DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum A stat that is telling about the state of the franchise.

I looked back at the Browns last 13 loses dating back to 2014.
in 5 of those games they have lost by less than a TD.
every other game(8) the Browns have loss by more than a TD.
In the 8 losses in 2015 the Browns have lost by 14 points or more.
In its last 4 games
Rams 18
Cards 14
Bengals 21
Steelers 21.
the average margin of loss of the Browns since 2014 is 13 points.
that is the hard truth.
yet some of you want to see Farmer on board for another couple years?
based on what?
the numbers don't lie.

We are headed in the wrong direction based on those #'s. But we already knew that didn't we?

want a stat lol

188 penalty yards
15 yards rushing

Yeah, but didn't you guys tell me that Flip was going to make us a strong running team and the moves by Farmer would help us stop the run?

How's that working out for you?

You obviously are wanting to pick a fight with someone today but I am not in the mood. You can go back to praising the Greatest of Shannahan without interruption.

2002 and 2007 are the answers..

the question? what years since 1999 have the Browns been at or above .500 for a season?

I think I am starting to get the idea that a magic pill for us does not exist...There is plenty of blame for all...how about everyone in the organization work as a team and collaborate toward 1 common goal - including who we draft?

Didn't Pett just say that everyone was on the same page with all the draft picks?

i can say this from a coaching perspective...

You can motivation a player to get the best out of them and they will play at a high level. These players are not playing their best football... not even close.

This team looks so irritated that they stopped caring and have becoming indifferent. I am starting to think the talent is there and the mental aspect of football has destroyed this team.

Excellent point, mac. One that I don't believe anybody has mentioned before...

Your numbers tell the story.......

This is a coaching issue. We are out coached and out schemed. This team is not devoid of talent. Trust me. That is why teams are calling about certain players. This is about using the talent you have in creative ways. Our head coach is trying to put round pegs in square holes. He is rigid, and not adjusting his system to his talent. This is why the defense is so bad. Remember, Mike Pettine is supposed to be this defensive guru ( I still haven't seen it.) The Browns have a X's and O's issue on both sides of the ball.

There are two agendas here... the front office who buys the groceries and the coaching staff who makes the meal. The groceries are okay...as other teams would take these same players and make a fine dish. We have a bad cook in the kitchen. Remember, it was Pettine who wanted Gilbert.... and we all know who wanted Johnny (JH)...... The other draft picks aren't worthless. In regards to our FA, the front office doesn't choose which players play..... Pettine doesn't play players who have an "attitude". This is why Bowe has been on the bench all year, and why Tate was traded. He doesn't know how to manage difficult players. Good coaches know how deal with difficult personalities and motivate those who are less inclined to follow along. We don't have that...and until we do, we will keep losing. Mike Pettine has lost the locker room and the respect of the team.

I disagree and posting cliches in an attempt to blame the coaching staff is what happens when fans overestimate the talent on the team.

There were a few of us who tried warning people before the season that this team was seriously lacking in talent, but folks did not want to hear it and instead resorted to name calling.

It sucks when reality sets in because then there is the need to distribute blame by using the old pegs and holes theory. LOL.........because if only we had a square scheme, guys would automatically get faster and stronger.

Vers, I agree that it is primarily a talent issue, but coaching and scheme do fall in to play. That said, I would rather keep Pet another season and give Farmer his walking papers.

Coaching is certainly part of the problem, but just look at what I was responding to. The guy blamed it all on the coaching and said the talent was good.

Weve see what some of these guys can do. Trouble is were having them do other things this yr. Thats coaching, and I'll have to disagree with Peen, For whatever reason, the players have lost repect for Pet, which means he's just a lame duck now.

Ouch. Gives us a couple ideas of where to start.

I will give a example of how its more of a lack of talent than coaching.
look at the Baltimore Ravens.
John Harbaugh didn't forget how to coach overnight and what made him a good coach.
the Ravens have coordinators with resumes of success.
yet they are losing to teams like the Jags and Browns.
simply put the Ravens are losing the talent battle on Sundays.
especially at the skill positions of impact like WR, CB.
sometimes a lack of talent can hamstring what coaches coordinators can do on Sundays.
very few Browns could start for a current playoff team or a team in the playoff hunt.

