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Legend
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Nothing good ever comes from folks not 'staying in their own lanes.'
In ANY profession.
I can't imagine what bad mojo It'd create if our CEO (who has no background in music performance) started telling the Music Director how to rehearse, perform concerts, or tell him who should be playing the solos. The very idea is hysterical. (no- I mean that literally. I'm actually laughing my azz of as I type this!).
This Schiener stuff is bugging me more than the 'Farmer In The Filmroom' soap opera story arc that ran through last season. At least I could envision a reason for a GM- ANY GM- to be in film, as long as he's simply observing how his draft picks are doing. But some suit-wearing non-football business exec-type trying to dictate to a Field General? Yeah... nothin' stupid about that.
Like I said in another thread.... it's gotta be in the Berea water supply.
Division of labor exists for very good reasons. Ignore the wisdom & logic behind its premise at your peril.
"too many notes, not enough music-"
#GMStong
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Sorry, but I no longer read every thread on the board. I just don't have the desire to do it anymore. The Refs moved it, so it's all good in the end.
Thanks for pointing it out though.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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Legend
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Yikes. They are wasting Andrew Luck. Yep.
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Legend
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I could have sworn I posted this--or a very similar--article on the Colt's fire OC thread??? Ray sent a text to the Ref's here demanding that your post get deleted 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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Legend
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You know what's crazy? I think Schiener was part of those meetings w/the coaching staff and Farmer last year, too. I think those meetings pretty much blew Shanny's mind.
I think a lot of people didn't want to deal w/the reality of the situation last year because they were so hopeful that this regime was the right one. I get that. We all need hope. Heck, even when I am blasting a player, coach, GM, or owner....I am hanging onto the hope that my instincts are wrong.
But, it's pretty mind-boggling to think about. It's probably hard to come to a real consensus. And whomever has the ear of the owner probably indirectly dictates what is going to happen.
We have had similar situations at school. Our principal didn't like any complaints from parents. I would send home weekly progress reports to the parents instead of just the typical interim [or midterm] report and quarterly report card. Parents who heard about this would ask why other teachers were not doing the same thing. We had many similar types of things going on, and this is just one example, but we would all be asked to meet with "The A-Team" and come to a consensus. You can guess what happened. The losers were my students and their parents because I was no longer permitted to send home the weekly progress reports.
You might enjoy this one, Clem. "The A-Team" consisted of the principal, the assistant principal, the guidance counselor, and the curriculum director. I dubbed some of us as belonging to the "F-Troop." Do you remember that show?
What's my point? Too many voices and unclear roles rarely leads to production. It leads to dysfunction and disharmony. Power struggles are in vogue and resentments run high.
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Yeah, I figured that is what happened.
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Legend
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We aren't the only dysfunctional team: Tonight, WTHR's Bob Kravitz wrote a pretty damning piece on Ryan Grigson that is very much worth your time. In the piece, sources described Grigson as a "terrible meddler" to Kravitz. Again, you should read the piece, but there are several examples that Kravitz uses to show just how terrible things have become because of Grigson. It was Grigson who insisted that running back Trent Richardson play despite weight and performance issues, with the reasoning being that Grigson wanted the trade (in which he gave up a first round pick) to look better. Similarly, Grigson insisted on keeping Josh Cribbs as the team's return specialist last year despite some struggles. Furthermore, Grigson has really undermined Chuck Pagano's player discipline, not allowing him to enforce things like the coach wants to. One example is with Billy Winn, who was late to some meetings - Pagano wanted to discipline him but Grigson overruled the coach and wouldn't let him. The undermining of discipline led to a source telling Kravitz that "the culture here now is the worst I've ever seen it." And then lastly, Kravitz says that offensive coordinator Pep Hamilton was "forced on Pagano" and that everyone in the building knew that Hamilton reported to Grigson, not to Pagano - despite Hamilton coaching on Pagano's staff. There are more, too, but that's all Kravitz was told.
