DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Anti Islam rhetoric

Do you have a true understanding of what we're talking about or do you just like causing fights?

And Atheists feel that their way is right as well.

So do Agnostics, Natural worshiper, and so on.

Yes.

And YTown and razor are still wrong.

They don't understand that it doesn't matter if the text got twisted or not, the BASE of the text comes from the Old Testament, and thus, they worship the same freaking God.

Do you and YTown and razor understand what I'm saying, or do YALL just hate Muslims that much?

And I do not disagree with that.

Not at all what the debate was about. The same God. Maybe a corrupted message(depending on which side you are on) but still the same ONE GOD

Where have I said that I hate Muslims?

I can disagree with someone without hating them. The Muslim Holy Book, which is reputed by Muhammad to be the same in heaven as it is on earth when it its original form says the things that I have said. I have compared what the Koran says compared to the Bible, and they are not the same. The very character of the Islamic "Allah" is different than the Jewish/Christian God. They cannot be the same Almighty God. One has to be false, because what the 2 entities are does not match in so many ways.

If I say that God is a bright blue light bulb, and worship it as the God Almighty, even assigning similar power to that light bulb, does not make that bulb the God of the Bible.

One other thing of interest.

The Bible if full of miracles. How many miracles have been performed by Muhammad and his followers?

You just said it yourself, they may try to change who God is, but not matter what they say in their writings, he is still the same God. I can write God is blue, and you can say, no he is red. He is still the same God. You said it yourself.

Same god. Sorry bout it

And here's what the kicker is, that makes you guys sound like you have no idea what you're talking about.

You said earlier judaism laid the ground work for Christianity.

How could they lay ANYTHING when they don't believe Jesus was the son of God?

Isn't that the entire POINT of Christianity?

That alone makes it two different religions. That alone should have you denouncing Judaism as hard as you're going after Islam.

That's why I called you and razor out. Cause your inherit bias is astonishing.

No, it is not.

God is God. Period. He is the ONLY Almighty. Period.

Muslims worship their "Allah". This being is reported to be similar in power to God, but his nature is completely different. The Allah of the Koran is NOT God. They share a name, and some superficial similarities, but they are not the same, any more than 2 people with the same name are the same person.

Look at all these different names, and that's just in the bible:

http://www.agapebiblestudy.com/documents/the%20many%20names%20of%20god.htm

Man stop it.

If God cared so much, he wouldn't allow so many different names in his one "true" religion. It would just be one name no matter who said it.

Man bro, I respected you cause atleast you practiced Christianity to the fullest, but now I think you're just full of it.

Actually it did. I'm not going to go into all the details (because I don't know them all) at 12:23 am but I'll explain enough of what I can.

First of all, every prophet in the Old Testament foretold some aspect of Jesus life.

Next, the sacrificial and ceremonial system God laid out also laid out 'pictures' of Jesus life as well.

I'll end with this regarding the sabbath meal, this was so powerful when he saw it explained it actually converted a local Jew to Christianity and he's pastoring a large church here in Central Ohio.

At the beginning of the meal the host took three (I'll call them crackers for lack of knowledge of the real term) stacked up, took the middle one, broke it, wrapped it up and hid it. At the end of the meal, the host takes it back out, uncovers it and he and those with him rejoice.

(Cracker 1) Father.
(Cracker 2) Son.
(Cracker 3) Holy Spirit.

An obvious allegory of the death, burial and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Foundation laid.

Good night.

Gee thanks. I am glad to see your incredible tolerance for other's opinions.

You just aren't listening. You refuse to listen. You haven't answered anything I posted, other than to say that I am wrong. Sorry if that is not at all convincing for me. I gave you specific reasons for what I said. You gave rhetoric and insults in return.

If I went onto another site and called myself Swish, and took the opposite positions as you hole., would we be the same person because we share a name?

Anyway, you can ask Him one day for yourself ....although i suspect that at that time, if things don't change, you'll have bigger concerns. That is really unfortunate.