Bademosi is a pure special teams player and you have him covering one of the best receivers in the league with no help over top? Might aswell have Kruger and Bryant covering wide receivers in the open field. Wait we have already been there done that.

I dont give a rats ass about Gilbert's attitude, Bad is the worst corner on this team. These moves we see on defense are just stupid!!

The coaching is so bad that I dont know what we have personnel wise. Its like using a 3/4 inch socket on a 1/2 inch bolt and blaming the socket for not working lol

There's a "square peg/round hole" similarity there but I can't quite put my finger on it, or in it. LOL

Pick any team that is over .500... how many of our starters could start for those teams?

I can think of 2 or 3 that would start for most of them or get a lot of playing time for those teams, a handful that would serve as useful back-ups or rotational players on those teams.. and some that would probably be cut immediately.

Its not about cliches. When you have guys who were pro bowlers on your squad, its not a talent issue. You also have two QBs putting up great numbers. But when you continue to get beaten in scheme and refuse to make an adjustment, it is a coaching issue. Do we have great depth? No. But we are far better off than we have been in years. Our issues are about a failure in execution of X's and O's. Our LBs are repeatedly out of position, allowing us to be gashed for long runs. We are also almost always in ) protecting, leaving average CBs on an island for a long time without a sufficient pass rush. Our highly regarding OL is calling the wrong blocking scheme vs defensive fronts. Last year, our OL was making holes and moving piles. This is all coaching......

When everyone from the GM to the HC, the OC and the DC are all a bunch of rookies at their jobs, I don't really know what people expected would happen.

Thirteen is a weird number? Why thirteen?

"When looking at losses, we usually score less points than the other team. That's a stat."

Yogi...is that you?

you wanna know another ugly stat?

since 99, we've picked within the 1-10th position....10 times, not including picks where we traded back from.


oh yea, one year, we didn't have a pick until the 4th round.

Agreed. How can the talent disappear in one year? Especially when the same guys are there? I think the coaching and schemes must be so bad that nothing can overcome it. We need a reboot at coaching.

Infamous Beau Bell lol

What really bothers me is that week after week we see the same issues and nothing improves at all. You go back to the Jets game. QBs play well. Defense cant stop the run nor the pass. OL playing like crap. No run game. here we are 10 weeks later and its the same thing and you get the same answers.

No reason for dramatic changes. We arent there yet. We will watch film and evaluate blah blah freaking blah. When asked about Oneil, its we came up together we are on the same page more of the same. I want Pet to give us a reason not to want this thing blown up and he apparently believes mroe of the same will produce better results.

What talent?

I agree with Vers, What talent are we talking about, Common sense and the trade deadline tells the story of how much talent is on this team! We have 1 guy believe it or not 1 guy on this team that a couple of other franchises were willing to take a look at and possibly trade for. That its not 1 other individual was seriously even talked about! To me that speaks volumes about the talent or lack of talent on this team! Back in the day how many franchises would have taken Kosar, Mack, Byner, Dixon, Newsome, I can go on and on. However the fact and question still remains to be 2 questions? Is it lack of talent that we have? Or is it lack of good coaching that we have! Unfortunately if its
the players we restructure the front office! or if its the front office we rebuild the team! During the Steelers game last weekend I found myself not really glued to the TV because its honestly embarrassing to watch a "Professional Football Team" look worse than a High School Varsity Football team! Rant over thanks:

I would have gotten rid of Farmer after the Texting incident ... JMHO

"Ray's smart,'' Haslam said. "He works hard. I think he understands football. He's been in football all his life. He relates extremely well to players. He knows it not only from a personnel standpoint but how a game should be managed.

anyone who thinks pettine will stay and farmer will go are just fooling there self.

Farmer has already covered Haslam's arse for the Manziel pick so he is not going anywhere. There is no way Farmer wanted Manziel. I don't care how many lies they want to tell.