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Cleveland Browns' Mike Pettine hopes to avoid starting a rookie QB and would like to draft one later than No. 4 http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ss...#incart_m-rpt-1CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer might be able to breathe a little easier heading into next week's NFL draft. Coach Mike Pettine stressed Tuesday that he hopes to avoid starting a rookie signal caller and that ideally he'd like to draft one later than the No. 4 overall pick. "I've never felt that if you draft them high that you have to start them right away,'' Pettine said on the first day of veteran minicamp. "You can make a mistake there and I've been a part of both (starting them right away and waiting). I think it's extremely difficult to come in out of a rookie camp and some (organized team activities), a mandatory camp and a training camp and all of a sudden be ready to be a starter in the NFL. "I think that's a rare guy that can handle that and he has to have a great supporting cast in order to do it, so it's something you hope to avoid because I think you can set that player back and set your team back. We're in the 'win now' business and as history has shown, it's very difficult to do with a rookie quarterback.'' Pettine, who's been studying the likes of Johnny Manziel, Derek Carr, Blake Bortles and Teddy Bridgewater, has been with teams that have thrown their rookies into the fire and others that have waited, and he's come to the conclusion that patience is a virtue when it comes to inexperienced quarterbacks. He was with the Ravens in 2003 when former first-round pick Kyle Boller started right away and struggled, and was still there in 2008 when Joe Flacco was third coming out of training camp as a rookie, but was pressed into service because of injuries. Flacco, buoyed by the league's No. 2 defense, led the Ravens to the AFC Championship Game as a rookie and made the playoffs each of his first five seasons, including a Super Bowl victory in 2012. Pettine was in New York when Mark Sanchez led the Jets to the AFC Championship Game in each of his first two seasons despite some shaky performances and was ultimately released this offseason. Last year, he was in Buffalo when the Bills were forced to start EJ Manuel because of Kevin Kolb's concussion, and Manuel, who missed five games with a knee injury suffered against the Browns, went 4-6. "When you look at the history of the league whether it was (Tom) Brady or whether it was Aaron Rodgers, or Carson Palmer (they waited),'' said Pettine. "Even Russell Wilson sat for a little bit and (Colin) Kaepernick was a package player his first year.'' Pettine acknowledged that his preference for sitting rookie quarterbacks will impact the Browns' draft strategy next week and that in a perfect world he'd bypass one at No. 4. The Brown have scouted quarterbacks from all tiers of the draft, including probable mid-rounders Aaron Murray, AJ McCarron and Connor Shaw. "That’s been a big part of the discussion in the draft room,'' Pettine said. "That’s a position that we know we’re going to need to address, and you talk about where you’re going to do it and the impact that it’s going to have on the rest of the team. "Certainly it’s an ideal situation if you can get that quarterback later in the draft and that way you’re drafting a position player at four. But we’re in the business of staying true to our sequence, that if our fourth-best player or somebody rated above that is there at the fourth pick that we’ll feel comfortable turning the card in regardless of what the position is.” If Pettine isn't trying to throw other teams off, Hoyer appears to have the inside track to start this season.
Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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Legend
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Legend
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Pettine sounds like he gets it. Let's hope he can now follow through with what he believes.
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2nd String
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2nd String
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Russell Wilson started from day one so I am not sure what he means that he waited a bit.
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Hall of Famer
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wilson wasnt named the starter. He came in as the 3rd QB and ended up clearly beating out the other 2.
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Hall of Famer
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"I've never felt that if you draft them high that you have to start them right away,'' Pettine said on the first day of veteran minicamp. "You can make a mistake there and I've been a part of both (starting them right away and waiting). I think it's extremely difficult to come in out of a rookie camp and some (organized team activities), a mandatory camp and a training camp and all of a sudden be ready to be a starter in the NFL.
I like that. It's a tough PR sell for the homers and casual fans, but that has been my fav scenario for this offseason. Draft a QB at 4 or after a little trade down or at 26, whatever. Then let him truly compete with Hoyer and only if he's really better than the vet, like Wilson was, let him start.
Bortles would be a good selection in this scenario. Carr probably too. Not sure you could pull it off if you select Bridgewater or Manziel though. Teddy's selling point is his readiness, so if you sit him and lose early, you'll have a PR nightmare and bust murmurings, especially after his ProDay media saga.
