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Those of you who try to figure out who the Browns might pick in this years draft, here are Holmgren's drafts while in Seattle. Any tips in this info as to what the Browns might do this year?
Passing Rushing Receiving
Rnd Pick Tm Pos Yrs From To AP1 PB St CarAV G Cmp Att Yds TD Int Att Yds TD Rec Yds TD College/Univ
1999
1 22 SEA Lamar King DE 5 1999 2003 0 0 3 16 57 Saginaw Valley State
3 77 SEA Brock Huard QB 3 2000 2003 0 0 0 2 8 60 107 689 4 2 9 48 0 Washington
3 82 SEA Karsten Bailey WR 4 1999 2003 0 0 0 1 19 9 88 1 Auburn
4 115 SEA Antonio Cochran DE 7 1999 2005 0 0 2 18 85 Georgia
5 140 SEA Floyd Wedderburn G 3 2000 2002 0 0 2 12 46 Penn State
5 152 SEA Charlie Rogers RB 5 1999 2003 0 0 0 3 67 1 7 0 Georgia Tech
6 170 SEA Steve Johnson DB
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2000
1 19 SEA Shaun Alexander RB 9 2000 2008 1 3 7 68 123 2187 9453 100 215 1520 12 Alabama
1 22 SEA Chris McIntosh T 2 2000 2001 0 0 1 7 24 Wisconsin
2 52 SEA Ike Charlton DB 4 2000 2003 0 0 0 5 53 Virginia Tech
3 80 SEA Darrell Jackson WR 9 2000 2008 0 0 7 56 123 6 18 0 499 7132 51 Florida
4 116 SEA Marcus U. Bell LB 3 2000 2002 0 0 1 7 45 Arizona
4 119 SEA Isaiah Kacyvenski LB 7 2000 2006 0 0 2 15 100 Harvard
6 175 SEA James Williams WR 4 2000 2003 0 0 0 4 30 1 -5 0 29 410 1 Marshall
6 185 SEA Tim Watson DT 0 0 0 Rowan
6 190 SEA John Hilliard DE 3 2000 2002 0 0 0 6 27 Mississippi State
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2001
1 9 SEA Koren Robinson WR 8 2001 2008 0 1 4 35 96 23 115 1 294 4244 16 North Carolina State
1 17 SEA Steve Hutchinson G 9 2001 2009 5 7 7 65 117 Michigan
2 40 SEA Ken Lucas DB 9 2001 2009 0 0 7 44 133 Mississippi
3 82 SEA Heath Evans FB 9 2001 2009 0 0 0 20 126 162 577 4 50 398 3 Auburn
4 104 SEA Orlando Huff LB 6 2001 2006 0 0 3 20 87 Fresno State
4 127 SEA Curtis Fuller DB 4 2001 2004 0 0 0 3 42 TCU
4 128 SEA Floyd Womack T 8 2001 2008 0 0 3 21 91 Mississippi State
5 140 SEA Alex Bannister WR 6 2001 2006 0 1 0 1 59 9 121 1 Eastern Kentucky
6 172 SEA Josh Booty QB 0 0 0 LSU
7 210 SEA Harold Blackmon DB 2 2001 2002 0 0 0 1 9 Northwestern
7 222 SEA Dennis Norman C 5 2003 2008 0 0 1 14 64 Princeton
7 237 SEA Kris Kocurek DT 1 2001 2001 0 0 0 0 1 Texas Tec
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2002
1 28 SEA Jerramy Stevens TE 8 2002 2009 0 0 1 24 111 199 2174 22 Washington
2 54 SEA Maurice Morris RB 8 2002 2009 0 0 0 21 115 697 2996 7 100 763 4 Oregon
2 60 SEA Anton Palepoi DE 4 2002 2005 0 0 0 5 35 UNLV
3 85 SEA Kris Richard DB 4 2002 2005 0 0 0 3 39 USC
4 120 SEA Terreal Bierria DB 2 2002 2004 0 0 1 6 29 Georgia
5 146 SEA Rocky Bernard DT 8 2002 2009 0 0 3 30 116 Texas A&M
5 169 SEA Ryan Hannam TE 5 2002 2006 0 0 0 6 54 22 215 2 Northern Iowa
5 171 SEA Matt Hill T 2 2002 2003 0 0 0 3 26 Boise State
6 194 SEA Craig Jarrett P 1 2002 2002 0 0 0 0 4 Michigan State
7 232 SEA Jeff Kelly QB 1 2002 2002 0 0 0 0 1 Southern Miss
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2003
1 11 SEA Marcus Trufant DB 7 2003 2009 0 1 6 42 104 Washington State
2 42 SEA Ken Hamlin DB 7 2003 2009 0 1 5 36 96 Arkansas
3 73 SEA Wayne Hunter T 4 2004 2008 0 0 0 1 17 Hawaii
