He just keeps on embarrassing himself, and by proxy, the Browns organization. So Kobe Bryant isn't enough of an African American for Jim Brown. Wow. Just...wow.
When will the right people say they've had enough of Jim Brown and stop putting this bitter old man in front of a camera?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
Jim Brown lives in his own little world, a world of delusion and false enlightenment.
Unfortunately, he also has no filter on his mouth, and he spews forth whatever he thinks he sees and/or thinks he knows.
As far as why people would have him on? He's interesting and often controversial and inflammatory. Controversy and inflammatory statements sell.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
I hope Kobe can join Wilt Chumperlain on the "Not black enough to join in on the racial summits" campaign.
Interesting to see the thoughts though, but who cares. Jim Brown no longer has the care or the clout to do anything in Sports revolving race. If he did, he would have said something about someone like Mahmoud Abdul-Rauf being unfairly cut from the Nuggets despite being one of their best scorers.
At this point in his life Jim Brown just wants to look back on the golden age where he was arguably the greatest athlete who would have fireside chats with Bill Russell, Malcolm X, Ali, Sam Cooke, Kareem and many others about the civil rights movement. He's just being nostalgic.
I don't always agree with Jim on what he says, but I still respect his right to say it. He speaks his mind and you always know where he stands, and he will say something to your face you may hate, but he does not sneak around and only say things behind your back like so many people do today.
I'm pretty sure that it's safe to say that he did indeed throw shaq under the bus. I'm pretty sure that Kobe is a scum bag as are so many wealthy athletes.
I don't always agree with Brown. In fact, I rarely agree with him.. But he is allowed to say what he thinks.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
If you have no affliation with a group or organization and are speaking only for yourself, then sure. However, if you are representing an organization where your thoughts may be taken as those of the people you are fronting, then you have a different set of "rules"...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
Quote: When will the right people say they've had enough of Jim Brown and stop putting this bitter old man in front of a camera?
He still has tremendous name recognition and as long as people think he's going to say provocative things, somebody will always be willing to put him in front of a camera.
Jim thinks that Kobe isn't one of the "Top Black Athlete's in the US" because he didn't grow up here and doesn't really grasp the struggle of being black and an athlete in the US. Right?
I mean, he didn't say Kobe wasn't "black enough" in general or called him an Uncle Tom, Jim doesn't think Kobe understands the difficult path an American black man has to take to make it in athletics in the US.
???
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
When will the right people say they've had enough of Jim Brown and stop putting this bitter old man in front of a camera?
When people like you stop paying attention and giving the people that do it page views, video hits, etc... Like everything in the entertainment industry - stop talking about it and it goes away.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
Him and Donovan McNabb just need their own talk show, where they can diss everything/everyone, cry about everything/everyone and share their moot and trivial opinions to those willing and/or dumb enough to listen...
If I was to put a summit of black athletes together to talk to a black athlete to get himself right in a situation...I'm not calling Kobe either...I'm not black, but I wouldn't.
He's right...He was brought up in Europe, doesnt have a complete grasp on what african-american's go through in the US, or what they have gone through in the past, and what it feels like...
Plus Kobe hasnt been the picture of morality either...It's a lot of truth coming from that man's mouth.
I respect the heck out of that man. He's forthcoming, honest, and doesn't pull punches. Holmgren pushed him to the side of a franchise he helped put on the map...The man is an icon, dont treat him like a curmudgeon, and he wont speak out like one.
"It has to start somewhere It has to start somehow What better place than here? What better time than now?"
Quote: Plus Kobe hasnt been the picture of morality either...It's a lot of truth coming from that man's mouth.
I'm not even going that far and I don't think Jim was either. For example, Tony Parker, he grew up in France and is black. Would Jim Brown invite him to his Top Black Athlete's in the US to discuss race relations and it's progression?
I would invite Tony to get an outsiders opinion on France and how they do things, as well as Tony's perspective on the US for the time he was here. But that's assuming I'd want that kind of outsiders viewpoint. If I didn't, I wouldn't call him.
Maybe it's a bit closeminded to shut out people that might help, but if they don't fit the specific mold of person you want on the coucil, it's not wrong to exclude them. I think that's what he was saying. NOT - "Kobe is an Uncle Tom and can't be on my pretend council".
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
To a certain degree, we are all shaped by the times in which we've lived. Jim Brown is no exception. His views on race were forged at a time when things were pretty clear-cut for most of America: "if you're white, you're alright; if you're brown, stick around; if you're black, step back."
I was a little kid when JB was a young man, so I saw only a percentage of the stuff he saw... Quite naturally, my views are somewhat milder than his. When I talk to others his age, many acknowledge that things have indeed changed, but those changes came about from their approach as younger people... and that these attitudes must be maintained- lest we slip back into those times once again. I don't necessarily agree, but I at least understand their mindset. Had I been born one generation sooner and had to fight/suffer/risk punishment to learn the cello, it's quite possible that I'd share his views- in equal measure. We'll never know for sure... because I like he, am a product of my own time.
