I thought the defense looks much improved ... faster, more physical, more energy. The infusion of athleticism and Williams is paying off.

- Peppers also jumps off the screen. I was skeptical of the pick, but he looks like he belongs. Hopefully he keeps improving.

- Garrett had a nice few plays ... he needs to be more constantly disruptive (not just sacks). Most of the game he was one on one ... he has to win those IMO.

- Zeitler with some bad penalties. Gruden even called him out.

- Rod Johnson is not ready to be an NFL player

- Matthew Dayes is ready to be an NFL player. We'll see him a lot.

- Njoku has had a disappointing preseason IMO. Injuries, lack of opportunity, etc ... I still don't know what he's like as a player.

- Did Mullaney play? After last week he was quiet

- There's no doubt that Kizer brings more energy and upside. It's just if we want to risk starting him. Is it worth it? Will he be ruined? Etc. Tough call.

- Brock is just a bad QB. Accuracy is putrid. I don't know if Kizer is ready, but I do know that Brock will never be average ... heck, he might not ever be below average. IMO I don't want to see him anymore.

- We certainly miss Joe, Crow, Bitonio on O.

- Schobert is MUCH improved. Maybe the most improved on the team.

- Do we even miss Shelton when he's out? I forgot about him tonight. I'm not even sure who played on the inside of the line, but it seemed better.

- Kirksey got FOOLED on the play action dump off to Ingram ... that was all on him

- BBC's hit on OBJ was legal ... and had to have hurt ... but not dirty

- Great defensive check by us on the goal line that led to BBC's INT

- Kessler looks like he has gotten worse ... it's like he has no confidence and no ability

- Louis had a nice catch/YAC .. He looks more polished IMO

- JP Holtz is HUGE ... so is Calvin Pryor wow

- Nassib got a TON of reps. He did have some nice disruption, but man, they must want to really look at him.

- Cooper was in with the scrubs ... hmm

- Orchard didn't play did he?

- There's no secret: when the game's on the line, Williams is bringin the house


More to come ...

Winning is better than losing?

2-0 is better than 0-2 no matter how you slice it

+1

Interesting sight. #Browns veteran DL Desmond Bryant still playing late in fourth quarter. Being showcased for trade?
— Scott Petrak ct (@ScottPetrak) August 22, 2017

We've won three of our last four! Whooohoooo! I'm going drinking!

Where the heck are our wide receivers?

I watched a good, solid defense beating the opposing offense, and heard about how badly the Giants offense was playing.

No respect.

I just think they're not very good. Britt and Coleman leave a LOT to be desired as starters. We need to rely on RBs and TEs and 3/4 WRs to make catches

It's almost like they are going to be a problem.

We might want Peppers to play WR too.

I'll agree on Schobert. It'll be interesting to see how they get him on the field.

Orchard was out with a groin.

Complete list of players who sat out is here.

Browns announce players likely out vs. Giants
http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/arti...79-795a8cc91d68

No. Pos. Name
24 DB Ibraheim Campbell (concussion)
26 DB Marcus Burley (face laceration)
34 RB Isaiah Crowell (groin)
35 DB Howard Wilson (knee)
39 DB Ed Reynolds II (knee)
44 DL Nate Orchard (groin)
55 DL Danny Shelton (knee)
57 DL Cam Johnson (knee)
60 OL Gabe Ikard (concussion)
73 OL Joe Thomas (not injury related)
74 OL Cameron Erving (calf)
75 OL Joel Bitonio (knee)
99 DL Caleb Brantley (shoulder)

EXPECTED LINEUP CHANGES:
#78 Rod Johnson starts at LT for #73 Joe Thomas
#77 John Greco starts at LG for #75 Joel Bitonio
#29 Duke Johnson Jr. starts at RB for #34 Isaiah Crowell
#98 Jamie Meder starts at DT for #55 Danny Shelton

Don't we have Josh Gord...forget it.

When Colorado legalized marijuana, he was last seen going down a ski slope in a giant bowl.

Fastest, hardest hitting defense we have fielded since 2001. I believe the Giants receivers before the hit on Odell were looking for defenders.

The defense looked great except for Joe Haden and he was our 4th best corner today.

Brock was overthrowing everything and I wasnt that upset with the tip pick but pressure up the middle and he sailed it high down the middle right at a defender. Thats just absolutely stupid.