4 110 SEA Seneca Wallace QB 5 2005 2009 0 0 1 10 47 333 556 3547 25 14 54 214 1 4 76 0 Iowa State
4 135 SEA Solomon Bates LB 2 2003 2004 0 0 0 2 17 Arizona State
5 165 SEA Chris Davis FB 1 2003 2003 0 0 0 0 1 Syracuse
6 183 SEA Rashad Moore DT 4 2003 2007 0 0 1 11 43 Tennessee
7 222 SEA Josh Brown K 7 2003 2009 0 0 7 0 112 1 1 36 1 0 Nebraska
7 224 SEA Taco Wallace WR 3 2003 2005 0 0 0 0 4 Kansas State
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2004
1 23 SEA Marcus Tubbs DT 3 2004 2006 0 0 1 10 29 Texas
2 53 SEA Michael Boulware DB 4 2004 2007 0 0 2 15 64 Florida State
3 84 SEA Sean Locklear T 5 2004 2008 0 0 4 23 71 North Carolina State
4 116 SEA Niko Koutouvides LB 6 2004 2009 0 0 0 6 82 Purdue
5 157 SEA D.J. Hackett WR 4 2005 2008 0 0 0 13 42 118 1575 9 Colorado
6 189 SEA Craig Terrill DT 6 2004 2009 0 0 0 7 70 Purdue
7 224 SEA Donnie Jones P 6 2004 2009 0 0 5 0 87 0 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 LSU
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2005
1 26 SEA Chris Spencer C 5 2005 2009 0 0 3 15 54 Mississippi
2 45 SEA Lofa Tatupu LB 5 2005 2009 1 3 4 40 68 USC
3 85 SEA David Greene QB 0 0 0 Georgia
3 98 SEA LeRoy Hill LB 5 2005 2009 0 0 3 23 67 Clemson
4 105 SEA Ray Willis T 5 2005 2009 0 0 0 5 29 Florida State
5 159 SEA Jeb Huckeba LB 0 0 0 Arkansas
6 196 SEA Tony Jackson TE 0 0 0 Iowa
7 235 SEA Cornelius Wortham LB 1 2005 2005 0 0 0 1 8 Alabama
7 254 SEA Doug Nienhuis T 1 2005 2005 0 0 0 0 7 Oregon State
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2006
1 31 SEA Kelly Jennings DB 4 2006 2009 0 0 1 12 62 Miami (FL)
2 63 SEA Darryl Tapp DE 4 2006 2009 0 0 2 16 63 Virginia Tech
4 128 SEA Rob Sims G 4 2006 2009 0 0 1 8 35 Ohio State
5 163 SEA David Kirtman RB 2 2007 2008 0 0 0 0 6 USC
7 239 SEA Ryan Plackemeier P 3 2006 2008 0 0 3 0 43 1 0 0 Wake Forest
7 249 SEA Ben Obomanu WR 2 2007 2009 0 0 0 1 25 16 221 1 Auburn
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2007
2 55 SEA Josh Wilson DB 3 2007 2009 0 0 1 8 40 Maryland
3 85 SEA Brandon Mebane DT 3 2007 2009 0 0 2 13 47 California
4 120 SEA Baraka Atkins DE 2 2007 2008 0 0 0 2 21 Miami (FL)
4 124 SEA Mansfield Wrotto G 0 0 0 Georgia Tech
5 161 SEA Will Herring LB 3 2007 2009 0 0 0 2 36 Auburn
6 197 SEA Courtney Taylor WR 2 2007 2008 0 0 0 1 18 14 136 0 Auburn
6 210 SEA Jordan Kent WR 0 0 0 Oregon
7 232 SEA Steve Vallos G 0 0 0 Wake Forest
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
2008
1 28 SEA Lawrence Jackson DE 2 2008 2009 0 0 1 6 32 USC
2 38 SEA John Carlson TE 2 2008 2009 0 0 1 7 31 106 1201 12 Notre Dame
4 121 SEA Red Bryant DT 2 2008 2009 0 0 0 0 8 Texas A&M
5 163 SEA Owen Schmitt FB 2 2008 2009 0 0 0 0 26 5 21 0 12 50 1 West Virginia
6 189 SEA Tyler Schmitt LB 0 0 0 San Diego State
7 233 SEA Justin Forsett RB 2 2008 2009 0 0 0 0 30 114 619 4 41 350 1 California
7 235 SEA Brandon Coutu K 0 0 0 Georgia
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ web page
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What year was Holmgren relieved of his duties as GM in Seattle? anyway, after that, I'm not sure you can call these drafts his or use them as any indication of what might happen here.
