DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Food For Thought(Middle East)

I've mentioned before, and it got ignored for the most part, about the economic issues that allow groups like ISIS to thrive.

So think about this: We have all these backwood Christian militia groups who train and such and have military grade weapons.

If the unemployment rate was 30-40 percent here in America, with the government being a joke, how many versions of ISIS, Taliban, and Al-Queda would we have right here in the States?

Think about it.

We are not like the Middle East. Yes, we have our own issues and threats to deal with, but the Middle East is and has been a breeding ground for hatred for as long as I can remember.

They hate us, they hate each other and pretty much everything. They're born and raised like that so groups like ISIS really are not a shock that they not only gain power but thrive too.

In addition, I'm not sure we, as a government or people, would allow such a group to form and stay at a functioning level. Especially if they hated and targeted Muslims, Obama would send the entire army to dispose of them.

The Middle East terrorists groups vs the US militias are different animals.

First and foremost are the groups they are preying on. ISIS is preying on defenseless people, US militias would have to contend with a much stronger enemy, and their agendas would not gain much strength before vigilante forces would pop-up to stop them, alongside law enforcement and the military.

imma need you guys to look at my post, and think.

if the unemployment rate was 30-40 percent, y'all honestly think we wouldn't have the same versions over here?

at that point, our government would be just a broken as theirs. just think.

and think of this: Dawg_LB, if the middle east was entirely like that, then how come countries like Kuwait, UAE, and Bahrian, who buy the way slaughter our currency value, have almost no terrorist problems?

unemployment rate during the great depression was 25% at one time, 1933 I think, and we didn't have a bunch of savages create groups to go kill innocent people.

Just saying. I don't think there is much thought for this thread, America and the Middle East just two totally different entities,pointless to try to compare the what-ifs between them. There's a reason I'll never visit that land.

Why are the Muslim people slaughtering Christians all over the world?
I just read where they throw the Christians out of those boats headed for Italy, letting them drown in the Mediterranean. These aren't radicals, its everyday Muslims.

Guess the Christian Militias should save their ammo for the day ISIS comes here since they are already spreading over the world like wild fire.

You got two responses that you were asking for...and because they didn't agree with you, you tell the posters "to think". Really? They demonstrated that they DID think...just not what you wanted to hear/read.

And you wonder why you didn't get responses to an earlier post.

So are you going to answer the question, or act like Kanye and defend Beyoncé, even though those two posters are perfectly capable of defending themselves.

The reason why I say this is because we haven't had an eventt that put people's back against the walls like in Iraq.

We don't know what Americans put in that same situation would do, in a massive context like in Iraq.

We don't have to worry about heads being cut off if you disagree with someone, because our economy and government is stable enough to actually protect rights, unlike those countries in the Middle East.

That's why I said think.

Oh I see now, The economy is the reason Muslims crucify children and behead Christians. The reason we keep arresting American Muslims who are plotting destruction is because of the economy too. I wasn't thinking.

No. If things fell apart in America and the Christian Militias rose up as a force, we regular Christians would borrow from the Muslims and call them Radical Christians, thus washing our hands of all the things they do.

I didn't say it was the sole reason.

But it's he main reason why that region is jacked up.

Look around the world. The majority of countries that are completely screwed up and have he absolute worst economies.

Swish, the problem is that you are asking about 4 different questions rolled into one.

First you say this...


Then you go on to reference if our back was against the wall like Iraq...

So what do you want to know? If our economy was a joke and unemployment was high would these militias go blow up planes and buildings in other countries while yelling "Praise Jesus"? No, I seriously doubt we would.

If we had an invading/occupying force in our country like Iraq would they use guerrilla tactics to fight back against the invaders? Yes, I think they definitely would.

If our economy, and by default the world economy, was in the crapper do I think they would start killing innocent people? Not on a large scale, though there might be some incidences.

If our economy, and by default the world economy, was in the crapper do I think they might start attacking the government? Yea, I think that is much more likely.

