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Hmmm...that's an interesting twist. Work full time and go to school part-time. Employer gets a feel for you, you get a feel for the employer and an education at the same time. Not sure why that's not done more often.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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The company I work for will reimburse for classes if you achieve a B or better.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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That is ridiculous. Young people should not have a burden equal to a mortgage when graduating and just getting into their fields. Tuition is way too expensive. And books.
Textbooks are one of the biggest scams on the planet
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J/C
Interesting discussion brewing here...
Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
yebat' Putin
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
If they start handing out unlimited food and liquor as part of the cost I'll be heading back for my masters 
#gmstrong
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
If they start handing out unlimited food and liquor as part of the cost I'll be heading back for my masters
most of them do, you just have to know where to go to get them. oh, and you cannot be picky about what you eat or drink.
#gmstrong
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
If they start handing out unlimited food and liquor as part of the cost I'll be heading back for my masters
most of them do, you just have to know where to go to get them. oh, and you cannot be picky about what you eat or drink.
Quite a lot of them are sports factories and their coaches rank as the highest paid professionals in their state!
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
I never got any sort of "Resort" feeling at Case... Course, it's been a while.
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Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with paying professors well in comparison/competition to other universities. I'm not making any mention of this to knock the professors themselves, some of whom I actually consider friends now.
I just think that their salaries, at least in UT's case, have become a microcosm and a demonstration of schools being able to spend almost irresponsibly due to the high cost of tuition, which is fueled by the government guaranteed loans at the expense of the students.
I think you're trying to have it both ways in these arguments.
1.) Law school profs aren't the top of the field (i.e. they couldn't get jobs that pay much better in private practice).
2.) They are underworked and have cushy jobs.
These can't both be true -- if they are overpaid (and underworked) - then every lawyer on the market is going to try to get the job. As a consequence the standards for profs are going to go way up (and only the cream of the crop is going to get jobs). In that case only people who could get equivalent or better jobs in private industry is going to be a law professor.
On the other hand, in law profs aren't at the top of the field - it means that the pool of candidates isn't any good -- which means that the top lawyers are finding better jobs elsewhere.
Of course, maybe you don't want good lawyers to become law professors? Then you can argue for paying them less, but you are going to get lower returns in terms of quality and output.
~Lyuokdea
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Let's not forget salesman/woman . I have a good friend who never even finished High School who makes 100k plus year in year out selling
this is what I do as well... I'm 32 and I will probably clear 6 figures three years in a row, while making over 60 for the past 7 years. I never stepped one foot into a college and nor would I. But... my gf owes about 100k with her masters in marketing and college in general, She makes what the average American who went to college makes.
It pisses me off to no extent that someone should have that much in debt and can only start off making 60k and in this economy 45-50k. the other sad part is that everyone forces their children to go to college thus compounding the issue.
I think they need to make college loans harder to get and parents need to have a sit down with their kids. There are plenty of good jobs out there that make 50k plus without a degree.
I also think they need to get these colleges for predatory college enrollment. They will blow so much smoke up your that you will believe you can make 100k+ with a masters in... library and information science, English, music, Biology, chemistry and history degrees or education. They don't tell you that Master’s degree-holders don’t necessarily earn more than other people in similar jobs.
Last edited by superbowldogg; 05/16/13 12:20 AM.
Hunter + Dart = This is the way.
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
I never got any sort of "Resort" feeling at Case... Course, it's been a while.
yeah, but the reason that Case is now 2.5X the tuition it was "back in the day" is that they completely tore out all of the old dorms and built brand new ones on the Northside of campus that do have the "resort" feel to them.
#gmstrong
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These can't both be true -- if they are overpaid (and underworked) - then every lawyer on the market is going to try to get the job. As a consequence the standards for profs are going to go way up (and only the cream of the crop is going to get jobs). In that case only people who could get equivalent or better jobs in private industry is going to be a law professor.
On the other hand, in law profs aren't at the top of the field - it means that the pool of candidates isn't any good -- which means that the top lawyers are finding better jobs elsewhere.
Of course, maybe you don't want good lawyers to become law professors? Then you can argue for paying them less, but you are going to get lower returns in terms of quality and output.
I get your point but the big problem with your argument is that practicing law and teaching law are different skill sets... odds are that the best most respected attorneys are not the ones that would make the best law professors and vice versa...
It also doesn't take into account life decisions, somebody might be an exceptional attorney who just doesn't want the 80-90 hour per week grind and the stress of practicing law and running a firm and is willing to make a conscious decision to earn less than half as much for a more relaxed teaching gig with no stress, no travel, etc...
