DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... Time to end political correctness

And I can show you just as many facts that show there is no such thing, which wouldn't matter at all, because you have obviously already made up your mind.

As for your 'white privilege' nonsense, I live in a townhouse in a neighborhood that is at least 50% minority. I have two cars over 10 years old that I take care of to make them last longer. I put myself through tech school, so I wouldn't have to work manual labor jobs, and I busted my butt to get where I am now. I've worked for men, women, black, white, Asian, and others. Where is this privilege you talk about? Shouldn't I be living large with a slave like population working for me? I seem to recall paying the same prices everyone else does. I've had to repair my credit after the tech crash of '02. Where is this privilege?

It's all based on the color of your skin.

Wait a minute! That can't be right can it?

Racist.

Is PC over now? It's awful quiet since somebody besides me got called a Racist.

Because The Good Book admonishes us that God is no respector of Man. By natural extension, He is no respector of Man's institutions, either.

This whole "God's favored country" stuff is now, and has always been nothing more than feel-good rhetoric and propaganda. I don't believe for a minute that The Almighty favors any country over any other... especially considering the multitude of atrocities committed by all (sometimes, in His name).

God is not about politics. Anyone's politics.
We should keep His name out of our mouths when discussing something as filthy as this.

I learned that lesson years ago when at a Browns Steelers game.
I was sitting there praying for a Browns score when I noticed
the Steelers fan beside me was doing the same for holding them.

...and God was just laughing His celestial butt off at us....

Actually He told me He was watching New England at the time.

However, God has punished nations who have turned from Him in the past. (usually in the Middle East)

God may not care about politics, but I do believe that He cares about policies. He wants us to obey and follow Him, but I believe that He does allow things to happen for purposes none of us can see.

man, talk about a train wreck post.

you don't have a clue what people mean when we say white privilege.

This isn't oh you're white so you're gonna get into this school before i will, and that you're guaranteed to succeed in life.

White privilege is you getting the benefit of the doubt by cops, while we are instant;y stereotyped. it's you being about to start at ground zero when you enter the adult life, while we have to battle skin tone, the way our names are pronounced, the neighborhood we grew up in based off our address.

when i went to interview for Rick case, the manager was surprised to see. His words, "Reggie? haha i thought it was gonna be a white guy".

Thankfully i got the job, however, the guy already assumed who i was gonna be, especially when he saw the military experience.

Have you gone through something like that, ever YTown?


So, WP isn't some magical wand that says you guys get to do whatever you want. That's why race relations get nowhere because a lot of you guys don't even get what it means when we say white privilege. now you do.

Wow, someone feels special today. I've had two cops stick a gun in my face. My car has been searched twice. I have been mistaken by cops for a rapist and a cop killer. I guess all us white guys look alike. My last name is butchered all the time, and I already know it's due to a lack of vowels, as I have one of those jaw cracker German last names. I have yet to meet someone from India that can pronounce my last name, and I work with a lot of them in the tech industry. I grew up in the highest crime area in my city, so I got a lot of crap when I was still living in that area. Actually, the only difference I've found between my life and your statements, is that I've never been mistaken as anything other than white due to my last name. wah.

Political correctness is fine. It's common sense.

It's the ever increasing amount of OUTRAGE and thin-skinned whining that gets to me. People cry and demand to be compensated and apologized to for ANY and EVERYTHING these days. It's so annoying.

i don't feel special. just explaining the situation.

good morning grumpy pants.

There are a lot of reasons race relations get nowhere, and that is just one of them.

I've always felt privileged, not because of my skin color, just because I'm so damn good looking.

And I've always been very jealous of that.

I don't believe that I said anything specifically about White privilege, did I?

I understand what you're saying, and can accept that you do have issues like that as a Black person. I get that. Why is that, and are there things that Black people do that contributes to their exclusion by some people, and profiling by others?

I do have a couple of questions, and I absolutely do not ask these to be rude. (Thanks politically correct thread)


Anyway .....

How much do you think is owed to the fact that it seems like a disproportionate percentage of crimes, especially violent crimes, are committed by Black people?

How much do you think is due to the fact that many Black people refuse to acclimate, verbally, to the culture?

How much do you think is, at least partially, because many Black people look at life with a chip on their shoulder?

I don't ask these to be rude, or dismissive, I am just curious. Further, what do you think the solutions are?

I'm not a black man Swish and I didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night, so I don't experience the same obstacles that you do. But my perception of the situation is much different than yours.

I don't believe being treated more fairly than another race equals to be a privilege. I believe it's simply how everyone should be treated. I believe many whites, especially those who live in the suburbs, are treated the way all of us should be treated for the most part. Those are actually rights which we should all enjoy. Not a privilege.

