|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,356
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,356 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
jc
Moats signs a one year deal with the Steelers... 
https://twitter.com/ProFootballTalk/status/448159630146158592
I assume Pettine knew whether we wanted Moats on this team or not -- that he didn't means I'm not too worried.
Or he did but farmer said no. In any case i have a feeling we will be drafting a inside linebacker early in this draft...probably with the 26th pick. Besides dambsy we have no real depth there....if he gets hurt we are screwed big time
I have no belief that Farmer would say know to a guy that Pettine wants.Pettine has said that he and Farmer are in Lockstep on the kinda player they want. If that's the case, then they would both want that same guys and if one of them has strong knowledge of a guy, I'd think his assessment would count higher.. anyway, you'd think..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 305
2nd String
|
2nd String
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 305 |
Meh, my impression is that if you were the GM we'd be spending like drunken sailors lol. I wouldn't be happy with that. I want to be able to keep our studs and we'll need money for that.... and you really don't know who all we'll need to spend big money on.
For example, what happens if Hoyer really is the guy? If he blows up this next year how much money will we need to resign him? You think it'll be cheap if he turns out to be our franchise QB?
Who will be a FA next year that we'll want to make a play for? Do you know who will make it to the market? I don't want to tie my hands this year just for immediate gratification.
Yes let's try to win games NOW but let's try not to be stupid doing it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739 |
Quote:
Vers is more fixated with OG whereas for me it's one of MANY neglected need positions. Not signing an upgrade at FS, WR2, CB2 or ILB2 is as bad for me as missing out on an OG.
I am disappointed because I was excited about the possibilities in this FA. If they made more good moves (they had some), I'd be the biggest homer around.
I'm sorry if my opinion upsets you, but I see little reason to change it
We are what .... 2 weeks into free agency? The big contracts have been signed, and now teams are starting to go after bargain free agents to try and fill some holes. Many of these free agents will be backups for their new teams. Others might start as a stop gap. Few signed at this point are expected to be better than average players.
We will add 10 players in the draft. We have added 6 players in free agency. Man, how much can a roster be turned over in one year? We added 3 starters, at ILB, SS, and RB ......and a key reserve in slot receiver Hawkins. We added a backup OL who can be active on gamedays because he is versatile enough to play any spot on the OL.
We haven't filled every spot we possibly could look to improve so far. Oh no! The sky is falling! 
Man, we are now into the part of free agency where teams step back a little, and look for bargains. Some teams will cut some players because of other players they signed. Teams will start to settle a bit, and take a look at where they are. Some will start to make plans for the draft, and maybe move out a player here or there that they don't think can contribute. Overall, however, this will be a slower period of free agency. Maybe we'll add a player or 2 between now and the draft, but they will probably be situational or stopgap type players.
Then we go to the draft, where we have 10 picks. (with 7 in the top 4 rounds) This is where we'll make hay. We should come out of this draft with 3-5 guys who are key players, as well as a couple of rookie starters. If we add 3 starters in the draft, which is very likely, then we will have added 6 starters overall, plus a key situational player in Hawkins.
Once more, after the draft, we will have another settling period where teams will look at what they have, release some players who no longer fit, make some trades, and even maybe sign a guy or 2 who fills a hole they didn;t get filled in the draft.
I said it before, and I'll say it again ..... we are barely into the off-season ..... going through only the most expensive part of free agency so far. We still have what should be the most important parts of the off-season yet to come. There is no sense throwing around tons of guaranteed money in spots we are looking to address in the draft.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 77,469
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 77,469 |
Tab I don't believe it's a huge deal, but I do see the OL as one area we "lost ground on".
And yes, if we address it with a quality pick in the draft, that will be a good sign. But where I thought we lost ground was we did have a 6th man to serve as G.
With JT, Greco, Mack, Lavau, and Schwartz, we had what I consider to be a pretty good G in Pinkston to back up either G position. Great? Maybe not, but a solid guy there.