Manziel will be a PR nightmare regardless and could become a distraction, even if he himself toes the company line (which is doubtful enough), but there will "Manzielles" everywhere among fans. He's the only QB in this class that has this sect-like following already, it'd get ugly. Just another reason to stay away from him at 4 or as our 1st pick. If we can gamble on him later? Sure do it, but not as "the face of the draft and franchise"
#gmstrong
"Players come along at different points in time" - Ray Farmer
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 70,636 Likes: 510 |
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"I've never felt that if you draft them high that you have to start them right away,'' Pettine said on the first day of veteran minicamp. "You can make a mistake there and I've been a part of both (starting them right away and waiting). I think it's extremely difficult to come in out of a rookie camp and some (organized team activities), a mandatory camp and a training camp and all of a sudden be ready to be a starter in the NFL.
I like that. It's a tough PR sell for the homers and casual fans, but that has been my fav scenario for this offseason. Draft a QB at 4 or after a little trade down or at 26, whatever. Then let him truly compete with Hoyer and only if he's really better than the vet, like Wilson was, let him start.
Bortles would be a good selection in this scenario. Carr probably too. Not sure you could pull it off if you select Bridgewater or Manziel though. Teddy's selling point is his readiness, so if you sit him and lose early, you'll have a PR nightmare and bust murmurings, especially after his ProDay media saga.
Manziel will be a PR nightmare regardless and could become a distraction, even if he himself toes the company line (which is doubtful enough), but there will "Manzielles" everywhere among fans. He's the only QB in this class that has this sect-like following already, it'd get ugly. Just another reason to stay away from him at 4 or as our 1st pick. If we can gamble on him later? Sure do it, but not as "the face of the draft and franchise"
Personally, I agree with letting/forcing a QB to sit for 1-2 years (especially if the current starter is capable). However, I also believe this scenario is virtually impossible in Cleveland (especially if we draft Manziel). With every loss/bad possession/bad decision by Hoyer, we'd be hearing about a change.
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Dec 2006
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Sounds like an invite by the Browns to entertain offers to trade out of the #4 draft slot.
Home of the Free, Because of the Brave...
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Hall of Famer
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OP
Hall of Famer
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http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf...t_river_defaultCleveland Browns in 'win now' business is why they hope quarterback Brian Hoyer can start -- Terry Pluto CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Do the Browns need a rookie quarterback? Yes. Does he have to start? No. In fact, Mike Pettine prefers to open the season with a veteran under center -- and that makes sense. A lot of sense. As the Browns coach said after Tuesday's minicamp: "(Starting a rookie quarterback) is something you hope to avoid because I think you can set that player back and set your team back while we are in the 'win now' business. As history has shown, I think it's (win now) very hard to do with a rookie quarterback." The Browns are in the "win now" business. While intentionally keeping the definition of "win now" vague, the goal obviously is to step out of that 5-11, 4-12 ditch that has trapped the franchise for the last six years. Pettine also talked about how he was part of teams where Kyle Boller, Joe Flacco, E.J. Manuel and Mark Sanchez started as rookies. It's very obvious he'd prefer to postpone some of the growing pains (and early losses) by putting the ball in Brian Hoyer's hands to open the season. Quarterback Brian Hoyer returns to practice for the Cleveland Browns after ACL injury last year Cleveland Browns quarterback Brian Hoyer returned to the practice field on a limited basis during day-one of their voluntary veterans minicamp in Berea. Hoyer has been cleared to participate in everything but 11-on-11 team drills. Everything is always subject to change. Hoyer is making an excellent recovery from ACL surgery, but he's still coming back from major knee surgery. It was uplifting for the Browns to see him moving well and not wearing a brace during some of the drills at Tuesday's practice. Two years ago, Matt Flynn was supposed to be the starter for Seattle. The Seahawks picked Russell Wilson in the third round -- and he won the starting job by the end of training camp. No one with the Seahawks saw that happening on draft day, or even when camp opened in 2012. So it's possible a rookie starts for the Browns. But don't bet on it, even if the Browns grab a rookie quarterback with one of their two picks in the first round. General Manager Ray Farmer and Pettine are both rookies in their current jobs. But they have been in the league for a long time. They also weren't asleep when the team president Joe Banner, general manager Mike Lombardi along with coach Rob Chudzinski were all fired after one season with the Browns. They know what Owner Jimmy Haslam wants -- a team that is competitive. That's why four of the nine veteran free agents signed to contract are at least 31 years old. The two most expensive acquisitions are Karlos Dansby (32 years old) and Donte Whitner (28 but in his 10th NFL season). Receiver Nate Burleson (32) has played 12 years. Offensive lineman Paul McQuistan (31) has played nine years. The goal is to put a legitimate NFL team on the field right now. And that's why Farmer has brought in veteran quarterbacks Vince Young and Tyler Thigpen for tryouts this week. It's why they may look at other experienced quarterbacks this season. And finally, it's why they are hoping Hoyer can be a viable NFL starter. That way, when they do draft a quarterback -- he will not be forced into action right away. As Pettine said, "We're in the 'win now' business." Seldom does that happen with a rookie under center.
