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Man, if they decide that they want to move him, I would be a player all day long in trying to obtain him. I like Freeman as a QB, and think that he would do incredibly well in Norv's/Chud's offense. I also don't understand why the Bucs show so little interest in him. It really amazes me. Bucs showing mysterious lack of faith in their QB, Josh Freeman - NFL - CBSSports.com News, Rumors, Scores, Stats, Fantasy http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/22183...qb-josh-freemanWhy don't the Tampa Bay Buccaneers like quarterback Josh Freeman? They can say they do all they want, but their actions speak differently. They haven't given him a contract extension, even though Freeman is in the final year of his deal coming off a season where he set franchise marks for yards and touchdown passes, and they also drafted Mike Glennon in the third round of the NFL Draft last week. They can sugarcoat it all they want, but it's evident the Bucs don't like Freeman as much as they might say. I don't get it. For months, we've been hearing talk from those around the Bucs organization, and some inside, who say there is friction between coach Greg Schiano and Freeman. The word is Schiano doesn't think Freeman has enough fire in the belly, that he isn't his type of quarterback. "What does that even mean?" one NFC personnel director said. "What does he want from the gu?" Freeman is a gym rat. He loves the game. He is one of the first in the facility and one of the last to leave. That is something nobody in the organization can deny. The kid loves football. But he does it in his own style, which might not be the way Schiano wants it. Schiano is fire and bravado. Freeman is more easygoing than that. So there's friction. And it leaves Freeman hanging out there entering the final year of his contract. This much we know: Schiano didn't draft Freeman. He inherited him. General manager Mark Dominik drafted Freeman. And when he did, there were questions about it. I know. I questioned it at the time. A year later, I admitted I was wrong. Freeman can play. But the fact that the head coach is internally questioning it -- even if he denies it publicly -- says there are issues. One Buccaneers source said Schiano would like to see Freeman take charge of the huddle and the locker room more. "He wants a guy who is going to get in guys faces when they make mistakes," the source said. "The fiery, take-charge guy." Said the NFC personnel director: "They can't all be Peyton Manning." Freeman hasn't led the Bucs to the playoffs since being the team's first-round pick four years ago. But there are reasons, some due to a lack of talent for much of his time there. Some of it has been his knack for trying to do too much. But the Bucs are getting better, especially on offense. The pieces are all in place. At the league meetings in Arizona in March, Schiano once again publicly backed his quarterback. "I've said I believe we can win and achieve all the goals we want with Josh Freeman as our quarterback," Schiano said. "But to say you're married, well, nobody is married to anyone in this game. The reality is this is a performance-based game. You've got to win. They're not married to me. You've got to win or I'm not going to be the coach. Everybody in this game gets that." Freeman threw for 4,065 yards and 27 touchdowns last season. There were only six others in the league to do that last season. Eli Manning, Joe Flacco and Andrew Luck didn't do it. In two of the past three seasons, Freeman has thrown at least 25 touchdown passes. Flacco, who just signed a mega-contact extension after leading the Ravens to a Super Bowl victory, has never had a 4,000-yard, 25-touchdown season. In studying Freeman's tapes from last season, there were times where he looked like the franchise passer the Bucs wonder if they have. He was deadly accurate, read the field with his eyes and made strong throws. At other times, he let his mechanics slip and his poor footwork led to inaccuracy, which contributed to his 54.8 completion percentage. That is bad. There were things that impacted that low number. For one, the Bucs are a deep passing team, which will lower those numbers. And then after studying him closely on tape, there were other factors such as drops, poor routes, bad reads by the receivers and some stopping on their routes. Take his four-interception game against the Saints in December in a 41-0 blowout. Of the four picks, one was because tight end Dallas Clark failed to get across the face of corner Jabari Greer, one was a misread on a route run by Vincent Jackson and a third came when Tiquan Underwood stopped on his go route. Is that on Freeman? There is too much to like for the Bucs to be playing this kid this way. He is big, strong, tough, spins his head, and just needs to stop trying to do too much when things go badly. If he can do that, and work on his footwork, the Bucs might be spending more than they expected when it comes time for an extension. With Glennon being a rookie, there really is no quarterback controversy in terms of who will play in 2013. But there seems to be one in regards to the confidence the Bucs -- or at least Schiano -- are showing in their fourth-year quarterback. What I can't figure out is why.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I just don't see it but hey I still think Flacco just got on a hot streak in the playoffs but he still sucks lol
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I suggested that Freeman is the next Jason Campbell in another thread a couple months ago, and for some reason people thought that idea was pure blasphemy.
