DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Manziel continued

Lets see if Cam Newton gets benched or suspended for this..

https://vine.co/v/iawvuOKZmlA

Oh the humanity! He's good and has proven himself, that makes it OK according to many on here.

He may not. I'll bet if he gets on the field and lights it up they won't care. This league is filled with guys that probably don't get along - good play will erase that. We just don't know IMO if he is good. We need to see - this is a team issue and doing what is best. If they think this is what is best I hope they are shopping him now.


That bought us a lot. I'll take a liar, pompous, spoiled brat that lights it up over a nice guy that is below average. I want to win.


Yeah, every leadership position in the NFL - from owners down to players - are all filled with highly ethical people. Heck, our owner has some pretty big ethical questions against him for his business practices. He's still running his company.


I think you are right about him starting if he was honest. Again, don't care what he does in his off time, everyone else seems to. Do I worry he might screw up to the point of getting in trouble with the league? Maybe, but he hasn't yet - all he foes is go out and party. If it doesn't affect his football, I don't care.


All reports have him doing what he needs to do as far as football goes. That is all I care about.


And he shouldn't worry about it. He's turned this into a circus. How do you know he doesn't want it? I think he does, he just doesn't want rules exclusively imposed on him. Again, it was idiotic to lie, but it wasn't worthy of being benched.

wow. held on to his bottle and didnt throw it at the guy? no police involved? no pic of him talking to police with a 5 pack in front of him 2 weeks after rehab?



too bad johnny can not show that kind of control.... he might be starting if he could...{{{SIGH}}}

i think pettin was pressured into jff. then johnny partied and pet was like whew that was close.

I totally agree with that - it seems to be no secret he doesn't really care for him. Just speculation of course.

Was Newton's previous year a disaster because he didn't work hard? NO

Was Newton late for a team meeting and treatment for an injury last year? NO

Was Newton in rehab earlier this year? NO

Did Newton fail to follow simple rules set forth by the team? NO

Did Newton lie to his Head Coach? Bet he doesn't.

I can't believe people don't understand what happened here.

maybe... maybe not... bottom line is johnny LIAR blew it.

Last year, who cares.

Last year, who cares.


No, Johnny was trying to improve himself -maybe he did? We don't know.


Maybe their coach doesn't impose silly rules. Maybe they have a real coach that worries about the product on the field instead of what players do in their off time.


We don't know. Maybe he did and they handled it internally and didn't turn it into a circus.

Sure we do, after day drinking and getting in a domestic dispute with his girlfriend.... Going out on the weekend and drinking at the club? Sounds like rehab did a lot of good for him.

So based on how and where this is appearing in this thread you must believe there is some connection or comparison to JM and this 2 second clip of Cam.

Please connect the dots because it seems to be to be completely pointless.

For what it's worth I'll put my 2 cents in. He got demoted, punished, whatever you want to call it because he lied about doing something he said he wouldn't do. If he came clean and admitted it he probably would have been better off. I've been lied to in my life and I didn't like it, in fact it really ticked me off. If you put yourself in the FO shoes you can understand why they did what they did. Being I love the Browns I want Manziel to be the best qb we've ever had. We may still see him before the year is over.

Only if we cut him, the trade deadline is passed.

mac, here is an excerpt proving my claim:




Thus, if your "claim" is correct, Pet, Farmer, and Haslam are all liars and need to be demoted.

Or perhaps these experienced men should not be held to the same standards as a 22 year old????

Again, more hypocrisy.

Seem to remember people complaining the Browns should follow the Steelers FO model, do you think they would have demoted JM like the Browns did ? Ben abused women twice in one season and Vick killed dogs and spent what 1 year in prison. But Johnny lied...

He will probably start again this year.. I forget what coach said it, but it was said.

So, what will happen,,,, Will he be told he's starting and what will he do to sabatage his career next.

The kid is an IDIOT.

That's what I thought, Which means if we cut him we get nothing... Okay Thanks Tulsa

Flip and Pet both hinted.. If you didn't get a chance to listen to the presser from flip, I would recommend listening to it. He's a pretty positive guy.

let me ask you something. i could be wrong but... your whole reasons of defending johnny is because

a: people are picking on him

b: other people have screwed up so he should be allowed to get away with it.

am i missing something?

And that's your big defense of Johnny? Others have gotten away with things?

What you are missing it's not defending Johnny it's the reasoning, if you say build a team the way the Steeler did then you can't be in favor of benching your starting QB over a lie about partying.

Heck even their Head Coach got caught cheating on the side lines on video and LIED that he didn't do it!

well where was your outrage over the firings of banner and chud? the sqeelers wouldn't have done that?

They wouldn't have hired them in the first place but...

Were they fired for telling a LIE?

Deflate gate you think anyone lied there?

Yes.

Mac - just out of curiosity why does it matter who signed off on this? Does it affect how the players perform? Does it mean Pettine is a better or worse coach than his record and the performance on the field? Does it mean Farmer was more right or more wrong to draft JM? .... to me the answer is no.

In my opinion, this is a huge decision and one not taken lightly. As the HC - I would expect Pet to consult with OC, and his QBC - make the decision and then take it to Farmer/Haslam before the announcement. Decisions of that size don't get made in a vacuum - HC makes the call, runs it by GM and Owner. Why all the fuss?