Blocking those who argue to argue, eliminates the argument.
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Legend
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Legend
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Quote:
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"I've never felt that if you draft them high that you have to start them right away,'' Pettine said on the first day of veteran minicamp. "You can make a mistake there and I've been a part of both (starting them right away and waiting). I think it's extremely difficult to come in out of a rookie camp and some (organized team activities), a mandatory camp and a training camp and all of a sudden be ready to be a starter in the NFL.
I like that. It's a tough PR sell for the homers and casual fans, but that has been my fav scenario for this offseason. Draft a QB at 4 or after a little trade down or at 26, whatever. Then let him truly compete with Hoyer and only if he's really better than the vet, like Wilson was, let him start.
Bortles would be a good selection in this scenario. Carr probably too. Not sure you could pull it off if you select Bridgewater or Manziel though. Teddy's selling point is his readiness, so if you sit him and lose early, you'll have a PR nightmare and bust murmurings, especially after his ProDay media saga.
Manziel will be a PR nightmare regardless and could become a distraction, even if he himself toes the company line (which is doubtful enough), but there will "Manzielles" everywhere among fans. He's the only QB in this class that has this sect-like following already, it'd get ugly. Just another reason to stay away from him at 4 or as our 1st pick. If we can gamble on him later? Sure do it, but not as "the face of the draft and franchise"
Personally, I agree with letting/forcing a QB to sit for 1-2 years (especially if the current starter is capable). However, I also believe this scenario is virtually impossible in Cleveland (especially if we draft Manziel). With every loss/bad possession/bad decision by Hoyer, we'd be hearing about a change.
I hope that Pettine and Farmer have t he courage of their beliefs. If they do, they'll do what the think is best regardless of what the fans want.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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wilson wasnt named the starter. He came in as the 3rd QB and ended up clearly beating out the other 2.
Yup. Huge difference between being handed the job and going out and winning the job.
How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?
#gmstrong
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Cool, neat, awesome.
How many times do we have to hear this before we stop believing it in the off season?
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Hall of Famer
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"Certainly it’s an ideal situation if you can get that quarterback later in the draft and that way you’re drafting a position player at four. But we’re in the business of staying true to our sequence, that if our fourth-best player or somebody rated above that is there at the fourth pick that we’ll feel comfortable turning the card in regardless of what the position is.”
Music to my ears.
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,398 Likes: 280 |
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I like that. It's a tough PR sell for the homers and casual fans, but that has been my fav scenario for this offseason. Draft a QB at 4 or after a little trade down or at 26, whatever. Then let him truly compete with Hoyer and only if he's really better than the vet, like Wilson was, let him start.
Bortles would be a good selection in this scenario. Carr probably too. Not sure you could pull it off if you select Bridgewater or Manziel though. Teddy's selling point is his readiness, so if you sit him and lose early, you'll have a PR nightmare and bust murmurings, especially after his ProDay media saga.
Manziel will be a PR nightmare regardless and could become a distraction, even if he himself toes the company line (which is doubtful enough), but there will "Manzielles" everywhere among fans. He's the only QB in this class that has this sect-like following already, it'd get ugly. Just another reason to stay away from him at 4 or as our 1st pick. If we can gamble on him later? Sure do it, but not as "the face of the draft and franchise
I generally agree with you but you don't draft an inferior QB because it might be uncomfortable to draft the better QB and have to sit him on the bench for a year. It might make you temporarily unpopular (especially if the starter struggles or if the starter gets hurt and you go to the #3 guy) but if 2 years later the guy is really good, nobody is going to care or remember that you sat him.
The key is to make sure ownership is on-board with your plan.
yebat' Putin
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Dawg Talker
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All this talk about bringing in Derek Carr, Aaron Murray, AJ. McCarron, and Bortles is starting to get me a little depressed.
I sure hope Farmer and Pettine really understand what it takes for a QB to succeed in the NFL.
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Legend
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Legend
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All this talk about bringing in Derek Carr, Aaron Murray, AJ. McCarron, and Bortles is starting to get me a little depressed.
I sure hope Farmer and Pettine really understand what it takes for a QB to succeed in the NFL.
At 4, that might be all that's left ...Then what?