I don't see that now. Given that as of now, Pinston slips into Lavua's role, I don't see a quality depth guy there as we had in Pinkston. With the new signing, maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised, but I honestly don't know enough about the guy to say.
I believe it does however point to the fact they weren't simply ignoring the position however.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,263
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,263 |
Hey Djan Not trying to change your feelings. Just seems a lil extreme cause of all the pos. you listed most of them are pretty deep in this draft. With the least one being MLB. I'm sure we missed on a couple of things but we did try and now we will get it done come draft.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,263
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,263 |
Not to mention we also got that guy who we put on IR, wasn't he like a 2nd rd pick before he got hurt? And the dude we got off the Bungles practice squad, I heard the coaching staff of the Bungles really liked him. So its not like the cupboard is bare.
Dawginit since Jan. 24, 2000 Member #180
You can't fix yesterday but you can learn for tomorrow
#GMSTRONG
I want to do it as a Cleveland Brown because that's who I am.”
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Again with the semantics? It's getting old.
We got ONE starting need fixed from the end of last season: Tate at RB. That's it. I'll give you Hawkins if you consider sWR as a starter...
They CHOSE to cut/let go two veteran players: DQ was under contract and Ward was an AllPro who they didn't (formally) even make an offer to. Thus Dansby and Whitner are LATERAL moves in terms of simple number of needs filled. Maybe we got slightly better, but in counting NEEDS, they didn't erase any from the end of last season as we already had adequate starters there that were never considered needs, thus we didn't feel any needs there.
So we had about 6-8 starting position needs and filled one.
The Ravens had about 5 and filled them all and even upgraded elsewhere, so if you think my claim to fill more needs PRE-draft is bananas, go tell Ozzie that he's stupid doing exactly that.
All I'm asking is that our freaking GM does the same as good GMs of other teams do. Is that too much to ask? Is Farmer the smarter GM than Ozzie? Hasn't this "we have 98 draft picks, calm down, there's enough time" aplogetics rhetoric worn thin with you by now considering our constant 4-5 win seasons?
We keep making the same mistake over and over and over again, which is fielding a team with WAY too many glaring holes. You're only as good as your weakest link and last year's team with all the young talent at hand was proof for that. We need better starters (not great, just AVG !) and better depth...yet we do nothing and want to break in another 10+ rooks...
...here we go again: it's always next year with the Browns.
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 742 |
Quote:
We keep making the same mistake over and over and over again, which is fielding a team with WAY too many glaring holes. You're only as good as your weakest link and last year's team with all the young talent at hand was proof for that. We need better starters (not great, just AVG !) and better depth...yet we do nothing and want to break in another 10+ rooks...
I agree that so far its been lateral or slight upgrades aside of Tate. And yes, we need all of the upgrades we can get. But, there is more time. We can add depth and maybe another starter before the draft. And the draft could yield 2-3 immediate upgrades.
I honestly thought that Banner and Heckert's final year, we actually went backwards in FA. So, I'm relatively pleased. Relatively. But we definitely have more holes to plug and plenty of depth issues to address.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230 |
Way I see it Farmer is adding one to two year players until he can fill that roster spot with a draft pick. Mangini did the same when he got all his old Jets. You can't go into the draft without at least starter quality at every position. You also don't want to be force to draft a position that maybe better next year. I sure as heck don't want Farmer loading up with a bunch FA. Winning teams are built through the draft. Use FA as tool getting a special/unique player or fill a void.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635 |
Except come game day, Mangini's Jets players got their snaps and a lot of them. IE, David Bowens, Barton, Mosley, etc - they all played a lot on game days.
I hope in our case, we do fill that roster spot and with someone who can play.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
Every time I see Barton's name I have to bring this up -- he might have been the slowest football player in the history of the league. Ted Washington could have beat him in a foot race.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635 |
Quote:
Every time I see Barton's name I have to bring this up -- he might have been the slowest football player in the history of the league. Ted Washington could have beat him in a foot race.
This is the truth 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230 |
Quote:
Except come game day, Mangini's Jets players got their snaps and a lot of them. IE, David Bowens, Barton, Mosley, etc - they all played a lot on game days.
