DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Supreme Court Allows Nationwide Health Care Subsidies

K.


But, to get Obamacare passed, we were told there were 30 to 50 million uninsured Americans.

To date, how many got insurance through Ocare? 10 million? 12 million? 15 million? (who's paying for it? If the people didn't have insurance before, it's because they couldn't afford it.)

So, rates go up, subsidies get paid - and we still haven't gotten even half of the uninsured insured?

And have you seen what insurance companies want, as far as rate increases?

so you decide to look at it from a glass half empty view.

i look it at from a glass half full.

The number of American adults without health insurance fell 16.5 million from five years ago, when Obamacare was signed into law, the largest drop in four decades, a new report says.

The report, released by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services on Monday, says the uninsured rate is 13.2%, down from 20.3% in 2012-13.

That's a 35% decline, "quite simply an historic reduction in the uninsured rate," said Meena Seshamani, director of the Office of Health Reform for HHS. "Today, we know that the Affordable Care Act is working. ... These numbers represent real people."

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/natio...acare/24852325/

so that's millions less than before. MILLIONS.

Yes, hush now young democrat and pay your taxes like a good trooper. We need your wealth redistributed to the poor for the good of America.

not a problem. i love helping others. and if paying taxes is what i have to do then so be it.

the country is its strongest when we invest in ourselves.

Now don't get all carried away with this. The Fact is the Government likes helping others by redistributing your wealth. Just pay those taxes so they can continue to help others.

i don't mind helping people pay for healthcare out of my tax money.

sounds a whole lot better than say...war.

War? Oh yea, that's that thingy ISIS is doing so successfully.

how many americans have been killed by ISIS?

General question Swish, not really questioning you personally.

Why did they choose 2012-2013, near the highest unemployment (IE: uninsured) rates in recent history (8-8.3% 2012 to 5.5% in 2015)? To me, that is partially why the uninsured numbers have dropped.

The real data would be how many people who were uninsured during the economic boom, are now insured either privately or through the ACA programs.

If Obamacare is so great, then why did democrats have to lie to get it passed?

I'm still waiting for the cheaper healthcare costs Obama promised.

My complaint isn't that we are paying for those unable to pay for themselves, it is that nothing has been done or implemented to curb the rising cost.

How come Medicare was okay, then?

Experts see big price hikes for Obamacare
Premiums could rise more sharply in 2016.

The cost of Obamacare could rise for millions of Americans next year, with one insurer proposing a 50 percent hike in premiums, fueling the controversy about just how “affordable” the Affordable Care Act really is.
The eye-popping 50 percent hike by New Mexico insurer Blue Cross Blue Shield is an outlier, and state officials may not allow it to go through. But health insurance experts are predicting that premiums will rise more significantly in 2016 than in the first two years of Obamacare exchange coverage. In 2015, for example, premiums increased by an average of 5.4 percent, according to PwC’s Health Research Institute.

http://www.politico.com/story/2015/05/how-affordable-is-the-affordable-care-act-118428.html

Doctors.

And look at all the fraud involved.

Because it started in 1966, before I was born???

Not sure what your question really is in relation to the ACA.

And doesn't medicare require that you paid into the system, unless disabled?

But it's called the "Affordable" Care Act I thought? Useless, hike in their premiums met with insane copays.

Break America's Back Act

I'm not really disputing that the ACA didn't solve anything. I don't see where it helped that much. But I don't believe it's hurt the way some portray it. It all boils down to the same thing.

You can pay for those who are uninsured by ever increasing the cost of healthcare. You can help pay to insure those who are uninsured. What you have now is a combination of the two. Many have refused to sign up for health care. For that portion of the people you continue to pay for the uninsured. For the portion that did sign up for healthcare, you're helping subsidize their healthcare cost.

But bottom line, you're still paying. Now if you wish to look at frivolous law suits, the greed of health insurance companies and the high cost of prescription drugs, that really has no relevance in terms of healthcare coverage.

The problem is much deeper and it's systemic. If our government asked for competitive bidding from drug companies, like they do for the military, those costs would go down dramatically. If they capped malpractice suits, that too would cut costs.

Those topics and more were discussed as reasons for the rise in healthcare costs before the ACA was enacted. Now, suddenly, people wish to act like those issues no longer exist and scream "Obamacare!".

The entire healthcare system is to blame for the costs. It's a multi pronged problem and not one you can simply throw a political flag at.

It hasn't hurt? Well, it hurts now......give it a few years and we'll see the hurt.

Insurance companies are chomping at the bit to raise premiums (I believe anthem/blue cross/blue shield in N.M. is trying to raise premiums 50% next year. They probably won't be allowed to though)

Look - our premiums have gone up. Our deductibles have increased ("our" being my family). And what do I get for it?

I get a phone call almost every other month from our "health care provider" saying "you need to come in for a physical." Even though we've had them. (not me) in the last 3 months.

So much for "electronic health records will save money" huh?

What does Ocare do for the gov't? How much is it costing, and how much will it cost next year, and after?

It's no secret we're headed to single payer h.c. And, of course, the gov't. will be in charge of that. Consequently, tax rates will go up, and yet at the same time, your health care will be dependent on the yahoos in DC. They won't know you - they'll just know your age, a bit of your history, and your care will be based off of that.