If our economy was in the crapper and it was "every man for himself" do I think the thugs and the gang bangers would exploit every opportunity to loot, steal and destroy? Yea, oh wait, they do that now.

If any of this happened, do I think the government would respond with incredible force against it's own people, labeling them as terrorists and using it as a reason to clamp down much farther on civil rights? I have no doubt they would.

I guess the bigger question is that if we reached epic great depression levels, with a thin layer of extremely wealthy at the top, everybody else struggling, the government unable to do anything about it except stepping in to take more and more of your rights away and an uprising against the government occurred.... which side would you be on?

I think one of the most significant reasons ISIS thrives is the difference in culture.

The middle east has a strong patriarchal social structure that is used to justify the actions taken.

it would be difficult for any fundamentalist group here in the west to seize control like ISIS. It wouldn't be accepted.

Jesus often taught to the poorest of the poor in his earthly ministry. He never taught them to commit violence against anyone, under any circumstances. He never said to steal what belongs to others if you are in need.

That is a major difference between the Bible and the Koran. In Jesus' earthly ministry, He never preached violence under any circumstances. (even when those He taught often wanted Him to do so, specifically revolt and war against Rome) Jesus taught that material possessions on this earth are nowhere near as important as the treasures of heaven.

Now the Koran does take a far more militaristic approach to earthly matters. It calls for beheading and amputation of non-believers under certain circumstances ...... and the religion itself commands Muslim to go to war against Muslim so that the strongest will rule.

So, Christians and Muslims take a completely different approach to such circumstances, if they truly follow their respective holy books.

Sorry but I don't buy the biblical difference.

Historically Christians have been everything but peaceful. That excuses isn't going to fly.

Even at its base, there's not too much of a difference. But even if we roll with that, at the end of the day, man dictates how they view the bible or Koran.

Just because you call yourself s christian doesn't mean anything. Didn't stop Yall from doing some heinous acts, in the name of Christianity, which is the same thing these Muslims are doing.

Anyways, I still believe economy plays the major roll in that.

Other countries I listed are just as Muslim, yet don't have the terrorist problem since their rich.

Some Christians have definitely been violent, as have some (_______________) (fill in the blank of almost any group) Some Christians have been hateful. Some have been racist. Some have been almost anything. I don't know that those who can be hateful or racist can said to truly be following the teachings of Jesus Christ. The same cannot be said of violent Muslims though. They do follow the teachings of their holy book, the Koran.

I am curious as to what examples you would offer as to Christians being violent.

Salem witch trials come to mind.

The inquisition is another good one.

KKK I is another, but who's counting.

The reason I lump Christians together on this board is because here on DT, Yall have a habit of lumpi Muslims together.

I don't do that on Facebook. But here, I do it because Yall are massive hypocrites sometimes.

NO no no, Those were "Radical Christians" not like the peace loving Christians.

You must get off your high horse.

Do the KKK truly follow the teachings of Christ, or do they try to adhere to the image of Christianity to try and make themselves appear to be something they are not?

In their eyes they were.

Same thing ISIS is doing.

Our country got passed that thankfully. But we have a stable economy and government to thank for that.

Iraq does not have such luxuries.

When 2 of your examples are from over 400 years ago, that says something.

I agree that the Salem Witch Trials were an abomination. This is another case where Christianity was professed, but not really followed. The actions carried out by the religious leaders in Massachusetts in that time and place were not Christ-like, and, in fact, were not what Jesus taught.

Do you know what the Spanish Inquisition was? I only ask this because many have this idea that the Church (the Catholic Church, who I have strongly disagreed with in many instances) went after non-believers in the inquisition.

This was not the case.

The inquisition was to combat heresy within the body of believers and adherents of the Catholic faith in certain areas, who professed the faith, yet used practices and followed beliefs not within the Catholic faith. They did not concern themselves with Jews or Muslims. They were internally policing their religion.

I understand fully what that was. I think it was needed, maybe. But it was still violent. Doesn't matter if it's on other people or the same religion.

You already know how I feel about both religions.