I hope in our case, we do fill that roster spot and with someone who can play.
If you recall, Mangini instilled the "earn it' policy to eliminate the country club atmosphere. Besides, I don't think Browns drafted anyone who could replace the above mentioned. Mangini inherited one awful team. Browns had more talent after the expansion draft.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
If Mangini inherited an awful team, then what did Heckert inherit?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
An awful team Mangini made even older and worse? 
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230 |
Quote:
If Mangini inherited an awful team, then what did Heckert inherit?
A cancer free environment, a team who beat the Steelers, and five wins all in one year to bad Heckert couldn't continue the building process,
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 2,230 |
Quote:
A whole five wins!?!?
Heckert/Shurmur/Holmgren matched it!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Quote:
I think you and Vers. are having a "Mcfly" moment when it comes to the G's. Both you guys have done nothing but complain since the start of FA about OG's. Ever hear of the draft? I'm sure it is cheaper to pay a rookie G than over spend for a FA G. Now if we did throw $$$ at a G in FA both of you guys would have been jumping up and down mad about how we over spent for a G. Vers has already stated that he likes to argue the other side of a debate so I can see why he's never happy, does not matter what we've done he's going to debate the other side. But you, like to nit pick anything and everything. You guys are two peas in a pod. Never happy and never will. 
And I think you are so insecure that you can't accept the opinions of others. I also think you have some Nazi in you because we "all have to think the same."
How does that feel?
Leave the personalities out of it and just discuss football!!!!
Sick of all the personal attacks.
Oh, and this is for Daman...LOL..............my first few lines were a parody of what bleeds was saying. They were NOT my true feelings.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Can we please stop w/the Mangini talk? Sheesh, it was a few regimes ago. We'll never agree. Let's leave it at that.
You know...............reading through this thread, it was obvious to me that many are backing every move the FO is making.
It's the Regime Wars. They have been going on for years. You like one regime. You dislike the next. You dislike one regime. You like the next.
Can we please move beyond that and simply judge this particular FO on what they do? I know most of you hated Banner and Lombardi. I get that. However, will you please stop acting like Farmer is crapping golden bricks when he passes on several guards that would have really, really helped us and instead signed a WR who has done relatively nothing to a really big contract?
Will you please try to keep it real?
LOL>>>>>>>>>>>I know you won't, but hey, I tried.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
Quote:
Can we please stop w/the Mangini talk? Sheesh, it was a few regimes ago. We'll never agree. Let's leave it at that.
Aren't you the one who keeps bringing up Tim Couch?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634 |
Do we still need at least one starting guard.... YES.... would it be nice to get a starting guard in the draft and maybe a guy to groom.... yes. I believe the Browns feel they can do that in the draft this year bro without spending a high draft pick buddy.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
And do you believe that is probable? If so, allow me to ask you this: Isn't zone blocking way more complicated than man--or base--blocking? Doesn't it take more time to become cohesive? Isn't it harder for rookies than for guys who have already played in it, such as Beadles, Asamoah, and Scwhartz? Just because the "braintrust" believes they can draft two rookies to plug in right away, doesn't necessarily make it the correct decision, bro. See here..............I'm telling you that the OL will be a problem area this year and many, many posters will be complaining about that unit. Of course, most will say...........they were blasting the FO for not signing any of the FA's that were available this off-season, you know......................kinda like the TRich and Weeden threads. 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634 |
Does it take more time? YES IMO Is it harder to learn? YES IMO Is it the right decision? YES and NO yes in the long run IMO but no in the short term. I know your worried about the line, so am I. Will many people complain... yes, but many of them would complain if we had five pro bowlers on the O-line  Just like everything else we all have our opinions but we will have to wait and see who's opinion was right or wrong bro.
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 55,499 |
Good answer, but just so you know...............I am not all that concerned about who is right and wrong. That's just a board personna.
What I care about is that our OL won't be able to effectively zone block.
Bro, there were guys available this year: Beadles, Asamoah, and Scwartz are all effective zone blocking guards.