Take a pain pill.

j/c...

to my conservative friends, Obamacare is here to stay... whether we wanted it or not. Might as well get on-board and try to work with it and make it as effective and efficient as we can. With the right tweaking and modifications, who knows, it might really improve our healthcare system. And if it does, and Obama gets credit for it, good for him.

and for the record, might as well stop fighting gay marriage too.. it's coming, if not now, soon.

man....i never seen people so scared of change before.

i guess would we would probably shoot at aliens if they decide to visit us.

We'll accept more evolving conservatives

You know Arch, for years BEFORE the ACA was enacted, my premiums went up every year co pays went up and my deductibles went up. It was nothing new. It isn't some new phenomenon that started with the ACA.

I would suggest you look at what DC posted and go from there.

It seems you failed to address my points as to the biggest part of the problems with rising cost above and they have nothing to do with the ACA.

i was reading an article a while back

so is it true that the cost were always gonna go up, but ACA at least slowed the pace down from what it was?

It's possible. Costs were rising at a pretty steep rate before, they are still going up fairly quickly.. whether it's a little better or a little worse is debatable.. the only way to know "for sure" would be for those math geeks to create a statistical model to see what might have happened in a parallel universe and no matter what they found, the group that didn't like it would say they were wrong.

Now if we could just find some evolving liberals we might all actually make some changes for the better in this country!

I'm not sure if it slowed down or sped up. But my point was that the very things I hear most people complain of were going on before the ACA was ever enacted.

There are many factors that effect the cost of healthcare that are in no way associated with the ACA and those same factors have had an impact all along.

While this may all be true and seems like a reasonable position to take, it's not in keeping with what we were promised. I know, shame on anybody who actually believed that those promises were true... but we were promised fields of roses, clear skies, and rainbows... and what we have so far, looks very much like what we had before only some minor differences in who/how the bill is being paid.

So the question is, as it relates to continually rising health care costs, should we be comparing to what we had before, or what we were promised?

Pretty much as you said, to believe everything would be sunshine and roses as we were promised would have been naïve at best. However, I believe IF the ACA could have been delivered as it was intended to be, things would be much better.

But in politics, everything gets watered down and compromised to death in order to pass. By the time all was said and done, the ACA was nothing but a small piece of patchwork that would accomplish very little.

The entire system needed a complete overhaul and that was never going to happen.

I thought compromise is what everybody was rooting for in Washington?

"Compensation".

I'm not one who is against compromise. I'm simply saying what you wish to pass and what gets passed are usually two different things.

Especially in this case: We have to pass it to know what's in it, right?

You know Swish, Conservatives lost this with the first lawsuit, not this one. This lawsuit was just the typical stupid conservative hail mary that was never going to work!! Trying to stop the law with a 4 word phrase that is literally ambiguous within the over all law was dumb!!

I always ask conservatives, if you do not like the affordable care act, then what was the alternative?? Never an answer. Four plus years of voting for the repeal and not ONE vote on a so called better solution!!

And BTW - when people were polled and told of some of the benefits of the law AND called in the Affordable Health Care act, people liked the law. Call it Obamacare, the numbers dropped dramatically.

Pit,
The affordable health care act HAD to be watered down because the alternative means to TOTALLY look at all the profit built into the health care system!! Now who really wants to look under the hood of that car.

From the Hospitals, Docs and Big Pharm, who really is going to go down that path. Unless we were stomach that type of investigations, this was the only compromise.

Americans were NOT going to pay for a Gov/single pay health care system and the what was being done before was not sustainable. Again, this is law is the Compromise in the middle.

That's because you're a young pup.
You should have folks in 1965.


I've been seeing this for 5 decades now. Ain't nothing new. Read any history book.... the entire history of this species is inked by change- and resistance to it.

Each chapter- regardless of how pitched the fight or how much blood is spilled- ends the same way.

Resistance is futile.
Change is inevitable.
Change is inexorable.

The best we can do is try to send the momentum in one calculated direction or another, hope for the best... and continue to adjust to the ever-changing 'new normal.'

But one thing is certain above all: change will happen whether we're ready for it or not.


.02

Dylan said it best, Clem:

Come mothers and fathers
Throughout the land
And don't criticize
What you can't understand
Your sons and your daughters
Are beyond your command

Your old road is
Rapidly agin'
Please get out of the new one
If you can't lend your hand
For the times they are a-changin'.

Funny you mention it, but I've already quasi-planned to stop somewhere in the afternoon tomorrow, get a beer and play that song once SCOTUS grants marriage equality. Such a rapid transformation. It was a little over ten years ago that anti-gay marriage sentiments were used to drive voters to the polls. A little over thirty years ago, homosexuality was still classified as a mental illness. I'm looking forward to reading the bitterness of Scalia's dissent, but I plan to focus most of the day on the positive.

Weird. I really like that song. Sadly, I see myself in it. In a way.

And here's the reality - you will too, in time. It is what it is.

Absolutely. In Bill Burr's latest special, he does a bit talking about this, and at one point, describing his disdain for today's music, he adopts a crotchety old man voice and says "In my day, you dressed like a woman and sang about the devil. Now that was music!"