DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns mini camp...Phase 3: May 26-29, June 1-4, June 8-12

Which is why I complained a lot about our Qb coach last year.

I was surprised last year too. Dowell Loggains is labeled as good quarterback coach. I believe Fox added Dowell to his staff in Chicago.

I guess we will never know, but something went very wrong end of last season. Kyle Shanahan and others weren't on the same page. As soon as Gordon returned, it appeared like Kyle weathered a storm and changed the offense. When Gordon struggled, offense lost rhythm and collapsed, and then everyone panic trying to get it back. Listen what Pettine is saying in OTAs. He's learning the offense. Why? I think if things fall off this year. He has some idea how to get the group refocus.

For the record, I like Kyle Shanahan. I think he is technically sound play caller. From what happen in Washington and now Cleveland, I believe Kyle struggles with the management side. He doesn't adapt well to adverse changes.

You can put lipstick on a pig but it's still a pig. AKA, Hoyer and Manziel

In some other thread I said I would be surprised if Solomon made the team. So far it appears I was way off. He has been playing with the first team while Mingo has been out. My guess is that eventually Orchard and Mingo overtake him, but it shows a lot that he is playing over a second round pick. Obviously if Solomon is a real player it would increase our depth greatly.

I don't see how Solomon doesn't make the team. I wish we'd have gotten him before the season started so we could've seen more of him last year. There's no way he'd likely been as ineffective as Jabaal was. Stood out when he did play though. At the very least, those players just edging the team's roster based on their special teams role will be passed on for Scott who'll both play on ST's and be a rotational OLB.

JMO anyway.

Kyle is good at taking credit when things go well, and blaming somebody else when they go bad.

That seems to be what he's done throughout his career..

j/c:

The fact that Phil Taylor is still not practicing today because of last year's injury is very troubling.

Grossi sent out a tweet that Haslam greeted him as Mr. Positive.

I think the team has moved on from Phil Taylor anyway.

Yes and what I like is that Ray Farmer has already taken steps if they decide not to resign PT and if Mack leaves. By drafting X Cooper and Erving it shows that he has some foresight. I don't think we have seen much of this from past regimes.

phil taylor never practices this time of year...........

every time training camp opens, i notice big phil on the sideline until nearly the end of training camp. too much meat on his bones i guess.

It's funny, but to me it's very clear. We did just what you said. At least as it pertains to Mack. When we drafted Erving, the first words out of my mouth, Insurance for Mack leaving and if Mack doesn't leave, we've added either a Tackle or Guard or Back up Center.,

I thought it was a smart move. that's not to say that the guy they picked with be another All Pro, that I don't know, but the thinking is sound.

I don't think that any of the seriously injured players from last year are practicing yet.

Yeah you have to maintain the quality of football we have been seeing. Oh never mind...

j/c:

5 observations from Browns OTAs

1) DB Justin Gilbert is making plays

Gilbert’s recovery speed and pure athleticism were on full display Tuesday. In an 11-on-11 drill that had the Browns offense in the red zone, the cornerback broke up consecutive passes on quarterback Johnny Manziel, diving and batting the ball away at the last moment. After the second knockdown, his defensive teammates broke out in a chorus of cheers, loudly approving of his Tuesday practice session.

“He’s comfortable,” cornerback Joe Haden said. “He’s making plays.”

The changes from Gilbert have been all about paying attention to minor details – knowing where to be in zone coverage, taking more detailed notes in meetings and, plainly, more seasoning. It is worth noting that Gilbert had a shaky junior season at Oklahoma State before picking off six passes his senior year and proving to be one of college football’s preeminent cornerbacks.

“I definitely see changes, but I think you said it – probably too early,” coach Mike Pettine said.
“It’s just all about consistency. Just coming in here, perfecting his craft every day, and right now it’s so far so good.”

As of now, Gilbert and fellow second-year defensive back Pierre Desir have been locked in with the second unit as the outside cornerbacks. Gilbert’s repetitions with the first unit could see a bump if days like Tuesday keep happening.

2) RB Duke Johnson and WR Vince Mayle enter the fray

After tending to a family matter last week, Johnson was back in a big way Tuesday. Defensive linemen aren’t allowed to have contact with running backs, but it’s likely they would not have even had the chance to on some of Johnson’s runs. His explosiveness is apparent and all signs are pointing toward the rookie from Miami crafting a unique, but siginicant role by September.

“There was one of the runs in the team period that unless we were playing flag football, that would have been a 40- or 50-yard chunk,” Pettine said. “He’s got a lot to learn, but he’s probably a typical rookie where he is right now.”

