DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Evaluating Danny Shelton’s rookie season goes beyond the numbers

Evaluating Danny Shelton’s rookie season goes beyond the numbers

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Browns DL coach pleased with his performance so far

Anthony Weaver doesn’t need the numbers to justify what he’s seen from Danny Shelton throughout his rookie season.

The Browns defensive line coach saw enough out of Shelton in OTAs and the early part of training camp to know he could count on him as an integral member of his group. Shelton’s been a starter since the first game and has seen the same amount of playing time week in and week out.

Through 10 games, Shelton has 20 tackles. It’s been a sore subject of sorts with Shelton, who has expressed his frustration with not making the same kind of splash plays he made as a senior at the University of Washington, but it’s not in the slightest for Weaver.

“It’s not even a problem, he just has very high expectations of himself,” Weaver said Wednesday. “He’s a guy that wants to go out there and make every single play, and that’s how you wish all those guys were. He has those expectations, and I’m definitely not going to lower them, but again, I’m pleased with where he’s at to this point.”

Weaver never played alongside Haloti Ngata in Baltimore -- he left for the Texans the same year Ngata was drafted -- but he understands the role Ngata played and how it compares to what Shelton is tasked with as a member of the Browns. Essentially, it’s “a grunt position,” Weaver said, that isn’t privy to tangible statistics.

As a rookie, Ngata finished with 31 tackles and a sack. Cincinnati’s Domata Peko, another player Weaver said played a similar role as Shelton has as a rookie, had 43 tackles and 2.5 sacks.

“Sometimes the numbers aren’t there,” Weaver said. “Those guys get a lot of recognition when you start winning … Those guys, particularly that nose guard position, they get credit when you win because they do a lot of the dirty work.”

Weaver stressed Shelton’s performance against the run has been “solid” even though the Browns sit at No. 32 of 32 teams in rush defense. On most plays, Shelton requires double-teams, and he’s typically in on the play if he’s not, Weaver said.

As much as the selection of Shelton with the No. 12 pick in this past year’s draft centered on improving the Browns’ run defense, it wasn’t the end-all, be-all. Weaver referenced Miami’s offseason acquisition of Pro Bowl defensive lineman Ndamukong Suh as a similar example. The Dolphins are just one spot ahead of the Browns in rush defense rankings.

“This game is so unique where you need all 11,” Weaver said. “It’s never one guy that’s going to be a quick fix. It’s going to take us all, coaches included.”

Before the season, the Browns and Shelton both dismissed the concern from some analysts that he would not be able to thrive in the NFL as a three-down player. Because of the team’s depth on the defensive line and emergence of fellow nose guard Jamie Meder, Shelton hasn’t had to be one as a rookie.

That could change as soon as Nov. 30, as the status of veteran Randy Starks (knee) is up in the air heading into Cleveland’s Monday night showdown with the Ravens. The absence of Starks would shake up the rotations and provide more opportunities for Shelton in pass-rushing situations, Weaver said.

“As high as your expectations are for Danny and the people outside their expectations are for Danny, they’re even higher for himself. He wants to be a perennial Pro Bowler,” Weaver said. “He wants to have sack numbers for a nose guard. He wants all those things and because he has that want to and that will and that desire to do big things and be great.

“The sky is the limit for him, and I look forward to watching his career progress.”

Articles like this feel like a poke in the eye. I mean, seriously? I'm sorry, if he's playing up to expectation then the scheme really is that bad. Run defense is THE WORST IN THE LEAGUE. We're 29th in pass D. QBs week in week out are filing their nails and doing cross words in the pocket.

Waiting for a similar assessment of Dwayne Bowe's play from Brown's coaches.

I was wondering if these propaganda articles would start to paint Pettine, the staff, and/or Farmer a little worse so that the "every fan" wouldn't be too upset when/if they get fired.