Who knows.................maybe I am dead wrong and this won't be an issue....
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,231
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 28,231 |
Quote:
A whole five wins!?!?
I hate to break it to you this way, but that qualifies as one of our Good years.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739 |
I disagree with you. (Surprise)
I think that Dansby is a huge upgrade in the 3-4. If we were going to play a 4-3, then maybe a case could be made for DQ, but we aren't. We play a 3-4 "multi front" defense, and the LB have to be able to more than just play in space. DQ was solid in the 4-3, but last year he was more of a "half tackle" guy. Almost half of his tackles were assists. That is amazing for an ILB. He chased down plays, but rarely made impact plays.
We let DQ go and added Dansby in order to get a bigger impact inside. DQ is a great guy, and a good player. He is just not, and will never be, an impact player. He also, like it or not, has been the voice that a losing defense has listened to for years now. It is time for a new voice in the leadership role, and now we have it.
Same thing with Whitner. Whitner has been through a bad team becoming a great team with the Niners. That experience is so important on a team trying to turn their fortunes around. He is a vocal leader, and we desperately need that. Look at how the offense responded to Hoyer when he came in. Hoyer showed great leadership. Who on defense showed that kind of fire last year?
This year we'll have 2 fiery leaders on defense. I think that helps upgrade more than just the positions they play.
You may, and probably do, disagree. We'll see what happens when the season starts. I think that we'll see a major impact on the defense, similar to the one Hoyer had on the offense.
Let's look at what positions needed filling. (my view)
We needed ILB1, ILB2, CB, SS, WR2, WR3, G, RB, and QB. We have filled ILB1, SS, WR3, and RB.
That leaves ILB2, CB, WR2, G, and QB, in my opinion.
I do not see any other impact ILB available. Dansby seems to me like a perfect fit. DQ did not fit, so I see no problem with letting him go, no matter who replaces him. This other spot seems destined to be addressed in the draft, and probably with one of our top 3 picks..
We need a CB, and made a play for a couple of big names. DRC never visited, despite an invite from the Browns. Revis close to go to the Pats for a 1 year, 12 million deal. It likely would have cost us a lot more. I think that winning was important to Revis, so he can get another enormous deal. He gave a little now to get a lot more later.
I believe that we'll address this spot in the draft with one of our top 3 picks.
QB, obviously, is the other spot destined to be addressed high in the draft.
What does that leave for rounds 3 and on? WR2, G, and probably another RB. (though we'll have some depth with Tate, Baker, and a returning Lewis)
Do I think that we can find a WR2, G, and RB in rounds 4-7? Absolutely. We can also add depth as opportunities in the draft present themselves.
Frankly, I think that we eliminated desperate spots on the team, which is what free agency is for. Good teams don't try to fill every hole, because they can't. They sign selected players who fit, and then work the draft, and the post draft game. That seems to be our philosophy, and I am fine with it. We'll see how successfully Farmer handles these other aspects, but I am really pleased with "phase 1".
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,634 |
Quote:
Good answer, but just so you know...............I am not all that concerned about who is right and wrong. That's just a board personna.
What I care about is that our OL won't be able to effectively zone block.
Bro, there were guys available this year: Beadles, Asamoah, and Scwartz are all effective zone blocking guards.
Who knows.................maybe I am dead wrong and this won't be an issue....
Do you really believe we are going to the super bowl this year? If not do you think we have a better chance of going 2 or three years from now with young O-lineman who we have to pay less, or older O-lineman who will eat up more of the cap when we are close to the cap limit?
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
Quote:
We needed ILB1, ILB2, CB, SS, WR2, WR3, G, RB, and QB. We have filled ILB1, SS, WR3, and RB.