I don't intend to restart that debate (what's done is done), but I still support my viewpoint and I think Tampa Bay's actions reflect much of what I was saying. He's a below-average NFL starting QB with one average (and overrated) year under his belt. Yes, his 2010 season was average IMO. Very 2011-2012 Alex Smith-like, albeit slightly better.
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Does the owner favor Schiano?
If I'm the owner, and there's a power struggle between the coach and GM over Josh Freeman, I probably side with whoever's backing Freeman.
I don't think he's elite, but he could be, and you ride that chance until the odds dip to an unfeasible point.
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OK, maybe it's just me, but until I read that article, I hadn't heard or read anything from anyone that Freeman might be, even remotely, on the outs with the Bucs.
There are a host of reasons why they haven't done a new deal with Freeman. Remember, Flacco didn't have a new deal going into last season either. It could be a tactic to hopefully get a better deal more in favor of the Bucs. Dunno but that would explain it to a degree.
As for them drafting a QB in the third round, why not. I mean, picking up a 3rd round QB doesn't mean they don't like Freeman.
So, the question I have, did someone pee on this reporters Wheaties or does this story have legs?
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Another reporter desperate for a story?
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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Quote:
Another reporter desperate for a story?
Makes you wonder doesn't it. But this story will get picked up and soon, it will be considered fact.
Another thing you have to ask yourself, is this maybe, just maybe Freemans agent planting this to see if he can generate a new contract for his client or maybe even a trade of some kind.... ??????
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
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For me Freeman is the QB that sits on the edge of being a top 10 QB but just never has the it factor to get over the hump...Freeman will sit on the edge show signs of brilliants and than show signs of what the ..... just never getting over the hump.
To me he is always gonna be somewhere in the 10-20 QB rating in the leauge.
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I do think this reporter is making more out of the story than there is. He is also being very one-sided in his argument.
I like Freeman. He exploded on the scene a few years ago. However, he struggled in the second half of the past two seasons. He simply made a lot of dumb throws that cost TB some games. Right now, there are some major questions about him.
I do think he has the potential to be a very good qb. He has great skills. He certainly needs to become more consistent and become a leader---at least on the field.
I doubt that he is going to be on the market. I think the reporter is in love w/hyperbole. Next year, it could be a different story.
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For me Freeman is the QB that sits on the edge of being a top 10 QB but just never has the it factor to get over the hump...Freeman will sit on the edge show signs of brilliants and than show signs of what the ..... just never getting over the hump.
To me he is always gonna be somewhere in the 10-20 QB rating in the leauge.
Honestly, if you are right, then we already have a guy like that. No sense in breaking the bank on another one.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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Doesn't sound as if you are very impressed with him.. Myself I'd probably like to see what we have in Weeden in THIS system. if he's not the one, then we go find one in next years draft or trade for someone you believe in or find the next big thing in the arena league (yeah,, right) or the CFL maybe even. Just stay out of the LFL...LOL
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As much as I'm not a fan of him as a QB (he's definitely in my bottom-half of NFL starting QBs), I agree that there's probably not much of a story here.
He's getting the Flacco treatment, as you said. Although Flacco has been the better QB, even not including what happened last year.