Because certain races are being treated unfairly means they should be treated fairly just like others. Not that others are privileged. I know it may simply be a matter of semantics.

What has Colin Powell done differently from other Black people in America?

I really respect that man. Look at his life, starting as a young
Black kid growing up in the Bronx in the 50's to Secretary of State.

Seems there is something there to guide us all to future success.

What did he do differently from all the unsuccessful people in Murica?
Privilege? Race? Luck? Effort?

So because a white person has had a cop overstep their bounds, there is no such thing as racial bias? I grew up in downtown Cleveland and had to deal with a murder in front of my house, gang related street fights, my home being robbed multiple times, and used heroin needles showing up in my front yard. My life and yours was just as bad as those in the African American communities, and they should quit complaining. Or should they? I do feel that the term "white privilege" is a bit simplistic because there is also a classism component. But still, it's easy to feel that white privilege doesn't exist. That we've clearly moved beyond this. That I spent the first 6 years of my life in a trailer, and the next 10 in a downtown Cleveland duplex. What did my privilege get me?

My privilege affords me a lot. I got pulled over last month. I knew it wasn't because I was white. I can walk out of a store and the alarm goes off and the cashiers just wave me by. I live in the United States and by that fact have many freedoms others don't enjoy. My dad was able to go from being a Navy Chief Petty Officer to running his own business by the time I graduated high school, so I was able to enjoy not only the financial benefits of that, but the financial advice that can come from making your own way. I don't have disabilities so I don't need to worry about stairs, or reading braille. I'm a male so I don't need to worry about being raped walking to my car alone at night.

I think when it comes to the concept of white privilege, that it really should encompass several other attributes. Where you live, your financial standing, sexual orientation, gender, etc. It's hard to look at someone born into a hamptons upper crust family and go "oh they have no better chance in life than I do." Yet it's up to us to make do, and I think it's very important that we recognize those socioeconomic differences.

As the Cherokee proverb says, "Don’t judge a man until you have walked a mile in his shoes."

Hed served as a Shabbos Goy.

I have said this at least 10 times on this board...

The data shows that people who are in poverty commit the most crime rather then race. Looking at data segmented by race and poverty it shows that the crime rate is very similar for both white and black people. So crime is more a poor thing then a race thing. More black people are in poverty which causes more black people commiting crime.

There is a huge media perception that shows more blacks in a bad light. I follow the Columbus Police on facebook, and they post every colour of criminals under the moon. I mean it was eye opening to me.

To be honest this makes no sense. How many black people do you know who refuse to acclimate?

When you say verbally, do you mean dialect? I am not sure why that is important. (every region will have a different dialect)

As far as culture the entertainment/fashion industry loves to use black culture("Can you whip or Nae Nae?") Kareem abdul jabbar wrote a piece on how its ok for Miley, Iggy, Katy Perry can wear corn rolls (braids) and they are considered "trendy" but the little girl in Watts wears corn rolls and she is considered "ghetto".

It's perceptions based on our implicit biases towards each other.



Its different, we look at the things differently and our experiences are different.

Remember that part of more black people are in poverty? The government made it harder for blacks to create wealth on a national scale. Laws forced blacks in neighbourhoods with only blacks and banks refused to give loans for home improvements in those same black neighbourhoods. Fast forward 30 years those neighbourhood are slums that you see now. It's no coincidence that every MLK blvd in is a ghetto.


Solutions?
Fix poverty, fix the laws that disproportionately negatively affect black people.

Good luck fixing poverty. Mankind has only been trying to fix that since the beginning of time.

Take big business out of the equation,
fix unfair corporate tax codes,
end corporate welfare,
create a program that forces people to work for their entitlements (get foodstamps and don't have a job, you must clean the park ect...)

That is how I would start by fixing poverty.

jc.


So we all accept that in general, our society has pre-conceived notions based on skin color?

The question then must be asked, why?
Are white people just a bunch of racist bigots?
Do white people just not know the plight of the black people.
Does the black community help or hinder the image white people have of black people?
Does the white community help or hinder the image white people have of black people?


Pointing fingers, and blaming each other for the divide does nothing to solve it. Both sides hold some accountability, and both sides need to put in effort to correct it. And we need to quit blaming the entire group for the wrongs and mistakes of the few.

Really? I haven't seen anyone trying to fix poverty at all, ever, anywhere. As a matter of fact in today's society there are more forces at work trying to create poverty than there are trying to fix poverty.

