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You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
Did you ever hear of Carson Palmer or Phillip Rivers?
Hell, even Jay Cutler, Vince Young, Eli Manning, Matt Leinart and a few more I'm forgetting even started their first season as backups.
It's the way things are done in the NFL, or you end up with people like Ryan Leaf and Tim Couch. Pay attention.
...or Charlie Frye 
you had a good run Hank.
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my multiple postings of Frye being 17th best QB out of 36 QB's from Week 8 through week 17, the 2nd half of the season under Jeff Davidson.
How many times are you going to talk about Frye being the SEVENTEENTH best quarterback in a LIMITED TIME FRAME?
My God, let's build a statue for this monumentous feat. 
How would Peyton Manning do with no-oline, no running game, WR running wrong routes, WR dropping the 7th most passes in the NFL and NO AUDIBLES? I'd say yes, this is a monumentous feat. Mad because it debunks your myths that Frye is a horrible QB?
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Legend
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How many times are you going to talk about Frye being the SEVENTEENTH best quarterback in a LIMITED TIME FRAME?
The time frame matters because it's the only time frame Frye played with a competent offensive coordinator.
Frye's not why the team stunk last year. But let's just blame it on him anyways.
I'm not blaming anything on him, bro. I liked Charlie...Quinn's got the better potential. He's got more tools than Charlie Frye. Charlie Frye was nothing to gamble on, 17th best QB or not. 
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You say this Quote:
It's hard being a Browns fan when there are so many nescient Browns fans out there that don't know the first thing about what it takes to succeed in the NFL
But you also say this
Quote:
You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
[color:"white"]I've always been crazy, but it's kept me from going insane -Waylon Jennings
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Legend
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fickle women is what many Browns fans are like.
When it comes to QB's, I can't say I'd be the first to disagree with you.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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Practice Squad
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Quote:
You say this
Quote:
It's hard being a Browns fan when there are so many nescient Browns fans out there that don't know the first thing about what it takes to succeed in the NFL
But you also say this
Quote:
You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
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Legend
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my multiple postings of Frye being 17th best QB out of 36 QB's from Week 8 through week 17, the 2nd half of the season under Jeff Davidson.
How many times are you going to talk about Frye being the SEVENTEENTH best quarterback in a LIMITED TIME FRAME?
My God, let's build a statue for this monumentous feat.
How would Peyton Manning do with no-oline, no running game, WR running wrong routes, WR dropping the 7th most passes in the NFL and NO AUDIBLES? I'd say yes, this is a monumentous feat. Mad because it debunks your myths that Frye is a horrible QB?
Uh...no, as I never said Frye was a horrible QB. I jsut said Quinn has more potential and better tools.
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All Pro
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Quote:
You say this
Quote:
It's hard being a Browns fan when there are so many nescient Browns fans out there that don't know the first thing about what it takes to succeed in the NFL
But you also say this
Quote:
You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
If you new anything about a Salary Cap then you'd know what I said is correct. Then again ...
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
Quote:
You say this
Quote:
It's hard being a Browns fan when there are so many nescient Browns fans out there that don't know the first thing about what it takes to succeed in the NFL
But you also say this
Quote:
You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
If you new anything about a Salary Cap then you'd know what I said is correct. Then again ...
Dude...ideally, a high-round investment at QB sits for at least a season. Doesn't always work that way, but it's every GM's dream to have a year of time to let a guy watch.
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J/C...
What would I do with Frye....First off I would Draft a Left Tackle....like Thomas.(.we did.) then I would shore up the rest of the line.....Get Edwards head out of his ass....and make him act like the receiver he`s capable of being.....Draft a good size back to help Lewis ...
Have the O.C...call plays that will use the strengths of the offense.....Have Charlie compete hard for the job....and if he wins the job...PLAY HIM.....not to many QB`s would sucssede behind previous lines this team has had..........
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All Pro
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If you new anything about a Salary Cap then you'd know what I said is correct. Then again ...