Swish I believe you're starting to be obstinate just to be obstinate.

Muslims do not worship God. They worship a perverted and distorted version of him. I don't care what name you call him. The character and personality are very different.

I am who I am not because of what I am named but because of my actions and my personality. There are over 50 people in the country with the same exact name as mine. They are not me though.

The personality and character of Allah is nothing like that of Yahweh. It's like holding a poorly made imitation next to the real mccoy. They may have started out from the same place but they ended up with something similar looking but different.

While Muslims may have the intention of worshiping yahweh by perverting the old testament and perverting the teachings of Jesus they have created a false and graven image of God to worship instead of God himself. Much like the little black stone that all muslims prostrate themselves to 5 times a day in idol worship. Even though that stone is from an earlier period the arabs worshiped a rock god and used unusual rocks to make places of worship. It's still going on as they venerate a rock in an attempt to kiss it 7 times as part of their most holy of rituals. What better way to venerate a Rock Deity than to have millions of muslims bowing to it 5 times a day and try to kiss it.

Muslims do not worship the same God at ALL.

Oh, and Swish when I have EVER said I hate anyone much less Muslims? Please find where I EVER said something of that nature.

I'll make it even simpler then Ted did:

Judaism DOES lay the groundwork for Christianity because up until the Jewish leaders turned Jesus over to be crucified, it was all one religion. At that point Jews had to ask themselves only one question:

Is Jesus the Messiah they had been waiting for?

Those who said 'no' (Jews) continue to this day to wait for the Messiah.

Those who said 'yes' became what we call Christians.

Had Jesus not been crucified and he was accepted as the Messiah by the Jewish leaders, we wouldn't have Christians today. It would just be continuation of the Jewish faith.

I thought this was obvious?

You're not getting it. At all.

I'm simply arguing that Muslims worship the same God as Christians and Jews.

If you wanna say that Judaism laid the foundation for Christianity, then it also laid the foundation for Islam, as the BASE of the text is from the Old Testament.

If they used the same freaking book, common sense says they are worshipping the same freaking God.

They have the SAME prophets Ted.

Man you guys can stay close minded all Yall want. The truth is right there. I provide the argument and sources backing up my claims, people with much greater knowledge than anyone on this board have said the same things.

We won't agree. And that's fine.

But I'll keep an open mind. You all can keep your heads in the sand.

I am a fledgling Christian.. believing in Jesus being GOD incarnate and truly died for the sins of man.

However I have a hard time with ANY religious concept that claims only one path to the One GOD.. IMO surely an omnipotent being will have more than one road to him... one way to the exclusion of all others limits what GOD truly is.

I believe in the Christian GOD and as a result there are certain tenements, ideals and rules which mist be adhered to if I am to meet that Christian aspect in my Heaven... I truly believe that a Jew or Muslim or Hindu or Druid have in hold in their heart of hearts what their true GOD to be and in that they also have tenements, ideals etc which must be adhered to if they are to meet their GOD in their paradise.

And I believe that for one simple reason... what of those that have no access to our GODS ( Jew, Christian, Muslim) what of those that came before these religions were available, are they subject to eternal damnation because they did not believe in a Jesus that did not yet exist?

IMO a Viking who lives what in his heart the life true to his religious beliefs is indeed granted his access to his Valhalla..

GOD, all GODS are found within, not without and individuals must do what they are required to find their GOD or better yet allow their GOD to find them and then live and believe what their GOD so dictates.

see, i can get behind something like that.

but this this whole "my religion is right and others are going to hell" stuff is the wrong thinking.

God said that His law is written in the hearts of men. Their conscience, in effect, was God's Law before God "officially" wrote down His Law.

We all know that we should not commit murder.
We all know that we should not steal. (and the earliest laws made allowance for starving people to eat what they could on a farm, (fruit and grain) but not for them to remove any to take with them for later. That would be considered theft.
We all know that we should not lie about people.
We all know that we should not give our word to our Spouse, and then breat our word by cheating on them.
We know that it is not healthy to be jealous of those things that our neighbor has, and especially not to make plans to take what is theirs.

