DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Same-Sex Marriage Ruled Constitutional

At no point did I say that the people of Missouri were racists. My injection of those four words were to point out the fallacy in this gentleman's argument. Discrimination shouldn't be protected merely because the community wants to do it. We fought a war over that. This gentleman's argument did not prevail.

So by your silly standards I can change 1 word in the Constitution...

We the Black People...

So lame.

In my injection of race, the meaning of the ethos does not change. It's still someone arguing that we shouldn't federally reverse state decisions simply because a majority wants it that way. His argument could be "the people of State X don't want gays to marry because Jesus says it's icky", or it could be "the people of state X don't want blacks and whites to marry because it dilutes the race" - the intent of his point is still that the federal government shouldn't strike down discriminatory state statutes because the people want it. However, in your example, adding the word "black" into "We the people", changes the argument or intent entirely.

Might actually be my first proposal if anyone starts a thread
on how to end Racism in America.

I guess gay marriage has severely restricted your life? Please do tell me how different your life is today as opposed to yesterday.

My point is you act as though the SCOTUS should be deciding laws of the nation based on the Bible. That's not their job. Their rulings are based on the Constitution and not the Bible. That's why it's plain as day that there is a separation of Church and state. That's why Christians will constantly be disappointed by laws created in this country.

You have every right to wish that our laws be based in scripture if that's your desire. Yet they won't be which is what you should actually expect.

not going to waste my time.

The federal's desire to keep removing state rights and take all the powers for themselves is exactly what will end up causing civil war. It's very clear that the culture of big city liberals are trying to force their self destructive lifestyle on the more rural states that prefer nature and living as God intended us.

There are already several states with Millions of signatures with the desire to secede from the USA. It's not a joke. This country is getting torn in half because people only care about what they WANT instead of what is best for the country.

The division of powers to the state is what has allowed our country to coexist despite our differences. Having the FED try to control everything won't work. People from different regions of the country are just too different. It keeps stomping all over our moral beliefs and eventually to protect our children's future it WILL lead to the next civil war.

I guess the government already knows it's coming which is why homeland security has bought more ammunition than all of our previous wars combined. They didn't buy them to keep out immigrants. They bought them to kill Americans. To date they have bought 100 million coffins and 1.8 billion rounds of ammo. WTF would they need 100 million coffins for? For dead Americans. Why or how I don't know but you don't buy that many rounds of ammunition unless you plan to use them and homeland security is not there to fight foreign invaders...

Oh God


You're one of those people that thinks FEMA has concentration camps in Alaska aren't you?

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS LIBERALS LIVE BY


1.) The Bible is not absolute. None of the laws in it are carved in stone. Everything in it is subject to reinterpretation. If the information in the Bible is inapplicable to the current need, that information is to be disregarded. If the whole of the Bible is inapplicable to the current time, it needs to be eliminated.

2.) The Law is not absolute. No laws are to be considered as representative of moral archetypes. All laws are subject to reinterpretation. If a law does not meet the current need, that law is to be disregarded. If the whole of that law is inconvenient to current needs, that law needs to be eliminated.

3.) The Constitution is not absolutely inviolable. Nothing in the Constitution was written to last forever. All of the Constitution is subject to reinterpretation. If any part of the Constitution interferes with the current agenda, it is to be circumvented. If the Constitution as a whole limits the agenda of the current time, the Constitution needs to be eliminated.

4.) Truth is not absolute. Truth differs in different times and societies. Nothing is true forever. If the truths of the past are inconvenient, they are thereby proven to be falsehoods. If all the truths of the past are inconvenient, the lessons of the past can be disregarded.

5.) Morality is not absolute. What is considered to be morality depends upon the group and its circumstances. The morality of the group is to be the morality of all. If someone else’s morality is inconvenient, it needs to be vilified. If that morality is found to be a hindrance to the current agenda, it needs to be completely quashed.

6.) Right action is not an absolute idea. What is considered to be right action depends upon what group this activity occurs in. Anyone who does something the group does not like engages in a wrong action. If an action that someone considers to be right offends the group in control, that action is actually a wrong action. Actions that the group in control considers to be wrong are to be punished most severely.

7.) To be in charge is to be correct. What is correct depends upon the mood of the ones in charge. That mood is subject to change, depending on the circumstances of the moment. Anyone who says that the ones in charge are not acting correctly is himself in the wrong. Those who come against the group in word or deed are to be viciously persecuted for it.

8.) There is no absolute sin. The concept of sin is relative. What was considered to be a vice is tomorrow’s virtue. If you do something you do not personally believe is wrong, then you are not sinning. If everyone does it, it never was a sin in the first place.