However, there is a point of equilibrium... if you pay law professors too much, then yes, lawyers would be fighting over those positions... if you pay them too little then you are going to get crappy professors who can't teach.... Isn't that the point that market forces is supposed to find and maintain? Isn't that how capitalism works? A college isn't going to pay them a dime more than they have to in order to get the quality of professor they want... so to say they are being paid too much is to deny that the market is able to sort this out on its own.
yebat' Putin
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Should colleges just become job factories? It's practically what they've become.
Actually they are a cross between a job factory and a Sandals resort...
I never got any sort of "Resort" feeling at Case... Course, it's been a while.
yeah, but the reason that Case is now 2.5X the tuition it was "back in the day" is that they completely tore out all of the old dorms and built brand new ones on the Northside of campus that do have the "resort" feel to them.
Well, there was that year that we had a hot tub in our suite at Kusch Hall... I remember watching the Indians game from my hot tub (would have been Sept. 2000) in my dorm room thinking "Why do people complain about college living conditions?"
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Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with paying professors well in comparison/competition to other universities. I'm not making any mention of this to knock the professors themselves, some of whom I actually consider friends now.
I just think that their salaries, at least in UT's case, have become a microcosm and a demonstration of schools being able to spend almost irresponsibly due to the high cost of tuition, which is fueled by the government guaranteed loans at the expense of the students.
I think you're trying to have it both ways in these arguments.
1.) Law school profs aren't the top of the field (i.e. they couldn't get jobs that pay much better in private practice).
2.) They are underworked and have cushy jobs.
These can't both be true -- if they are overpaid (and underworked) - then every lawyer on the market is going to try to get the job. As a consequence the standards for profs are going to go way up (and only the cream of the crop is going to get jobs). In that case only people who could get equivalent or better jobs in private industry is going to be a law professor.
On the other hand, in law profs aren't at the top of the field - it means that the pool of candidates isn't any good -- which means that the top lawyers are finding better jobs elsewhere.
Of course, maybe you don't want good lawyers to become law professors? Then you can argue for paying them less, but you are going to get lower returns in terms of quality and output.
First off, I agree in part with what DC is saying.
I don't think it's as simplistic as what's been made out in your two points, but I do understand your premise.
1. Law professors are in the top of their field for teaching law. Highly acclaimed partners at law firms are in the top of their field for practicing law. The two are extremely different. Plus, I would say if you ever met the standard high-calibur law firm associate/partner, you would easily be able to distinguish him or her from his or her professorial equivalent almost instantly.
It is often true they come from the same statistical group of law graduates, but that doesn't account for motives and objectives of going to and graduating from law school. Or, further down the road, you'll notice with the high turnover in law firms that many who were an associate for 1-3 years will leave the firm to pursue a job teaching. Honestly, because of the lifestyle and when it boils down to it, they'd make more per hour of work as a professor than as an associate.
Here's the other kicker, following the recession, law firms took HUGE hits. Lots of salaries dropped, some partners even were let go, firms closed altogether, and lots of salaries were reduced. The billable hour business models began to erode. Mega firms had to rethink their salary strategies. Law schools kept chugging along.
2. While I don't think I used the words "cushy" or "underworked," I do think a lot of professorial salaries are based upon the education bubble that's being created by the underlying student loan discussion we're having. So I do think it's a shaky market price that could take a hit if the bubble ever ended up bursting.
Quite honestly, I think half the law schools in the country should be closed. We have NINE law schools alone in Ohio, churning out thousands of graduates each year. If the bubble burst and schools close down, it does lessen the demand for professors while increasing the supply.
Here's the other thing, too, going back to DC's point. Attorneys are falling over each other trying to be law school professors. Every time UT would have an interview, the line of candidates would be out the door.
I'm getting long-winded, but basically my second point is the foundation of the professorial salary I believe is tied to the student loan bubble.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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Here's the other thing, too, going back to DC's point. Attorneys are falling over each other trying to be law school professors. Every time UT would have an interview, the line of candidates would be out the door.
This happens in almost every profession during a really bad economy. Architecture/Engineering schools, dental schools, etc are seeing the same thing. Especially with older folks who can't afford the uncertainty of having their income go up and down dramatically... they are closer to retirement, they need something more stable and less stressful.... and that is how they view teaching.