And in case any of the JM did nothing wrong brigade are wondering about the difference between Johnny lying to his coaches and team (betrayal of trust) compared to a FO lying or misleading the media and not revealing the inner workings of the organization .... well I guess if you think both are the same or that organizations should and are totally transparent at all times - I don't need to say more because if that is what you truly believe then you don't know anything about football. It's not hypocrisy, it's how businesses operate in any arena, sports or business.

He should have stayed on Cleveland and doubled-down on preparation over the bye.

Yeah, probably so, I know I would have if I were in his position. That said, it was his off week and there is nothing wrong with what he did during that time.

I was mad when they benched Johnny, but if they told him to lay low and when he did not, he lied to the coach's face, well, not much choice. I still think we have to let him roll for the last 4-5 games and see if he can be the answer. If he plays well, he ma grow out of this DJ booth-partying-champagne bottles-lying idiocy. I know people will say, "Nope, he's an addict, you don't grow out of that." To that, I say lots of 22-year-olds grow up when life forces them to, and it isn't always a clinical thing. He gets it a helluva lot more than he did last year, but he is not all the way there, obviously. He could learn a lot from this latest episode. But we really have to find out.

So basically - from everything I have read from you:

1. If you were HC of the Browns you don't care about how much effort and dedication players show as long as you perceive they might have potential.
2. If you were the HC it matters not if players lie to you.
3. Team need and perceived "crisis" means that you are more flexible with insubordination that you would be if the team was doing well.
4. I can only presume on thisnext point because none of us know the reality - but IF you sat down with a player and spelt out what they needed to do to be named starter and keep the starter role - and then that player did the opposite - you'd cave and let him keep his starting role.

Have I covered the bases? Any other situation where you wouldn't care about your troubled young player tormented by demons of some sort who spent 10 weeks in rehab to try and sort out the priorities in his life and what his life choices are??

Nice twisting of Columbus's words.

How else can I interpret what he says?

He doesn't think Lying to the HC is a problem and JM should start.

He said in his last post that while he himself would have stayed home and studied/prepped - the fact that JM was out partying doesn't matter to him, and JM should still start. Therefore work ethic and attitude can't be that important.... how else does that translate?

It might be worded differently - but the essence is correct. How else is it possible to translate?

All of that really amazing work "ethic" and attitude has led us to 2-8 this season. Pettine is doing an amazing job.

I'm sure Gordon will get in trouble for this tweet too:

Flash Gordon ‏@JOSH_GORDONXII Nov 27
Waiting to spectate this @ESPNMondayNight tho.. #starttheguy

JeremyinAkron™‏@JeremyinAkron
Got a DM that Johnny was out drinking at Townhall. Just got a second DM from someone working there that he's doing shots right now...

Hayden Grove ‏@H_Grove 12h 12 hours ago Cleveland, OH
Source at TownHall: Browns QB Johnny Manziel was here earlier this evening. Was wearing thick glasses for low profile.Was picked up. #Browns



Why on earth would he go out to a club/bar last night? If this is true, perhaps he's trying to get released

If they play well, do what they are asked to do on the field and at practice, then yes, I don't care. Will they be successful doing this? Probably not - but this team stinks and it is silly to waste a game of evaluation when he did nothing wrong. I've stated about 100 times I hate that he lied, but it shouldn't have been turned into this circus. I want to win, end of story. What they are doing does NOT help accomplish that in any way, shape or form. I want to see him play so we can move on with all of our bases covered, I don't think he is going to succeed.


Let's have Mike go ask all of the players if they smoke pot. Bet every one of them says no, which we all know is not the case. Sure, he himself didn't specifically tell them not to, but it is against league rules and players will lie to protect their jobs. People are making this out like he lied about killing someone or beating his girlfriend - sure he shouldn't have lied, it was dumb (something immature 22 year old have been known to do), but I don't feel he should have ever been put in this position by the coaching staff.


I'm not sure what you mean here. Lots of things happen differently if things are going well. I'd answer this if I understood what you meant.


I would never, ever put dumb high school level rules on players so I wouldn't have to worry about that occurring. I'd give the players specific FOOTBALL ORIENTED things they needed to do to start. If they can achieve those, I don't care what happens on their personal time so long as it is legal. If they didn't achieve them, they are on the bench. It is not my job to be their dad. It is my job to coach, which Mike should really consider trying to do a bit better.


As long as he can play football, I don't care about any of that. That is correct. I want to win, I'm tired of losing and having pea-brained coaches leading this team. It isn't my job as a professional coach to worry about poor little Johnny's life choices. He needs to shape up on his own, what Mike does is not going to affect a thing.

I almost think that Browns fans like to lose so they can complain. I put a lot of money into this franchise every single year through season tickets, travelling to Cleveland, tailgating, time off work, going to away games (usually 2 per year), and countless team wear purchases. I almost cancelled my season tickets when I heard this news, but calmed down and thought better of it. Being a fan of this team is some sort of mental illness/addiction - I think we could all use a stint in rehab.

My guess? He doesn't care anymore an is likely trying to get released. I'd want out of this hell hole too. Cowboys will pick him up in a heartbeat where just about everyone in Texas will love him.

I believe it would send a perfect message to the entire team that accountability and honesty mean nothing to this team.

I didn't think purple was necessary.

Yes, let's base team decisions on the thoughts of a 20 something pothead who is currently unemployed.

I'm not sure what Josh Gordon has to do with anything. He's a loser who isn't even in the NFL. I don't want him back and find anything he says/thinks/does completely irrelevant to life. Other than maybe to see what he thinks and do the exact opposite.

He and Johnny can go get crunk and sell cars together for all I care.