought we had a easy one last year and look at how that turned out, the NFL changes year to year so I take nothing for granted.
Thanks for the replies guys, keep em coming.
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Getting rid of Shurmur makes us a 500 team.
I'm not sure if that's true or not but I saw a team last year that won 4 games, looked like it should have won 6 or 7 and all of the young players are now one precious year older.
I think a large part of how many games we win next year is these 3 things (and these are in order)
1. Coaching staff and how well they can pull our relatively young team into a new system quickly
2. Health and how much time our key players miss
3. Weeden has to improve.
If those 3 things go the right way, I could see us winning 9 games, if any of them don't go right, we could very well be a 5 win team.
yebat' Putin
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Quote:
I don't understand the Weeden hate.
Is it just that Browns fans are never going to be happy with a Quarterback?
Is it that they hated the pick to begin with, and refuse to have an open mind about his performance?
Is it that he's constantly being compared to a Quarterback class of RGIII, Luck, and Wilson who had ridiculous, not normal for a Rookie type success? And that he had a pretty "typical" Rookie season.
Is it that Browns fans don't see that Weeden was put in a system last year that made him destined to fail?
Or is it that I simply don't know much about football, and I'm the one in the wrong thinking Weeden can be a solid Quarterback in the NFL?
I don't know, I just don't see Weeden failing in this system.
Why do you see him succeeding?
I think he's entirely capable of having a DA-like breakout here. But he needs to shed the DA part.
When I look at a rookie QB, I try not to look at win or losses or stats. You look at the physical tools, the understanding of the game and the progression. You're basically asking a guy to climb a taller mountain after he's just climbed a mountain. Some will plateau there.
I see all of the tools in Weeden. I haven't seen much understanding, or progression.
He can be a solid QB in the NFL. But he has a very short window for the light to turn on. The odds are not in his favor.
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@CalDawg , I read somewhere they didn't even offer Phil a contract as for Phil not wanting to be here, just curious, how do you know that?
As for the rest of your post I pretty much agree, only you need 3 good corners not just 2, maybe I'm just jaded but I don't have as much faith in the later round picks, you say Milner fell, well look where we picked up our corner.......
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@CalDawg , I read somewhere they didn't even offer Phil a contract as for Phil not wanting to be here, just curious, how do you know that?
seriously, this has been beat to death.
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Quote:
I don't understand the Weeden hate.
I think the majority of people feel that Weeden can get better but at 29, he has to do it faster than most rookies... yes, there are some that hate him for whatever reason and some that appear to have almost blind faith in him... most people are comfortably in the middle taking a "wait and see" how much better he is this year approach.
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I don't know, I just don't see Weeden failing in this system.
The title of the thread is about "expectations" which are individual and subjective... this comment depends entirely on how you view "success" and "failure" which is also individual and subjective..... In the end, fair or unfair, Weeden will in large part be judged on how many games we win... If we are a 4-6 win team again, there is a 99% chance he will be judged a failure... 7-8 he will probably get a passing but not stellar grade... 9 or more will be viewed as a success by most people.... and there are a select few that even if we lose a lot of games will explain why it wasn't Weeden's fault and some that even if we win 10 games will explain why we did it in spite of Weeden rather than because of him.... that's just the way it goes 'round here.
yebat' Putin
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As for Weeden, without looking, wasn't his completion rate at around 54%? That is beyond awful and you think he will improve while throwing even longer passes????
Game 1 last year was probably the worst perfomance by I QB that I have ever seen, he did improve in game 2, but I seen little to no improvement the rest of the year. He had the deer in headlights look all year long, holding the ball forever.
Trent Richardson in on record saying they had to dumb down the offense for #3, that my friends is not a good sign, most players would take a bullet for their QB, this also calls into question his leadership ability.
That said, I think he has a great arm and is capable of becoming "solid"QB but this is his last chance, I'm rooting for him.
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@Arps , in case you did not read my original post, i'm new to the board ,besides pretty sure you were not part of that conversation.
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That said, I think he has a great arm and is capable of becoming "solid"QB but this is his last chance, I'm rooting for him.
I think if you had just said this, you would have about 90% of the board agreeing with you.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
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As for Weeden, without looking, wasn't his completion rate at around 54%? That is beyond awful and you think he will improve while throwing even longer passes????
You are over-simplifying it. It's not as easy as "shorter throws are easier"
Weeden's knocks coming out of college were his footwork, and the fact that he came from a spread offense.
So what do we do? Put him under center, to make him drop back (with his questionable footwork) while scanning the field.
He was put into an offense he had never been asked to run before, that not only didn't fit his strengths, it flat out exploited his weaknesses.
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Welcome aboard. Don't believe everything you read. Consider most of it. Shoot trolls on sight (site?). Hope to read more. Potential for a surprise with what we have. No Shurm should help IMO. Root 'em!
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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While I would agree that expectations should be tempered for next year... I think it's laughable that some of you think that an extra 3rd & 4th round pick next year is somehow going to net us a franchise QB. It won't.