I will say this though, I believe in any of these professional areas such as law, engineering, etc... a person should have to have their degree and 10+ years of experience before even being allowed to teach. You have to bring some real world experience back to the classroom. Going through school, getting a masters or a phd or a jd or whatever and then going right into teaching is a bad idea... JMHO..
yebat' Putin
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Ok, now we're getting somewhere: Quote:
1. Law professors are in the top of their field for teaching law. Highly acclaimed partners at law firms are in the top of their field for practicing law. The two are extremely different. Plus, I would say if you ever met the standard high-calibur law firm associate/partner, you would easily be able to distinguish him or her from his or her professorial equivalent almost instantly.
Totally agree. The jobs are very different, the people that are good at them are different as well.
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It is often true they come from the same statistical group of law graduates, but that doesn't account for motives and objectives of going to and graduating from law school. Or, further down the road, you'll notice with the high turnover in law firms that many who were an associate for 1-3 years will leave the firm to pursue a job teaching. Honestly, because of the lifestyle and when it boils down to it, they'd make more per hour of work as a professor than as an associate.
Agree again - that's part of the reason that professorships are so competitive. Although, I doubt they actually make more per hour of work - at a top law-firm (from my fairly limited knowledge) a full partner will make $500k+ (and an equity partner probably $800k+), the average law professor is around $200k. If law professors are even working 40 hr/week (what you first said, I'd bet that's a low estimate), I doubt partners are really working 100 hr/week (maybe first year associates, but not partners). Working 100 hr/week is really really rare in any field (though lots of stressed out people say they are).
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Here's the other kicker, following the recession, law firms took HUGE hits. Lots of salaries dropped, some partners even were let go, firms closed altogether, and lots of salaries were reduced. The billable hour business models began to erode. Mega firms had to rethink their salary strategies. Law schools kept chugging along.
Definitely true - private sector jobs have a much bigger variance in pay. While academic jobs usually underpay compared to private industry, one of the major perks is job security. Of course, from an economic point of view, the economic downturn actually helps universities in the short run. They aren't going to decrease tuition just because the economy went down in one year. And it's well known that depressions actually increase the number of students entering graduate school (as they can't find good enough jobs and thus try to increase their background in a field).
I don't see any reasons why academic jobs should follow the same boom/bust cycle as law firms.
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2. While I don't think I used the words "cushy" or "underworked," I do think a lot of professorial salaries are based upon the education bubble that's being created by the underlying student loan discussion we're having. So I do think it's a shaky market price that could take a hit if the bubble ever ended up bursting.
This is also fairly true - I'm mostly just arguing that if the salaries decrease, you will get lower quality law school professors. So law school prof might be a highly desirable job (but it is not an overpaid job compared to the candidate quality).
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Quite honestly, I think half the law schools in the country should be closed. We have NINE law schools alone in Ohio, churning out thousands of graduates each year. If the bubble burst and schools close down, it does lessen the demand for professors while increasing the supply.
Also tend to agree -- it never used to be true before. But suddenly over the last 5 years or so, good law school graduates are not finding jobs.
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Here's the other thing, too, going back to DC's point. Attorneys are falling over each other trying to be law school professors. Every time UT would have an interview, the line of candidates would be out the door.
YES! This is exactly what I've said since post 1. Of course it's a good job - that's why the people who get the job are very very good (they would be equity partners in top law firms if they decided to take that route instead). Or maybe they would go other very secure routes (working towards federal judgeships etc. -- which is even more security).