And now you think you know more about the salary cap than most NFL teams. Give it a rest. Do you even watch football?
[color:"white"]I've always been crazy, but it's kept me from going insane -Waylon Jennings
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The Browns did not draft Brady Quinn and are not going to pay Brady Quinn 1st round money to be a career backup to Frye. It now doesn't matter if Frye goes on to be a good NFL QB like Drew Brees. Frye's time as a Browns QB is almost over, just like Brees' time as a Charger was numbered when they got Rivers.
Anyone thinking Quinn is not going to be starting for the Browns in 2008 regardless of how good or bad Frye does this year is naive. This is Frye's last year as the starter, even if he makes a Pro-Bowl. You don't draft a QB in the 1st round and give them 1st round money to sit the bench.
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It now doesn't matter if Frye goes on to be a good NFL QB like Drew Brees.
It's possible that he does...but the odds aren't in his favor. With Quinn...the odds are higher.
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1st String
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If you've been around so much and seen so much then you would have remembered my multiple postings of Frye being the 17th best QB out of 36 QB's from Week 8 through week 17, the 2nd half of the season under Jeff Davidson.
Man, that's special!. SEVENTEENTH! Out of THIRTY-SIX! Wow! Let's take a closer look at that amazing period of time, shall we?
Week 8: Win - 81.8 rating - 68% completion - 1 INT - 1 TD
Week 9: Loss - 72.3 rating - 59% completion - 1 INT - 1 TD
Week 10: Win - 109.1 rating - 72.7% completion - 0 INT - 1 TD
Week 11: Loss - 89.1 rating - 63% completion - 0 INT - 0 TD
Week 12: Loss - 40.9 rating - 62% completion - 4 INT - 0 TD
Week 13: No decision - 131.4 rating - 85% completion - 0 INT - 1 TD
Week 17: Loss - 74 rating - 73.5% completion - 1 INT - 0 TD
Total: 2-4, 85.5 rating, 61.7% completion (118/191), 7 INT, 4 TD
So, he threw 7 INTs over that period, just 4 TDs and was shutout in three (43%) of the games. As well, he was not 3-4, but 2-4 -- Charlie left the KC game injured with KC well ahead.
Now, for your information, I've supported every QB we've had in here. I supported Frye when the coaches put him in, I supported DA when Frye was injured, and Frye when he returned.
I hated the way "fans" treated Couch, Garcia and even Dilfer -- it's hard enough to be a QB in this town on the field without all the other crap that goes along with it (cheering when someone gets hurt, etc). I know. I have seats by morons like this at the stadium and it drives my wife and I crazy.
All that being said, I'm also a rational person. Like our QBs on the field, I also support Savage. I wanted JT as first pick, but once Quinn started to fall and Savage showed interest, I supported that. When he made the pick, I was happy -- not because of what it meant for Charlie, but what it meant for the team overall.
I see nothing wrong with bringing in BQ and I expect Frye to man-up and compete for the job -- not take the easy way out and demand to leave.
I expect the best QB to earn the position and the runner up to learn to deal with it -- and I will whole-heartedly support whoever that is.
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Congrats on being a season ticket holder. I sure hope you weren't one of the fans that cheered when Couch got hurt.
I'm not sure why it's any of your business what I do, or why you continue to try to blame me, specifically, for every thing you dislike about others.
**Insert clever signature here attributed to some historical figure that sounds interesting but has been taken completely out of context.
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2nd String
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Frye has to be traded now. No way Frye makes it past the first play in practice before fans start calling for Quinn. It will be a horrible situation. Might as well trade Frye now.
Hopefully Savage didn't blow it like he did with Boller with this move to get Quinn.
ozzie drafted boller, and many reports stated it was teh oz man who actually pushed for kb
![[Linked Image from img413.imageshack.us]](http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4226/bentleysigpo1.jpg) Hurry Back LeCharles.
