Bull, here's what I posted in the economy thread.

I'm beginning to think I don't understand your argument. I honestly want to know your (you yourself, in your own words) hold-up when it comes to sending equipment to Ukraine.

I mean this sincerely. Read below and tell me where you think I'm wrong.

1. You don't want to send equipment to Ukraine because you think it's a waste/lost cause.

Maybe the situation has shifted lately with Russia being more dug in after the latest Ukrainian counterattack that stalled, but Ukraine has showed before that that, when properly equipped, they absolutely have the ability to boatrace the Russians.

2. You think Ukraine is corrupt and will mis-appropriate the stuff given to them.

We have been mostly sending them equipment. While this equipment has a real value to it, I don't believe I've read any indication that this is going on. Ukraine has had issues with corruption in the past and has put effort into stamping it out.

3. You think just sending equipment is a half-measure.

Having just gotten the American military out (for the most part) out of Afghanistan, I (and many others I imagine) are reluctant to turn around and send our troops to trench warfare in Europe. Especially when the military that we would be supporting has already shown the ability to be effective on their own when adequately equipped. I also find this reason to be weird given it's often used interchangeable with the spending argument... sending soldiers would be far more expensive (both in dollars and otherwise). Additionally, Ukraine is not in NATO, so sending troops would be diplomatically tough especially since other NATO countries have yet to send their own troops despite their ever-increasing proximity to Russian troops.

3. We should be pushing peace negotiations vs fighting.

IMO, this amounts to appeasement, and we have more than enough evidence (with Russia specifically as well as other similarly-led countries) to know that it won't work in the long run. Russia started this with Crimea, and we didn't smack them upside the head then and here we are. To borrow a football phrase, there's more than enough tape out there on Putin to know what he's about and what we should expect if we cave to him again. The way I see it, in order to avoid being right back in this same situation a couple years down the line, Russia has to take a clear L and be dis-incentivized to keep messing around in Europe.