DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum College QBs to Watch

I wasn't on this board yet, but in the '14 draft, Carr was my guy. It broke my heart when, with Carr still on the board, they traded up to get JFF. My first 3 picks (2-1st rd, 1-2nd) were Mike Evans at 4 (I was fine with the trade back to 9, Beckham was still there), Carr at 26, and Hyde with the 2nd round pick. I can't help but notice how much better those 3 players are doing than those we did pick.

My thinking, as of this moment, is Cook over Lynch because Lynch, while I absolutely love his size and skill set, will need time to develop, while Cook is closer to being able to step into an NFL starting role. If we are willing to park Lynch on the sidelines while JFF/Davis run the team for a year, then I would be more willing to roll the dice on Lynch. But this is Cleveland, and I don't see the discipline of leadership necessary to draft a QB with a top 5 pick then give him time to develop.

Rosen UCLA True Freshman
Browning Washington True Freshman
Mangum BYU 35 year old Freshman
Rypien Boise State True Freshman

All starters.

Seen many of them play in High School.

Have seen a number of games from each one this year.

Each one plays in pro style offense.

I like all four.

The one I think is the best...

Rypien

I broke down his game against Utah. Early in the game he threw an out from the far side hash. My eyes bugged out and I nearly jumped off the couch. It may have been the best throw I've ever seen a college QB make.

Has anyone ever seen him take a snap from under center?

At this point, Goff is my favorite.

Sonny Dykes runs a pure spread system. I would be shocked if Goff has anymore than a handful of under the center snaps.

Always love talking draft w/you, bonefish. You are one of the few honest posters on here. I will always have your back.

Btw------you were all over Mariotta last year. I was not. Thus far, you are looking to be right. Nice job.

Do you remember when we were discussing the draft before we took TRich and Weeden? We had some very good conversations. Those were good times.

Ive seen Rosen play in High School. He has a certain "it"

I think if he threw as consistently as Rypien he would be much better.
I also think Rypien's footwork is better.

Whether Browning or Mangum could play pro, that isn't clear.

Yet

The more I read about Cook, the more I'm feeling certain that he's the guy.
He plays under center, makes complex NFL-level reads, has good size, plenty of arm, small windup, quick release, makes good decisions.... he has the physical aspects you want to see in a QB, and he has the football mind to go with it.

My only questions would be the personality concerns raised in this thread, and I would want to look a little deeper into his completion percentage. It seems strangely low, but I don't know the reasoning behind it. I've seen him described as accurate, so it seems strange that this would be the issue. Does he throw it away a lot? Are there a lot of drops? Of those things, the personality worries me the least.

He can be accurate, but he is also erratic. He misses high w/too many throws, although he's been better w/that this year.

From what I've seen, Cook is extremely inconsistent.

So, it's something that would probably be fixable with coaching?
Probably a footwork or release point thing?

That's an acceptable risk, I think, especially when you factor in the TD:Int ratio..... he may miss, but he does it safely.

I don't know. I really haven't studied him enough to make an intelligent evaluation. I have watched him quite a bit, but I would need to watch a lot more of him to give a proper evaluation.

The accuracy thing has bothered me, though. To me, not throwing accurately is a huge no-no for qbs. It's like WRs who drop a lot of passes. I never saw the sense in going after a WR who drops a lot of passes and I never understood going after qbs who were inaccurate.

With that said, perhaps the games I watched him play were disproportionate in regards to his accuracy issues. I am not putting a final grade on him. I'll have to watch more. I just know that I heard how great he was and when I watched him last year, I was dismayed by how many throws were high.

I heard a local guy on the radio saying he thought it was a big deal that Cook was not voted a team captain even though he's a 3 year starter, and a senior. I don't know if it is or not, but it would seem to be.

Unless the guy saying it is one of his teammates, I wouldn't put too much stock into it at all without deeper research. It's strange because it is atypical for the position, but it doesn't automatically mean that it's a negative.


I'd imagine that teams & scouts will spend a lot of time talking to his teammates - both the younger ones and the seniors - as well as the coaches to get the real scuttlebutt.

According to this article, the Browns have already met with his high school coach at Walsh Jesuit HS, so its good to know they're doing their "due diligence" ...

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000...-qb-connor-cook

Like we did with Manziel?
And Gilbert?
And West?
And Gordon
And ...

No. He has a great QB coach and won't get any better from here. He's peaked.

I think the spread thing is a bit overblown. If a guy is good he will figure things out quickly (Mariota).