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I'm exactly midway between Tampa and Miami, so that is the majority of our sports news. Very little on JAX down here. I can say I have heard nothing to even hint this story has any basis over hypothetical opinions. Been stories of Tebow and Sanchez but none on Freeman. I just looked at our local media and nothing on this story at all.And looked at the Tampa Local sports page and again, nothing on this story. http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/bucsthe only QB article I could find there http://www.tampabay.com/sports/football/bucs/bucs-pick-glennon-has-fans-with-more-on-the-way/2118556
Last edited by FloridaFan; 05/03/13 09:50 AM.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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As much as I'm not a fan of him as a QB (he's definitely in my bottom-half of NFL starting QBs), I agree that there's probably not much of a story here.
He's getting the Flacco treatment, as you said. Although Flacco has been the better QB, even not including what happened last year.
he's not getting the Flacco treatment is the point of the writer though. Flacco was offered $15-16mil/year and he turned it down and stated that he was "betting on himself" (turned out pretty good for him)
Bucs are not offering Freeman an extension. Not a story IMO (yet), but if they don't in July, then, yes, it is a story because he is a fringe top10 QB and they would be signalling that they do not want him.
I'd gladly trade them Weeden & Pitt's 3rd rounder for Freeman without any thought about it 
#gmstrong
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Quote:
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As much as I'm not a fan of him as a QB (he's definitely in my bottom-half of NFL starting QBs), I agree that there's probably not much of a story here.
He's getting the Flacco treatment, as you said. Although Flacco has been the better QB, even not including what happened last year.
he's not getting the Flacco treatment is the point of the writer though. Flacco was offered $15-16mil/year and he turned it down and stated that he was "betting on himself" (turned out pretty good for him)
Bucs are not offering Freeman an extension. Not a story IMO (yet), but if they don't in July, then, yes, it is a story because he is a fringe top10 QB and they would be signalling that they do not want him.
I'd gladly trade them Weeden & Pitt's 3rd rounder for Freeman without any thought about it
I thought people would understand what I was saying. I should have been more clear.
He's getting the Flacco treatment in that they don't think he's played well enough to give him an extension before his contract expires. They rather wait the season out and see if he improves (or at least keep their options open) before committing to him for another 5-6 years.
Same exact thing that happened to Flacco — only again, I think Flacco has been better for his entire career (other than 2010).
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Quote:
Another reporter desperate for a story?
Actually, this story has been making the rounds for a while. I think that I posted a similar story prior to the draft.
Here's a link from Tampa Bay about Freeman. There are other articles with a similar angle out there.
http://www.tampabay.com/blogs/bucs/heres-why-the-bucs-havent-had-a-shakeup-at-quarterback/2114014
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Quote:
Quote:
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As much as I'm not a fan of him as a QB (he's definitely in my bottom-half of NFL starting QBs), I agree that there's probably not much of a story here.
He's getting the Flacco treatment, as you said. Although Flacco has been the better QB, even not including what happened last year.
he's not getting the Flacco treatment is the point of the writer though. Flacco was offered $15-16mil/year and he turned it down and stated that he was "betting on himself" (turned out pretty good for him)
Bucs are not offering Freeman an extension. Not a story IMO (yet), but if they don't in July, then, yes, it is a story because he is a fringe top10 QB and they would be signalling that they do not want him.
I'd gladly trade them Weeden & Pitt's 3rd rounder for Freeman without any thought about it
I thought people would understand what I was saying. I should have been more clear.
He's getting the Flacco treatment in that they don't think he's played well enough to give him an extension before his contract expires. They rather wait the season out and see if he improves (or at least keep their options open) before committing to him for another 5-6 years.
Same exact thing that happened to Flacco — only again, I think Flacco has been better for his entire career (other than 2010).
you, sir, are mistaken. the same thing did not happen to Flacco. Flacco turned down contract extensions from the Ravens. they were offering him Philip Rivers money and he wanted top-QB in the NFL money.
those extension talks often don't happen until July though, which is why I am saying that it is a non-story (for now)
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl...-apart/1970287/
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Last August, when Baltimore Ravens brass met with Joe Flacco's agent to briefly discuss a contract extension for the quarterback one year before his rookie deal expired, they were very close to an agreement.