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Hall of Famer
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#gmstrong
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all that dysfunction, yet they still in the last game for the playoffs.
while we sit on the couch...again.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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~ Legend
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Who would have thought there was a GM who loved Browns players more than the Browns. After reading the piece I felt like 'the other woman'. Trent Richardson, Billy Price, Josh Cribbs, Chud, and DQ? My God.
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I wonder how well Cleveland's record would be playing in the AFCS rather than AFCN. Having six games against Texans, Titans, and Jags vs Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens.
Cleveland could have four or five more wins this year giving them near 8 wins. Funny, enough wins winning the South!
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I wonder how well Cleveland's record would be playing in the AFCS rather than AFCN. Having six games against Texans, Titans, and Jags vs Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens.
Cleveland could have four or five more wins this year giving them near 8 wins. Funny, enough wins winning the South! Are we better than the Jaguars?
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Dawg Talker
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I wonder how well Cleveland's record would be playing in the AFCS rather than AFCN. Having six games against Texans, Titans, and Jags vs Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens.
Cleveland could have four or five more wins this year giving them near 8 wins. Funny, enough wins winning the South! Are we better than the Jaguars? I think they are equal, so I am unsure. Do you think Cleveland has a better chance beating Jags or Ravens twice this season? Beginning of the season is your answer still the same?
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Legend
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I wonder how well Cleveland's record would be playing in the AFCS rather than AFCN. Having six games against Texans, Titans, and Jags vs Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens.
Cleveland could have four or five more wins this year giving them near 8 wins. Funny, enough wins winning the South! Are we better than the Jaguars? I think they are equal, so I am unsure. Do you think Cleveland has a better chance beating Jags or Ravens twice this season? Beginning of the season is your answer still the same? I definitely agree that the South is weaker. I just think that we are also really, really bad and really, really bad teams lose most of the time.
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Dawg Talker
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I wonder how well Cleveland's record would be playing in the AFCS rather than AFCN. Having six games against Texans, Titans, and Jags vs Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens.
Cleveland could have four or five more wins this year giving them near 8 wins. Funny, enough wins winning the South! Are we better than the Jaguars? I think they are equal, so I am unsure. Do you think Cleveland has a better chance beating Jags or Ravens twice this season? Beginning of the season is your answer still the same? I definitely agree that the South is weaker. I just think that we are also really, really bad and really, really bad teams lose most of the time. Semi agree. Name the AFCS power teams. I think Colts and Texans are a step above but not by a lot. If Cleveland had a legit FO, they dominate that conference. Think about it. If Cleveland had similar FO to say any team in the AFCN, Cleveland rules with par talent. I think the Jags maybe on track. Colts dump Pagano they join Cleveland being dysfunctional. Colts, perfect example owner, HC, and GM not on same page.
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Legend
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I wouldn't want to be in the same division as Andrew Luck for the next decade. Especially because they are going to have their pick of whatever coach they want.
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I wouldn't want to be in the same division as Andrew Luck for the next decade. Especially because they are going to have their pick of whatever coach they want. I don't consider a future Luck an equal to Brady. Luck is a good QB. A rock solid defense I think can rule the roost assuming a functional offense unlike Houston.
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Hall of Famer
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We aren't the only dysfunctional team: Tonight, WTHR's Bob Kravitz wrote a pretty damning piece on Ryan Grigson that is very much worth your time. In the piece, sources described Grigson as a "terrible meddler" to Kravitz. Again, you should read the piece, but there are several examples that Kravitz uses to show just how terrible things have become because of Grigson. It was Grigson who insisted that running back Trent Richardson play despite weight and performance issues, with the reasoning being that Grigson wanted the trade (in which he gave up a first round pick) to look better. Similarly, Grigson insisted on keeping Josh Cribbs as the team's return specialist last year despite some struggles. Furthermore, Grigson has really undermined Chuck Pagano's player discipline, not allowing him to enforce things like the coach wants to. One example is with Billy Winn, who was late to some meetings - Pagano wanted to discipline him but Grigson overruled the coach and wouldn't let him. The undermining of discipline led to a source telling Kravitz that "the culture here now is the worst I've ever seen it." And then lastly, Kravitz says that offensive coordinator Pep Hamilton was "forced on Pagano" and that everyone in the building knew that Hamilton reported to Grigson, not to Pagano - despite Hamilton coaching on Pagano's staff. There are more, too, but that's all Kravitz was told. The three players mentioned in that article by name were all brought into the league by Cleveland.
