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They didnt cut Bess because of drugs or being mentally unstable but because he couldnt catch a cold. If you are a great player they wil protect their investment. If you suck they will eliminate the problem.
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That is kind of my point.
We will support you [only if you are really, really good] otherwise, we could care less about your druggy self.
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We really don't know and don't know Bess' response to it if there was something.
He wasn't the league leading WR so the interest in reporting on it was not there like it is with Gordon.
#gmstrong
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Don't get me wrong.......I am glad Josh is getting help, but man.........I detest hypocrisy.
Quote:
"If any of our players are in need of help, we'll do our best to provide it for them and also that we're going to do what we feel is best for the organization,'' Pettine said.
What did they do for Bess?
We have no idea what they did for Bess. You make a lot of assumptions in your life, don't you? How do we know that the Browns didn't offer Bess help, only to have him decline the help? Plus, Bess' problems certainly appeared to go way past any that Gordon has. Also, maybe they were worried about his influence on other players on the team.
It's hard to know what happens inside any organization with certainty. We don't knwo the day to day, and we don't know the biggest problems that presented themselves with regards to each player.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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We will support you [only if you are really, really good] otherwise, we could care less about your druggy self.
Yeah, I guess there is a selfish element to it. But we still don't know if they tried to help him or not.
#gmstrong
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You know what, guys...............I think you are full of crap.
Always w/a speculative answer that favors your point of view.
Don't look at things objectively, guys. Look at them so it fits nice and tidy in your own little viewpoints.
You might fool others w/your BS, but you ain't fooling me...............there is NO WAY that the Browns treated Bess's and Gordon's situations the same way in terms of human compassion. No way!!!
Now.....................is that okay? Perhaps? However, don't give me this crap about the Browns being compassionate and caring about the welfare of their players. They made their decisions on each player based on how much they have produced and could produce in the future. Good will was NEVER part of the equation.
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Wow! I sound mean.
Sorry about that. Really.
I just don't buy the human compassion part. I think the Browns made a business decision on both players. Human compassion had nothing to do w/it. Sorry for the harshness of my previous post, unless PDR, crfs, or TopDawg read it...........LMAO.
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~ Legend
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There's a bit of a difference with weed/alcohol abuse than a few manic episodes.
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http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap2000000368581/article/report-browns-josh-gordon-checked-into-rehabWow Gordon checked into a rehab. Maybe his agent told him to. Report: Browns' Josh Gordon checked into rehab 16 By Kevin Patra Around the League writer Published: July 24, 2014 at 07:09 p.m. Updated: July 24, 2014 at 07:23 p.m. Josh Gordon has taken steps to get right after his recent DWI arrest. Fox Sports' Mike Garafolo reported Thursday that the Browns wide receiver checked himself into rehab after his recent legal troubles. Gordon still expects to report to Browns training camp on Friday with the rest of the team's veterans as he awaits a status update on his 2014 season. NFL Media Insider Ian Rapoport reported that the appeals hearing for Gordon's potentially lengthy suspension for a positive drug test will be held on Aug. 1. Browns coach Mike Pettine said this week the team has no plans to cut ties with the dynamic but troubled receiver. Gordon's willingness to check into a rehab facility signifies a step in the right direction for the Pro Bowl receiver. The 23-year-old pro has had multiple positive drug tests dating back to his college days. He was suspended two games last season following a failed test. It seems clear that Gordon has a substance abuse problem and help can only come when he admits he has a problem. However long Gordon is suspended from the Browns, hopefully he'll continue to get whatever help he needs.
Joe Thomas #73
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Okay, so who deserves more compassion? The guy who greedily indulges himself of the guy w/legitimate problems?
Come on, bro. This isn't about right or wrong, just or injust. It is about one guy produced big numbers and the other didn't. Compassion has ZERO to do w/it.
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~ Legend
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Okay, so who deserves more compassion? The guy who greedily indulges himself of the guy w/legitimate problems?
Come on, bro. This isn't about right or wrong, just or injust. It is about one guy produced big numbers and the other didn't. Compassion has ZERO to do w/it.