Also, if you wanna look at what might happen, don't you also have to look at Heckerts history?
I don't actually think this gives us much of a roadmap at all to be honest.. to many different factors. Heckert, Mangini.. are just two differences.
JMO however.
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Of course he was the GM for only a small number of those years. That said, for all the QB guru talk that is not an impressive list of QB's. None drafted before 3rd.....
Brock Huard QB
Josh Booty QB
Jeff Kelly QB
Seneca Wallace QB
David Greene QB
Certainly past performance does not guarantee future returns but it doesn't inspire a ton of confidence in our hoping to find a mid round starter.
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Legend
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Quote:
What year was Holmgren relieved of his duties as GM in Seattle? anyway, after that, I'm not sure you can call these drafts his or use them as any indication of what might happen here.
Also, if you wanna look at what might happen, don't you also have to look at Heckerts history?
I don't actually think this gives us much of a roadmap at all to be honest.. to many different factors. Heckert, Mangini.. are just two differences.
JMO however.
daman...after the 2002 season Holmgren was relieved of the GM duties. That doesn't mean he did not have input though.
I was surprised at the number QBs he did draft while in Seattle.
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Input,, sure. I'd bet on it. Control,, I doubt it. Which makes this exercise moot or at the very least, not really valuable in assessing what he might do now. even if he was guy doing the picking now that is..
#GMSTRONG
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We better hope he does A LOT better than this because those drafts pretty much suck and explain the Seahawks demise pretty good...not saying Holmgren is the culprit, since the drafts after 2002 aren't any better than "his"
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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2nd String
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Quote:
Of course he was the GM for only a small number of those years. That said, for all the QB guru talk that is not an impressive list of QB's. None drafted before 3rd.....
Brock Huard QB
Josh Booty QB
Jeff Kelly QB
Seneca Wallace QB
David Greene QB
Certainly past performance does not guarantee future returns but it doesn't inspire a ton of confidence in our hoping to find a mid round starter.
but also taking late round guys shows he was looking for him diamond in the rough more than anything. He had Hasselbeck and Dilfer.
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2nd String
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A better indication would be Holmgrens years as GM and Heckerts years as GM. Mangini was coach but not GM so he has some sway but seeing Heckert/Holmgrens track record is more important
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Quote:
A better indication would be Holmgrens years as GM and Heckerts years as GM. Mangini was coach but not GM so he has some sway but seeing Heckert/Holmgrens track record is more important
x2
Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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Heckert became GM in 2006
2006 1 1 14 14 Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State
2 2 7 39 Winston Justice T USC
3 3 7 71 Chris Gocong DE Cal Poly
4 4 2 99 Max Jean-Gilles G Georgia
5 4 12 109 Jason Avant WR Michigan
6 5 14 147 Jeremy Bloom WR Colorado
7 5 36 168 Omar Gaither LB Tennessee
8 6 35 204 LaJuan Ramsey DT USC
2007 1 2 4 36 Kevin Kolb QB Houston
2 2 25 57 Victor Abiamiri DE Notre Dame
3 3 24 87 Stewart Bradley LB Nebraska
4 3 27 90 Tony Hunt RB Penn State
5 5 22 159 C.J. Gaddis DB Clemson
6 5 25 162 Brent Celek TE Cincinnati
7 6 27 201 Rashad Barksdale DB Albany State
8 7 26 236 Nate Ilaoa RB Hawaii
2008 1 2 16 47 Trevor Laws DT Notre Dame
2 2 18 49 DeSean Jackson WR California
3 3 17 80 Bryan Smith DE McNeese State
4 4 10 109 Michael McGlynn G Pittsburgh
5 4 18 117 Quintin Demps DB Texas-El Paso
6 4 32 131 Jack Ikegwuonu DB Wisconsin
7 6 18 184 Michael Gibson G California