Kizer did some good. He held the ball to long at times but yea its probably gonna be him in game 3.

Myles Garrett was doubled, held, tackled.

Schobert is making a name for himself. He once again looked like that guy in Carolina. Its preseason but he flashed often.

BTW Kizer if you are gonna lower your shoulder and run over some one, make damn sure it isnt your throwing shoulder.

Duke should just concentrate on being a slot receiver. I like Dayes better as the RB.

Not a bad showing... a lot of guys who are 2nd and 3rd team got a lot of reps which is good.

+1 good post

I wouldn't be upset with the interception normally, but having passes tipped has been a problem with Osweiler in both Denver and Houston.

Couple thoughts:

Tonight at least, on D they looked fast, ready to hit and aggressive.

Nice to see MG get his first sack. It was a gimme cuz the QB rolled right into the wheelhouse, but still good.

I'd like to keep Kizer on the bench but Brock's inaccuracy is not a positive sign. It's still pre-season though, I'm no hurry to rush Kizer but he flashed

Gonzalez is our new kicker .

Obj is a diva lol. What a puss

Peppers is dangerous on returns . My wife's favourite brown is Cribbs, and I said meet the new Josh. Unbeaten! Lol

Lots of good points already made...I'm a bit surprised how much I enjoy watching our defense...if we can maintain this level of intensity they can keep us in/maybe even win us some games.

Peppers played well, had to pick up some slack on a few plays from a very slow/out of place Haden...

Offense has no flow or rhythm to it
Osweiler is on his 3rd team for a reason
2 Rbs can't carry this offense it's not the 70s or 80s anymore
This offense will easy to defend.

I thought the defense looked fast and decisive.let's not forget it's easy to dial up pressure when the offense can't run the football.
The open field tackling was supurb.
Peppers is good at going north and south with the ball. Put him on offense. Why not ?

Too many penalties again on offense
Osweiler is garbage
Your better off starting Hogan
Kessler is a scout team qb at best

I forgot Schoebert, mourg. He had another solid outing, agree with you. The announcer said Williams asked Joe to shed 15 pounds to get quicker. Maybe to use him as a hybrid? Anyways I thought #53 looked good again tonight.
Hue needs to cover his mouth with the play card thing.

It's no longer about is Kizer "ready"

He's the best QB we have.

Brock is horribly innacurate. Like. Wow.

And why is it that two of our taller QBs (Weeden and Brock) are the ones that always get passes batted down? Heck Seneca Wallace had fewer.

I don't like Duke running up the middle for some reason. Let's leave him in the slot, and give Dayes the backup carries. Kids legit.

I have no idea if we can stop the run because NYG haven't been able to run the ball since Hillis was there.

I'll have to watch the game again with a closer eye on Haden. I was focused more on the trenches. My initial thought is that you're being too hard on Joe with the slow and out of position talk. I don't think he was really given the opportunities to make plays that the other guys did. Different strengths, so asked to do different things.

Brock didn't look great, but he wasn't given much help. Zeitler struggled early and Rod was beat early and often. Duke's pass blocking left a lot to be desired, not sure how much the dinged up wing from the stiff arm played into it.

It's hard to get a feel for how the receivers are doing from the broadcast view. Can't really tell what concepts they are running, or if anyone is getting open that the QB isn't seeing.

The run D overall looked pretty good. Still need to clean up the fits a bit. Schobert was flying around, but he could do a better job of wrapping and he might want to spend some time with the JUGS machine.

Was surprised to see Des Bryant playing in the 4th quarter. Is he on the trade block?

Almost certainly, though I don't see us getting much for him.

Forgot about Haden. He seems to be getting targeted by the QBs pretty consistently ... he looks bad to me.

Also, Britt may have been a mistake signing. Nothing about his play or persona indicates that he'll be a difference maker

Leaves me wondering if next years draft will be spent totally on offense. With our picks, a few key players could possibly make this D one for the records. The 18 draft is going to be crucial for the final push to a possible return to glory.

I don't think after the 18 season we'll be in the top ten anymore. Fingers crossed.

I want your optimism!

Trust me. I have to dig pretty deep to get any!

A ways to go but I think we're teetering on legitimacy. Hue hiring an OC would be a great step.

I remember having that feeling in '07. It really seemed like we were on the up and up.