I still somewhat doubt the claim. From what I remember we did offer help to Bess by putting him on the PUP list once we learned about his family issues. We also haven't offered that much help to Josh (AFAIK) except for words of encouragement. I think the Browns helped a lot, but we just had to cut ties with him after the Police "assault". That said, Bess is doing really good now, apparently.
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Gordon is still on our roster despite many more screw-ups than Bess. Come on.......we all know why. It's because Gordon has more talent. It's not about compassion for the person. It's about what can this guy do for me down the road.
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Again, we don't know the details of either player, let alone both. It is obvious that Bess had problems, but as far as I know, never failed a drug test. Has it even been proven, absolutely, that he has a drug problem, or does he have mental issues? Maybe bess asked to be released so he can work on his issues. We don't know. I make assumptions and state possibilities, and so do you. You simply take the opposite side, That doesn't make you right, and it doesn't make me right .... because we will probably NEVER know for sure what the whole story is.
It's like when a guy fails a drufg test and is suspended. he says that it was ... something ...... but the NFL never comments beyond what policy was violated, and what the penalty is. We have t fill in the blanks with reports, leaks, stories, and interviews/statements by the plater. What is the truth? Who know ..... beyond the fact that someone got suspended?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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I hear you.........but come on, bro................are you really saying that the production of the player has NO BEARING on how much compassion the team shows each player?
Let's get real. Gordon has screwed up more than Bess, but he is receiving compassion from the Browns because of his production, not because the Browns are so caring.
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Oh I'm quite sue it does, but that doesn't automatically mean that the team would boot the 5th rounder while keeping the 1st rounder. There are constant value judgments being made in the NFL, and character is one of those. Pettine said that you may have different solutions for different players. What worked for Chris Carter, for example, might not be the best way to handle Gordon. I agree that the UDFA who is suspended for drugs is far less likely to ever play in the NFL than a guy like Gordon. That doesn't necessarily mean that the team doesn't try to help each player though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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~ Legend
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Gordon is still on our roster despite many more screw-ups than Bess. Come on.......we all know why. It's because Gordon has more talent. It's not about compassion for the person. It's about what can this guy do for me down the road.
Not necessarily what I'm trying to say. I'm just trying to say that Bess was offered treatment just as Josh was. I get the differences between them and their positions completely. I just feel like you're saying that the Browns' left Bess out to dry, which is not true imo.
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Don't get me wrong.......I am glad Josh is getting help, but man.........I detest hypocrisy.
Quote:
"If any of our players are in need of help, we'll do our best to provide it for them and also that we're going to do what we feel is best for the organization,'' Pettine said.
What did they do for Bess?
They cut him.. why? because in addition to helping our players, we're going to do what we feel is best for the organization... Bess wasn't a very productive player..
In the end, this is a football team, not a state run mental facility. They will tolerate and help the players that can help them back. That's not being hypocritical.
yebat' Putin
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That's pretty much, almost exactly what Vers is saying.
#gmstrong
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Then we just disagree on whether it's hypocritical or not.. I don't think it is.
yebat' Putin
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I'm not sure if this has any impact on the situation, but everyone from the GM, to HC, OC and DC are new. We have an entire new regime in place.
I for one won't judge what this regime is doing compared to what the last one did. I'm not saying this regime would have tried to help Bess in the same way they are trying to help Gordon, but I can say one never knows.
Things and policies change from regime to regime. Who knows, maybe if Banner was in charge Gordon would be cut? I just believe it's unfair to question why one regime acted differently than the last one. Each acts on their own.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Plan on Gordon not playing this season. 
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Gordon is still on our roster despite many more screw-ups than Bess. Come on.......we all know why. It's because Gordon has more talent. It's not about compassion for the person. It's about what can this guy do for me down the road.
Not necessarily what I'm trying to say. I'm just trying to say that Bess was offered treatment just as Josh was. I get the differences between them and their positions completely. I just feel like you're saying that the Browns' left Bess out to dry, which is not true imo.