God said that He wrote His Law on the hearts of men, and that is the criteria for judgement for those early people. He also gave the earliest people the right to sacrifice for forgiveness of their sins.

The Bible repeatedly shows God's forgiveness for those who seek Him. King David, for example, actually had a woman's husband killed, because he desired the man's wife. (Bathsheba) The implication, in the Bible, is that he might well have even raped her the 1st time they were intimate. He got her pregnant, and tried to convince her husband to sleep with her while he was home on leave, but he refused, saying that none of his men on the front lines had the comfort of their wives. So, King David arranged for the man to go to the front lines, and to have him be abandoned there.

In the end, David lost the child he conceived that 1st time with Bathsheba, but because David repented of His sin, and asked for forgiveness, God forgave him.

Jesus said that all who seek God will find Him. That does not mean that if you worship "any" God, that this is acceptable for God.

Now I don't pretend to know how God will handle those who have never heard of Jesus as anything except the Son of God. What that uncertainty does for me is makes me try all that harder to try to get the message of Jesus out to those who do not know Him, or who have ignored Him in the past.



Do you believe that a Satan worshiper will inherit heaven? How about those who worship a god requiring them to throw their children into volcanoes? What about those cults who insist that they worship God, while having sex with children?

Jesus said that He is the Way and the Life, and that no one gets to the Father but through Him. That means that there is ONE path to heaven, and that path is Jesus Christ. No other paths exist, at least if we believe the Word of Jesus Christ. If we don't, then why do we worship Him? Why are we Christians if we do not believe in Jesus Christ, and what He taught us while He was on this earth? People have this idea that Jesus was tolerant. Jesus sat with sinners, not to justify their sin, but to turn them from their sin. He helped sinners not to commit them further to their sin, but to turn them away from their sins. He did not save the adulterous woman from being stoned so she could go back to her sin. (and death) He did so in order that she would turn away from her sin, and trust in Jesus instead.

One other thing I want to mention. People somehow think that if you consider yourself a Christian, and "believe" in Christ, that you are all good. Well, even the demons believed in Christ. They acknowledged who Jesus that Jesus was the Son of God. Simply believing that Jesus is the Son of God is not enough. We have to accept Him as our Lord and Savior, and follow Him. That means repenting of our sins, and doing our best to turn away from our sins. If we believe in the Bible, and in Jesus Christ, then we believe in His message and teachings as well. Some people want to pick and choose, and yes, some even do twist what Jesus taught, but if we follow Jesus, then we are to actually follow Him.

That means that there can be no other God but God. God repeatedly punished His own people for bowing down to idols, and worshiping other gods than Him. How can this be consistent with saying that worshiping other gods is fine? I see no way that it can be.

The character of God and the character of the Islamic Allah are completely different. They promise different things when this life ends. They offer different criteria for being judged. The Christian God says that Jesus was the Messiah, and also the Son of God, while the Islamic Allah does not. The Bible says that Jesus died on the cross as a perfect sacrifice for our sins, and the Koran says that Jesus was taken into heaven by God, alive, and that God gave Jesus' likeness to someone else, and that that man suffered and died in Jesus place. (a truly offensive idea to the believing Christian) If we believe in the Christian God, and His message, then there are no other gods. Period. I don't know exactly how God will judge those who have never heard of Him, but I suspect that He will judge them according to the Law He wrote in their hearts, and they may, possibly, be given a chance to accept Christ as Lord, though I cannot say for certain. However, I do not believe, in any part of my soul, that God will say, "No matter what you did, or who you worshiped, if you thought it was me, then whatever you did will be forgiven as long as you thought it was Me." I just simply do not believe that. (and I know of no Christian theologian who does either)

I agree with much of what you say YTown..