Mayle sported a red non-contact jersey because of his recent thumb surgery but still saw extensive action. The 6-foot-2, 225-pound rookie lined up as the outside receiver in several 11-on-11 sets. Even though quarterbacks were instructed not to throw Mayle’s way, it was solid experience for the rookie to integrate himself as a route runner in Cleveland’s offense. The Browns expect Mayle to be full-go by training camp and are hopeful he’ll push for early playing time, too.

3) Offensive formations have been interesting

Tight end Rob Housler was lined up as the outside receiver on more than one occasion. All 6-foot-5 of wide receiver Rodney Smith stood in the slot and hauled in a 20-yard pass a on seam pattern in the middle of the field. A passing drill had Terrance West at receiver. Another formation had Mayle in the backfield as a running back before he split in motion out wide.

“Flip’ (offensive coordinator John DeFilippo) has some unique things that he’s putting in that, just looking at them from a defensive perspective, are very challenging,” Pettine said.

4) Mental repetitions big for young quarterbacks

While Josh McCown ropes in the first-team repetitions, Manziel and Connor Shaw mimic his every movement off to the side – even on running plays. Last year, it was suggested the pair of young quarterbacks use practice for the mental repetitions. This year, it appears to be required and seems to be helping.

“I thought (Manziel’s) done an outstanding job so far grasping what we’re doing,” Pettine said. “I thought he made some real nice throws today. He’s had his days where he struggled, but that’s natural – No. 1, learning a new offense and No. 2, going against a defense that is significantly ahead just due to chemistry and cohesion and knowledge of the book. I think we all feel good about where he is.”

5) Other nuggets

Rodney Smith made a number of plays Tuesday. He gallops across the field and is consistently getting open. Remember, the Browns claimed the wide receiver from the Vikings last October. The 25-year-old from Florida State was only active for three games in 2014 and has yet to catch an NFL pass, but as Pettine reminded reporters recently, it’s extremely hard for a young player to jump in midseason and earn playing time. It’s only June, but there is intrigue in Smith’s size and newfound comfort in DeFilippo’s offense.
When K’Waun Williams broke up a pass on Andrew Hawkins – at least his third breakup of the day – defensive coordinator Jim O’Neil literally busted out an Irish dance jig and screamed, “Not in his house Hawk! Not in K’Waun’s house.” The Browns also used Williams in a variety of blitz packages throughout the OTA. Pettine said perhaps nobody’s leap in 2015 has been as noticeable as the second-year cornerback.
“A lot of it’s just a credit to him that he took that time from January to April,” Pettine said. “You could see he looks different physically. He’s bigger, but he’s leaner. He’s moving better. It’s great to see him go against Hawk in the slot. Those are some of the battles I look forward to the most watching during practice.”
Wide receiver Dwayne Bowe nicked up his knee on a touchdown he scored against cornerback Tramon Williams. Pettine said he may sit out Thursday’s OTA, but it is nothing serious.
Linebacker Karlos Dansby and fullback Malcolm Johnson were not in attendance Tuesday, but had notified the team of the previous scheduling conflicts.

http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/arti...84-89bd416d8cde

Is this a reporter who is employed by the Browns?

Awesome news to hear about Williams. Haden said today that Williams is the best nickel he's ever seen. High praise.

It's awesome to hear about someone who took the offseason so seriously. What a work ethic.

I'm stoked to watch him play.

5 observations from Browns OTAs

Kevin Jones
Staff Writer

In addition to signing Dylan Sutcliffe, the Browns held an OTA practice on Tuesday. Here’s what we saw.

1) DB Justin Gilbert is making plays

Gilbert’s recovery speed and pure athleticism were on full display Tuesday. In an 11-on-11 drill that had the Browns offense in the red zone, the cornerback broke up consecutive passes on quarterback Johnny Manziel, diving and batting the ball away at the last moment. After the second knockdown, his defensive teammates broke out in a chorus of cheers, loudly approving of his Tuesday practice session.

“He’s comfortable,” cornerback Joe Haden said. “He’s making plays.”

The changes from Gilbert have been all about paying attention to minor details – knowing where to be in zone coverage, taking more detailed notes in meetings and, plainly, more seasoning. It is worth noting that Gilbert had a shaky junior season at Oklahoma State before picking off six passes his senior year and proving to be one of college football’s preeminent cornerbacks.

“I definitely see changes, but I think you said it – probably too early,” coach Mike Pettine said.
“It’s just all about consistency. Just coming in here, perfecting his craft every day, and right now it’s so far so good.”

As of now, Gilbert and fellow second-year defensive back Pierre Desir have been locked in with the second unit as the outside cornerbacks. Gilbert’s repetitions with the first unit could see a bump if days like Tuesday keep happening.