I call big time BS and that's where we obviously "disagree" although it's hindsight rhetoric on your part to make yourself feel better, like Willie and others do. After the last game was played NOBODY on here asked to get rid of DQ and Ward and make upgrades on them, NOBODY, not even you or Vers, I'm 100% sure of that. Most wanted DQ's contract re-structured and Ward -re-signed long term, so that means that nobody saw them as need positions which needed to be upgraded. We needed someone NEXT to DQ and maybe someone next to Ward at FS and CB2, but don't try to sell thos two positions as needs, becaue they weren't. It was their CHOICE, thus a self created need. Dansby for DQ doesn't make Robertson better as ILB2 and the guys behind him, they're still the same players in the same spot on the depth chart, no matter your and other's fantasy rhetoric to feel better about this FA. We upgraded sWR and RB...with two guys that never were starters, so they're projections at this point, although I'd agree that they're projections that have a shot, but still the experience part (been there done that) is missing there.
Quote:
I do not see any other impact ILB available.
...not anymore. There were other complementary ILBs available like Spikes or Moats or A.Jordan or V.Rey or D.Smith, who at least would have solidified the need and upgraded the depth. They just chose (again) to not pursue them. Probably dreaming big looking at the draft, which is a mistake imho.
If you bank on 3rd day picks to be contributors from day one, your team is very likely to start the season 2-6 and waste another season before it has even started. Rinse and repeat.
You say good team don't try to fill every hole, but that's exactly what some good teams like the Giants, Ravens and Broncos did, so aren't they good anymore?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,149
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,149 |
I think you are twisting the position on Ward. I know I felt this way and know I wasn't the only one who felt this way....while I may not have said I wanted to let Ward walk, I said I wouldn't mind if he did. Great player against the run, not so good against the pass. I said I wouldn't be upset if we kept him, or if we let him move on...and I'm not.
Overall I think we upgraded because Whitner is better against the pass. In the end, I value skills against the pass in backfield guys more than their ability to defend the run.
Linbacker is the other way. I value their ability to stuff the run and or pressure the QB over any lack of coverage skills.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,142
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,142 |
I don't think Ytown is that far off base. DQ's struggles in the 3-4 were many and well-documented; so I disagree, in principle, about what you said about DQ going into the offseason. While many people had a soft spot in their hearts regarding DQ, anyone that took an objective look at his spot saw a sorta-need. I say sorta, because DQ is good enough to hold down the fort, but everyone could see, due to age and scheme mismatch, that the guy's days were numbered on this team. Sure, we could've kept him around, but instead we "sorta-upgraded".
Ward - Totally with you on this one. At the end of the day, this is about as lateral a move as it gets.
WR - Bess going nuts created a need, and we filled it. We still have a need at WR, but I the right move is to address WR2 in this draft. No need for another FA WR (and we get to finally take a look at the one guy we grabbed from GB).
Safety - I think this FO is content to sit on what we now have at the safety position. I think I'm ok with them doing this.
ILB - This is a position where I'm just 'ok' with them addressing in the draft. It would've been nice if they grabbed a Moats or something, but I'm not as miffed about this as I am...
CB2 - Huge miss in FA. We need to get a competent vet in there to start opposite Haden. Skrine is only a spot-starter on the outside. McFadden is just not good enough (and may not ever be). We went after Revis, but I don't think we went hard enough. For starting CBs, you can't draft rookies and throw them into the fire. Ugh...
Guard - Also would've been nice to get someone in FA, but I'm not worried about addressing this spot in the draft. Yeah, we might have to take a guard a little higher than we'd like to get a starter, but it's doable.
I agree with a poster above that said if we had done FA like you wanted, then we would've been spending like drunken sailors. However, there are 1-2 positions that I think we should have been able to upgrade that we haven't yet.
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
-Ballpeen
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 17,475 |
How could Polian (of all people) look at Denver signing Peyton Manning and not consider them the big winners? I don't think Polian put the status of FA Winner...a consensus of ESPN n NFL Network guys did. Just like some were talking about Revis signing with NE had them saying here n there they were the big winner. But at the end they will name another. Right now it would have to be Denver I think. I don't know who made a bigger splash then them. So I'll go on record that the streak will probably end this season. Unless Manning gets injured they are going to the playoffs. 99% sure only cause there is that 1% chance. 