9.) Oppression is not an absolute construct. It is important to be in charge. If you are in charge, there can be no oppression. If you are not in charge, there will undoubtedly be some who oppress you. If you lose control of all means to power, you are absolutely by definition one of the oppressed.

10.) There is no absolute definition of what is life. There is no definite consensus of or opinion on what constitutes life. Life is an intellectual, legal construct, not a physical reality. If something is inconvenient in your own life, you can disregard its existence, and thus consider it not to be among the living. If something becomes totally inconvenient to your lifestyle, you can eliminate it without any moral compunction.

https://dcclothesline.wordpress.com/2013/01/23/the-ten-commandments-liberals-live-by/

That's reductive nonsense. Plenty of Southern God-fearing Christians don't care if gays get married. I know more than a few. This isn't about morality, it's about equality in the eyes of the law. Preach your morality from the pulpit, and feel free to tell people they are immoral. But your moral belief system shouldn't be a compass for law.

ok well i don't agree with that.

see? i'm not a hypocrite. y'all attacking me like i'm the one that sued them.

when are you and Razor going to get it?

you keep posting all this religious stuff and biblical verse.

WE DON'T CARE. i'm not religious. so for a lack of better term, go kick rocks.

our government has no official religion. thus, it CAN NOT make laws off of religious grounds.

all this nonsense and crying you're doing, you forget that it's being going on for centuries. this isn't some new thing. there has been gays before this country was a twinkle in anybody's eyes. a LOT of them.

just because you get a warm and fuzzy pretending it doesn't exist, doesn't mean it's not happening.

if a tree falls in the woods, and nobody is around to see it, does it still make a sound?

that's what you and other religious people act like that's how this country operates.

"well, if i just close my eyes, and if gays stay in the background, then technically, its not happening, and we are morally right!!".

nah bro. stop being delusional.

this country has had massive moral issues since the beginning .

slavery, jim crow, women's rights, interracial marriage, japanese camps, massacre of indians, prohibition era, civil right's movement, etc.

stop acting like some moral decline is happening at a rapid rate. if anything, our morals are going up, as people are being treated more and more fairly each passing generation.

your right to discriminate is gone. suck it up or move out the country.

Yet I never mentioned the court, did I?

I asked a very specific series about Christians, and how they justify the way they act towards things that are contrary to the Law of the God they claim to follow. I never asked why we have laws, I asked how Christians can support laws that are in violation of the teachings of the Bible, and what Jesus taught, and then I gave specific examples.

So, I will ask again, how does a person who claims to be a Christian, who claims to follow Jesus Christ, and to obey God, instead, decide to promote things that run contrary to what Jesus taught us? Should we expect salvation is we disobey and disregard what God tells us to do?

If we are Christians, then shouldn't we, and in fact, aren't we required to follow our Lord? Then why don't we?

Jesus never said a single word about shunning sinners, or refusing to deal with them. I've asked you before and I'll ask again - what is happening in America that is forcing you to do something against your religious beliefs? No one is asking you to perform an abortion, or have sex with a man, or sit through a gay wedding ceremony. Hell, no one is even telling you to condone them. All of your complaints are based on the fact that American society is not going the way you wish it to. No one is forcing you to sin.

christians can follow whatever they want.

but your religion does NOT trump the constitution and civil liberties of others. that only applies in Christian nations, like european countries.

Did I say a word about shunning sinners? No I did not.

What I did say is that we should not approve of sins committed by others. Jesus never did this. He forgave sins, as was His right as the Son of God and Messiah .... but He never once told people to continue in their sins.

He forgave the adulterous woman, and told her to go and sin no more. He did not tell her to continue in her sinful lifestyle.

There is a difference between refusing to deal with sinners, and approving and promoting a sinful lifestyle.

If I own a motel, and my neighbor, who I know ifs married, shows up with a woman who I also know is not his wife, should I be forced to rent him a room if I believe that adultery is a sin? Should I be forced to promote and approve of his sin?

I don't believe I should.

As far as how does it affect me .... well, if I love my neighbor, and it affects the culture in which we live, and it promotes what the Bible says is sinful behavior, then I have a responsibility to stand against things that I believe to be wrong.

I pray every night that God gives us help and more time to try and reach more people with the message of Jesus Christ. I absolutely hate the idea of people being condemned by their sins, and I hate the idea that people want to offer sins societal approval, which will lead more people to sin.

We all have the choice to make for ourselves, though. Either we follow and Obey Jesus Christ, or we will be condemned when this life ends. That is my firm belief, and it is the last thing I want for anyone to suffer.