If I take Jim Brown the football player/Browns spokesperson out of the equation, I find him to be a fascinating individual. Outspoken, opinionated, fearless, and driven to represent his cause celebre. Those are personal traits I can admire and respect, even if I disagree with some of his views. For me, he represents a time in America's culture when racial issues reached the tipping point... and African American people of note became the voice for social change. A voice that was finally being heard- after almost 300 years of 'social deafness.' Without those voices, it's hard to imagine having the life I'm now living.
So... yeah, in some ways he's become a "museum piece," but I'm also thankful for museums- they preserve and maintain a "moment in history." That's important to me... because they provide the baseline for how much progress and change has occurred since.
Speaking only for myself, I'd kill for the opportunity to spend an afternoon with the man (I'll take lessons anywhere I can find them). It would be an interesting inter-generational discussion, to be sure... and I'm certain I'd leave that conversation with much to think about.
If you have no affliation with a group or organization and are speaking only for yourself, then sure. However, if you are representing an organization where your thoughts may be taken as those of the people you are fronting, then you have a different set of "rules"...
I have no idea what you mean
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
If you have no affliation with a group or organization and are speaking only for yourself, then sure. However, if you are representing an organization where your thoughts may be taken as those of the people you are fronting, then you have a different set of "rules"...
GMAFB
Jim Brown has been saying what he wants to say since the 1950's What in the hell makes you think he will change now. Like I said before I may not agree with everything he says, but I sure as hell agree with his right to say it. If Anybody in this country has earned the right to speak their mind he sure as hell is one of them.
Jim thinks that Kobe isn't one of the "Top Black Athlete's in the US" because he didn't grow up here and doesn't really grasp the struggle of being black and an athlete in the US. Right?
Jim thinks that Kobe isn't one of the "Top Black Athlete's in the US" because he didn't grow up here and doesn't really grasp the struggle of being black and an athlete in the US. Right?
WRONG...
Okay, instead of calling my interpretation wrong in caps, then what was he saying your opinion?
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Jim thinks that Kobe isn't one of the "Top Black Athlete's in the US" because he didn't grow up here and doesn't really grasp the struggle of being black and an athlete in the US. Right?
WRONG...
Okay, instead of calling my interpretation wrong in caps, then what was he saying your opinion?
That he's one of the best athletes in the world currently, but he wouldn't be invited to talk about racial issues in hypothetical forum organized by Jim Brown. Jim Brown isn't one to mince words and what he said was extremely straightforward.
That he's one of the best athletes in the world currently, but he wouldn't be invited to talk about racial issues in hypothetical forum organized by Jim Brown. Jim Brown isn't one to mince words and what he said was extremely straightforward.
If you have no affliation with a group or organization and are speaking only for yourself, then sure. However, if you are representing an organization where your thoughts may be taken as those of the people you are fronting, then you have a different set of "rules"...
GMAFB
Jim Brown has been saying what he wants to say since the 1950's What in the hell makes you think he will change now. Like I said before I may not agree with everything he says, but I sure as hell agree with his right to say it. If Anybody in this country has earned the right to speak their mind he sure as hell is one of them.
I didn't say he would change. I stand by my post...
When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the losers...Socrates
I don't know, Clem. I would have a hard time admiring and respecting a man who has been calling for and demanding the equal treatment and respect for a group of people when he has shown a blatant disrespect for the very people in his own life.
I've always been in the minority on Jim Brown around these parts, and I realize that, but I just don't like the guy. Great football player and a spokesperson for many people, and that's where anything good ends for me. I find him to be a hard person to like.
JB also went after Michael Jordan and Tiger Woods a few years back for not being Down With The Cause. I have no particular high regard for Jordan, Woods, or Bryant because of events in each of their lives (much like Jim Brown), but it cannot be said that each of them has not done some degree of "giving back".
Jordan's is pretty impressive with his work for Boys and Girls Clubs of America, Special Olympics, and the United Negro College Fund. The Tiger Woods Foundation and its companion Learning Centers helps children with classes to help them learn Math, Science, and Language Arts skills. It also provides assistance for children of military families. Kobe Bryant is official ambassador for The After School All Stars, an after school program that provides activities to over 70,000 at-risk inner city youths. The foundation in his and his wife's name helps disadvantaged youths through educational programs and parental/family support.
These guys don't have to answer to Jim Brown, or anybody. Each of them has walked the walk to some degree, if only with donations. Jim Brown is not the arbiter of which type of activism is meaningful and which is not. It seems like he's just upset that they don't bow and scrape at the altar of Jim Brown.