Just how close?
Only $1 million separated the sides, according to a person with knowledge of the negotiations who spoke to USA TODAY Sports on the condition of anonymity because the team has not discussed the specifics of last year's talks.
That's $1 million in total value over the course of a six-year offer
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I agree it's a non-story.
Adjusted for NFL contract inflation, that deal they were offering Flacco wasn't worth that much. Rivers' and Roethlisberger's contracts were already outdated. Back in Fall 2012, I don't think anyone actually thought Flacco was better than Roethlisberger and I personally think Rivers was/is a lot better than Flacco. If they were willing to give him a contract similar to theirs, it doesn't necessarily mean they thought he was as good as them, and it doesn't necessarily mean it was a good deal for Flacco himself. If Freeman were to agree to an extension this summer, I think his pay would be pretty similar to Rivers/Roethlisberger's as well.
I have to admit that I completely forgot about the fact that they offered him an extension, so I apologize for being misleading. It's not like it was that great of a deal for him, though (not saying this was the point you're trying to make). The proposed deal favored the Ravens IMO.
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I would trade for Freeman and wouldn't think twice about giving up a 1st or 2nd round pick along with Weeden. (as long as he signs a 4-5 year contract extension. Good Qb's are hard to come by... he is a good QB and probably the only piece of the offense we are missing.
Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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I've always admired Freeman from afar - ever since his rookie season.
1. I don't follow the Bucs at all to be any kind of authority. So I will guess here - he's probably had close to A DIFFERENT OC every season???
2. The Bozo is writing an article in the draft aftermath New Dead Zone. But there is one small detail that actually could be merit to this discussion...blind squirrel variety.
Freeman is in the last year of his contract. We just had Flacco, Ryan young QBs going to get a boat load of $$$$ If Freeman has a good agent this battle for his contract will be long n hard. Tampa will have the NO STATE INCOME TAX to their favor but not much else.
3. If (BIG IF) he hits the FA market n we do not have a Franchise QB in Weeden...I'm glad we got a stock pile of Cap Space to go for it! I love his skill set, Norv n Chud coaching him n this Offense with our guys, OL, Trent, Gordon, Little, Bess, Cameron - Then a younger Big Ben type of guy! Wow oh Wow!!!
4. I know he has a pretty good Interior...but I'm not sure what kind of OTs he has - whatever it is - NOT CLOSE TO OURS 
5. As a true Bozo I'm sure his major premise of this article is based on the Big Time investment of a 3rd round QB (Glennon) who has a lot of work ahead of him to even get close to Freeman. But then there is a reason why I call them Bozos...lol 
JMHO
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Quote:
Another reporter desperate for a story?
That's my two cents.
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Quote:
Quote:
Another reporter desperate for a story?
That's my two cents.
Again, there are many similar stories out there, so it doesn't seem that it is one reporter stirring the pot.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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j/c Has Freeman ever had anyone to throw to? Clayton, Bryant, Benn? Not exactly Torrey Smith, Boldin, and Rice. Arguably the most talented player Freeman has had on offense was LeGarrette Blount...and they got rid of him. I do wonder whether it is worth having these "not quite elite" qbs. Somehow Flacco became the #1 QB during the playoffs, but that shouldn't happen that often. With the talent the Bucs have on their squad they really need a top 5 QB to get anywhere near the superbowl. It seems we have been blessed with horrible QBs. Only with Weeden are we stuck slightly with the "is he good enough?" question. My current football theorizing is that you absolutely need a top 5-10 QB to get anything done in this league. I think Freeman could get there with any sort of talent around him. i wouldn't want to trade a 1st for him if we have a shot at Bridgewater/Manziel, but any other draft I would consider it. If I may be frank I would have prefered to go with a guy like McCoy or Curtis Painter and tank until we could land a supreme talent at QB. If the RG3 trade had gone the other way I would have been a happy guy (this season...last year I didn't want him  )
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Well, they did have this new guy last year named Vincent Jackson... I hear he's pretty good.