I can accept that sins are legal, but that does not mean that I will speak approvingly of things I believe to be wrong from a Biblical stance, and I absolutely will not support them. That is my right.

Except your religious beliefs fortunately do not trump the rights and liberties of Americans. You'd be arguing for Sharia Law if you followed islam, YTown.

And frankly, that would be my right if that was the case.

People can agree, or disagree. That is their right. This is what you seem to miss. You think that it is perfectly fine for you to have your beliefs, but no way can a Christian have, and promote, his beliefs, and the teachings of Jesus Christ. Every law in this country is based upon someone's beliefs. There is no reason why laws should only be based upon the beliefs of those who have no religious beliefs. There is no reason for the religious to withdraw from putting pressure on society and lawmakers to make laws that promote the values found in the teachings of Jesus Christ. Further, I think that Christians have a responsibility to follow Christ, even in matters of a secular nature, and ought be very careful that they do not offer approval of sinful behavior, thus encouraging sin, and/or leading others to sin. This is something the Bible specifically warns against.

We all have our beliefs, and we all have the right to follow and express our beliefs. Somehow the world has managed to convince many Christians that our beliefs should be kept hidden at home, never to be seen by anyone else, and certainly never to be spoken of in public. Ridiculous. We have as much right to express and follow our beliefs as anyone else does. Our beliefs do not "trump" the civil process, but to say that they have no place in civil debate is just stupid.

Promoting beliefs is fine. Just don't use your beliefs to suppress the constitutional right of others based on a theological text that lacks solid evidence outside of faith.

We all have our own beliefs that we use to guide us. Mine happen to be religious. Yours, obviously, are not. Your non-religious beliefs are not superior, or in any way less fallible, than my religious beliefs.

I have said this before, and I will say it again ..... desires are not rights. We have confused this to a great degree these days. People have a desire for something, so someone argues that it is a right. Not all desires are rights.

And not all "Rights" are "Right".

Sounds like social club churching at its finest. Too lazy to care or obey the Bible and they still claim to follow God.

Sadly there are not many real followers of God left in this country. Most people "Calling" themselves Christians do absolutely nothing for God except to hold their hand out and say, "Gimmie, gimme." Then they become agnostics or atheists because Daddy didn't give them what they wanted.

If homosexual behavior doesn't offend you as a Christian the same way stealing, lying, or killing does then you better check your salvation because chances are you left it behind somewhere trying to keep mankind happy instead of God. If you have the Holy Spirit in your heart then ALL sin should offend you and not be OK.

The Libthingys and pretend Christians tell us we came from a
Primordial ooze and they seem intent on leading us back in that direction.

Would you prefer they follow the word of the Bible and murder homosexuals?

HA! Where did you read Jesus saying that? The Book of Jack?

Which is exactly what I said. You are free to say that homosexuality is a sin, because the Bible says so. If that right is ever taken from you, count me on your side. Just don't act like it's unfair if those beliefs aren't taken into consideration when it comes to law. They shouldn't be taken seriously in that context.

Swish, I will express my political views anytime I like. If you don't like it then put me on ignore. I got the same right to speak my mind as anyone else. Then again I guess rights don't include Christians anymore since it just reminds people that what they want to do is wrong and is real inconvenient to hear. People would rather just be told it's ok to just do whatever disgusting thing you want.

The things people do does not happen in a vacuum. The things we permit to happen and give our approval of change our culture. If the people who do know the difference between right and wrong don't speak up and fight bad things from corrupting and damaging our society then who will? It's not like those lost at sea with no skills at navigation can find their way home without help.

Just like our country is lost at sea and has no idea to right the ship until a good captain shows up to navigate for it. Instead we have the lost voting more lost idiots like Obama who would rather sink the ship then to save the people on board. I know how to navigate and I would rather save as many people as I can whether they want to be saved or not. You can stay on a sinking ship if you want. Thats your choice. Just don't ask me to stay on it myself or leave my family onboard as I take my family home to an America I can go back to being proud of instead of being ashamed of.

i'd never put you on ignore. for what? the ignore button is for people who REALLY can't tolerate other's opinions.

But I, for one, am proud to be American, especially now.

The ruling isn't gonna change, the progress isn't gonna be reversed.

you're in the minority now on this decision.

but like i said, it won't change, the SC has spoken. so you can complain all you want, that's you're right.

I'm simply saying that it won't change, so you can either learn to deal with it, while complaining of course, or you can lead by example and leave to a country that supports religious law and against gays.

plenty of countries in the middle east that would love to take you, is what i'm saying.