In most rankings we are listed in the Winners bracket - hopefully not the TOP WINNER...I want to surprise all and go in the playoffs. Wish we had continuity in our O n D...  So it might be I have to wait till 2015?
So we got our OG...are we done? Will we go for a Grossman.
Will we wait till after the draft and fill some depth with 1 year contracts???
JMH?
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,475
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,475 |
Quote:
Guard - Also would've been nice to get someone in FA, but I'm not worried about addressing this spot in the draft. Yeah, we might have to take a guard a little higher than we'd like to get a starter, but it's doable.
your prayers have been answered lol
Meh.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739 |
Sorry, but I have wanted to upgrade DQ for a long time. I have felt that he was overrated for quite a while. I have had the opinion(and taken abuse) that I feel that he is not a difference maker. I call BS on that. On 12/27, I said this: Honestly, I have no idea how they see DQ. I have always seen him as more competent than impact player, but that may be what they want inside on their defense. https://www.dawgtalkers.net/showflat.php?...rue#Post1103533That has long been my feeling about DQ, He is a competent guy, but not a difference maker, at a position where many great defenses have a difference maker. As far as Ward, many of us were perfectly OK with replacing Ward with Byrd. Well, that didn't happen, but they did replace Ward with a Pro Bowl Safety. It's not like they replaced him with some bum who can't play the position. Further, the speed with which the Browns signed Whitner implies that he was a major priority for the team. Pro Football Focus evidently had Whitner ranked as the 5th best Safety in coverage last year. That would have to be an upgrade over Ward, who is better as an In the Box Safety. Different schemes require different strengths. As far as the other ILB available ..... we were linked to Moats ...... but what is Moats? He is competent ...... but that's about it. Signing him certainly wouldn't have been some grand and glorious moment of excitement. He has experience ...... but that's about it. I would have liked to have seen the Browns make a run at Rey, but I see no way the Bengals let him go. I really wasn't thrilled with what was left after the 1st round of free agency. I think that we got the perfect guy for the middle of this defense we'll run ..... as well as a leader. You disagree. We'll see how it all works out.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,739 |
NFL evolution: How safety became the most significant position on D | The MMQB with Peter King http://mmqb.si.com/2014/03/19/nfl-free-agency-safety-position-evolution/BROWNS Out: T.J. Ward (signed as UFA with Denver for four years, $22.5 million, with $14 million guaranteed) In: Donte Whitner (signed as UFA from San Francisco for four years, $28 million, with $13 million guaranteed) At first glance, this appears to be a downgrade. Ward, 27, costs an average of just under $6 million annually and is coming off the best season in his four-year career. He’s not only a stalwart tackler (both in open field and in traffic), he’s also instinctive in zone coverage and formidable in man-to-man. Whitner, who turns 29 in July, will cost his hometown Browns an average of $7 million annually. He’s a better downhill hitter than Ward, but not a better tackler. He can play zone coverage but is less dimensional in man-to-man, having operated primarily as a two-deep help-defender in San Francisco. Whitner also has the veteran experience to communicate disguises and adjustments before the snap, which is crucial in Pettine’s scheme. Whitner, however, is arguably a superior fit in new head coach Mike Pettine’s multidimensional scheme. Pettine didn’t blitz his safeties all that often as Buffalo’s defensive coordinator last year—perhaps due to his secondary being depleted until November—but he routinely did under Rex Ryan in New York. Whitner, thanks to tremendous initial downhill burst, is a missile who excels on blitzes. That same downhill burst also allows him to squat and fire into passing lanes, a terrific trait to have in disguised-pressure schemes that are designed to force quarterbacks into throwing early. The Browns paid more for an older, less versatile safety, but they might have gotten the one best suited for their needs. Indirectly, they confirmed that Pettine’s scheme will be very similar to the one he ran with the Jets. Which makes sense. In Joe Haden, Pettine has one of the few corners who can play the Revis role.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 12,635 |
Good article and states what been said around here often by a numerous amount of people - however, there are still those who feel TJ would have a better than Hitner in Pettine's scheme and there is nothing to be said to change their mind otherwise, and that's coming from a BIG The Ward fan in myself.
