DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Who Goes First Jimmie?

I agree.

What puzzles me is that many people want Farmer and/or Pettine replaced, but the question remains, who replaces them?

If someone is a great GM or coach, they probably already have a job. So no matter who you bring in, there is no guarantee of success.

There are good people waiting for a job every year. Bruce Arians could never get hired as a head coach (to the point where he almost retired). He was the interim coach for the Colts, wins coach of the year, and is now probably a top five coach in the league.

John Schneider, the Seahawks GM, is considered to be one of the best in the league. Never was a GM prior to taking the Seahawks job.

Between the NFL and college there are dozens of qualified people. You just have to find the right person.

Very true, but nothing you said refutes what I said.

Neither of those guys had a track record of guaranteed success before landing their positions.
That was my point. Changing for the sake of changing doesn't guarantee you will find the right person. So until you hire and give them a chance, you won't know.

Right, but once a person has been hired and you have seen the fruits of their labor, you determine whether they are good or not.

(I am not saying that Pettine and Farmer are bad.)

You can't not fire people because you don't know what the next person will do. If that was the case no team would ever fire anyone (or anyone in any profession).

Agreed.

And you also can't fire people without having an idea of who you want to replace them (And a realistic chance of hiring them), that you at least think might be an improvement.

You can't not fire people because you don't know what the next person will do. If that was the case no team would ever fire anyone (or anyone in any profession).

You also can't hire unproven people that you know are going to have to grow into the position a little and then fire them after 2 years because they didn't have immediate success...

I am willing to give Pettine more time than most. But if he wins four or less games this season, he probably isn't going to be successful.

Sometimes, doo-doo occurs and you're just going to have a bad go of things due to circumstances out of your control.

When you look at the turnover in coaching and FO's since our return, if you had other options would you want to come here?

i am sure farmer pointed that out to haslam when he was saying pettine cannot devolope young talent.

When did Haslam say this?
oh, nevermind... you're making a funny

i am sure farmer pointed that out to haslam when he was saying pettine cannot devolope young talent.

Note to self: don't feed the trolls.

We have GOT to stop being such a knee-jerk reactionary organization.

No doubt. But not because he likes soccer.

Wow! How your perspective has changed in such a short time.

You're part of the majority, though. The sad thing is that you guys have been wrong..........consistently.

WTF are you even talking about?

I've been preaching about not being knee-jerk for YEARS. Where have you been?

He was suspended.

Muffy looks engaged.

Which one is "Muffy"?

Eh.... I don't think you can just look at the win total. You have to look at the context of the record. We have GOT to stop being such a knee-jerk reactionary organization.

Sometimes, doo-doo occurs and you're just going to have a bad go of things due to circumstances out of your control.

Daman, your post highlights the reasons why we absolutely have to play Johnny.

Why going with McCown is not a plan.

How Pettine will not be successful without a QB.

How we can't really judge Pettine without a QB.

How the Browns should be doing everything during the week to bring Johnny along instead of allowing McCown to take away valuable reps and prep time from him.

Hell, if Pettine thinks Davis is a better long-term prospect than he should be doing everything he can to be preparing Davis to get in the games.

36 year old perennial loser McCown is not a plan.

The Browns should not fire Pettine after this year. He should get more time. But if he hangs himself with his own rope, it will be hard to feel sorry for him.

And that is currently what Pettine is doing. He's hanging himself with his own rope. He's in way over his head. He wants to be liked and respected too much by his players in the short-term. He's not capable of making long-term decisions. He has admitted he doesn't feel that is his job. He's a prisoner of that awful catchphrase "play like a Brown". He's forced to play try hard guys and cut guys with more potential so he can stand by his word. He makes awful statements like "availability is your best ability".

Mike Pettine is a week to week coach. The players are week to week players. But the fans of the Cleveland Browns deserve a long-term plan and a long-term winner. They deserve a coach who has the cajones to carry out a long-term plan.

Pettine is hanging himself and I hate it. I don't want to start over again. But we don't have a plan. When you don't have a plan, the results are going to be bad. Pettine is going to end up getting himself fired.

NO, it doesn't highlight why Johnny should be starting.. Not even close.

What it highlights, if you were paying attention, is that even a HALL OF FAME Coach like Noll could have issues making the final decision based on "WHAT HE SEEs and WHAT HE FEELS"

Saying that Johnny should start just because a case could be made that Bradshaw should have started is just plain off base.

Based on Hindsight, of course, sure, I get it. But in that moment, clearly, Noll didn't think that Bradshaw was the answer. I remember him beating on Bradshaw in the press back then...

You know, it could be that what Noll was doing is setting Bradshaw up. Terry was a "wild child" back in those days. I mean, seriously, the NFL was the wild west and Bradshaw was a bit of a wise mouth kid.

Maybe, JUST maybe, Noll was teaching him. Kinda like what MIGHT be going on with Johnny Manziel.. I certainly don't know that.. no way to know that. But it's possible.

Of course, BTTB will now come on here and tell me I'm clueless but won't answer any questions.. Just insult me, and others. Can't wait to hear what Vers will say... after all, I didn't disrespect Farmer.. so I must be wrong.