I mean, that's the popular response to muslims around here:

if they don't like it here, leave, right? that's what a lot of people say.

now it just applies to you.

Execution or judgement is not murder. That being said I would rather they be shown the mercy of God than his wrath. Don't mistake mercy for acceptance or approval though. It just means a little more time to save them from the Lake of Fire and the destruction of their soul.

The problem with being lenient is far too often people take leniency as permission to keep doing it or for calling it normal.

For instance, everyone tells a lie now and then so don't be such a prude and get over it. Everyone eventually cheats on their spouse its just normal so get over it. Doesn't everyone smoke pot? I mean its harmful and illegal but so long as i am only hurting myself just get over it.

At some point God's mercy will come to a screeching halt just like all exasperated parents do. I don't envy my children or grandchildren when that moment comes because its is indeed coming sooner rather than later. It ALWAYS does.

The corruption of our government will soon destroy our country. We had a good run and currently the oldest government in the world. I guess change won't be so bad ... I wonder if the new government will keep the same name or change it? I wonder how many of us will die in the making of it?

I would not say that a liberal loaded SC speaks for the majority. It doesn't even have the authority to make laws anyways which is what it is trying to do.

If the states refuse to enforce it then it won't matter anyways. It will be interesting to see if some states fight the decision by refusing to comply with it.

BTW I don't think I have ever used that phrase if you don't like it then leave. I'd rather you stay while I work on converting you

I don't care much if I am liked or not.

And what was it that Jesus said about homosexuality and gay marriage?

on that one, we have in common.

for the uptenth time, i must give you props for at least stick to your ideals, and speaking out against all sins, not just one.

even though we agree, just know i respect that. i see way too many part timers.

I appreciate that. It's not like I don't understand where other people are coming from. I understand that they just want to do what they want to do especially if they don't see any harm in it. I completely understand that.

It's just I have seen way too much in this life to just say that certain things are OK and are not harmful. I've read too many historical accounts to not see certain patterns that are repeating themselves. It's just sad that once a nation reaches success that they always give up what made them successful and then fall apart from the inside out.

When a country loses its moral compass and lets the family unit fall apart it is ALWAYS doomed to fall. You easily see that pattern all though the history of every country that ever was.

Then after being brought to their knees and fighting for their lives they go back to realizing how important the family is and treating each other with honor by putting the family first instead of themselves first. You see great nations are formed when the people set aside their own petty desires and put the needs of the nation first. That is what leads to greatness.

America has lost that for the most part because we spent a lot of time with success. We got soft and no longer make the tough choices needed to make our nation great anymore. Instead it's all about how much we can indulge our selfish desires and to heck with the consequences.

I don't think it's too late yet. Otherwise I'd be holed up in the mountains already. It's getting close to that point though.

Christ is quoted at one point that God created people “in the beginning” as male and female, and that marriage is the union of one man and one woman joined together as “one flesh.” (Matthew 19:4-6 and Mark 10:6-9)

When He discussed sexual morality, Christ had a very high standard, clearly affirming long-standing Old Testament law. He told the woman caught in adultery to “Go and sin no more.” (John 8:11) He warned people that not only the act of adultery was wrong, but even adulterous thoughts (Matthew 5:28). And he shamed the woman at the well (John 4:18) by pointing out to her that he knew she was living with a man who was not her husband.

The country just got bumped a little toward center from where it was balancing over the deep right chasm.

The deep right are crawling out enraged trying to pull the country back toward the cliff and hopefully down into their world where they control every facet of everybody's life.

Governments have a tendency not to solve problems, only to rearrange them.

RONALD REAGAN

Cool, so if we're still going by Old Testament law as affirmed by Jesus, then I take it that you and other strict Christians are not eating pork or other forbidden foods like shellfish or those that mix meat and dairy (bummer, no cheeseburgers), not wearing clothing made of more than one material (so much for those cotton/poly blend t-shirts), planting fields with only one crop, not trimming your beard or cutting your hair, not getting a tattoo, working on the Sabbath, etc.

I'm sure you guys are obeying all of those laws and the ones I didn't list, right?

My understanding is it's much higher than that today, on the order of millions of dollars:

http://blogs.wsj.com/totalreturn/2014/10/30/estate-tax-exemption-for-2015-announced-by-irs/

Still either way a buck is a buck, and a buck you give to Uncle Sam is a buck you don't get back. Being married in state A and then state B not reciprocating your marriage benefits is not good.

Speaking of unintended consequences, I read somewhere that thanks to this we should now have 50 state reciprocity of conceal carry, because conceal carry rights in state A should apply to state B equally...