That he's one of the best athletes in the world currently, but he wouldn't be invited to talk about racial issues in hypothetical forum organized by Jim Brown. Jim Brown isn't one to mince words and what he said was extremely straightforward.
Then what did I say that was so WRONG?
He called Kobe a phenomenal talent and because he grew up in Italy, not the culture here in the US, he wouldn't call him to be part of his hypothetical forum to discuss race relations here in the US.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Quote: I don't always agree with Jim on what he says, but I still respect his right to say it. He speaks his mind and you always know where he stands, and he will say something to your face you may hate, but he does not sneak around and only say things behind your back like so many people do today.
Making an extreme example here, but if you replace "Jim Brown" with the "KKK" you would have no choice but to maintain the same stance. You're covering up what he says by hiding it behind his right to speak. Well, then the KKK has every right to say whatever they want because you have to respect their right to say it.
I don't agree with the KKK but if I believe in America and freedom of Speech then I have to respect their right to say it. They say things I hate, but they don't sneak around peoples backs like so many do today.
But one is Jim Brown, the other is the KKK.
So let's just get past the idea that he can say whatever he wants because it's his right. Let's concern ourselves with how his bombastic, racially-charged, self-serving and often ignorant ways affect those around him, more specifically the Cleveland Browns.
Jim Brown has every right to be a grumpy, crabby, pissy old man, but that isn't in question.
As a representative of the Browns, he should be a bigger man than he is. Keep in mind this is the same man that called the President of OSU a Slave Master and the OSU environment a plantation He goes on to reference all kinds of negative things by stating...how did the quotes go...that he essentially inferred that Mike Holmgren used the term "monkey" when talking about him, and even invoked the lynching of black people and some other terms.
I fully understand that Jim Brown is jaded by the world he grew up in, a world I won't ever understand. But you know what? Jim Brown needs to be a BIGGER man than that. He should clean up his own backyard before jumping into someone elses and telling them how dirty it is.
Sorry, GM, I'm not going to allow Jim Brown's ugly words to hide behind his right to say them. This isn't about his right to be an ass. This is about Jim Brown being an ass and picking fights where there are no fights to pick.
There is very little about Holmgren that I approved of, but poop-canning Jim Brown was easily one of the smartest things he'd done during his time here.
What Jim Brown continues to say is proof of that. In fact, I had hired a new Banquet Captain a few months back when I took a new job. He is black. Tonight we were watching SportsCenter and I brought up what Brown said about Bryant. I asked him what he thought about it, because Jared came up poor and has worked his way into college. He said that Brown doesn't have to respect what Kobe Bryant is, but he has no right to tell the entire world that Bryant isn't enough of an America Black man to lend his voice to discussions about how to make life better for other black people. Setting that aside, he went on to say that how he carries himself above others and those he represents is hypocritical considering how he's committed crimes and abandoned people when they needed him the most. Maurice Clarett comes to mind with that latest example.
But it's OI. It's not about what Jim Brown says or what he does, so long as his right to say and do things is protected.
C'mon.
I can't believe I'm defending a POS like Kobe Bryant and feel as though I have no choice because the greatest RB in the history of the NFL just won't shut his arrogant mouth. Sucks for me that he's actually a paid employee of my favorite team.
If Jim Brown's only goal were the betterment of the human race, I might be able to understand why he does what he does. But I know better. His words...tell me better. He's about Jim Brown first, and he needs to just be quiet. Of course we know he can't ever do that, which brings us right back to the problem.
It's crazy...as I'm typing this ESPN's Youngstown Boys is playing in the background, and one guy being interviewed regarding the suspension of Clarett says...
"Any fences that could have been mended between Clarett and Andy Geiger were destroyed when Jim Brown called Geiger a Slave Master."
brilliant.
Jim Brown may be well-intended but nobody can really know because he's too arrogant and self-serving. I for one wish the Browns would again take him off payroll.
Last edited by Referee2; 12/16/1306:53 AM.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
Men like Jim Brown, Jessie Jackson, & Al Sharpton are all about themselves. Their words further fuel the hate of the racists - of both colors - and alienate many of the others who hear their self-serving BS.
Why don't we hear from people on TV like your newly hired guy? From a guy like Clem? From many of my friends, clients and the friends of my children?
The very people who promote themselves as leaders of their community are anything but that...leaders.
I read what you posted and Browns comments. In the past he has said some things that I would have to agree with you about. But in this case, you're blowing things way out of proportion.
I believe it's far more basic than you're making it out to be.
Kobe didn't grow up in the U.S., therefore he has no idea and can't identify with the struggles of blacks growing up in America. That actually makes perfect sense.
If you wish to make more out of it than that, by all means go ahead. But I'm not so sure all that many people will agree with you.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Quote: im Brown has every right to be a grumpy, crabby, pissy old man, but that isn't in question.
I believe I already said that.
Quote: As a representative of the Browns, he should be a bigger man than he is.