2) RB Duke Johnson and WR Vince Mayle enter the fray

After tending to a family matter last week, Johnson was back in a big way Tuesday. Defensive linemen aren’t allowed to have contact with running backs, but it’s likely they would not have even had the chance to on some of Johnson’s runs. His explosiveness is apparent and all signs are pointing toward the rookie from Miami crafting a unique, but siginicant role by September.

“There was one of the runs in the team period that unless we were playing flag football, that would have been a 40- or 50-yard chunk,” Pettine said. “He’s got a lot to learn, but he’s probably a typical rookie where he is right now.”

Mayle sported a red non-contact jersey because of his recent thumb surgery but still saw extensive action. The 6-foot-2, 225-pound rookie lined up as the outside receiver in several 11-on-11 sets. Even though quarterbacks were instructed not to throw Mayle’s way, it was solid experience for the rookie to integrate himself as a route runner in Cleveland’s offense. The Browns expect Mayle to be full-go by training camp and are hopeful he’ll push for early playing time, too.

3) Offensive formations have been interesting

Tight end Rob Housler was lined up as the outside receiver on more than one occasion. All 6-foot-5 of wide receiver Rodney Smith stood in the slot and hauled in a 20-yard pass a on seam pattern in the middle of the field. A passing drill had Terrance West at receiver. Another formation had Mayle in the backfield as a running back before he split in motion out wide.

“Flip’ (offensive coordinator John DeFilippo) has some unique things that he’s putting in that, just looking at them from a defensive perspective, are very challenging,” Pettine said.

4) Mental repetitions big for young quarterbacks

While Josh McCown ropes in the first-team repetitions, Manziel and Connor Shaw mimic his every movement off to the side – even on running plays. Last year, it was suggested the pair of young quarterbacks use practice for the mental repetitions. This year, it appears to be required and seems to be helping.

“I thought (Manziel’s) done an outstanding job so far grasping what we’re doing,” Pettine said. “I thought he made some real nice throws today. He’s had his days where he struggled, but that’s natural – No. 1, learning a new offense and No. 2, going against a defense that is significantly ahead just due to chemistry and cohesion and knowledge of the book. I think we all feel good about where he is.”

5) Other nuggets

Rodney Smith made a number of plays Tuesday. He gallops across the field and is consistently getting open. Remember, the Browns claimed the wide receiver from the Vikings last October. The 25-year-old from Florida State was only active for three games in 2014 and has yet to catch an NFL pass, but as Pettine reminded reporters recently, it’s extremely hard for a young player to jump in midseason and earn playing time. It’s only June, but there is intrigue in Smith’s size and newfound comfort in DeFilippo’s offense.

When K’Waun Williams broke up a pass on Andrew Hawkins – at least his third breakup of the day – defensive coordinator Jim O’Neil literally busted out an Irish dance jig and screamed, “Not in his house Hawk! Not in K’Waun’s house.” The Browns also used Williams in a variety of blitz packages throughout the OTA. Pettine said perhaps nobody’s leap in 2015 has been as noticeable as the second-year cornerback.

“A lot of it’s just a credit to him that he took that time from January to April,” Pettine said. “You could see he looks different physically. He’s bigger, but he’s leaner. He’s moving better. It’s great to see him go against Hawk in the slot. Those are some of the battles I look forward to the most watching during practice.”

Wide receiver Dwayne Bowe nicked up his knee on a touchdown he scored against cornerback Tramon Williams. Pettine said he may sit out Thursday’s OTA, but it is nothing serious.
Linebacker Karlos Dansby and fullback Malcolm Johnson were not in attendance Tuesday, but had notified the team of the previous scheduling conflicts.

Link

This is good to hear.

Indeed. I also liked reading that Gilbert seems to be turning it around. Duke Johnson seems to be turning some heads, and I'm really curious to see Rodney Smith on the field.

And Pettine said he looks leaner and bigger than last year, too! Williams and Hawkins has gotta be the best battle here!

K1 had a hell of a rookie year. Might have been the best slot corner performance we have had since Cutch was sliding inside at times. I expect a big year for him. I think we will be in a lot of nikel and dime this year, just because that is where our talent is at.

Great to hear the praise of Gilbert. I dont think he is our #1 from day 1 but I could see him taking over for Williams before the season is done.

All those formations wow who ever came up with all of those, its almost like he took several pages out of Al Saunders play book, lol thats right he did lol. We did a lot of this with Chud, getting the big TE out wide. I like the idea of getting these backs out into the patterns as legit threats. I think all 3 of our backs can catch and will get more and more opportunities.

Many years ago, the Broncos had a receiver names Rod Smith. They did not get much out of him the 1st 2 years he was on the roster, but they got really good production from years 3-11, before finally dropping off in year 12, and heading into retirement after that season.

I am counting on our Rodney Smith doing no less. (well ...... maybe we'll just hope that he becomes a player for us anyway)

Fluff.