ALL white people are not racist or bigots, calling someone a racist is a big deal (IMO) however we all have our own implicit biases that are ingrained into us that fuels and feeds our own stereotypes. ( Understanding Implicit Bias from OSU )

Only thing I can do is try and talk about it from my perspective. I see it from different ways, I am from poverty, educated and now thriving. There are alot of things I see black people do that makes me angry, then I sit back and think like "what if I worked a min wage job and had no options to improve myself"..

If only it were that simple.

Force them to work? Are you giving out free daycare while they work for their food stamps, and in turn, losing even more money? What about those with disabilities? What about those who are newly in this boat and should be spending their time looking for a job, not doing work like this?

There's lots of gotcha's to that thinking. It doesn't mean its wrong, but its certainly not as simple as you make it sound.

Not really. Not with any real sincerity, at least.

Why? because you can't have rich without poor.
There's no prestige in being a "have" unless there are "have-nots" for comparison
And you can't be a king without subjects.


There is enough food being produced on this planet to feed everyone alive. Yet starvation is still a top killer worldwide. It ain't the lack of food that's killing these folk... it's the lack of political, moral and social will that allows them to die in such a gruesome fashion.


We've always talked about it... but we've never really tried to end it.

Not really. Not with any real sincerity, at least.


.02

Well now, that is probably the best reason to get rid of the stupid 'white privilege' claim. Thanks for providing that.

How on earth can someone claim all white people are privileged until they have lived my life? I can tell you from a first hand perspective, my color has never gotten me anything.

He's also a gigantic proponent of affirmative action

A classism component that's directly related to racial segregation in the economy. Classism does exist, but as a direct result of racism.

But white privilege isn't a rare candy. You don't automatically level up because you're white. That's not how white privilege operates. It operates in the meaningful, minor, daily occurrences everyday. Those add up real quick. White privilege does exist whether or not you (Not directed at you Gage) want it to.

Just because you may personally feel that to be the case, doesn't mean that it is true. Do you know with 100% certainty your color of skin never helped you get a job over someone who was black or asian for example? Do you know with 100% certainty that the cop who pointed that gun at you wouldn't have pulled the trigger if you were black? I would be cautious at painting your life as knowing with 100% certainty nothing was handed to you because those kind of comments are very easy to break down..

That's my point. Mankind will never be equals with each other unless you try to Harrison Bergeron society. There's always going to be people with more wealth trying to acquire more wealth. Even at the expense of others.

That will NEVER change.

I believe focusing on poor black people verses poor white people is the biggest part of the problem here. Poor neighborhoods across this country are treated pretty much the same. For those who can't afford to fight the system, the system targets much harder than those who can.

This isn't a black and white thing. It's a have and have not thing. Once poor people figure this out and work together, rather than allow catch phrases and division among themselves, then they can accomplish something. Until then, we'll keep hearing things like "white privilege" that will continue to divide even the poor.

It absolutely is connected, and I didn't mean to imply that it was not. When we call it just "white privilege" we get folks like Erik claiming that because a white person somewhere had a tough time growing up then white privilege doesn't exist. People of color say they should be treated more fairly and white folks immediately respond with "we should all be treated more fairly." It's like sitting down for dinner and your father serves everyone their dinner, except you. You say "I should get some food to eat too." Your father says "we ALL should get some food to eat."

Part of me wishes we had a better method of communication to more accurately describe the way people of color are treated as compared to white, than just calling it white privilege. The other part of me realizes that no matter what you call it, some people would prefer to be ignorant or a bigot anyway.

Being aware of systemic racism isn't divisive. I think it's more inclusive. If we can understand our fellow person, no matter their social standing, we can start to work together to reduce racism, poverty, illiteracy, etc. This isn't about ignoring poor white people, it's just about understanding a small component of the racism that still prevails in our nation. It would be like chiding a medical group for trying to cure cancer because they aren't spending their time on both cancer and AIDS. We have groups that are concerned about wealth inequality just as we have groups concerned with race relations...

That's just an inherent flaw of capitalism. People view capitalism as a personal ladder, where you being successful doesn't take away success from other people. That's just not true. Capitalism is much more like a pyramid where there's a hierarchy and not everyone can be on top. We need to refocus it back to people of color, because they're being targeted at disproportional rates.

And that's why I'm not a fan of capitalism

Ah, you just read the same article I did, right?

Unfortunately poor black people are not treated the same way as poor white people, this is "privilege". You may think that poor people are treated the same but factual data proves they are not.

I have posted an article a few times that showed a study from a very respected College institution. They found out that when looking for a job a white man who went to jail had a much higher call back response from black men who never went to jail.

I challenge you to explain this?

Is this privilege? How and why can a criminal have better success getting a job that a non criminal?

(so far everyone on this board ducked that question, which makes me believe that people want to ignore the difficult questions)