The pain of being a Browns fan is worse than getting an iffy result from a colonoscopy.

Watching the replay right now, I'm concerned that our front 4 STILl isn't getting enough consistent pressure. I mean, Ogbah really hasn't done anything. I didn't even notice him playing. With the investment in the DE's, we should be able to just send 4 and still get there occasionally

Defense is fun to watch. Putrid offense put up 10 lousy points but we won. Sure, it's a meaningless preseason game, but we won.

Still issues running the ball. Duke is not Crow as a runner. He is not a 3 down back, IMO. Or maybe we do not have 3 down offensive linemen.

Worst case scenario is starting to come together. Even though he is not ready, Kizer is the emerging as the best QB. Starting job is there for Brock to take, but the accuracy was poor yesterday. I still give him the nod in order to give Kizer more time.

Kessler - I am done with him. Gutless. That botched handoff had more velocity than any of his throws. Interesting to hear Gruden be done w a QB. Maybe Mary Kay is next.

Punter looked better.

Peppers with some nice returns.

We are still able to nullify a few good plays a game with penalties.

Positives:

+Schobert was all over the field. Played fast.

+Peppers looks good in return game.

+Collins made a few nice plays.

+Defense is faster.

+Taylor looked good.

Negatives:

=Zeitler had a bad game. And I am not just talking about the penalties.

-Haden is slow.

-Duke is not an every down back.

-DL w/no rush.

-The LT was bad. So was the RT.

Concerns:

*Team took a knee after Hue asked them not to. Lack of respect for coach.

*Brock was inaccurate.

*Kizer holds the ball too long.

*Kirksey was out of position a few times.

*Myles couldn't beat one on one blocking. The sack was on G. Smith. He left the pocket.

*Too many penalties.

When we do it consistently and actually do it against a decent offense, the respect will grow.

We haven't earned ANYTHING, yet.





This defense is going to be entertaining as long as they can avoid the injury bug and bring this intensity through Week 17. It's a long season.

The offense is going to be frustrating to watch; perhaps downright maddening.


We don't have any WR's that show up.

DL gets amazingly little penetration for an attack D that isn't constantly doing the 2-gap "Read-&-React" thing.

Our 2nd string is better than the Giants 2nd string.

Kizer is better than Osweiller, already.... but, he still isn't ready.

You could tell our OL was missing important pieces.

We need receiving targets that know how to run routes and be open in their window.


I expect a slow and bumpy start to the season that picks up steam as these kids grow as a team during the late autumn and early winter. You could see a little bit of it in their faces last night - they're buying in fully, especially on defense. We'll get blown out once or twice, and we'll probably steal a couple of games with defense... I'm expecting some tough lessons for the youngsters in the first few weeks.

Pretty much echo what most said, but a few things for me

JT should have played, not sure how you evaluate your QB missing your best lineman and replace him with probably your worst. Love JT and all, but sorry, he needs reps as well, against a defense like NYG would have been a good time to get them.

We need to find our Greg Williams for offense, I despise Hue as a playcaller, and it wasn't even execution, it was plain bad playcalling.

I'm listening for any and all trade offers for Haden

Duke isn't an 3 down back, he's a 3rd down back. He provides as much resistance as a blocker as a Erving shaped traffic cone. Move him to slot full time and just use Crow/Daye.

I really want Brock to win the job, but man he's not doing himself any favors, Kizer needs to sit, but if they want butts in the stands, they are going to have to either play him, or trade for a bridge QB. We don't have anyone that even looks salvageable other than Kizer, and he has his own issues.

Our defense you can tell is well coached, the offense you can tell are not...

Looks like Gonzo is going to be the kicker, rightfully so, you don't draft a kicker if you don't intend to keep him, and we drafted the best one in FCS.

It's preseason.
The play calling is as much about getting film on various personnel in different formations and situations as anything else. Don't read too much into it.

However, speaking of Hue and his offense - I really dislike all the goofy formation shifts he constantly does. Yeah, I suppose it forces the D to show their hand a bit, but it constantly feels gimmicky and like a Delay of Game penalty waiting to happen.

Gotta get them the ball... Our QB's didn't do a great job of that.

Did the WR's get any consistent separation tonight?

Cause if preaseaon is any indication, looks like we need to draft one or two in the first round next year.

I'm betting that we sign another next offseason and draft two high in 2018 -- we don't have anything on the roster that would make it on most other teams.