The law is written by GOD on the hearts of man and therein lies my belief,,, were I divert is in the idea that I can never be sure the laws GOD wrote on my heart are the same as anyone else's, as a result my relation with GOD is solely that... MY relationship with GOD.


Now I have chosen or maybe more to the point GOD has chosen that the laws on my heart are Christian laws and as such I am required to adhere to those laws to the best of my ability and to do all those things you noted, believe, repent, love etc and to show those that I can that my the Christian way may in fact be the best way for them... but that is all I can do... make good on my promise to my GOD to do that which he requires me to do. Now if I show someone what I think is the light and they reject it... if they are doing what their GOD has said then in their heart that is what they must do... the ultimate reward given or withheld from that person is between him and his GOD.

Now as far as Satanist.. I have no idea why someone would worship Satan, I do not know what is to be gained and what the reward is in the afterlife,
It would seem to me that acknowledging Satan by extension, acknowledges the one GOD and in the Christian aspect the GOD that threw Satan down,... so why worship the lesser being... that said yes I believe that a person who follows Satan will in the end get what he , again in his heart of hearts, expects to get but that is their choice and to me it will markedly less then the paradise I will be granted.

On the Christians that have sex with children... those are not Christians and try to pervert Christ's lessons into such will but them in exactly the place a Christian GOD says they will go.... this I believe, that they KNOW in their heart of Hearts and while their earthly minds may deny it, their souls know it and they know they will be given the reward GOD has promised to all given the chance to believe in Christ and have rejected it.,( and that leads into the other question of I have of Christianity, bit that is for another day).

On the volcano dumpers... yes if those laws are the ones GOD wrote on their sold then those are the ones they should follow... as callous as that sounds.

GOD tells me not to judge and while I see it means just everyday actions of those around me can it also mean don't judge those that follow different avenues to him.. I think it can... I can not see GOD's plan for me, how can I see it for others?

While I can push the agenda of my GOD, (as is his desire for my rules) I can not measure the decisions of others based a Christian only yardstick, GOD will deal with them as he sees fit and as it fits his plan.

GOD has chosen me to be a Christian and I will try live / love as such and to bring people to my light of the world,, if I can not and they reject it then.. I will shake the dust from my shoes and move on... they will have to deal with GOD themselves on his terms... I believe they will find their way to whatever GOD has planned

Ytown you are still arguing which book is right. We can say the Koran is wrong, and I believe that too. but as much as you or I may believe that their book about Goad is wrong, that still does not change who that God is. That is still the one, omnipotent God. Names for that God mean nothing, those names are created by man.

so all those people who had a religion before christianity is burning in hell.


"my religion is the right one"

"nah bro, mine is".

I really don't understand what is so hard for folks to understand.

Yahweh hates sin and hates lies

Allah is ok with lies and deception

They are not the same entity.

Jesus was the fulfillment of the old testament and is the ONLY means of forgiveness and entering heaven. If you call yourself a Christian then when Jesus says so then you have to believe him. Otherwise stop lying and calling yourself a Christian.

The entire purpose of the Muslim faith is to eliminate the salvation Jesus offers and pervert the message and laws of God. To me its the single greatest work of the Devil ever accomplished because it forces adherents to not accept the salvation of Jesus.

Actually, they have one more prophet (a false one) than we do, and he's the one causing all the problems we're having right now.

And they don't believe the prophets we agree on to begin with. All those prophets that foretold the coming of Jesus Christ and they don't believe that he was the Messiah.

Did you know the koran agrees with everything the Bible says about Jesus? Virgin birth, miracles, crucifixion and resurrection?

My wife found a youtube video of a muslim scholar (a young one) learning all this and eventually becoming a catholic due to what he found in the koran.

