DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Joe Flacco vs. DeShaun Watson 2023

Miami coming here in January sounds like fun.

I agree. I think Joe Thomas called it the middle class. Most teams have 2-3-4 of the really good players. The better teams have a roster with a lot of the "good to decent" type players. Guys who are never going to be HOFers or even multiple pro bowl type players, but guys who aren't going to have any problem playing at a solid level in the NFL over 10 years.

I feel like this is one of the reasons why Pittsburgh is able to pull these games out of you-know-where and stay relevant this long. Their roster is overflowing with these types of guys operating within very stable systems (offense/defense).

^this^

It's also why they routinely beat us down, year after year. With no depth, few true playmakers and wholesale turnover in the FO/coaching ranks every 2.3 years, Browns couldn't even beat mediocre Steelers teams. I remember coming very close to punting this team and never looking back ~10 years ago. When I saw the futility of rooting for a team with no roots, I really lost interest. Today, this team looks the way it does because the Browns did the one thing they'd never done before: stick with something through the growing pains.

Today, the Browns have a stable FO that seems to mesh well with the coaching staff. Professional execution of job duties with no hint of "Go root for Buffalo." In 4 years, this bunch have installed an infrastructure that functions as it should. But it took four years. That 2.3 year average I mentioned earlier isn't made up. I crunched those digits myself when I wrote my first "continuity" screed, years ago. In 2024, we're seeing the difference that 1.7 years makes.

Brownies: stuck in a Groundhog Day/short attention span loop for almost 20 years. Dark times.

That was then. Now is better.


.02

Speaking of which, since Stefanski outlasted Black Monday after his fourth year, that makes him our longest tenured HC since the return, doesn't it? Now he's been in longer than Crennel?

The only place we may disagree is on your 2.3 years theory. I'm not dismissing your math by any means. But I don't think the length of time matters in terms of continuity if you have the wrong people in charge. I don't believe that four years would have made Hue Jackson or RAC or Kitchens a winning HC. At some point, if you have the wrong people in charges you have to pivot. Time won't fix that.

While Stefanski never bottomed out. There were no 0, 1, 2, or 4 game winning seasons. It never appeared to me that the team itself quit on him. No matter all of the noise we heard to the contrary, he kept a steady ship. That's something I hadn't seen before since 1999. I guess to sum it all up I would say that prior to Stefanski what some call the difference in continuity and how Stefanski proves continuity works, I would say that Stefanski proves that continuity only works if you have the right people at the helm. As I said, nobody will ever convince me that continuity would have helped Hue, RAC or Kitchens. If anything that 2.3 year average is too long to waste on the wrong people.

Crennel was from 05 until 08, so he had four seasons

good call

He did... and when I crunched my numbers (way back when), his 4 years actually skewed the Average Life Expectancy marginally better... by a few .10ths of a point.


Our 20- year FO history was abysmal. Tragic. Embarrassing.
I'm still shocked that this many of us have actually held on to share a season like this.

I'm glad I did, no matter how this run turns out.
This season has given me the kind of fun I remember having as a Browns fan before The Departure.

And I get PIT's points, as well- bad management demands upgrades. I should have framed my initial post differently. Here goes:

It's unfortunate for Browns fans that they had to live through 2 decades of wilderness wandering because of ineptitude at the decision-making level. Junior couldn't have cared less about Dad's Pet Project, and 'Flying Pilot Jimmy H' spent 10+ years getting fleeced by hucksters before 76 Berea's s# began coalescing. (I will never forget/forgive Mike 'Golf Cart' Holmgren for how little he did for us).

_________________


The contrast between then and now is stunning.

Back in the 'Good' Olde Days, Sept-Jan was boring, and all the NewzNoiz came from 76 Berea... during the offseason. I remember telling my wife: "You go on ahead, watch 'Days Of Our Lives'... The Browns are MY soap opera." Nowadays, the inverse is true: we hear little to nothing about office drama... and the thrills are happening on the field. As it should be.

It took a lot of competence, dedication, and boring-ass professionalism to reverse decades of bad insertia, but it looks like Our Browns have finally done it.


Dawgs: 4 years of competent consistency (thank you, PIT ) have given us a 5th seed playoff berth, a better than 50% chance to advance... and most importantly of all:

A foundation for future seasons.

That's what makes watching this season so much fun for me. I'm enjoying The Now, while also thinking about next season.

Not scared today.
Not scared about next year.

That is something very new for this long-time Browns fan.
This is fun.
Fun without apprehension.


.02

Nailhead, meet hammer! The confidence felt going into these games is wonderful.

Right, and IIRC he was fired on Black Monday after his fourth season. Since Stefanski survived Black Monday after his fourth season (and is still actually coaching games), he is now officially the longest tenured since the return, right?

[channeling my 'inner Ed McMahon']: "You are correct, sir!"