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I like Freeman but it's hard to back him when it's been a few years and he still has nothing to show us.
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Well, they did have this new guy last year named Vincent Jackson... I hear he's pretty good.
that Doug Martin guy at RB can catch a few passes as well
(not to mention Mike Williams hasn't exactly had a bad career either)
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I like Freeman but it's hard to back him when it's been a few years and he still has nothing to show us.
It's never one person that makes it. that's why they call it a team sport.
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Ha. Yeah V. Jax, Mike Williams, and Doug Martin count I should really keep up to date  If he is elite he should do something with that group.
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for one, he's not elite. the only QBs I consider elite are Peyton, Brady, Brees, and Rodgers (Big Ben when healthy, but he hasn't been). RGIII, Kaepernick, Wilson, Ryan, Stafford, and maybe Flacco can get into that group this season. Freeman is in the next set of QBs. With Eli, Luck, Romo, Rivers, Schaub, Cam, maybe Dalton. However, that makes him definitely a QB that I would like starting for my team. TB had the #14 offense in the NFL last season: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff2012TB had the #8 offense in the NFL in 2010: http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/teamoff2010(yes, 2011 Freeman looked terrible. that's why he's in the group that he is in and why TB could conceivably trade him. if he was elite without question, then it wouldn't even be worth talking about him)
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Makes me lol so hard to hear people say Kaepernick is on the cusp of being elite. You serious? 10 TD's in 13 games and he can be elite? If you're putting him in there, you better be putting Alex Smith up there too.
You list guys as elite who have done it year after year at record breaking paces, then you list 3 first year QB's? YOu list Kapernick as a potential elite but put Luck with Andy Dalton?
You seriously have Eli Manning with the likes of Romo and Dalton?
Terrible list.
What am I reading?
to the topic at hand, no he isn't elite but he's tough and has been playing with a rag tag group around him. Let's not act like the Bucs are oozing with talent on offense.
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Makes me lol so hard to hear people say Kaepernick is on the cusp of being elite. You serious? 10 TD's in 13 games and he can be elite? If you're putting him in there, you better be putting Alex Smith up there too.
You list guys as elite who have done it year after year at record breaking paces, then you list 3 first year QB's? YOu list Kapernick as a potential elite but put Luck with Andy Dalton?
I think you are getting worked up a little quickly. But, let me explain my rationale.
First, it was merely a list of QBs who "could" get to that category this season.
Kaepernick - Do I think he'll get to elite? no. I think he'll fall back into the 3rd category this season. However, if he makes a jump up in play after the season he just had while getting SF a Superbowl win, it'll be hard to deny his body of work.
*also, he only started 7 games - had 15 TDs in those 7 games including his rushing TDs. Then, had 7 more TDs in 3 playoffs games.
Luck - he was not that good last year. I like him for the future as well, but, even if he has a big year, he won't be there quite yet for me. Completely subjective, but I'd view him more like Matthew Stafford. Sorry if that offends you, but his statistics along with what I saw of him don't back him being at the same level quite yet.
RGIII & Wilson - I also think DC's will catch up with what they are doing and they'll fall back. But, both had extremely good years and there is a chance that the spread offense will work and they'll be the lucky recipients of being 2 of the first ones to do it for good teams.
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You seriously have Eli Manning with the likes of Romo and Dalton?
Terrible list.
What am I reading?
Eli - hot/cold guy. He has gotten unbelievably hot for 2 stretches at the absolute perfect times in his career. However, for the rest, he's a Romo/Flacco guy. When he's hot, he's as good as anybody, but, yeah, I want more consistency.
and, again, I think you misread what I was saying. It wasn't a ranking of top QBs, it was which QBs could conceivably jump up to elite. While, they are somewhat similar lists, they are different to me.
#gmstrong
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Legend
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Luck - he was not that good last year. I like him for the future as well, but, even if he has a big year, he won't be there quite yet for me. Completely subjective, but I'd view him more like Matthew Stafford. Sorry if that offends you, but his statistics along with what I saw of him don't back him being at the same level quite yet.