LOL..........the WRs are so bad that I didn't even list them under Weaknesses. It's just a "given" that they suck.

jc...

The Browns defense looks to be way ahead of the offense. Just how long it takes for the Browns offense to gel is a concern...makes me wonder what the Browns offense is doing in practice and the classroom.

The QB situation could be a factor in execution as each play is being divided among 2 qbs. Instead of your starting qb running a play 3 times in a row, teaching via repetition, we have 2 qbs splitting time, running a play maybe a twice...not enough reps to learn a play thoroughly, imo.

Hue's idea of naming a QB by tomorrow which should allow one qb getting most of the reps, should help to improve the offensive consistency and the consistency of the qb play.

Are there any basic plays that the Browns offense can run effectively?...any bread and butter run or pass plays that the Browns offense can execute on a consistent basis?

...as I said, the defense is way ahead of the offense..and the offense needs to pick it up a lot, just to catch up to the defense.

...my guess, the Browns offense goes 4 or 5 games into the regular season before they begin to gel. Winning games early is going to be tough..

The Browns best QB is Kizer and if the Browns do not play him, choosing to protect him, it will slow his development and the development of the entire offense.

Osweiler is worse than I thought he would be and Kessler's improvement in the off-season has been minimal.

The way I see it, Hue has to play the kid, doing his best to protect Kizer on the field. Allow Kizer to develop at his own pace and do not throw too much at him, too soon.

j/c:

I think Brock starts Week 1 but I don't know how long that will last. He played poorly last night. Inaccurate. A batted ball. I think he only played a couple of series because (1) the dress rehearsal is Saturday and (2) Hue knows Kizer needs more seasoning.

Kizer looks the part at times but holds the ball too long and has a propensity to fall further back from the line of scrimmage after the snap. Even after 7-step drops if felt like he kept going back. That makes throwing the ball very difficult, obviously, and he needs to work on that.

Duke should never be our in-between the tackles RB but I like his ability everywhere else. I'm interested to see Dayes continue to improve. I think the kid has a chip on his shoulder for being drafted so late.

Love the potential of the defense. Fast. Swarming. Relentless. The McCourty strip was a good example of finishing better than the other player. We'll need the defense to provide a ton of turnovers this season. Peppers was great. I like our d-line for the most part, although the Giants running attack isn't anything to write home about, I thought we did alright. Myles Garret may not always make THE play, but he forces teams to account for him. I can't wait to watch him this season.

Schobert played well. Nassib too.

Zeiter needs to to better. Greco didn't look 100%, but I got to give the guy credit, he came back earlier than may thought he would.

This will sound insensitive but did anyone else think OBJ was a bit theatric in his "injury"?

Looking forward to Saturday night!

a bit, but I just took it as being mad that he took that sort of shot in a preseason game when none of it matters; he also may not have realized that it wasn't a deliberate cheap shot.

I agree, memp...

Beckham knew the cameras were following him toward the locker room and going down to his knees was an effort to get some more face time.

The hit was legal and Beckham can cry all he wants and it will not change that kind of tackle.

A lot of dbs are smaller than the wrs, so taking a wr high is not going to get them on the ground unless a 185# db has help.

I can imagine what Gregg Williams had to say about Calhoun's tackle and Beckham's play acting. That dbs job is to get the wr on the ground, legally..Calhoun did his job!

Yeah, it's been mandated by the league, when tackling a runner or receiver, don't go high. Avoid the upper torso at all costs. He did.

The league also doesn't want DBs hitting guys high because of the head-to-head injury potential.

DBs are in a very tough spot.

Favorite play of the game: screen pass to Vitale; think Kizer's touch on screen passes is great and will be a big part of his game.

Yet had he scored he would have bounced around like it WAS a game with meaning. It's pretty much a game with meaning for guys fighting for jobs. You can't ask one guy to temper his aggression when OBJ would have stuck it in his face had he beat him.

Start kizer week one.

I thought to myself...what a drama queen, put a skirt on him.

i found it interesting that Hue said "No, they're open" when someone asked about WRs not getting receptions. That's all we need to know. He knows all of our QBs are crap.

Our offense is concerning, while our defense is playing good preseason ball.

well coleman was getting open, but where was higgins and them other dudes at?