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Legend
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Legend
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All this talk about bringing in Derek Carr, Aaron Murray, AJ. McCarron, and Bortles is starting to get me a little depressed.
I sure hope Farmer and Pettine really understand what it takes for a QB to succeed in the NFL.
Well, since Pettine was talking about what would happen in " a perfect world", I'm not ready to jump the gun. We all know that there is no "perfect world".
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Practice Squad
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http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf...t_river_default
Cleveland Browns in 'win now' business is why they hope quarterback Brian Hoyer can start -- Terry Pluto
CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Do the Browns need a rookie quarterback?
Yes.
Does he have to start?
No.
In fact, Mike Pettine prefers to open the season with a veteran under center -- and that makes sense.
A lot of sense.
It seems to have made sense to every regime we've had come in here. The big problem is, the regimes never stick with the veteran for long because they either stink or they get hurt. Take a look at this list of starters at QB with how many games they started:
2013 Jason Campbell (8) / Brandon Weeden (5) / Brian Hoyer (3)
2012 Brandon Weeden (15) / Thad Lewis (1)
2011 Colt McCoy (13) / Seneca Wallace (3)
2010 Colt McCoy (8) / Jake Delhomme (4) / Seneca Wallace (4)
2009 Brady Quinn (9) / Derek Anderson (7)
2008 Derek Anderson (9) / Brady Quinn (3) / Ken Dorsey (3) / Bruce Gradkowski (1)
2007 Derek Anderson (15) / Charlie Frye (1)
2006 Charlie Frye (13) / Derek Anderson (3)
2005 Trent Dilfer (11) / Charlie Frye (5)
2004 Jeff Garcia (10) / Kelly Holcomb (2) / Luke McCown (4)
2003 Kelly Holcomb (8) / Tim Couch (8)
2002 Tim Couch (14) / Kelly Holcomb (2)
2001 Tim Couch (16)
2000 Doug Pederson (8) / Tim Couch (7) / Spergon Wynn (1)
1999 Tim Couch (14) / Ty Detmer (2)
Detmer was the vet until OOPS! he's hurt. Throw Couch in!
Couch is the starter OOPS! he's hurt. Throw Pederson/Wynn/Holcomb in!
Garcia is the starter OOPS! he's hurt. Welcome back, Holcomb and McCown.
Dilfer is the starter OOPS! he sucks. Throw in Frye!
Frye is the starter OOPS! he sucks. Throw in Anderson.
Anderson is the starter OOPS! he sucks. Throw in Quinn, Dorsey, and Gradkowski.
Let's flip a coin to see who starts between Quinn and Anderson. OOPS! they both suck.
Let's bring in two veterans! OOPS! Delhomme and Wallace get hurt. Throw in the new kid McCoy.
Let's draft Brandon Weeden! OOPS! he sucks and gets hurt, let's bring inBrian Hoyer OOPS! he's hurt, let's bring in Jason Campbell OOPS! he sucks.
*sigh*
I hope we have a plan beyond Hoyer, who I like, because odds are, we're going to be starting him and at least another one to two QBs. We average 2.33333 starters per year since 1999. That's crazy.
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Legend
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Legend
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Detmer was the vet until OOPS! he's hurt. Throw Couch in!
Man I think that's incorrect.
Detmer didn't get hurt the first year here. He opened the season and we got trounced by I think Pittsburgh.. The next game the FO panicked and put in Couch who started until he got hurt and Detmer took over again.
The following year, Detmer did get injured and missed the entire year.
That's the way I remember it and that's the way it's listed on Wiki..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Dawg Talker
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All this talk about bringing in Derek Carr, Aaron Murray, AJ. McCarron, and Bortles is starting to get me a little depressed.
I sure hope Farmer and Pettine really understand what it takes for a QB to succeed in the NFL.
At 4, that might be all that's left ...Then what?
Trade Out!
Take a position player like Sammy or Mack
Trade Out!
Trade Out!
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All Pro
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All Pro
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I'm all for BPA and trading-out or trading-down.
But we need a franchise QB. We can't pass on our top QB and settle for our 3rd or 4th rated QB.
If we don't see The MAN in this draft, I seriously hope we make trades to get another 2015 1st rounder. We will need the ammo.
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The more of Carr I watch, the more I'm on board with that pick, if it's the direction we go....
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Hall of Famer
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Well I'm on the opposite side of the coin .. The more I watch the more I have to say , please no ...  ..
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Forums The Archives 2014 NFL Season NFL Draft 2014 Cleveland Browns' Mike Pettine
hopes to avoid starting a rookie
QB and woul
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