That's certainly a possibility. The thing is, it has to be a very intelligent and football smart QB.

So while it can be done, I believe it takes a certain type of QB that you simply just can't find anywhere. Which means the odds are longer.

It's a possibility, but his comment lacks understanding of the position.

You just don't "figure it out quickly." LOL It's this........"you just don't know."

Some guys can read coverages post-snap and some never will. You don't teach post-snap reads of coverages. You teach pre-snap reads.

It's tough w/Spread qbs because there is no film on them ever having to make post-snap reads. Thus, you DO NOT KNOW if they can or not.

It's the sort of thing where it isn't a learning curve so much as it is a learning Cliff. Additionally, I'd say that it is more akin to learning chess than math or how to structure a sentence.... and that means that either the prospect's mind is geared toward being able to learn it, or it might just be something they'll never quite get as well as someone else.

So, when you do come across a prospect that has been doing it and performing well with it for a number of years, that has some very real value that separates him from the others. It answers a LOT of the typical unknowns that you'd face with a QB prospect.

1st, I agree that Goff should stay in school.

2nd, I seem to remember someone posting an analysis a few years ago on some criteria for college players to predict success in the pros. One was number of games started. Another was completion percentage. I don't remember the number of games started cut off but for completion percentage I seem to think that was over 60%. If any one can find it, that would be great to review.

3rd, just because a qb is running a pro style offense and taking snaps under center, it doesn't mean that he is reading coverages or going through progressions more than a qb running the spread.

I remember that report. I believe it came out right before the Manziel draft.

It was even before that. And # of games started was 42.

That number eliminates virtually any and all Junior's.

I'm a Cook guy and starts is a big reason why, among other solid things he has including excellent QB size.

Watch him more Vers. He does look off the Safety. He does go through progressions. His OL and WR's stink.

It's the Parcells rules you're referring to.

Okay.......thanks.

Bill Parcells' rules for drafting a QB:

1. The quarterback must be a senior... because you need time and maturity to develop into a good professional quarterback.

2. He must be a graduate... because you want somebody that takes their responsibilities seriously.

3. He must be a three-year starter... because you want to make sure his success wasn't a fluke and to know that he has been "the guy" for a significant period of time.

4. He must have 23 wins... because big numbers don't mean a whole lot if you don't win.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2011/2/3/1972396/bill-parcells-rules-for-drafting-a-quarterback


There's another rule, made up by a Sports Illustrated writer named John Lopez, called the 26-27-60 Rule. The rule goes like this:

If an NFL prospect scores at least a 26 on the Wonderlic test, starts at least 27 games in his college career and completes at least 60 percent of his passes, there's a good chance he will succeed at the NFL level.

Quarterbacks who passed all three aspects of the formula include Peyton Manning, Phillips Rivers, Eli Manning, Drew Brees, Tony Romo, Matt Schaub, Kyle Orton, Kevin Kolb, Matt Ryan, Ryan Fitzpatrick and Matthew Stafford.

Players who failed at least one part of the formula includes Ryan Leaf, Joey Harrington, Michael Vick, Akili Smith, Tim Couch, Daunte Culpepper, David Carr, Vince Young and JaMarcus Russell. Sam Bradford was the only quarterback in last year's draft that aced all three in the formula with Colt McCoy coming up one point short of the Wonderlic. Tim Tebow and Jimmy Clausen also failed the Wonderlic portion.

And with any simplistic formula, there's always exceptions like Brett Favre, Donovan McNabb, both of whom scored below 26 on their Wonderlic scores. Matt Leinart played over 30 games, scored a 35 on his Wonderlic and completed over 63% of his passes.

http://www.cincyjungle.com/2011/2/2/1970455/the-26-27-60-rule-a-formula-for-drafting-quarterbacks

FWIW, Connor Cook will meet all of Parcells' rules when he graduates. When he opted to stay in school last spring one of his stated reasons was to get his degree.

He falls short on the 26-27-60 rule, due to only 58% completion pct (plus we don't have his Wonderlic score yet).

Those "rules" are so outdated, it's crazy.

Connor Cook got hurt.

So that is why he is sitting..did they say what was the injury?

He got clocked and landed on his shoulder awkwardly.

FYI.

Memphis (8-1) at Houston (9-0) at 7 pm EST on ESPN2.

I really enjoy watching Lynch play quarterback. I hope he comes out this year and I hope we take him with the number 1 overall pick.