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Ok, so why is everybody feuding over Quinn vs. Frye? Both wear Brown and Orange and deserve our support until they no longer are a Brown If Frye plays well and earns the starting job then he should be the starter, if he does not then Quinn should get an oppurtunity. Whoever starts, we fans, should support. If Frye loses the starting job to Quinn then it would be nice to have him as a backup but if he wants to leave and try to get a starting gig somewhere else then I don't blame him and I wish him well.
However, Mensa, I don't think the 17th best QB in the last 8 games is going to be the deciding factor in any of the other teams wanting him as their starter. He did nothing that was so great in those, or any other game, as our starter and it's the final results that most people and teams look at.
BTW. I'm not blaming Frye for our problems either, just saying he didn't exactly light it up on offense. Plenty of blame to go around with last years Browns.
I did not want Quinn with the 3rd overall pick and we got J.T. I'm happy and even though I feel we gave up a lot for Quinn, I will support him as long as he wears the Brown and Orange, same goes for Frye. (and all other players.)
Last edited by Rabidfan; 04/29/07 01:36 AM.
![[Linked Image from i89.photobucket.com]](http://i89.photobucket.com/albums/k233/marctheshark1969/thrandelelisafaggot.jpg)
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Now what I'd do is sit Quinn for a season and allow him to learn the playbook and the new offensive scheme. (would be better if we had a vet for Quinn to learn under but we don't.) Then in 2008 I'd let Quinn and Frye battle it out for the starting job, if Frye proves this season he deserves the oppurtunity to challenge for the starting spot. If Frye looks bad this season then Quinn would get the shot at starter and Frye would either accept being our backup or move on. If he stayed fine, if not, then I'd look to bring in a vet backup. DA would be gone now, Dorsey, rumor has it, has some intelligence on the sideline and that could be useful for another season and maybe longer. He could be our 3rd stringer. I'd be praying that Bentley will be back, at least by the 2008 season. That would give us a BEAST of an OL. Bentley and Steinbach G, Fraley C, Thomas LT, then we would just need to solidify the RT spot. Tuck will probably be ok for the short term but we will need to address that spot soon. Maybe Shaffer or Sowells but I'm not holding my breathe on that thought. After that, it's just depth for the OL.
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#9 is terrible. Makes me happy as a Browns fan to flush that turd down the toilet he belongs in.
The pulse of Browns fans today is that we are re-energized. We kicked everyone else's ass today. Cinci, Pukesburgh, they're ALL jealous of us today. Trust me on that.
Start Quinn day one. Quinn is in every way possible superior to #9.
Last edited by Ammo; 04/29/07 01:53 AM.
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Hall of Famer
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Just wondering what you guys think is gonna happen to Frye now that Quinn is in the fold. The most likely scenario IMO is that he's traded before the end of the weekend, seeing as how he can't really add anything as far as mentorship goes.
But what if there aren't any takers? Do we cut him? Do we try to keep him on as a backup?
You don't do ANYTHING with Frye.
He's the starter going in because he's experienced. Quinn is the future but Frye gets a chance to prove everyone wrong and win the job behind an IMPROVED offensive line.
That's all the Frye backers could EVER ask for going into his 3rd year.
If he doesn't do everything that people wish he can do, he becomes a viable backup QB which makes him value as a 3rd round pick.
Think about it. If you trade Frye, now Derek freakin' Anderson becomes the backup QB, which means a guy with no experience.
Forget what some guys want you to think. Frye doesn't call the shots. The BROWNS call the shots. Frye is under a CHEAP contract for two more seasons, and nobody wants him as a starter.
That should tell people everything they need to know about him as a player.
Keeping him as a starter until Quinn is ready makes sense, and making him a backup QB makes sense if Quinn turns out to be better. The TRUTH is that every Frye supporters dream is here, in that he's getting a real offensive line. That's all they ever asked for: Give him a line and see what he can do. Well.......here's his chance. If he's good enough, he's succeed. Great for us. He deserves the chance. But if he doesn't, he's an above-average backup which is good for everyone.