I honestly do not know how to even answer this. If this is truly what you believe, even though there is no backing for such a position in the Bible anywhere, then I really don't know what to say. It seems as though you might be applying human sensibilities, and desire for acceptance, to God. This trait cannot be applied to God ..... not if we believe in the God of the Bible. The God of the Bible is a jealous God. He wants people to Love and obey Him. He does not accept when people choose to do otherwise. The Bible assures us that the only way, again, the only way, to heaven is through Jesus Christ. Why would God, in the Bible, say this if it were not true? Why would God send Jesus to die on the cross for our sins if there were other, easier ways to get to heaven? Why would God allow Jesus to suffer incredible pain and humiliation on the cross, if He felt that any old beliefs would bring a person to eternal life? What would be the point? If we are Christians, then we need to make sure that we are not misleading people on these very important points. God says one thing in the Bible about this subject. One thing. The way to the Father is through Jesus Christ. Not A way. Not ONE way, but THE way. Would Jesus, who we as Christians accept as the Son of God and as an aspect of God Almighty, lie about such an important matter? Would He tell His followers that they must do one thing, and force them to deny themselves the sins of the world, if they could revel in those sins, and still attain eternal life?

The Bible tells us that God hates sin in all forms. The Bible says that we are to worship no other Gods but God.

There are some verses to read that demonstrate how God looks on evil, not with acceptance, but with disdain.

Proverbs 6
Psalms 5
Psalms 97
Luke 17: 3-4
Galatians 5: 19-21
Romans 8: 9


The list goes on and on. The message of the New Testament is that God hates sin, but that we are rescued from sin through the blood of Jesus Christ. There is no other way.

It is an idea of man that we can be saved through all different ways. However, the Bible disagrees with this in the strongest of terms. If we are Christians, then we, by virtue of the very nature of being a Christian, believe in Christ, and what he taught. How can a man be a Christian, and disregard what the Bible teaches? How can we be Christians and not only allow, but encourage people to go astray?

No, according to the Bible, both Old and New Testaments, a man cannot do as you suggest and still find his way to salvation and eternal life. It is dangerous to tell others that they can, and the Bible actually rebukes those who would lead people astray in such a manner, so please be careful doing so.

Please, speak to someone in your church about this matter, because this is a very dangerous path to take. It leads people away from Christ, because others allow all kinds of things that God says are immoral. God does not have one set of rules for Christians, and another for everyone (or anyone) else. Christians are expected to follow the 10 Commandments. If God says that we are to do so, then why would He tell others, "Don't worry about it"? Does that make sense in any way whatsoever?

Please, get some advice from those who are smarter than I. Please read your Bible so that you are not led astray. Do not trust what I say, but read it for yourself in your own Bible.

I would get into much of the rest of your response, but I fear that it would only get lost in the rest of a very long post. Please feel free to ask about anything else in your post, either me, or others on the board who love the Lord, or your pastor, or others in your church.

The name is not the important thing here, it is the implication that The God of the Bible is the same as Allah. They are NOT. The Islamic Allah is an attempt to twist the Judeo-Christian God into what 1 man wants ....

Please, ask your pastor about this. Speak to him regarding this subject. Obviously I am doing a poor job of explaining this, and for that I apologize, Please speak to your pastor about this matter. I do not know how to explain this any better than I have, and evidently it just hasn't been good enough. Please, do not assume that your answer is right, or that my answer is right, but check what the Bible says, and what your Pastor says about this matter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZOZlDjF5xU

see? i found a christian converted to islam.

thats the beauty of the internet, you can find anything.

so now we're right back to square one.

anyways, it's funny, cause i keep pointing it out but you keep ignoring it.

jewish people don't believe that jesus was the messiah EITHER!!!!!

Why oh why is it that everybody wants to be like "yea....but" when i say that?

yall making excuses for judaism, but islam can't get the same benefit of the doubt?

hypocrites. sorry, but thats exactly what you guys are being.

The old testament laid the ground work for all 3 religions.

yet only ONE, just one. Eins, Ichi, Uno, believes Jesus was the messiah and the son of god.

yet Judaism is getting praised, and islam is not.

what a joke. if you don't see the hypocrisy in that, then i got nothing left for you.

and i'm going to keep saying it, especially since YTown doesn't want to answer the question:

What happens to all those people who had religion before christianity was even a twinkle in anybody's eye? they burning in hell right now?