It just sucks going back to visit home and now when I got visit I gotta be asked if I'm going to join ISIS. What the hell is that.

Which is mainly why I brought this up. I think if hey did Iraq like Kuwait of UAE, we wouldn't be dealin with ISIS right now, or not at this type of level.

I noted why I lump many believers of the Muslim faith together, specifically because of what their holy book says. With a modest amount of research, I can probably pull up dozens of verses of the Koran that call on their followers to kill people. (and often in a violent manner)

There were similar themes in the Old Testament, but the world evolved, and God's plan came to fruition. He sent Jesus to be a perfect sacrifice for the sins of man, and eliminated the stringent penalties for sin contained in the Old Testament.

I challenge you to find one time that Jesus told anyone to go kill, behead, cut off the fingers of someone, or otherwise commit violence against another person in the entire New Testament. Like I said, with a rather quick internet search, I can find numerous such examples in the Koran. There is a massive difference between the teachings of Jesus and the teachings of Muhammad.

Maybe it's the crappy land. The Middle East has always bred a depraved, subhuman element.

"And I laid traps for troubadours
Who get killed before they reached Bombay"

When I think of that region of the world, economics is one of the absolute LAST reasons I would cite for it being jacked up.

Of course, with as important as materialism & prosperity are to the American culture, we tend to apply a higher value to its impact than it warrants.


Their culture as a whole, the fact that most areas are still backwater regional tribes, the devout adoption of a religion and the blind following of what the religious leaders teach, the utter inability for their own governments to stand on their own, etc....

Economics plays very little part in things, IMO.

I'd also add that the witch trials happened during a time when the average person believed in witchcraft and magic.

I'm pretty confident the average person now, would believe those accused then, where just mentally unstable and steer clear of them.

Classic...just classic.

Well, I don't know about the land, but I think crappy is relevant.

Toilet paper. That's the key. Send rolls and rolls of it over there. Can't be civilized w/o TP

I just think it's huge.

We have examples right here in the states.

The poorest area happen to be where most of the crime and racist bigots are at.

Now imagine that on a large scale. Then say hello to Iraq.

Christians are being slaughtered because they are letting themselves get slaughtered.

But the problem isn't that the country is poor, the problem is that 97% of the people are poor. We think we have unequal income distribution? PFFFFFFT... in many of these middle eastern countries it's far worse with some sliver of 1% owning almost all of the wealth. And we think our government is in the pocket of the rich? Again, I'm betting it's far worse over there because those in the government are about the only ones that ARE rich.

In general, take every problem we think we have, multiply it by about 20, and that's how they have it.

They are being slaughtered because the Muslims have decided to slaughter them. They are vastly outnumbered. One boat where they threw the Christians overboard had 100 people on it, 9 of them were Christians. I have started seeing where they are banding together now, giving them a fighting chance.
Perhaps the future will see a return of the Holy Wars of the past.

But that's what I'm hinting at.

Iraq can be a power house if they did the same things Kuwait, UAE, Bahrain do.


For instance, actual Kuwaiti citizens get monthly checks just for living there. There's a lot of things the Kings and princes would do that would put even more money in the citizens pockets.

Oil money.

Those counties don't have a terrorist problem.

If the USA, or anybody would've probabaly set up shop in Iraq, and had the citizens earning money off the oil they sold, with the only ca being they had to turn in terrorist to authorities, ISIS would be gone as fast as it started.

Think of it like this: how far would you go to make sure your family was eating, not on the streets?

Those are the decisions a lot of these guys have to make. But if I tell you "DC, you see how Kuwaitis are living? I'll give you a monthly check, all you have to do is report terrorist to the authorities if you see one"

What are you gonna do?

For yhe Middle East to not be so much of a problem, we need to think outside the box. Military action is NOT working.

You could literally substitute anything that has happened in the western world and find Christianity as a reason behind it. It's all about where you place the spin. You could easily make a claim that the holocaust happened because of Christianity and it wouldn't be far fetched at all.