Pettine and Jim know their defense and if they deemed Hitner a better fit/option, then I believe it.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,584
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,584 |
Quote:
The Ravens had about 5 and filled them all and even upgraded elsewhere, so if you think my claim to fill more needs PRE-draft is bananas, go tell Ozzie that he's stupid doing exactly that.
What drivel. The Ravens have signed or traded for 3 players (WR Steve Smith, C Jeremy Zuttah, and S Darian Stewart) yet they lost DE Arthur Jones, CB Corey Graham, S James Ihedigbo, OT Michael Oher, and WR Tandon Doss. So lets see, they lost their starting RT, DE, SS, 3rd CB and backup WR and they added a mediocre Starting C, a backup S, and a guy who at this point in his career is a backup WR. So tell me how the filled all their holes when they still have huge ones at RT, WR, DL, SS, and 3rd CB.
#gmstrong
Live, Love, Laugh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 5,761 |
They also re-signed their other most important contributors in ILB D.Smith, WR/KR J.Jones, TE Pitta and above all LT Monroe. Those are 3-4 starters too that they had to re-sign or replace with a very limited cap to work with.
The Ravens opened FA with 12mil in cap. We had over 4 times that amount and didn't do more. In fact, they plugged more holes with those 12mil than we did.
Their only urgent need left at before the draft is RT, and maybe DE, but Tyson is their version of Hughes and is at least a servicable 2nd DE.
Entering FA they had major problems at WR, TE, ILB, FS, C and LG. They upgraded LG by moving last year's RT, Osemele, over there where he fits better, which in turn swapped the need to RT.
Other than Smith at WR they didn't try to break the bank or bring in stars, but the plan was to fill as many of those holes as possible with servicable vets who are experienced...and they did just that.
We did the contrary. We neglected servicable, low price vets and either gave aging "stars" their retirement contract (Dansby/Whitner) or overpaid for young projection who lack experience (Hawkins, Dray...Tate-deal was ok, but helped by low market). If you think that's smart, more power to you.
The difference in FA philosophy couldn't be clearer imho. Maybe we should start looking at how good teams work the FA and not make the draft our Super Bowl every year. How many times do we have to realize that you can't ask a rook to be a good or even servicable starter from day one? Remember last year's "plan" of McFadden competing for CB2? Why put yourself in that situation? Why back yourself into a corner like that?
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 42,413 |
You would probably agree it is much easier to execute a free agent plan when you have twenty years of infrastructure in place, right?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,584
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 4,584 |
They could have signed their own guys at any time they didn't have to wait until Free Agency started to do it. Quote:
Other than Smith at WR they didn't try to break the bank or bring in stars, but the plan was to fill as many of those holes as possible with servicable vets who are experienced...and they did just that.
???? They didn't sign anybody but a backup S and traded for a C which wasn't a big need for them to start with.
Quote:
Their only urgent need left at before the draft is RT, and maybe DE, but Tyson is their version of Hughes and is at least a servicable 2nd DE.
Entering FA they had major problems at WR, TE, ILB, FS, C and LG. They upgraded LG by moving last year's RT, Osemele, over there where he fits better, which in turn swapped the need to RT.
They still have huge needs at RT, DE, SS, and WR. You think Tyson who in 2 years has only managed 19 tackles and 2 sacks is good enough to start? That's half the stats of Hughes.
Quote:
The difference in FA philosophy couldn't be clearer imho. Maybe we should start looking at how good teams work the FA and not make the draft our Super Bowl every year. How many times do we have to realize that you can't ask a rook to be a good or even servicable starter from day one? Remember last year's "plan" of McFadden competing for CB2? Why put yourself in that situation? Why back yourself into a corner like that?
The key word is "competing". You don't think other teams hope that their rookies can compete for starting roles?
#gmstrong
Live, Love, Laugh
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Signings/Re-Signings
|
|