~Lyuokdea
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Saw this today on yahoo http://finance.yahoo.com/news/true-confession-ive-completely-given-193302452.htmlTRUE CONFESSION: I've Completely Given Up Trying To Pay Off $186,000 Worth Of Student Loan Debt By Mandi Woodruff | Business Insider – 4 hours ago Email 2 Print Photo: Courtesy of Nicole Jackson At 44 years old, Nicole Jackson says she has bigger concerns than the six-figure student loan debt that has shadowed her for the last 20 years. Jackson, a Miami, Fla.-based family law attorney, gave up on ever paying off her $186,000 federal student loan balance years ago. At $1,600 per month, her monthly loan payments would easily eclipse her $1,200/month mortgage and she and her husband are raising three teenage daughters. "The way I see it, I'm already screwed," Jackson told us. "I'd rather make sure my kids are OK. Unless I start making significantly more money [my situation] is not gonna change." With the nation struggling under a $1 trillion student debt crisis, stories like Jackson's are nothing uncommon. For the first time ever, the national student loan default rate exceeds the credit card delinquency rate, and so long as student loans remain one of the few types of debt that can't be discharged in bankruptcy, chances are the situation won't improve any time soon. At the beginning of her story, Jackson, a native New Yorker, was one of the lucky ones. Her father, a doctor, paid for a year of her undergraduate studies, leaving her free to dodge student loans for a while. And with a well-paying job at a Manhattan law firm, she had more than enough funds to finance the rest of her undergraduate studies. But when Jackson decided to pursue her dream of becoming an attorney at the University of Miami, it became impossible to avoid taking on debt. "My intention was to go back to work after my first year of law school," she said. "[But] I did so poorly that I didn't think I could [keep a job at the same time]. So that’s when I started borrowing money." It was a costly decision. Jackson took out about $26,000 in federal loans for each year of law school and then another $20,000 in private loans to keep afloat while she studied for the bar exam. She graduated in 1994 with more than $100,000 of debt. Within three years, she had one daughter, a surprise set of twins, and was earning less than $50,000 per year. "It’s always been a struggle," she said. "I worked for the state of Florida most of my [career] and the most I was making was $50,000/year. With three kids, it wasn’t enough money." So she bought as much time as she could, starting with consolidating her federal studen¤ loans. Since she worked for the state, she was able to defer payments and declare financial hardship as well –– whatever it took to keep from defaulting. "I just got to a point where I stopped keeping track. I wish I could give it back." Her private loans took top priority. The payments were only $130/month, but since private lenders don't offer the same deferment options as federal, it was either pay or roll out the welcome mat for debt collectors. Meanwhile, her federal loans ballooned. With an 8% interest rate, they appreciated even after she consolidated, growing from a principal balance of about $80,000 in 1994 to $186,000 today. Other than her home and a car payment, it's the only debt she carries to this day. Eventually, her debt drove her back to New York, where she moved her family and took a lucrative job at a Manhattan law firm. She was finally able to start making federal loan payments, but the move took a toll on her family life. "I was making six figures, working 13/14 hour days, and my kids were sad because I wasn’t around," she said. "I wanted the money but I didn't want my kids to be miserable. They were babies." After two years, they packed up and headed back to Miami, where Jackson continued plugging away on whatever legal cases came her way. E xhausted with state work, s he started her own firm in 2008. She earned $20,000 her first year. It's a running joke that sh e's just one personal injury case away from becoming debt-free. "I just got to a point where I [stopped keeping track]," she said. "I wish I could give it back." For now, she has her eyes on her future –– namely, her daughters' futures. Her eldest will be in college in 2015, and Jackson devoted her savings to establish a prepaid college savings plan for all three of her kids. "I’ve stressed to my daughter the importance of not borrowing any money. If she doesn't get a scholarship or there’s money that needs to be found somewhere, I’ll borrow it myself and I'll deal with it before I let her," she said. "I don't want my kids going into life with this over their heads." Have a college debt story to share? E-mail me at mwoodruff@businessinsider.com.
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That's a touching story.
Okay, sentimental crap over..............if she doesn't pay her loans, who will? Someone else.
Seems to be the American way anymore.
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Not really a touching story to me. Maybe I'd see it differently if my loans had put me in that position, but to me its her that put her in that position.
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Going out of state to a private university wasn't a necessity, either. That easily over-inflated the cost of the same knowledge she could have attained elsewhere.
Politicians are puppets, y'all. Let's get Geppetto!
Formerly 4yikes2yoshi0
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Not really a touching story to me. Maybe I'd see it differently if my loans had put me in that position, but to me its her that put her in that position.
Apparently my snarkiness didn't come across.
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Lol, thought you were playing the "compassionate conservative" angle.
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Why on earth is this a story?
I live off of under 10k per year, probably more like 6k-8k. I could pretty easily get by on 4k a year. She could have easily paid this off by scrimping, especially considering she had a six figure job? Pleeeease. The math of this story made zero sense to me. Live off rice and beans and pay off your debts you bum. Sounds like a spoiled brat who is making far more than most people but still won't pay off her debts. Shed tear for the girl with the six figure salary... please...
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Why on earth is this a story?
I live off of under 10k per year, probably more like 6k-8k. I could pretty easily get by on 4k a year. She could have easily paid this off by scrimping, especially considering she had a six figure job? Pleeeease. The math of this story made zero sense to me. Live off rice and beans and pay off your debts you bum. Sounds like a spoiled brat who is making far more than most people but still won't pay off her debts. Shed tear for the girl with the six figure salary... please...
Not saying much when in today's society you can get by with zero income 
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Why on earth is this a story?