Too many of you use stats as your guide.
Andrew Luck was far and away the best of the rookie qbs last year. He did more for his his team than perhaps any other player in the NFL last year. He was asked to carry that offense. He was asked to make all kinds of difficult throws. He was pounded behind a crappy OL.
Yet, some want to use completion percentage and other stupid stats to judge him. 
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Legend
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Quote:
Luck - he was not that good last year. I like him for the future as well, but, even if he has a big year, he won't be there quite yet for me. Completely subjective, but I'd view him more like Matthew Stafford. Sorry if that offends you, but his statistics along with what I saw of him don't back him being at the same level quite yet.
He took a team that was 2-14 the year before into the playoffs. He absolutely carried that team.
Vick Ballard was his running back. His defense gave up close to 400 yards and 24 points a game.
He is the sole reason that team made the playoffs.
Not that good? 
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2nd String
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2nd String
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for one, he's not elite. the only QBs I consider elite are Peyton, Brady, Brees, and Rodgers (Big Ben when healthy, but he hasn't been).
RGIII, Kaepernick, Wilson, Ryan, Stafford, and maybe Flacco can get into that group this season.
Freeman is in the next set of QBs. With Eli, Luck, Romo, Rivers, Schaub, Cam, maybe Dalton. However, that makes him definitely a QB that I would like starting for my team.
Freeman is worse than Eli, Luck, Romo, Rivers, Schaub, Cam and Dalton (well maybe not Dalton).
Eli is asked to be his entire team's offense and is still better statistically (albeit only slightly last year), and led two Super Bowl-winning teams.
Luck is asked to be his team's entire offense and almost singlehandedly led one of the league's least talented teams to the POs. If Freeman was asked to shoulder Luck's load in Indianapolis (throwing the ball 600+ times), his numbers would be worse than Luck's. It's amazing in of itself that Luck led his inferior team to an 11-5 record, while Freeman led his team to a 7-9 record. Yet Luck is his equal?
Romo is asked to be his team's entire offense and is way better statistically (he's a choker, but at least he leads his teams to situations in which he can choke).
Rivers is asked to be his team's entire offense, plays behind one of the league's worst offensive lines, and still puts up better numbers than Freeman. And when he had an offensive line like Freeman's, he put up numbers that Freeman couldn't dream of putting up.
Schaub is better statistically and has led his team to two straight PO appearances (although I'll admit that his team is rather talented).
Cam has worse personnel (no receivers outside of Steve Smith and a bad offensive line) and puts up better numbers. And he's a bigger threat to run the ball.
I think Dalton is actually Freeman's equal. Not in that they're the same type of player, but I don't know which one I would pick if I had to choose.
I don't know why people here like Freeman so much. He puts up worse numbers than almost any of the guys who are supposedly in his tier, and has less success than most of them as well. And if he was asked to shoulder the load of a Luck, Romo, Eli, Cam, or Rivers (all players who have to throw the ball significantly more OR have significantly less talent around them), his numbers would be even worse than they already are.
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He was also able to bring his team back in games that looked lost. He was so money under pressure that it was incredible.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Hall of Famer
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Luck - he was not that good last year. I like him for the future as well, but, even if he has a big year, he won't be there quite yet for me. Completely subjective, but I'd view him more like Matthew Stafford. Sorry if that offends you, but his statistics along with what I saw of him don't back him being at the same level quite yet.
Too many of you use stats as your guide.
Andrew Luck was far and away the best of the rookie qbs last year. He did more for his his team than perhaps any other player in the NFL last year. He was asked to carry that offense. He was asked to make all kinds of difficult throws. He was pounded behind a crappy OL.
Yet, some want to use completion percentage and other stupid stats to judge him.
They can't look at the reality that Indy won 11 games and made the playoffs. They had a soft schedule due to their prior season's record but it's still better than what the Browns accomplished in 2007 when they were in a similar spot.