Bottom line? We don't do JACK with Frye. He's under contract and doesn't have enough clout to call a shot. Sorry. The TEAM comes first and from that standpoint it's best if Frye plays out his role as some kind of QB for this team. Whether that's as a starter or as a backup it doesn't matter. He has value here and we need to keep him.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Just wondering why everyone thinks we need to Sh__ can frye now that we have Brady....
Do some of these people NOT understand the concept of depth???
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I'm a Frye supporter for sure! Of course now that he's here, I'm a Quinn supporter because I'm a Browns fanatic!
I think with the line revamping Charlie will only become an above average QB.
I never thought he'd be working for a bust in Canton or even Pro Bowl status.
The same line hopefully will allow Quinn to NOT get the snot beat out of him in year one or two, whichever is the case.
Too trade CF away right now would not be wise. To think that Frye will sulk around Berea like a little boy is way off the mark. Charlie Frye will bring it this summer, and although he may not have all the tools and he may lose out...
he will show up to play. That can only be good for all of us!
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Do some of these people NOT understand the concept of depth???
I understand depth, I also understand how humans react.
I highly doubt Frye's going to want to stay in Cleveland for 12 years as Brady Quinn's backup. The day the Browns place Frye behind Quinn in the depth chart is the day Frye's going to want out of Cleveland so that he can have a chance to start somewhere else.
I bet Derek Anderson is going to want to get out of Cleveland the day Quinn is put ahead of him on the depth chart. He's smart enough to know that once a team sticks the 1st round pick ahead of him in the depth chart that his chances of getting ahead of him on the depth chart ever again is basically zero.
When teams draft 1st round QB's the rest of the QB's on the current roster know what that means; 'just a matter of time before they annoit the 1st rounder is ready'. They know that the day that team makes that 1st round draft pick the starter, is the day they never have a chance to be the full time starter on that team ever again. Hence why they want out so that they can go to a team with a legit chance to start.
People that think Frye and Anderson are going to sit around for years to come as the backup for Quinn have a different reality coming. If both are backups it will be with another team.
Either trade them and get something for them, or watch them leave as FA's and get nothing in return.
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Legend
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People that think Frye and Anderson are going to sit around for years to come as the backup for Quinn have a different reality coming. If both are backups it will be with another team.
Well that makes as much sense as poking a bees nest with a stick  They wouldn't want to sit on the bench for us, but they would want to sit on the bench for another team
BTW You didn't answer my question last night. Just when did you make up your mind that Quinn was a better QB than Charlie???
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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BTW You didn't answer my question last night. Just when did you make up your mind that Quinn was a better QB than Charlie???
I'm still waiting for him to post the YouTube blooper reel on Charlie. He was quick to post the one for Quinn.
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Just wondering what you guys think is gonna happen to Frye now that Quinn is in the fold. The most likely scenario IMO is that he's traded before the end of the weekend, seeing as how he can't really add anything as far as mentorship goes.
But what if there aren't any takers? Do we cut him? Do we try to keep him on as a backup?
You don't do ANYTHING with Frye.
He's the starter going in because he's experienced. Quinn is the future but Frye gets a chance to prove everyone wrong and win the job behind an IMPROVED offensive line.
That's all the Frye backers could EVER ask for going into his 3rd year.
If he doesn't do everything that people wish he can do, he becomes a viable backup QB which makes him value as a 3rd round pick.
Think about it. If you trade Frye, now Derek freakin' Anderson becomes the backup QB, which means a guy with no experience.
Forget what some guys want you to think. Frye doesn't call the shots. The BROWNS call the shots. Frye is under a CHEAP contract for two more seasons, and nobody wants him as a starter.
That should tell people everything they need to know about him as a player.