I really don't know the answer to who is and who isn't open. I do know that Brock was wildly inaccurate 95% of the time and Kizer was wildly inaccurate 50% ... or so it seems

Favorite play of the game was Peppers smack on Marshall near the sideline...I think Marshall got hurt on that play...Peppers hits hard

I don't think OBJ was hurt at all. I think he was mad he took the shot in preseason. It appeared as soon as he knew the cameras were on him he started to act hurt. I doubt he was hurt at all. Diva to the second power.

Until fans stop appreciating flashy hits and start rewarding safe tacking,this kind of stuff will happen.

This wasn't a tackle,it was a hit. Bad fundamentals on the DB, nothing good about this one ,IMHO

Also very sad to see fans that enjoy plays who can easily end the career of a player.

I think it's the right move, but we won't do it because we have the Steelers. If it were anybody else, we'd probably start Kizer.

From what I've seen from Brock, he hasn't changed since last year. He's afraid to go downfield and can't move the ball. Why start him week 1?

'
coaches should PROTECT Duke by leaving him in the slot - he doesn't belong at RB up the middle. I like him a lot, but let Dayes do that as you said, or Duke will be injured half the year.

If you watch any of the training camp videos, they are being taught to tackle this way. Taking out the guys legs is an effective way to bring a larger guy down.

Our D is looking good although we need our young guys to still develop. Our O is another matter. The QB and WR's positions are unsettled obviously. I think our O-line is good with solid depth if we stay healthy there. I feel we are good at RB and are o.k. at TE with further development of those players. With our QB position not settled our O will take longer to gel and will be a work in progress.

I was worried about FS and MLB (and still am to a degree), but I'm more worried about Haden now than ever before

One more thought. With Calhoun and Peppers in the secondary, WRs are going to know that the hit is coming. I love that type of intimidation.

That is true. I also think Taylor has shown the propensity to hit too

Made it to about the 4th quarter. Couldn't take it. Preseason football is horrible.

Can I first drop a giant LOL on ESPN for having a collective stroke because of a legal hit on Odell Beckham? If that was one of our receivers, I don't think that's a talking point, that even as I type this, is being regurgitated on ESPN.

As far as the actual game...

I'm trying really hard not to get caught up in what I see in the preseason. It's not real football. Coaches are holding back schemes on both sides of the ball. It's not the same.

The one thing I will say, is that Deshone Kizer has handled his reps better than the other two have. He has a lot of learning to do, but you can see the potential in him. I think they really did a nice job of drafting this kid, because he fits the mold of what you want your QB to look like, and what you want him to be able to do. 6"4" and 230+, he's got a pretty big frame on him, and you can see the big difference in arm strength from him to Kessler. I really think a few years under Hue (hopefully we don't fire him) and I think he can develop. A lot of argument about sitting/starting him. I don't think you can put a huge blanket on the issue. Some guys don't need to sit and can come in right away. Some guys require time. I think we can bury the 2-3 year sitting plan that for some reason people think is still a thing. If Kizer needs to sit, a half season to a full season is about all he needs. In today's NFL, the QB needs to be out there, learning. Anything else and you are probably just wasting time. Development on the job is how it goes.

I would not be surprised if Hue names Kizer the starter tomorrow. I think that move also buys him more time. You already know you're losing games with Osweiler, why not lose games while developing a young QB with promise.

Brock Osweiler as we all already knew, isn't a starter in the NFL. Cody Kessler isn't either with his arm strength. You can't survive in the AFCN with his arm. It sucks, because I think he has it upstairs, but he's just so limited.

I really think Duke Johnson is going to be a guy that breaks out this year. He's just too talented, and I think we may have something with him and the Crow.

Myles Garrett looks like a load to deal with. We'll see when it's for real against Pittsburgh, but he is going to draw quite a few double teams. You would think when Shelton is back healthy and it his best, with him and Garrett drawing doubles, that other guys should really take advantage, especially in a Greg Williams style scheme. That's where getting a guy like Peppers, even as a nickel can be valuable because of QB's having to get rid of the ball too early/deflected throws, and all the other chaos that happens when a QB isn't comfortable. You have a legitimate threat for someone to return the ball for a touchdown.

Peppers is talented. I never liked him as a corner, but they will have all kinds of areas where he can be a nightmare.