I live off of under 10k per year, probably more like 6k-8k. I could pretty easily get by on 4k a year. She could have easily paid this off by scrimping, especially considering she had a six figure job? Pleeeease. The math of this story made zero sense to me. Live off rice and beans and pay off your debts you bum. Sounds like a spoiled brat who is making far more than most people but still won't pay off her debts. Shed tear for the girl with the six figure salary... please...
Question: and I'm taking notes here.......how do you live off of $10,000 per year, or less?
What is your rent?
How much do you spend on food?
Do you have a car?
How do you pay for internet?
Are you putting anything away for retirement?
How do you pay for heat, or a/c?
You must not have kids?
Are you happy?
Like I said, I'm taking notes.........because I would love to afford my kid, mortgage, gas, electric, phone, food, gas for my vehicle, etc......on less than $10 grand a year.
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Wow.. let's look at the facts of this story... Quote:
Her father, a doctor, paid for a year of her undergraduate studies, leaving her free to dodge student loans for a while.
Her father is a doctor in New York and he was only able to help her with one year of college? Sounds like he has money management issues as well.
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And with a well-paying job at a Manhattan law firm, she had more than enough funds to finance the rest of her undergraduate studies.
If she had "more than enough" perhaps she should have saved some.
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But when Jackson decided to pursue her dream of becoming an attorney at the University of Miami, it became impossible to avoid taking on debt.
Was her dream to become an attorney or was her dream to live in Miami and go to a very expensive private school? I'm not sure what it was 20 years ago but Miami is the #76 ranked law school today by the system that I found but it's about the same price as UVA, which is ranked 7th... that's a bad investment.
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Jackson took out about $26,000 in federal loans for each year of law school and then another $20,000 in private loans to keep afloat while she studied for the bar exam.
$20K so she could sit home and study for the bar? I know its a rigorous exam but how long does it take to study for the bar? 6 months? She needed $20K untaxed just to survive for 6 months when all she was going to do was study since she wasn't working? And don't forget, Daddy the doctor couldn't help her with this either evidently.
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She graduated in 1994 with more than $100,000 of debt. Within three years, she had one daughter, a surprise set of twins, and was earning less than $50,000 per year.
More irresponsibility... She's what, 26/27 when she graduates and she has to pop out 3 kids in 3 years when she already can't pay her debt? I'm sorry the twins were a "surprise".. they have figured out what causes child birth and somebody smart enough to get through law school should know what it is and take the necessary precautions.
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"It’s always been a struggle," she said. "I worked for the state of Florida most of my [career] and the most I was making was $50,000/year. With three kids, it wasn’t enough money."
Would it be politically incorrect of me to ask where the father(s) of these kids are in all of this? No father is ever mentioned, just her and her 3 surprise kids...
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Eventually, her debt drove her back to New York, where she moved her family and took a lucrative job at a Manhattan law firm. She was finally able to start making federal loan payments, but the move took a toll on her family life.
So she has the earning potential... she's just not willing to do what is necessary to pay the bills. Am I to believe that it's either $180K in New York at 13 hours per day or $20K working for herself and that there isn't something in between?
I can understand that people make mistakes and sometimes get in a bad situation, but this woman's life is one bad decision and one irresponsible act after another.... I have very little sympathy for her... she says she's teaching her kids to not make the same mistakes, hopefully she will be successful.
yebat' Putin
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All Pro
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All Pro
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And to take it one step further....
I think both companies and employees could benefit...
Say a program where the pay was fairly minor but the employee learned a great deal and was a valuable asset to the company.
Thus income and no student debt vs. partying till you drop, eventually getting a degree in liberal studies and having 100k in student loans weighing things down.
That's how I got though college with very little loan debt. I worked full time in my profession while I finished school, granted it took me a lot longer to get out but I had < 1500 in loans and real experience when I graduated.
We're trying to throw the ball downfield and he checked the ball down to Trent Richardson and the Indians on the choice.
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Legend
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Legend
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Wow.. let's look at the facts of this story...
You left one fact out. She packed money away in savings to pay toward her kids education while refusing to pay on her own debt. 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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j/c It's weird to live in a country where so many people insist that poor people pull themselves up by the boot straps or suffer their own consequences while at the same time insist we pay tax dollars to companies, banks, corporations/individuals so they will give us the honor of doing business/making profits here in any way they lobby the government to allow. and now you can go ahead with the typical cries of commie socialist!!!!