Keeping him as a starter until Quinn is ready makes sense, and making him a backup QB makes sense if Quinn turns out to be better. The TRUTH is that every Frye supporters dream is here, in that he's getting a real offensive line. That's all they ever asked for: Give him a line and see what he can do. Well.......here's his chance. If he's good enough, he's succeed. Great for us. He deserves the chance. But if he doesn't, he's an above-average backup which is good for everyone.
Bottom line? We don't do JACK with Frye. He's under contract and doesn't have enough clout to call a shot. Sorry. The TEAM comes first and from that standpoint it's best if Frye plays out his role as some kind of QB for this team. Whether that's as a starter or as a backup it doesn't matter. He has value here and we need to keep him.
This is going to hurt a lot. Toad - you are right. migrane onset
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Do some of these people NOT understand the concept of depth???
I understand depth, I also understand how humans react.
I highly doubt Frye's going to want to stay in Cleveland for 12 years as Brady Quinn's backup. The day the Browns place Frye behind Quinn in the depth chart is the day Frye's going to want out of Cleveland so that he can have a chance to start somewhere else.
I bet Derek Anderson is going to want to get out of Cleveland the day Quinn is put ahead of him on the depth chart. He's smart enough to know that once a team sticks the 1st round pick ahead of him in the depth chart that his chances of getting ahead of him on the depth chart ever again is basically zero.
When teams draft 1st round QB's the rest of the QB's on the current roster know what that means; 'just a matter of time before they annoit the 1st rounder is ready'. They know that the day that team makes that 1st round draft pick the starter, is the day they never have a chance to be the full time starter on that team ever again. Hence why they want out so that they can go to a team with a legit chance to start.
People that think Frye and Anderson are going to sit around for years to come as the backup for Quinn have a different reality coming. If both are backups it will be with another team.
Either trade them and get something for them, or watch them leave as FA's and get nothing in return.
Derek Anderson isn't worht a thing. He'll be a June 1st cut. Next years depth chart:
Frye
Quinn
Dorsey
(Unless Quinn really is NFL ready, then flip flop Quinn and Frye)
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You know what I've learned from this thread? That soup and mensa (now there's a name....) cannot possibly be wrong about anything. Just ask them. I do have a few comments, though.
Charlie will be the starter coming out of camp. Unless BQ is much better than I think he is. Or Charlie is much worse. This just makes sense. Will Brady replace him at some point in the season? That depends on the play of the line and the QB but the odds say, yes, Brady will be playing by the end of the season. Again, I see nothing wrong with that. The better man should play and I have no doubt he will. Whoever that may be.
"Mensa" says Charlie won't be happy as a backup. I hope this is true. It will make him work harder. But his options are limited at this point. If he can't at least give Brady a run for his money, even if Brady wins the job, then what team will sign him as a starter? I have to believe that barring a guarantee of a starting job somewhere Charlie would rather be a backup in Cleveland than a backup in, say, Buffalo.
Here's a novel idea....how about we let the guys compete and see what happens? I think it'll be pretty interesting. So what if a few fans bitch? What's new about that? Happens everywhere.
Note to Ammo: Give it up. You sound like a whiny little girl. Perhaps you are?
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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All Pro
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Derek Anderson isn't worht a thing. He'll be a June 1st cut. Next years depth chart:
Frye
Quinn
Dorsey
I don't see how we could keep Dorsey instead of Anderson. I think Dorsey gets cut.
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Derek Anderson isn't worht a thing. He'll be a June 1st cut. Next years depth chart:
Frye
Quinn
Dorsey
I don't see how we could keep Dorsey instead of Anderson. I think Dorsey gets cut.
Dorsey can break down film. They love Dorsey's brain and that can help out Quinn much more than Anderson can. Dorsey also played in Chuds offense at Miami. If it's similar - Dorsey is a huge assett. IMO.