God is a douchebag for that one, if thats the case.

"my religion is the right one"

"nah homey, mine is, and you're gonna burn in hell cause i said so"

God is not a douche bag.

Jesus loves you.

Who else does not believe this?

Oh, OK, now I see.

You do realize ..... well, no, actually you do not seem to realize that Muslims do consider Jesus to be the Messiah. The point of contention between Christians and Muslims regarding this issue is that Christians also consider Him to be the Son of God, who died for our sins .... while Islam says that he was a man, the Messiah, who lived a perfect life, but who was taken into heaven by Allah as a living man, while He substituted another man in Jesus' place, and according to some, He gave this man Jesus likeness.

I have a question for you swish ..... when was the Koran created on earth?

As far as your question that you say I did not answer, I did answer it to the best of my ability in a previous post on this very thread. I am sure that you can go find it if you look.

Swish we are not hypocrites we are saying there is a difference.

Christians and Jews follow the old testament. Christians ARE Jews. We maybe not be Hebrews but we worship the same Yahweh.

That being said, whether a Jew, a Muslim, or an Atheist if Jesus is not accepted as the sacrifice for your sins then you will not go to heaven when you die. You will eventually be burned up in the Lake of Fire and cease to exist.

Why would a Christian ever praise the Muslim faith that leads people to forsake the salvation of Jesus. The Muslim faith that says it's ok to break the 10 commandments that God himself wrote. The Muslim faith that says its ok to murder, cheat, or steal from anyone who is not Muslim.

One of the main reasons the Muslim faith took off is because the only way to protect yourself from muslims pirating you was to convert because once you converted and became a Muslim the other Muslims were not allowed to steal from you anymore. It's called religious extortion and racketeering. In fact Muhammad was nothing more than a glorified bandit who distorted the word of God to justify his thievery, rape, and murder of Jews or anyone else not a part of his followers.

Modern Muslim leaders are not much different:
------------------------------------------------------------
by Abu Ishak al Huweini:
"We are at a time of Jihad; Jihad for the sake of Allah is a pleasure, a true pleasure. Mohammed’s followers used to compete to do it. The reason we are poor now is because we have abandoned jihad. If only we can conduct a jihadist invasion at least once a year or if possible twice or three times, then many people on Earth would become Muslims. And if anyone prevents our dawa or stands in our way, then we must kill them or take as hostage and confiscate their wealth, women and children. Such battles will fill the pockets of the Mujahid who can return home with 3 or 4 slaves, 3 or 4 women and 3 or 4 children. This can be a profitable business if you multiply each head by 300 or 400 dirham,. This can be like financial shelter whereby a jihadist, in time of financial need, can always sell one of these heads (meaning slavery). No one can make that much money in one deal (from hard work) even if a Muslim goes to the West to work or do trade. In time of need, that is a good resource for profit."

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Anwar al-Awlaki, a cleric born and raised in the United States and once held up as an example of moderate Islam, instructs his followers not to steal for the sake of self-enrichment, but rather for the cause of Jihad:
"The reasoning behind comparing booty to hunting and wood gathering is because the property which exists in the hands of the disbelievers is not considered to be rightfully theirs in our Islamic shari’ah because of their disbelief and when Islam does give them the right to own it, it is an exception to the rule such as in the case of ahl al-dhimma after they pay jizyah. This is why our scholars say that Allah has called booty as "fai’" which means "to return", so they say that the property of the disbelievers that doesn't belong to them has "returned" to the believer: its "rightful owner."
Even so, he goes on to add that

The income generated from booty taken by force from the enemies of Allah is purer and more virtuous than income generated from being a businessman, an engineer, a physician, or a farmer, simply because that was the source of income that Allah destined for his Messenger Muhammad"

--------------------------------------------------------------

Even Muslim leadership admit that Mohamed was nothing more than a glorified bandit king. By telling people that his new God said it is good and just he got people to steal left and right for him.