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Legend
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Legend
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j/c
It's weird to live in a country where so many people insist that poor people pull themselves up by the boot straps or suffer their own consequences while at the same time insist we pay tax dollars to companies, banks, corporations/individuals so they will give us the honor of doing business/making profits here in any way they lobby the government to allow.
and now you can go ahead with the typical cries of commie socialist!!!!
Except this story isn't about her being poor and in debt, it's about her having every opportunity to be very successful, yet fails to do what the rest of us do when we find ourselves in budgetary troubles.
I also find this interesting Quote:
With an 8% interest rate, they appreciated even after she consolidated, growing from a principal balance of about $80,000 in 1994 to $186,000 today."
Consolidated what? She either consolidated a lot more than student loans or she just let it compound interest all this time. Even if all she paid was the interest charges, it shouldn't go up over 100k.
and then Quote:
My intention was to go back to work after my first year of law school," she said. "[But] I did so poorly that I didn't think I could [keep a job at the same time]. So that’s when I started borrowing money."
Maybe she should have realized law wasn't her bag of tea.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Legend
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Legend
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It's weird to live in a country where so many people insist that poor people pull themselves up by the boot straps or suffer their own consequences
It's even more weird that we live in a county where if your father is a doctor and you are a law school grad that you are considered poor.
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while at the same time insist we pay tax dollars to companies, banks, corporations/individuals so they will give us the honor of doing business/making profits here in any way they lobby the government to allow.
I'm pretty sure you will find that most of the people who have an issue with this woman also have an issue with tax dollars being spent on private industry... so I'm not sure where you are going with this.
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and now you can go ahead with the typical cries of commie socialist!!!!
So what do you advocate? Should the government just say, "Well, we see where you have made 8 or 9 really bad choices that led you to this debt so here... let's just forget it.... and heck, since we are in such great financial shape, let's just forget about the other $1 trillion in student debt that's out there. When you are $15 or 16 trillion in debt, what's another trillion?"
I'm sorry for my thinking that when somebody borrows money and signs a piece of paper stating that they will repay that money... that expecting them to do so makes me too much of a cold hearted capitalist. 
yebat' Putin
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Legend
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Legend
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I'm sorry for my thinking that when somebody borrows money and signs a piece of paper stating that they will repay that money... that expecting them to do so makes me too much of a cold hearted capitalist.
Come to think of it, I would have way more expendable income to help build the economy if I just quit paying my mortgage.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
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I'm sorry for my thinking that when somebody borrows money and signs a piece of paper stating that they will repay that money... that expecting them to do so makes me too much of a cold hearted capitalist.
Come to think of it, I would have way more expendable income to help build the economy if I just quit paying my mortgage.
I get the humor but this is the fallacy in the argument, because you wouldn't.... in the long run, your taxes would have to go way up so you could pay some small percentage of everybody else's mortgage who also didn't want to pay...
yebat' Putin
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Legend
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But maybe I could join the ranks of those who pay no income taxes and actually get money back. 
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Legend
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Legend
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But maybe I could join the ranks of those who pay no income taxes and actually get money back.
Now you're talking.... that's living the American dream.
yebat' Putin
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I live off of under 10k per year, probably more like 6k-8k. I could pretty easily get by on 4k a year.
Tell us your secret. This I gotta hear.
My utilities are about 4800 a year alone. My food bill is probably 5000 a year at a minimum.
Hair cuts are 300.00 a year for me and another 500 a year for the wife.
That's 10,500 and I haven't accounted for one gallon of gas or paid for Car insurance yet. I haven't touched on health Insurance or Life Insurance costs or copays at the doctor or medication costs At all..
And I also haven't touched upon housing costs. Even if you own your own home, you still have to pay upkeep and repairs not to mention property taxes.
I haven't mentioned toilet paper and other sundries that you need to have in the house., What do you do, take 2 ply TP and split it?
I guess I don't know how it's even remotely possible to live on 10000 a year or less.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Why do you keep insisting that it's her father's duty to keep funneling her money for her education?
My father is a pretty successful attorney and was fortunately able to pay for my undergrad. When I decided to go to law school and then get a second bachelor's in electrical engineering he said "congrats, good luck, you're on your own to pay for it" and it had nothing to do with his ability to manage his own money. Of course, when it came time to apply for grants and scholarships I wasn't eligible because despite being martied and having not lived with my parents for nearly 8 years, I had an "expected family contribution" based on my parents' income.
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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He said he lives in Thailand, lower cost of living there. Has a Motorbike as a vehicle and probably doesn't have things like insurance to worry about.
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Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Should the Federal Government
waive student loan debt?
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