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Otto now matter what happens we will have a better starting QB, and a better backup QB in 2007 than we did in 2006. Let the best man win 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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You don't do ANYTHING with Frye.
ya you do ... U help him all u can .... to do that U find out when his birthday is and get him the nicest clipboard ever ... find one with a coffee holder for those cold days on the lake ... u then go shopping for tweazers .... a real nice, durable pair as his right arm will be very very busy removing all the splinters ... 
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But we don't use wooden benches any more Diam
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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If you new anything about a Salary Cap then you'd know what I said is correct. Then again ...
Mensa,, when you take a QB in the 1st round, it's rare,, very very rare that they are capable of starting year one and be decent..
Elway stunk his first year to year and a half.... Kosar didn't start until later in his first year... Marino did and was totally terrific pretty much for day one,, Manning started right away and had his struggles but came around quickly..
Then there is Carson Palmer that sat for a year behind Kitna, and Rivers that sat for two years behind Brees... Both of them worked out just fine,,, I hope you would agree..
It really has totally NOTHING to do with the CAP,, Most teams know that with few exceptions, the right thing to do is let them sit and learn the pro game..
If was all about the CAP and nothing else,, you would never see teams letting thier 1st round QB's sit,, Yet, you see it all the time..
I'm not sure why your having a problem understanding this,, it's really pretty simple!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Legend
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Legend
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*LOL* ... Ok .. then throw in a heated seat cushion .... them alimunum seats gotta get awful cold ..
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Legend
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Legend
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Thats more like it 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
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Hopefully RAC sticks to his guns and the best players get to play.
![[Linked Image from i4.photobucket.com]](http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y132/Defiantmac/nickk2.jpg) PRO-BOWLER!
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Legend
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Legend
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I would rather get that stuff for Anderson and get a ticket to another team for Charlie...
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
If you new anything about a Salary Cap then you'd know what I said is correct. Then again ...
If you knew and understood anything at all about the Salary Cap as it really is, you'd know that:
1. All rookies are beyond affordable as they must ALL fit within your allotted rookie pool... the cost for the year he will be sitting is Disposable
2. We have enough space under the cap this year to afford to sit him for his entire career
3. At #22, his entire contract will be less than the guaranteed money of Thomas... probably at most 1/3 of Thomas' garanteed money
and you can take your "he's gonna get top 10 money" and put it where the sun don't shine because it's baseless, reactionary crap resultant of your sour grapes ... that ain't happening because if nothing else THAT won't fit within what our rookie pool will be AND we're not going to off the rest of the league by screwing up the slotting amounts like that AND Quinn's agent will already know and understand all of that.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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Legend
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Legend
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j/c
Frye's response to Quinn's challenge should determine his future with the Browns. Whatever you might think of Frye's abilities, nothing he has done to this point entitles him to a guaranteed starting job. If Charlie is openly resentful, or mopes around acting hurt ... if he does anything other than step up and fight to keep his job and help the team win - whether as a starter or a backup - then he has to be let go. It's like what one of the bigshots where I work says ... "I don't fire people; they fire themselves." Sucks, but it's true.
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Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Quote:
You don't do ANYTHING with Frye.
ya you do ... U help him all u can .... to do that U find out when his birthday is and get him the nicest clipboard ever ... find one with a coffee holder for those cold days on the lake ... u then go shopping for tweazers .... a real nice, durable pair as his right arm will be very very busy removing all the splinters ...
Couldn't have said it better myself.
He shouldn't see a down this year. Brady Quinn vs. the Steelers week one. That's not a knee-jerk reaction statement or someone willing to throw the kid into the fire and get hurt. It just makes sense.
a) Quinn is better than the other guy RIGHT NOW and can play week one, ask Charlie Weis.
b) Joe Thomas
c) Jamal Lewis, Kellen Winslow, Braylon Edwards.
d) Scheme change, both need to learn from scratch, and my instinct tells me Quinn will learn this system much faster than that other guy.
It's time, and Diam, my grin's not as big as yours, but it's about as big as a non-ND fan can get!
Last edited by Ammo; 04/29/07 11:02 AM.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum What to do with Frye?
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