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Legend
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Legend
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We aren't the only dysfunctional team: Tonight, WTHR's Bob Kravitz wrote a pretty damning piece on Ryan Grigson that is very much worth your time. In the piece, sources described Grigson as a "terrible meddler" to Kravitz. Again, you should read the piece, but there are several examples that Kravitz uses to show just how terrible things have become because of Grigson. It was Grigson who insisted that running back Trent Richardson play despite weight and performance issues, with the reasoning being that Grigson wanted the trade (in which he gave up a first round pick) to look better. Similarly, Grigson insisted on keeping Josh Cribbs as the team's return specialist last year despite some struggles. Furthermore, Grigson has really undermined Chuck Pagano's player discipline, not allowing him to enforce things like the coach wants to. One example is with Billy Winn, who was late to some meetings - Pagano wanted to discipline him but Grigson overruled the coach and wouldn't let him. The undermining of discipline led to a source telling Kravitz that "the culture here now is the worst I've ever seen it." And then lastly, Kravitz says that offensive coordinator Pep Hamilton was "forced on Pagano" and that everyone in the building knew that Hamilton reported to Grigson, not to Pagano - despite Hamilton coaching on Pagano's staff. There are more, too, but that's all Kravitz was told. The three players mentioned in that article by name were all brought into the league by Cleveland. So you're saying our team is so crappy, that we are now getting people on other teams fired?
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Not sure what the implication is. Just an observation.
But when a crappy team decides it no longer wants a player ... buyer beware, I guess.
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Legend
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IF Pettine is fired and IF Pagano is fired.....does anyone see Pagano as a legitimate HC in the league and a possible candidate here?
It seems like he has gotten a raw deal in Indy.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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2nd String
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Wow this sad,firm I worked for-Spancrete Northeast inc-I did shop production and design drawings for the 2 remodel/repair/addition phases of Fawcett Field. Also involved in erection inspection for fit of of beams and seating walks.
I bleed Seal Brown,Burnt Oranage and White w/Chrome. It's a proud honored birthright and family tradition.
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Legend
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Not sure what the implication is. Just an observation.
But when a crappy team decides it no longer wants a player ... buyer beware, I guess.
One other thing - A sympathize with Luck. I said this kid was going to become damaged goods getting hit like no other QB in the league. What a Shame...
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off!
Go Browns!
CHRIST HAS RISEN!
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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i feel you.
but man....Luck even without getting hit throws a TON of interceptions.
maybe he's damaged goods, or maybe he isn't durable?
wilson gets smacked all the time, yet he hasn't missed a snap.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Legend
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and there we are, tied for 1st.
and seattle right behind us.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Legend
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and there we are, tied for 1st.
and seattle right behind us.
Obviously playcalling, how long the QB holds the ball, and how bad the offensive line is all contribute to how much the QB gets hit.
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yes,
but i'm not arguing that. i'm arguing durability.
looking at your links, wilson doesn't get hit as often as luck. but he's still been getting smacked.
the offensive line, if we want to use that part, has fell off from last year in seattle. now, is it as bad as the colts? no, but he's still been hit for 3rd overall in the league.
using the other part, holding on to the ball, wilson holds on to the ball a lot as well.
so the only thing that i will say luck is screwed at is playcalling. i don't think this year the OC put him in a good enough situations to not only win, but not get killed.
but my thing is durability. i'm just glad Luck isn't RG3 fragile, or they'll be a big problem.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Luck was durable for three years. My guess is that the accumulation of hits finally got to him.
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Hall of Famer
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Not sure what the implication is. Just an observation.
But when a crappy team decides it no longer wants a player ... buyer beware, I guess.
One other thing - A sympathize with Luck. I said this kid was going to become damaged goods getting hit like no other QB in the league. What a Shame..."Buyer beware" does not mean never consider the goods
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