This off season we were told Justin Gilbert had turned it around and we would see the results on the field. Last year ir was as soon as Mingo learns the nuances of the OLB position he will be a force to be reckoned with as a pass rusher. Prior to that was the infamous, as soon as TRich learns the Brown's playbook he will justify the #3 pick. I'm sorry, but for me coaches of a 2-8 football team have no credibility whatsoever. Rather than giving their opinions to the media their time would be better spent working on their resumes.

Glad we got him..

Problem is we need more instinctive LB's. Don't know if it's scheme, or what, but to win games we gotta be able to stop the run.

Did the author take Kevin Jones' old job? Does he work for the Browns? It's kinda hard to believe that a real journalist would write such fos piece.

IF Anthony Weaver said it I believe it. The guy has always been a straight shooter. He gets on his lineman, and while I don't think you will ever see him bash one of his guys I have never seen him hand out praise unless he believes what he is saying about a player.

I'm hoping Danny has a big leap his second year. He's done some good things, but factoring where we drafted him, he needs to improve big time.

DING DING

I have been telling anyone that would listen for a year that the trouble with our run D has been the ILB's.

It was ignored.... I will say it again... until which time our ILB's are upgraded with speed and better instincts the interior run defense will suffer.

Gapping the NT to one side or the other allows him to be more easily sealed and generates a lane to cut off the Center / Guard's butt and our ILB are nor capable of filing that gap ( as they need to do. we crash out DE and OLB to support that problem and we leave the edge open.

Orchard has proven over the past couple of games he will hold the edge better than most we have had recently, but it still is weak.

Shelton needs to learn to play lower. He got away with playing higher in college because he was the strongest guy on the field. He is not that guy in the NFL.

If Starks can't go because of his knee next game, I'd like to see them play Shelton some at DE with Meder at Nose. They won't be able to double team both of them.

Er. Isn't Meder quite a bit quicker than Shelton and thus more suitable to play DE?

Meder is a big boy but he got ate up against the run last game, probably the only time all year we were giving up plays up the middle.

My take on Shelton is that he has been solid against the run in the middle but his hand technique is still a bit lacking and he allows the OL to get into his chest. With a lot of guys they would be pancaked but he is still so damn big they dont push him much but he still gets pushed. This is what made Ngata so good. He could use his hands to maneuver the center to gain the angle and then use his blunt force body to drive the center into the QBs lap.

I know some have been critical of the big guy but he is right on pace to where I expected him to be. Ithink we will see more from him next year. Its not an easy position to beast at as a rookie.

Weaver said he's "pleased" and that Shelton is having a "decent" season.

The only coach speak that is lower than that is "he battled".

Thw worst part is that he can't even flash as a rotational player.

And Mourg, what games have you watched? I've seen the Browns D get owned between the tackles since week one, especially late in games or in the 4th Qtr when teams needed them most.

This is why our defence can't stop the run.
Our linebackers, especially in the middle. They cannot successfully fight & fill the hole. They are too slow & are the single reason we get gashed for big gains.
Old & slow in the middle, results in being wore down by the second half, & we all know how that has gone this yr.
I also feel that our safeties are underperforming, Gipson really doesn't want to be here & Whitner has slowed down considerably.
Dansby reminds me of Willy McGinnest in his final yrs. here, still smart, but drained of the physical tools to be effective.
While I like Robertson, we need to remember that he was in serious risk of not making this team 2 yrs. ago & last yrs. play saved him, since then he's regressed with injury. Kirksey has his moments, but is best in coverage.
When we improve the MLB's we will instantly see the difference in the run D.

Maybe so, but I am more interested to see what Shelton does at the DE spot than anything else. Despite his size, he was more of a penetrator in college.

I'd also like to see a few more 4-3 looks with both of them in there at DT and the two Bryants with one gap responsibilities. I think that might be our best shot at pass rushing right now.

just speaking out loud, but i bet we aren't talking about how bad shelton is playing if we ran a 4-3.

i know some are gonna go "we run a hybrid" but the reality is that we have our OLB's dropping into coverage a ton.