I'm worried about Joe Haden. I just wonder if he's going to ever be as good as he was his first few seasons. Tall order in week 1 as well.

I can't wait to get this last preseason game over with. I don't count the Chicago game because nobody will be playing in that game, and with Ohio State playing the same night, nobody will be watching either. I really can't stand preseason football.

Unfortunately no. I and others have been saying this for several years.

OBJ is one of the biggest stars in the league. No one even knows our wide receivers names.

Shouldn't Beckham have gotten a flag for unsportsmanlike conduct when he took his helmet off when on the playing field ?

Hmmmmm.....I believe so??

Yes...he also through the ball across the field before removing his helmet.

BSPN and cover of our game was really biased and lame. The OBJ "meltdown" when they kept going back with breathless coverage and left the game on the field stunk. Anybody else injured get that? How about Browns are 2-0 after 1-15?

GRuden was entertaining. The other guy dredging up last year, number of QB's, losses in division, and all the other snarky biased comments did not cover the game in front of them and reflect a hard-core bias against the franchise. We screwed plenty of pooches admittedly. How about fair treatment today for a change? Proof here that "Critics are legless men who teach running" is true for ESPN especially and with no good reason.

Just win, baby and shut the moronic "insights" and "anal(yses)" of the haters down. Command respect.

yeah, he should have had two penalties

Since ESPN is being brought up - I just want to say that I'm GLAD that we don't have any more Monday Night games, and I hope we never have another.

That was a painfully horrible telecast to watch and they have effectively ruined what used to be a great part of the football week.

I would seriously rather have watched/listened to Spero Dedes and Rich Gannon.

J/C,
Justin Currie in 22 snaps had
3 tackles, 1 assist (4 combined).
And looked good in coverage, even if his guy made the catch, he did not allow for any YAC.

I hope his ankle won't keep him out too long.

j/c

i also just realized that we'll kinda be on hard knocks next week!

You bite your tongue!

He was waived (with injury designation) today and the number he wore, #36, was assigned to Christian Bryant, newly signed DB.

MNF has been horrible for years. They get shafted with horrible matchups, the commentating crew has been horrible for over a decade, and they constantly shoe-horn in their own network garbage during some of these broadcasts.

I just wish I understood the thought process when these schedulers decide the monday night games. The Sunday night broadcasts get way better matchups, and that's even before the flex options. You see a lot of the big market/crappy teams on Monday nights. The Jets, the Bears, etc.. get national games regardless of how good or bad they have been the last few years.

I might be missing something and true fans overreact, but nothing classy about ESPN brutalizing all things Cleveland and demonizing our fanbase. Do not see this against other teams like they get after us. Because we have had rare success and some epic fails since the Return, we can never be otherwise. Is mockery clever? Insightful? No. Nor is it deserved. Hope this is our time.

Some dolt at ESPN, if one is truly known by his own product, has made unfair Browns bashing something like a core value, a guiding principle shaping coverage and treatment, with stilted bias a peculiar standard reserved for Cleveland franchises. It is wrong IMO.

Wonder why fans of ESPN have left the product? It is the inane and nonsensical programs being foisted on viewers instead of sports. I miss better days when ESPN was better and MNF was a showcase. Not sure what that broadcast was pandering to, but I know what they were biased against. I do not see the payoff for them, unless it is private club fanboy type of coverage. I used to enjoy the NFL more; that has been quite a spell back.

j/c

yeah, Currie was waived today ... so it looks like his injury was significant enough to force him out

Don't like hits by Db's, never did.Its not safe tackling, its playing for highlights.

Specially don't like hits on WR's, I like for Db's to make plays on the ball, try to strip and if they can't to wrap up.

If they are doing this in camp,it will end-up bad...

I couldn't disagree more. As long as football is a contact sport you gonna have BIG collisions. You can take out the leading with the head and targeting the head but other than that the contact will happen and it should.
Now if you wanna make this flag football thwn you have your style of football.

Yes, I seen that, I don't get it. He played bettet then any of our other SS.

He was waived with an injured designation. If no other team claims him, he reverts to our IR list.

Gotcha

Its not about flag football it is about fundamentals. Sound tacking instead of flashy highlight plays that put you in danger and the other player to, and also that take increase the chances of you looking like a fool and give up a big play.

I also think that hitting big someone who is with his feet on the air and unprotected is cowardice and a dirty play, but that's just probably me.