I also think the Bess situation is/was different. When it comes down to it (IMO, of course) Bess's issues and his getting cut are two separate things.
Bess got cut because he sucked. Questionable catching (which was his advertised strength, if I remember correctly) led to quite a few highlight reel bonehead plays. The guy didn't produce, so he got cut.
At the end of the season, it came out that he was on a downward spiral. I don't know what the Browns did to help him, but putting him on the PUP was doing him a solid, I believe.
Vers, I don't think you're 100% wrong. It would be silly to say that cutting Bess didn't come down to a business decision. But I don't think that's a bad thing. These guys are here to run a football team, and other people are paid to run rehab/treatment facilities. One of the considerations had to be Bess's influence on the young guys on the roster (i.e. Gordon).
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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I for one won't judge what this regime is doing compared to what the last one did. I'm not saying this regime would have tried to help Bess in the same way they are trying to help Gordon, but I can say one never knows.
Ray Farmer was hired in February, Bess was released in March... so Farmer may not have known Bess, but he is the guy who released him.. would he have helped him if he knew him better? I don't know... but when the old regime left, Bess was still on the roster.
yebat' Putin
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Then we just disagree on whether it's hypocritical or not.. I don't think it is.
If you're exceptionally good at your job, you tend to get special treatment.
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Ray Farmer was hired in February, Bess was released in March... so Farmer may not have known Bess, but he is the guy who released him.. would he have helped him if he knew him better? I don't know... but when the old regime left, Bess was still on the roster.
I'm certain he knew everything. FO's don't typically sign/cut players without all the detailed information available. Bess didn't play well. That is known. Perhaps it was a result of his off field behaviors. Plus, we don't know the extent that the FO tried or didn't try to help him. Or even if Bess chose to take advantage of any help if offered. If he was using drugs he could very well have been in denial which could have caused him to refuse help.
In the end we aren't privy to inside information. Because of Gordon's season last year he is the much bigger story so we hear more.
Who knows. I don't believe any FO is just downright ruthless barren of human compassion for all but their best players.
#gmstrong
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J/C: Per Twitter ; Nathan Zegura: Quote:
#FLASH MT @AKinkhabwala: Someone just pulled into the Browns facility in a camouflage Porsche.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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j/c...
1. I think by the Law we can't as an organization publicize medical treatment etc. with the media so I don't know what we did for Bess if anything.
2. Without a doubt in LIFE - we tend to help and show favoritism to those in the Upper Case of station. Whether it be work, beauty, handsome, etc. I mean if I have a top sales man making 6 figures cause they are bringing in millions to the company in gross sales and a low end making barely 30K and bringing in not that much. Both get a DUI. Man that top salesman is going to rehab on our dime get him back and straight - oh the other guy. You've over stayed your welcome here...good bye! That is pretty much the norm all over.
jmho
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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I've searched unsuccessfully for the actual rules concerning failed drug tests for the NFL. Anyone have a link for them? I'd like to read for myself what the rules say exactly, and what the penalties are for each occurrence.
My biggest question is, does the league require any drug and alcohol counseling in any level of infraction(s)? Or do they just punish them?
Never have hope. You won’t be disappointed.
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Quote:
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I for one won't judge what this regime is doing compared to what the last one did. I'm not saying this regime would have tried to help Bess in the same way they are trying to help Gordon, but I can say one never knows.
Ray Farmer was hired in February, Bess was released in March... so Farmer may not have known Bess, but he is the guy who released him.. would he have helped him if he knew him better? I don't know... but when the old regime left, Bess was still on the roster.
The question could be asked, why didn't Banner and Lombardi do more to help Bess, especially since his issues began to show publicly when he left the team in Dec. 2013...
...Bess, 12/13/2013 web page
...Bess, 1/16/2014 web page
FOOTBALL IS NOT BASEBALL
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Just clicking bro
"Let he who is without sin cast the first stone"
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Quote:
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I for one won't judge what this regime is doing compared to what the last one did. I'm not saying this regime would have tried to help Bess in the same way they are trying to help Gordon, but I can say one never knows.