He was the same way in the 50's, the 60's 70's, 80's 90's 2000's and ever since, yet you expect him to change now Like I said I don't agree with everything he says, but I respect the man for sticking to his guns, and being up front and honest about his beliefs.
Quote: Jim Brown needs to be a BIGGER man than that
Yet you call him a grumpy, crabby, pissy old man, and an ass. hmmmm I have not heard this in a while around here but pot meet kettle lol
Now you don't like Jim Brown. You don't hide your feelings, your up front and honest about it... you know you sound a little like old Jim and I respect you for being so straight forward about your feelings as well Toad
Quote: He was the same way in the 50's, the 60's 70's, 80's 90's 2000's and ever since, yet you expect him to change now
Who he is as a person doesn't have to change. How he reacts in public when he's in the employment of someone else changes the game.
Quote: Yet you call him a grumpy, crabby, pissy old man, and an ass. hmmmm I have not heard this in a while around here but pot meet kettle lol
WHOA...I'm not old.
Quote: Now you don't like Jim Brown. You don't hide your feelings, your up front and honest about it... you know you sound a little like old Jim and I respect you for being so straight forward about your feelings as well Toad
If I were paid by the Browns I would be bigger than that.
And Pit, there are people in this thread who agree with me, as well as the one person of color with whom I had this conversation with.
It's not hard to read that Jim Brown didn't just state that Kobe may not have the background to have enough experience to be on his board. Jim Brown went way out of his way to verbally beoch-slap Kobe Bryant in a very snide, unprofessional manner.
It's not always what you say but how you say it. Even then, dare I say that if you put 500 young black kids in a building then sat Bryant down in one chair and Brown in another, more kids would listen to Kobe than Brown. Many youngsters can't identify with him because of the generational gap. Call it fair or otherwise but life doesn't operate on that basis. If he had half-a-brain he would embrace someone like Kobe for the good he could do, not go out of the way to insult him.
But that's always been too progressively forward in thinking for Brown. It's more satisfying for him to be a lesser man.
It's tough having him be a mouth-piece, even more-so because there are so many good messages which he has the ability to deliver yet is too petty to affect.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy. Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
The way you are talking about Jim Brown is awful and you should be ashamed as you have a job with some company that I don't know about.
Jim Brown is in an adviser role which means he's never speaking on behalf of the Browns, but you want to make it seem that way. Do you have a problem with Jim Brown not inviting Wilt Chamberlain to the Ali summit?
Quote: He was the same way in the 50's, the 60's 70's, 80's 90's 2000's and ever since, yet you expect him to change now
Who he is as a person doesn't have to change. How he reacts in public when he's in the employment of someone else changes the game.
Quote: Yet you call him a grumpy, crabby, pissy old man, and an ass. hmmmm I have not heard this in a while around here but pot meet kettle lol
WHOA...I'm not old.
Quote: Now you don't like Jim Brown. You don't hide your feelings, your up front and honest about it... you know you sound a little like old Jim and I respect you for being so straight forward about your feelings as well Toad
If I were paid by the Browns I would be bigger than that.
And Pit, there are people in this thread who agree with me, as well as the one person of color with whom I had this conversation with.
It's not hard to read that Jim Brown didn't just state that Kobe may not have the background to have enough experience to be on his board. Jim Brown went way out of his way to verbally beoch-slap Kobe Bryant in a very snide, unprofessional manner.
It's not always what you say but how you say it. Even then, dare I say that if you put 500 young black kids in a building then sat Bryant down in one chair and Brown in another, more kids would listen to Kobe than Brown. Many youngsters can't identify with him because of the generational gap. Call it fair or otherwise but life doesn't operate on that basis. If he had half-a-brain he would embrace someone like Kobe for the good he could do, not go out of the way to insult him.
But that's always been too progressively forward in thinking for Brown. It's more satisfying for him to be a lesser man.
It's tough having him be a mouth-piece, even more-so because there are so many good messages which he has the ability to deliver yet is too petty to affect.
Quote: Who he is as a person doesn't have to change. How he reacts in public when he's in the employment of someone else changes the game.
He was employed by the Browns in the 50's and early 60's but he still spoke his own mind just like he does today. Why in the hell would you be shocked now
Quote: If I were paid by the Browns I would be bigger than that.
So you would sell out and not be yourself... got it... yet Jim have never sold out and has remained true to himself. Like I said more than once before I might not agree with what he says but I do respect him being his own man no mater what others think. Kinda reminds me of me
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif)
Like I said before I may not agree with everything he says, but I sure as hell agree with his right to say it. If Anybody in this country has earned the right to speak their mind he sure as hell is one of them.
Like I said I don't agree with everything he says, but I respect the man for sticking to his guns, and being up front and honest about his beliefs. 
and I respect you for being so straight forward about your feelings as well Toad 