8 6 34 200 Joe Mays LB North Dakota State
9 6 37 203 Andrew Studebaker DE Wheaton
10 7 23 230 King Dunlap T Auburn
2009 1 1 19 19 Jeremy Maclin WR Missouri
2 2 21 53 LeSean McCoy RB Pittsburgh
3 5 17 153 Cornelius Ingram TE Florida
4 5 21 157 Victor Harris DB Virginia Tech
5 5 23 159 Fenuki Tupou T Oregon
6 6 21 194 Brandon Gibson WR Washington State
7 7 4 213 Paul Fanaika G Arizona State
8 7 21 230 Moise Fokou LB Maryland
I feel like rounds 4-7 are more luck if you get a good guy. Most of those guys to me should be on your team for a few years but you dont expect starters. But in rounds 1-3 thats where you see if they are a good drafter cause those guys SHOULD impact the team
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Hey Mourg.... What ever happened to our boy " Max Jean-Gilles G Georgia " ? I thought he would develop into something special ! Wanted him real bad in that draft ..
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Quote:
We better hope he does A LOT better than this because those drafts pretty much suck and explain the Seahawks demise pretty good...not saying Holmgren is the culprit, since the drafts after 2002 aren't any better than "his"
Not a whole lot to be encouraged about, that's for sure.
One thing I noticed. When looking at both his and Heckerts drafts, if you make a trade and can get a good player for a 4th rounder, it seems the odds are in your favor that you made a good deal, despite if you only get a couple of good years from the traded player.
Barry Bonds Check
Roger Clemens Check
Mark McGuire Check
Lance Armstrong Check
71-79 Steelers Taboo
(Lets pretend it didn't happen.)
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Quote:
Input,, sure. I'd bet on it. Control,, I doubt it. Which makes this exercise moot or at the very least, not really valuable in assessing what he might do now. even if he was guy doing the picking now that is..
I agree with you Damon.
But I do believe a HC does get input as to "what he needs" in a draft to help turn the team around.
That being said, both at Green Bay and at Seattle, MH's two past HC positions, in both cases, their second available pick was used on a QB.
In G. Bay they had two first round picks. The latest one being the #19 pick which G. Bay traded to Atlanta for Favre.
In MH's first year at Seatlle, they only had one first round pick but had no second round pick. So that "second draft pick" that was a vailable was their third round pick.
Where my biggest disagreement with macs post is that he was building a team and as such, his prioritieq changed as the team progressed. So to me, only the first year Green Bay daft when he went there and his first year Seattle draft are truely relivant on how he may approach the draft here in his first year.
In both cases, whether he actually made the call on who was drafted, I do find it odd that the second available pick in both these drafts were used on a QB IMO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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Break down of top 3 rounds of Heckerts Drafts
Bad:
Victor Abiamiri DE Notre Dame(started 5 games last season, seems to just be a back up)
Tony Hunt RB Penn State(back up for two years, now out of NFL)
Trevor Laws DT Notre Dame(back up on team, hasnt started in two seasons)
Bryan Smith DE McNeese State(one eagles for one season where he didnt play, got cut and is now a back up on the jags)
Undecided:
Winston Justice T USC(started last season once shaun andrews got hurt and recieved 4 year contract this season)
Kevin Kolb QB Houston (not a starter til last year but its his job now)
Stewart Bradley LB Nebraska(awesome as starter in 2008, was on IR all of 2009)
Good:
Chris Gocong DE Cal Poly(til he was traded to us)
Brodrick Bunkley DT Florida State
DeSean Jackson WR California
Jeremy Maclin WR Missouri
LeSean McCoy RB Pittsburgh
So two guys were awful and not on the eagles, two are back ups, three could show that they are good this year and five were good picks.
Thats a 8 outta 12 that were hits. and another two that are still on the team. That looks pretty solid to me.
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Quote:
We better hope he does A LOT better than this because those drafts pretty much suck
Ditto Heckert. 