Also, I continue to be amazed at the fascination some of you guys have for Dee Millner. DB's are not as valuable in a 3-4 as pass rushers. They have made that crystal clear this off-season.
I also find it funny that all the "Dee Millner guys" have a sudden fascination with Mingo's weight. I don't remember ANYONE ever having this much concern when D'Qwell Jackson, for example, was in the 220's when he was drafted by Phil & Romeo. Yet, look at him now. Couldn't be less of a concern. Mingo is atleast 10 lbs. heavier than Jackson was when he came out. Mingo will fill out to 255-260 in a couple years.. anyone who thinks otherwise or feels the need to fret over it really needs to find some better things to do to fill their time. Seriously.
![[Linked Image from media.247sports.com]](http://media.247sports.com/Uploads/Assets/762/857/2_857762.JPG) Pope Dezz!
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Weeden doesn't appear to me to have any "moxy".
Big arm? Check.
Prototypical size? Check.
Good college career? Check.
Accurate? Still TBD at the pro level, but very accurate in college. For argument's sake, let's call it a 'Check'.
His coach did him zero favors last year. You could physically see Weeden go into a shell after Shurmur kind of dumped on him in the media about turnovers. Here's what I would say to Weeden: "Friggin' grow a set dude.". Seriously, stop feeling sorry for yourself and quit with the Charlie Brown slumped shoulders, deer in the headlights body language and just go play some football.
If it was possible to spot such a thing, he doesn't appear to have any intestinal fortitude, if you ask me. As a QB, that's not a good thing.
JMHO ... and I in no way want him to fail. I want him to succeed. I just didn't see much in the way of mental toughness last year. I think he needs bigger balls.
I am excited to see what Chud and Co. can do with him this year. I do think the FO gave him a vote of confidence by not drafting a QB ... even tho they probably didn't really like any of them. I think they think there is possibly something there.
But Weeden has to own it. And he can't be a pansy. Put the damn team on your shoulders in the 4th quarter and lead us to victory. Please.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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Quote:
While I would agree that expectations should be tempered for next year... I think it's laughable that some of you think that an extra 3rd & 4th round pick next year is somehow going to net us a franchise QB. It won't. [/qoute]
I don't know if you were talking directly to me or just clicking on me, but I have been one of the ones saying I have no issue with trading away our 4th/5th round picks.
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Also, I continue to be amazed at the fascination some of you guys have for Dee Millner. DB's are not as valuable in a 3-4 as pass rushers. They have made that crystal clear this off-season.
Again, Mingo was my #1 choice.
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I also find it funny that all the "Dee Millner guys" have a sudden fascination with Mingo's weight. I don't remember ANYONE ever having this much concern when D'Qwell Jackson, for example, was in the 220's when he was drafted by Phil & Romeo. Yet, look at him now. Couldn't be less of a concern. Mingo is atleast 10 lbs. heavier than Jackson was when he came out. Mingo will fill out to 255-260 in a couple years.. anyone who thinks otherwise or feels the need to fret over it really needs to find some better things to do to fill their time. Seriously.
I'm not concerned over his weight. I will tell you that the response you're going to get is that DQ was a 2nd round pick, and Mingo was a top 10 pick. Right or wrong, that's the argument you'll get.
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It's kind of early to be looking forward to next year's draft. I usually wait at least until the bye. That's usually the last bright spot of the season.
We'll see what we have when they get the team on the field for a couple of real games. It's too soon to give up now. There's plenty of time for that once the season starts.
"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
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Accurate? Still TBD at the pro level, but very accurate in college. For argument's sake, let's call it a 'Check'.
That's quite a stretch. He didn't strike me as a "very accurate" passer in college, especially because he wasn't usually challenged to make the type of throws you need to make in the pros in Gundy's version of the spread offense. And after watching him play last year, I don't know we can even lean toward "check". I didn't find him to be accurate at all last year. Let's hope he improves though and hope that this offense is better suited for him. If he can't get it done this year, there's no excuses left.
Pope Dezz!
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TopDawg - Just clicked on you... comments were just general observations of this thread and others. Wasn't singling out anybody specifically..
Pope Dezz!
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@Arps , in case you did not read my original post, i'm new to the board ,besides pretty sure you were not part of that conversation.
Im pretty sure that I was part of at least 2 of them. Since you are new, how would you know? I didn mean to offend you, just not looking forward to yet another long drawn out Banner bashing thread over Dawson.
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Legend
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Lower my expectations? Can't be done.
On the upside, we're almost guaranteed to do better than I expect.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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I believe I've posted the current NFL examples on here several times... NFL OLBs are 255+ in 3-4 and Mingo played at 230. It's a projection, and if his best quality is his speed, there is definitely risk that he won't be able to maintain it.
3-4 ILBs (like Bowman and Willis) can easily play at 240.
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This will make my 4th season with rock-bottom low expectations.
I am mentally prepared for zero wins, Superbowl win, & everything in between.
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Not sure that's possible. 6 wins is pretty low as it is.
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Lower your expectations for next
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