Ray Farmer was hired in February, Bess was released in March... so Farmer may not have known Bess, but he is the guy who released him.. would he have helped him if he knew him better? I don't know... but when the old regime left, Bess was still on the roster.
The question could be asked, why didn't Banner and Lombardi do more to help Bess, especially since his issues began to show publicly when he left the team in Dec. 2013...
...Bess, 12/13/2013 web page
...Bess, 1/16/2014 web page
I don't think anyone knows "for sure" what Banner and Lombardi did or didn't to to help Bess..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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LOL........your argument proved my point. Whatever man..........like we always say........perception is reality for many folks.
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I'm gonna go out on a limb here, JG gets suspended for 10 games, yeah that's right, 10 games.
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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How did you come up w/that number?
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Maybe a really not failed drug test, Roger Goodell saving face after the Rice suspension, and the 2 weeks of rehab showing something of a good will.
Essentially hope, looking for closure on the situation, and #brownsgoodkarma
President - Fort Collins Browns Backers
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Haven't seen this posted anywhere... On Fansided.com Quote:
The NFL’s receiving yards leader from a season ago will meet with the NFL on Aug. 1 to have his appeal hearing heard and could be facing an indefinite suspension according to ESPN’s Chris Mortensen. However, Mortsensen also mentioned on Friday’s “NFL Live” that Gordon could get off on a technicality and could be available for Cleveland.
If true, the season may be looking up! 
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Quote:
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I for one won't judge what this regime is doing compared to what the last one did. I'm not saying this regime would have tried to help Bess in the same way they are trying to help Gordon, but I can say one never knows.
Ray Farmer was hired in February, Bess was released in March... so Farmer may not have known Bess, but he is the guy who released him.. would he have helped him if he knew him better? I don't know... but when the old regime left, Bess was still on the roster.
The question could be asked, why didn't Banner and Lombardi do more to help Bess, especially since his issues began to show publicly when he left the team in Dec. 2013...
...Bess, 12/13/2013 web page
...Bess, 1/16/2014 web page
I wasn't aware that professional sports organizations were morally obligated to help people with mental issues or drug additions.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Haven't seen this posted anywhere...
On Fansided.com
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The NFL’s receiving yards leader from a season ago will meet with the NFL on Aug. 1 to have his appeal hearing heard and could be facing an indefinite suspension according to ESPN’s Chris Mortensen. However, Mortsensen also mentioned on Friday’s “NFL Live” that Gordon could get off on a technicality and could be available for Cleveland.
If true, the season may be looking up!
That would be pretty good.... 
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Hey Tony: I appreciate your support of Josh Gordon. Cutting him seems ridiculous. Why give up so early on such a promising athlete's career? The benefit of his potential impact on the team in future seasons far outweighs the minimal cost of keeping him on the roster now, not to mention the personal benefit he gains from the support of the organization and his teammates. In regards to Josh Gordon's contract, I believe you stated a one-year suspension would essentially extend his contract another year. Given our (Browns fans') paranoia about losing our players to free agency, is the extension of Gordon's contract a silver lining to the loss of his impact on the roster in 2014? Of course the best-case scenario involves him playing as many games as possible, but having him only play a couple games this year would essentially eliminate the possibility of extending his contract due to a year-long suspension. Thanks for the great work. -- Nick, Charlotte, NC Hey Nick: That’s an interesting question – is it better to have Gordon suspended 16 games and owe the Browns two more full seasons under contract, or have him be active for, say, four games and owe the Browns only one more season under contract? The problem with an indefinite suspension is that, per rules, the Browns would be prohibited from having contact with Gordon during the suspension and in order for him to be reinstated he would have to pass drug tests along the way. If the suspension is for less than “indefinitely,” Gordon would be able to practice and play in pre-season, as the suspension would begin in the first week of regular season. Thus, they would have more time to surround Gordon with their support group and keep him focused on staying clean. I don’t know the answer. http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=18&post_id=35241
being a browns fan is like taking your dog to vet every week to be put down...
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Josh Gordon hearing set for late
July
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