If we are playing a 4-3 Shelton's skills are greatly diminished. He is a space eater. He was never a guy that was going to penetrate into the backfield like Donald or McCoy.

how so though? he's been getting double teamed fairly often. in a 4-3, he's be a beast.

IMO, of course.

I don't think he has the quickness needed to be a dominant tackle in a 4-3.

I think part of his problem is that he too fat. I hope he loses some weight this off-season.

You can still 2-gap in a 4-3 and can mix and match 2 gap and 1 gap responsibilities. We have shown a lot of 4-3 looks this season, just not with those 4 guys I mentioned as the personnel.

I like the thought of him and Meder in together.


I am in agreement though, that our ILBs are the problem. We need a beast. Robinson is a hustler, but not that strong. I think Dansby is just getting slow.

I think Shelton has the tools, and I think with another offseason of conditioning, he will get leaner and stronger.

I heard you, but I just couldn't convince myself to give you a reach around

well i dont want to run down a rookie but so far he is no upgrade on what we had. not saying he cannot get better but we got rid of what we had too quick. jmo.

Swish, I think Shelton's build and skill set is much better suited to a 3-4 than a 4-3.

he could very well be. to be honest i don't know much about line play.

15 said he should lose some weight. i agree, but the guy has a decent motor. i liked the pick, especially since people on the board during the off season said we needed a NT.

I liked the pick, too. Now.........not so much.

well, imo of course, what i see is terrible playmakers surrounding him.

other than Dez, we don't have much talent at the DE position.

the 3-4 needs boss OLB's. other than maybe Kruger, we don't have that, either.

So the question becomes...is shelton bad? or the front 7 in general?

Shed a little fat, add the weight back as muscle, and work on quickness and flexibility.

A solid offseason in an NFL training program should do him wonders.

My issue w/him is this:

He has the perfect build to get low and dominate w/leverage. Unfortunately, he seems to be the high man on almost every play I see him in. This lack of leverage allows the opponent to get under his pad level and turn him much too easily.

I am not writing him off. He can improve. He needs to, because right now, I am wondering why I liked him as much as I did coming out of the draft.

Dj actually called this ahead of time. I have to give him credit.

There are a lot of fat nose tackles, but yeah, he probably should lose some weight. There was one play last week where he was unable to even get in a stance. That's rather embarrassing.

Shed a little fat around the belly.... check

add the weight back as muscle...... check

Instead of quickness and flexibility, he needs to learn how to keep his pads down. He is a beast when he can do that, however he really has a problem doing it

IF we have a staff that knows what they are doing....

Was in the same boat. I compared him to more Terrence Cody than Haloti Ngata.

Flexibility will help him do that while helping prevent injuries, and the quickness work will help his explosiveness at the snap.

Add in a bunch of throwing around large weights with the upper body while anchoring the lower to help train for shedding blocks, too....lotta obliques & core work.

They have been Coaching him up on keeping the pads low from the get go. It's a habit that is going to take time to break, but I think he is trying really hard make it his instinct. He could get away with not keeping his pads down in College, but not in the pro's. He needs a GOOD off season conditioning program

when the 1st RD Draft grades come out at the end of the season I expect Shelton and Erving to be
graded low.
Both have had very little impact on the season.
I really haven't anything out of Shelton that warranted him a 1st RD pick.
he does nothing that makes you go wow!

Shelton has been disappointing, but I think he will pan out. The reason I say that is that he has the right body type, he is very smart (academic All-American) and has a motor. There's not all that much to the position besides technique, size/strength and desire. So I think he has the will and ability to improve his strength and technique.
I know NT is a tough position, but I remember once Esiason telling maybe Krumrie or someone like that, "Hey, I have to know what everyone on the field is doing. You are responsible for about four square feet of space on each play." Shelton will make himself a great DT.