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Didn't look at Heckert's, but those drafts that mac posted ... underwhelming.
Just get a franchise QB. That's all I ask. I don't care how we do it, just do it.
Once we have a franchise QB in place everything, and I mean everything, will start looking better.
It all starts with the QB.
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Quote:
I was surprised at the number QBs he did draft while in Seattle.
Mac - I am not surprised one bit at the number of Qb's. MH is a Bill Walsh disciple. Walsh believed that you should draft a Qb in each and every draft. Not high of course but always looking for a developmental guy late. Always have a cheap backup but hoping to find that diamond in the rough.
Don't blame the clown for acting like a clown.
Ask yourself why you keep going to the circus.
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I think you guys need to put drafts into perspective. It seems that you believe that teams get 2-3 starters or high quality players in every draft. Before I would judge Heckert's or Holmgren's drafts, I would have to see what other teams like Pitssburgh or New England did in the same drafts. Or what the average is of hits and misses using all the teams in the NFL.
It is too easy to look at a draft from one team and suggest it was bad, but how about comparing it to all the other teams drafting that year. Sometimes it is a case of there just not being a lot of good players in that particular draft. Other times teams are set at most positions and draft picks sit the bench behind very good veterans for a couple years.
To me, trying to compare their drafts to what might happen this year is a waste of time. Call it peeing in the wind.
#gmstrong
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Quote:
Quote:
I was surprised at the number QBs he did draft while in Seattle.
Mac - I am not surprised one bit at the number of Qbs. MH is a Bill Walsh disciple. Walsh believed that you should draft a Qb in each and every draft. Not high of course but always looking for a developmental guy late. Always have a cheap backup but hoping to find that diamond in the rough.
jest...Can the Browns afford to take their time, drafting a QB in a later round, hoping to develop him into our future starter?...
...IMO, no, the Browns can't afford to wait past the 3rd round.
I believe there is a sense of urgency within the franchise to solve the QB issue, "long term". Delhomme appears to be a two year fix as the Browns starting QB, "IF" he can recover from last season's disastrous performance.
Here is Holmgren's record of QBs drafted since 1999, while in Seattle...
Brock Huard..........1999, 3rd rd...99-04, backup...
Josh Booty ...........2001, 6th rd...01-03, 07, backup...
Jeff Kelly...............2002, 7th rd...02-03, backup...
Seneca Wallace....2003, 4th rd...03-10, backup...
David Greene........2005, 3rd rd...05-08, backup...
Holmgren's most recent history shows that waiting to pick QBs in the later rounds, produces "backups". The Browns do not need another backup QB.
The Browns have the best QB Holmgren drafted while with Seattle, Seneca Wallace.
I believe the Browns will draft a QB in the 1st round, if Clausen or Bradford are available at #7.
I would be a little surprised if the Browns wait past the 2nd round to fill our need for a future starter, with Colt McCoy or Tebow in the 2nd round.
If the Browns do not draft a QB in the 1st or 2nd rounds and if Dan LeFevour is still available when the Browns pick in the 3rd round, he could be Holmgren's choice to fill our QB needs.
One scenario that is not talked about much is the possibility that the Browns target a backup QB already on a roster that shows promise. There is also a possibility that the Browns plan to wait until next season to address the QB position.
IMO, the sooner the Browns address our #1 need, the better.
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All Pro
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He also traded fro C Frye as well.
I think he's found some real gems but he's also taken many shots to find them.
They key is that only on Farve did he use a first round pick (#19) but he's found others with value lower.
Agreed to previous poster that those drafts are underwhelming.
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just clicking...
In fairness to Holmgren, after he brought Hasslebeck to Seattle in 2001, Holmgren was not drafting for a starting QB.
Holmgren's first year in Seattle, he did draft Brock Huard in the 2nd round, who did not develop into much...then he traded for Hasselbeck and helped to develop him into an outstanding QB.
This year, IMO, the Browns are looking for a starting QB for the future. I'm going to be surprised if they do not draft Clausen or Bradford in the first round, should they be available at #7.
If the Browns wait until the 2nd or 3rd round to draft a QB, it will depend on who is still available.
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Forums The Archives 2013 NFL Season NFL Draft (2013) Holmgren's last 10 drafts..what
will he do this year?
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