Andrew Luck carried that team and there were some good performances by others, but Luck was the key to the team's turn around. They got him some help with the OL as well in the 3rd and 4th rounds.
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I think the way to look at it realistically is go down the list of QBs and with each n every one assess how you would wish them as in being our QB. I mean its pretty easy....for example Dalton...ahhh no. Luck actually out of the entire list combining age talent etc. my #1 pick n that's over RG3 (injury makes it a no brainer for me) who I am/was a big big fan of. But I mean I would want Luck here over EVERYONE of those QBs including Brady, Manning etc. the kicker also is Great great talent aside the kid is a Lifelong Browns fan...how much better can that be!!!
I feel so sorry for him...his OL is terrible n I don't think Indy did much to help that. I hope not to lose one of the great QB prospects of our time due to becoming damaged goods. One of my all time favorite QBs was Dan Pastorini - hope he doesn't become another. Teams will come after him more n more. 
JMHO
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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Legend
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Quote:
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Luck - he was not that good last year. I like him for the future as well, but, even if he has a big year, he won't be there quite yet for me. Completely subjective, but I'd view him more like Matthew Stafford. Sorry if that offends you, but his statistics along with what I saw of him don't back him being at the same level quite yet.
Too many of you use stats as your guide.
Andrew Luck was far and away the best of the rookie qbs last year. He did more for his his team than perhaps any other player in the NFL last year. He was asked to carry that offense. He was asked to make all kinds of difficult throws. He was pounded behind a crappy OL.
Yet, some want to use completion percentage and other stupid stats to judge him.
and some say it's crazy to consider his stats. look what I said, I used both his stats and what I saw. I saw a QB who struggled like most rookies do. He obviously has talent and I expect him to improve this season (where most 2nd year guys regress), but I'm not going to let a few comeback wins taint my view of him (or should we also be wishing for Tebow and VY?)
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2nd String
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Tebow and VY didn't have to throw the ball 40 times per game, play behind a terrible offensive line, and play on a terrible team in general.
Every week, the Colts' fate solely lies in Luck's hands. His team (and their lack of talent and tendency to want to throw the ball so often) puts more pressure on him to perform than almost any other QB in the NFL. Nobody is picking up Luck's slack, unlike Tebow and Young.
Luck is pretty good. Better than Stafford IMO, and not far off from being a top 10 QB in the NFL.
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Legend
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Please tell us what your eyes told you? Bruce Arians was quoted as saying that the guy is farther along than Peyton Manning when he was a rookie. Indy put a tremendous burden on Luck's shoulders. They ran the no huddle. They asked him to audible all the time. It was up to him to put Indy in the right formation and play. All things that they didn't ask a young Manning to do. In short, he is the smartest qb to come along in a long, long time. The guy can make every throw. He is very accurate. He reads defenses pre-snap and coverages after the snap.He doesn't check down and throw a 2 yd. pass on 3rd and 11 like Weeden and many others do. No, he throws for the first down. Does that hurt his completion percentage? You bet it does.But, I would rather have a guy out there getting the team first downs than one who completes a high number of passes because he won't throw for the first down. Luck is athletic. He can run. He is big and strong. He took a beating behind a poor OL. Yet, he stood in there and delivered the ball in the face of the rush. Like tab, I worry about him being hurt, because he took a freaking beating. He isn't as pretty as RGIII. He doesn't have the following of all the TV types. His team isn't nearly as good as others, yet he somehow led them to 11 wins. And I can't believe you are making light of his come from behind wins. The guy is the best when it's clutch time. Nah, that is not important. I like RGIII and Wilson, but put them on Indy's team and see what happens. Put Luck on either Seattle or Washington and see what happens. Can you imagine Weeden playing behind Indy's OL? LOL I said it earlier and I will say it again.............one can make a strong argument that Luck was more important to his team than any other player in the league last year. I do think Indy will have a rough season. They caught the magic last year, but that team is not very good. Of course, it will give guys like you even more reason to underrate him. All I know is this. Give me one player to start a franchise with and that guy would be Andrew Luck!
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