Yet, you want to call Christians hypocrites when we say the Yahweh God and Allah are not the same being? Gimme a break. Allah is nothing more than a stolen identity made up by Muhammad to justify the crimes he and his band of murdering thieves wanted to commit.

It sure is convenient to have a religion that lets you do anything you want to anyone who is not a Muslim. I have no respect for that kind of behavior and never will. God doesn't either.

Matthew 7: 15-17

15"Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16"You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn bushes nor figs from thistles, are they? 17"So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit.…

They already knew someone like Muhammed would come and warned against him. Then Jesus said, "Whoever has ears to hear, let them hear."

Nobody once said the God, as described in the Bible,is the same God, as described in the Koran. Yes, I get that they are two different books, and two different descriptions.

The actual being is still the same being.

There is ONE God. Everything that has happened after that is up to your beliefs. You believe in Christianity and the story of Jesus(so do I) , you believe Mohammed was a murderous false prophet(so do I ). That does not change who that ONE God is. God is God. Religion is man.

IIRC from my earlier catechism days, those that lived before Jesus' time, or those who had not had the opportunity to be witness to him (like people living in China and what we now call the Americas) will have an opportunity to accept and embrace Christ and God on Judgement Day. The whole "you're going to burn in hell" thing for non-believers isn't being applied to those who haven't had an opportunity TO believe yet.


I haven't been to church in decades so this teaching may have changed... but I don't think so.

Sounds a lot like the race debates.... Too many people trying to win the debate instead of develop an understanding.

I am having trouble seeing the Forest because the trees are in the way.

Here is where we differ:

The Islamic Allah is different from the Christian God, because the Islamic Allah does not exist. He is a false god, a non-existent creation of Muhammad. To say that a none existent creation of man is somehow the same as God insults God. God is God, and the Islamic Allah is one man's version of a supreme being, who changes over time, and does, miraculously, what the servant says to do. (like when Muhammad lusted after his daughter in law, and, in violation to accepted customs of the time, and the law of the Koran, had his son divorce her so that he could take her as his wife ..... which required another "indulgence" of sorts, because Muhammad already had his maximum allowed number of wives, as permitted the Koran.

The Islamic Allah was a heretical creation of one man's devious imagination. He is not God. He was one man's desire for power. It worked. He led many astray.

Tell 'em what you really think YTown!

Well, different cultures throughout history have had thousands of different names for supreme beings, of all kinds of descriptions and depictions. Odin, Zeus, Ra, Amon ...the list goes on. Jehovah was the 1st mention of God as a singular, all powerful being though. However, if we accept the other proposition, that Allah is God because of what he is reputed to be capable of doing, then Odin would have to be the same as God, and Amon, and Ra, and hundreds of others.

We do not accept that idea, so why is Allah somehow different?

Are you saying some of the children of Abraham rejected God and turned to Allah? They all believed in the one true God before the split, right?

Islam was not created until what ...... 600 AD? Abraham lived in roughly 2000 BC. That means that Muhammad came up with his religion about 2600 years after Abraham lived.

Prior to that, there was no mention of any such religion. There were hundreds of pagan religions throughout the region, as well as Judaism and Christianity ... but no mention of Islam, or anything resembling it, until roughly 600AD.

Ok, gottcha now. I wasn't clear on what you were saying.
So does Islam exist with the old Arab belief in the one true God or did Islam replace the belief of Abraham in God?

I do not doubt the intentions of Muslims to follow God. I do not doubt they feel their Allah is the the same being as Yahweh.

Yet you can't change so many things about God to suit your own purposes and still call him God because in the end you have just made your own private version of God. Christians who cherry pick which laws and commandments they follow are no different. If anything they are worse because they DO have God's true words and ignore them.

I don't hate anyone. I just want all my brothers and sisters out there to end up in heaven with me and to live this very short life filled with the same peace I have received from the Holy Spirit and the knowledge that I am forgiven. Not that I am perfect.