DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The Running game.

These showed a lot. Good post that was a hard read for a homer fan.

I am discovering a few common threads getting up to bye week. Listening to Pett, watching losses (some were games in name only), seeing us erode, and seemingly unable or refusing to fix stuff that helped us lose, i.e., losing in the same way over and over again, it was like Groundhog Day stuff.

We repeat the same stuff, the official line, and it just isn't so. We will be smash mouth, we will run on anybody, graduate level defense, just a few little things to fix, we will play whoever gives us a best chance to win, we won't play people who don't practice well, etc.

At bye week, my takeaways are these: We cannot or will not change, and our adjustments are poor or worthless; talk is cheap and we spend it freely; our run game is poor and deteriorating and we seem clueless as to fixing it; what we say and what we do seem worlds apart; plays are not chosen for there effectiveness (Ouija and dart boards might explain it better) because lousy plays are repeated and we don't often revisit what works; it is hard to determine what we are good at, if anything; enough pressers do not create a win, nor do they excuse losses; and, I do not trust the judgment and decisions from the results I see. We place a premium on something which doesn't work well here with this group. We play stupid pass coverage and place a premium on coverage skills of linemen who can't find an edge with both hands.

We are deep into the hoopla; we don't needed meetings, committee work, groupthink at this point. Pettine needs to demand something different and better. Schemes need toughened. Run. Tackle. Just can't trust them to try different. Seems all about individuals, not unit, not scheme, not game plan. Heartbreaking isn't strong enough.

Well, below is a list of issues I have with our running game.

1. Not committed enough to running the football. Even when we've been in games and had the lead coming out in the 2nd half we didn't run it. This made me mad and is just plain dumb and a moron move.

2. Why are we not running a zone blocking scheme like last year? Because we don't have Shanny? I would think Flip\Wilbert Montgomery should at least know what the system is and maybe how to run it. Ask the players about the scheme and if they think its worth it moving to that system again. Don't just shove your scheme down their throats and not adapt to the players strengths. This is probably the stupidest thing you could do.

3. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE decide on a running back and stop this committee crap that we keep seeing. Pick someone and be done with it already, it looks foolish and I hate it.

4. Use the fullback the way a full back is supposed to be used. If our current one is not good enough get another one.

5. Run the I formation, that is all.

Well, why would we want a really good OC when we have Farmer and Scheiner to tell the OC who to play and what plays to run?

We hear about everything except those things of which we do not hear.

How can you possibly know that we hear about everything? Because they want people to know that they're trying? Riiiight. That's why we often hear thing like, "We tried to sign so and so but he didn't want to come here". And then there's the frequent, "We were never able to get into a dialog with so and so because he didn't want to talk to us".

Do we ever hear about misses, failures and negatives from the FO? I don't remember much of that.

They are not using Malcolm Johnson enough!

The Malcolm Johnson, and Isaiah Crowell backfield, is not being used enough.

And that is likely on purpose, because Malcolm Johnson is a horrible lead blocker. Horrible. After Owen, Oby, Johnson, that other dude I can't even remember his name and etc etc - we'll seemingly never be able to find a decent fullback, one that isn't getting pushed backwards when they meet opposition in the trenches.

Wow Eotab, you really think holes aren't being opened due to the TE's and FBs more so than the line? 10% line, 90% TE/FB as to the blame?

Interesting. I think I need to start watching Jim Dray and Barnidge when I see them blocking in there. Maybe your on the money. I know your right about FB, but I thought out TE's were both decent blockers (this, of course, is excluding Housler) but maybe it was an assumption that was bad on my behalf!

If that were the case, the coaches would pull the TE's for extra O lineman called eligible.
They'd call plays with pulling Guards, pulling tackles, and we'd see running success.

I don't think it can be that simple.

Yep......he is gone. I think that is all but a given now. I really hope Irving lives up to what the FO thought of him, but even if he does we will have basically a rookie making line calls next year......not good. I hope Cam get's to at least play next to Mack the rest of the year so he can see how he goes about his business.

Good catch, eotab!

Only thing I'll miss from Mack is the handoff. Very rare do we have bad snaps causing fumbles.

Other than that... deuces. He's not worth the money he's making.

If he doesn't want to be here than so be it. From what I have read he is not playing well and a lot of it could be his attitude not just the injury. We can be 2-8 without him too. There is no way to go but up IMO.

It's all opinion, but I am pretty tired of reading about how Mack is not playing well. He is playing well.

We are going to lose a very good player and replace him w/a guy who plays too high, is very weak, and reaches w/his hands instead of playing w/good technique and driving w/his legs.

I'm sure there will be tons of posts to come about how Mack was overrated and Irving is all that.

Mack has always been overrated but with that said, before his injury last year, he was playing at the highest level possible for a center. He was really bad early on. He has improved but he is no where close to where he was before the injury and is average. With average play and a high priced contract, I dont see him getting more money anywhere else than what he will get under his current contract.

If he leaves it will be because he really just wants out of this place. I dont think money will be an issue.

Farmer has made a lot of mistakes, but to me his number one mistake is the way he treats/views/negotiates with our own players. Successful franchises draft players and develop them and retain them. Farmer seems like he's allergic to retaining quality, home grown players. He engages in game playing like "allowing the market to set their rate". Insulting.

Of all the things people complain about with Farmer, this to me is his worst transgression.

We may or may not lose Mack. Everybody is ASSUMING he will leave which he has not said in public or even in private to team mates as far as I know.

Yes we are making assumptions. But at this point, I'd be much more surprised if he was a Brown next season than not.

I don't get to watch the Browns much so a lot of information I get about them is on this board. One friend at work asked me why I don't get NFL ticket so I can watch them every week and I replied I'm going to pay good money to get upset every week. Not worth it. But I feel I do get a lot of good info here and also on msn fox sports espn and the Browns website.

We've known Mack was gone since the minute he signed that contract.

It would be so Browns for us to not replace Mack with Erving (the guy we drafted in the first round to replace Mack).

Exactly. Was there any doubt?

Well

Then

What

Did

I

Type

Between

These

Lines?

I mean if you can read between lines you must know

I also recall that earlier this year Greco was getting reps (traning camp?) at OC. Although I see the rationale with drafting Erving as Mack's replacement should he leave, perhaps we need Greco's game experience until Erving is up-to-speed...

I think Farmer drafted Irving to replace Mack and Thomas lol

If that is not Browns, then drafting a guy who has never played guard in the first round with the goal of having him play guard in the future is very Browns.

Conclusive evidence about our running game proves out here ..... our oline is ok.

I hope we don't lose Mack. He is not playing poorly. It's getting on my nerves to read how he has regressed so much. He is still a top-flight center.

I hope we keep him, Gipson, and Barnidge.

i like mack too, but it comes down to if he even wants to play here.

I know you're against Irving right now, but he was drafted to possibly replace mack, yes? we haven't seen him at the center position, yet.

for all we know, this could end up being the Barnidge/cameron situation.

Alec, who influences Ray-ray and is his de-facto boss, hates RB/FB which was noted before the season. He looks at this from a business standpoint. Even if Ray-ray wants to get someone on the cheap, it will still be flagged for JH to look at during the taddle-tail sessions.

Erving was drafted because of his play at center, not tackle.

The pick was always dumb.