He is.

Nonetheless, if we ignore the embellishments there are still some facts in there. If we buy into the glittering generalities we can become falsely encouraged. But if we dismiss those and focus only on the facts we get an idea that some players are improving.

That says nothing in regards to the future. Only that on that day some of them were doing well.

And by Anti-Fluff, you mean most posts on the board!

Yup,,, But so what?

Browns DBs off to early lead as driving position group of 2015 season
Jun 03, 2015 -- 6:00am

The all-hands team: Watching the Browns’ OTA practice on Tuesday, I was astounded by how many times the DBs got their hands on balls.

Almost every note I took was of a DB breaking up a pass. It happened in one-on-one drills from inside the 10-yard line, in 7-on-9s into the end zone, and in team drills in the middle of the field.

K’Waun Williams, Justin Gilbert, Joe Haden, Robert Nelson, Pierre Desir each broke up passes. There were another half-dozen or so in the one-on-one drills before I started noting names or jersey numbers.

For the most part, these were aggressive poke-aways in tight coverage – not the result of errant throws. And the impressive thing was the absence of live pass rush, of course, in the early touch football phase of spring workouts. In other words, the quarterbacks weren’t necessarily rushing throws.

The coverage was just that good.

“That’s a good group,” coach Mike Pettine said. “Those guys are doing a good job, and they’re certainly ahead of the curve.”

There was one good offensive play -- Josh McCown standing tall in the pocket, peering over the center of the defense and rifling a strike to Taylor Gabriel crossing from the right side and breaking inside safety Donte Whitner at the back of the end zone.

Otherwise, it was a dominant day for the DBs. Not unexpected, given the talent, the emphasis on press corner coverage by Pettine, the carryover from last year and the developing attitude that the secondary – the smallest and the feistiest of the defenders – will be the heart and soul of the 2015 Browns.

“It’s par for the course,” Haden said. “We just come into it making sure we get our hands on a lot of balls. Everybody’s playing hard. It’s a competition room, so they know you’ve got to stand out and make plays.”

Go with your strength: In his first season as coach, Pettine overhauled the Browns’ secondary and solidified the position group as the driving force of the defense. In 2014, the Browns led the NFL in opposing quarterback rating (74.1) and were first in the league with 99 pass breakups.

Those marks were more impressive when you consider the Browns ranked 27th in sack percentage.

The vast majority of coaches believes pass defense starts with rushing the passer. Pettine works from the back to the front.

“It feels good because you know the kind of guys that you have around you, and the coaches that you have around you,” Haden said. “They really believe in us, and the talent we have in the room, with Donte, Tramon (Williams), KK (K'Waun Williams), Justin, Pierre’s coming along … we’ve got so many people out there.”

Looking up: As good as the secondary was last year, it figures to be better in 2015, rivaling the Seahawks and Jets for best position group in the NFL.

Start with the fact there weren’t any coaching changes on defense, meaning the holdover players don’t have to learn somebody or something new.

The major personnel change was Green Bay Packers free agent Tramon Williams replacing departed Buster Skrine. Gilbert, last year’s first-round flop, seems more committed and attentive in the early going of his second year. And there are some new wrinkles, such as every cornerback preparing to be able to drop down inside and cover the slot receiver, so as to give offenses unpredictable looks.

And controlling the DB room are Haden, who is reveling in his new leadership role, and safety Donte Whitner.

“I feel very comfortable with the coaches,” Haden said. “I feel very comfortable being able to talk with the players. We know the system, know the scheme. We know it’s going to be a very, very competitive room and one slip and you could be out of the room.”

The only concern at this point is the contract dispute involving Tashaun Gipson, the rare free safety who is both an accomplished ball-hawk and intimidating hitter. Haden begged off from commenting, other than to say, “I hope it’s going to be OK.”

Eventually, Gipson will sign and play out the 2015 season. And then the deep and talented Browns secondary may well dictate the course of the entire team.

“It’s gonna be on us, but we know we have the ability to be the leading group of the team,” Haden said.

http://espncleveland.com/common/more.php?m=49&action=blog&r=17&post_id=46131

McCown career QB rating is 76.1 did anyone else catch that?

yea. or our recievers are that bad?

Can't be that McCown sucks right? What does Hoyer have to do with McCown sucking for his 13 year career, can you explain that?

Oh wait a minute its because he has played behind 7 different bad O Lines. He just needs time because he can't handle pressure, pressure makes him play scared and when he is scared he throws Ints and leaves the ball on the ground, gotcha.

Here in Cleveland he won't get pressure because our running game will keep him in favorable down and distances all the time, and that will make it so he doesn't have to play scared anymore. 1st up the NY Jets.

i dont do fantasy. i leave that up to you.

That's a bit different for a Grossi article.