DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... 4 Things That Were Supposed To Happen By 2016 Because Obama Was Reelected

Yes. And we do. Problem is, too many want the "top" to be handed to them.


Sure it does. The problem isn't the 'country', it's the people that want success handed to them.

And before I go further, keep in mind that not everyone can be at the top.

Take Clem. You think he got where he is without work?

Ballpeen: You think he got to be a retied judge without work?

Columbusdawg - you think he got where he is without work?

DC - his job wasn't handed to him.

Heck, me: You think being self employed is all that? It's great, right up until it isn't. It takes work.



All of these examples, and many more, come about because of the opportunity we're all given. The OPPORTUNITY. Results vary based on many things, but WORK is the key.

I'd love it if my degree gave me the opportunity............no, I won't even go there.

Our system gives opportunity, AND incentive. Problem is, one needs to use the opportunity. And that takes effort - not hand outs. The incentive is there. Problem is, too many don't seize it, realize it...however you want to phrase it.

Right, but many of us are set for success with a strong support system. Just as easy I could get born into a place in this country that wouldn't have given me the tools that I needed to get where I am today.

Not many get the luxuries than many of us are born with. I'm talking more than material goods here, too. Many don't get the benefit of the intangibles all of us take for granted.

Not everyone can be born with a silver spoon in their mouth. Some people will have more obstacles to overcome than others...obstacles which they may or may not be responsible for. In this country, in many cases the less you have the more opportunities are available. If you're at the poverty level, you can get a free ride to college or a trade school. There are jobs out there, but they require effort and commitment.

i think you severely overestimate how many people want things "handed to them"

most people simply want the same opportunity to succeed.

you seem like you never understood the difference.

Really? Why do all these college yups think the top 4% should pay for THEIR college education?

Perhaps, but then everyone on your side of the aisle in elected office campaigns on putting a chicken in every pot.

The absolute underlying problem for those at the bottom begins at home. The most respected poster on this board Clem, ALWAYS cites his family, and especially his 'pops' as a major influence in his life.

How many people in poverty have a 'pops' in the home these days? Or actively involved in their lives other than the rare child support check and the mind games with their mothers?

Ever since 'the great society' when the government replaced the man in the home as the provider his incentive for providing for, taking responsibility for and even staying with his family is greatly diminished. And even if the man does stay, it's more beneficial financially to remain unmarried to his children's mother so they can sponge off of the government. First minimum wage factory job I worked a guy was telling us all how he and his wife declared themselves legally separated so she could get an extra $20 a month (maybe in the fall of '85 $20 bucks wasn't bad) from Uncle Sam, but he still lived with her.
What a legacy to pass on. How to get by on minimal effort.

Fair enough.

I disagree though.

All?

Stop exaggerating. The biggest complaint is that our college tuition keeps rising and rising.

I'm a college student, I don't think they need to pay my education

But thanks for playing.

That's fine.

Who pays for your college?

It's funny how people complain about liberals voting for stuff like this, yet the main states that take a ton of federal aid are ran by republicans.

I don't get that.

The best socialist countries? Yes it does, everybody gets a a fair shot...well, most people. Definitely a lot more than us.

To say I had the same chance to succeed as somebody raised in the burbs is simply ignorance.my dad was home he we struggled like crazy.

You guys take these factors as if they are the end all be all to the solution to the problem.
Both my parents did 20 years in the military, yet we struggled like crazy afterwards.

Tired of this "pops not home" rhetoric.

I don't see how giving all my money to the government benefits me.

And yet you think I had it easy? Or my son? Son still has college debt, and he's digging deeper in to debt. To get an even better job than he has.

And then you say something about states run by republicans taking federal aid? Let me let you in on something: Anyone and everyone that thinks they can get federal aid do so.

Take a look at democratic cities or states. They ALL seem to be bankrupt. Wonder why that is.....

Be as tired as you want, character and values are passed on from dad at home. Yeah you probably struggled cause your parents had you in private school. I will probably clear over $70k this year and I'm struggling to keep my kids in a VERY good school district but I could have it much easier if we were to move.

I'm sure those socialist countries citizens have more chances, there are some countries that have populations that wouldn't fill half of one of our states.

I didn't say you had the same opportunities as someone in t he burbs…but was I talking about you? Even the poorest people in this country have better chances than most of the planet.

Didn't say anything was the end all be all, but I would say that what I've laid out here are the beginning of the problem.

Rocket I used to believe that way when I was in my 20's...but then when my wife and I made our way..I felt guilty...and tried to make it up somehow.

Then my father told me something before he died that has always stuck with me...He said..I fed a bird some birdseed when it was in the middle of winter...thought I was helping the poor little bird...then more birds showed up...so I put more birdseed out...more birds showed up...so I went to the store and bought bags of seed...even more birds showed up.

Now I have a giant seed bill...the birds are crapping all over my house,cars,and yard...and I cant keep up with all of the new birds showing up.

I'm sure this was some regurgitated thing he had been told...but I have always thought about that. I'm all for a helping hand but I am very choosy now on who gets the help.

Bernie Sanders man if he is the answer or his way of thinking is the answer...then please God kill me now...I want off this rock. There is so much information available to almost anyone on how to succeed...the info is available at a simple click...but an attitude to go get it done well that is another story.

In the interest of debate, if you feel that you have too much, or more than you've earned... what is stopping you (or anyone else who feels the same way) from divesting themselves of the excess?

Let's look at Bernie Sanders: what sort of lifestyle is he living? I don't know that he's in the 1% but I'd bet he's living a lifestyle a helluva lot more cushy than most of us, certainly a level on par with the people he says should pay more. So is he? If his bracket isn't paying enough in taxes, is he paying more than what his EZ-40 says he should pay?

If you feel guilt, or such a refined sense of altruism for the life situation you find yourself in, that's completely on you. I won't tell you should feel otherwise. In fact it is admirable the level of which you care about others.

But you can't morally or ethically justify forcing others to believe and behave as you. And that's what increasing gov't control is: force. You can't morally or ethically support candidates such as Sanders or Clinton (or ANY other candidate of any party) who don't even come close to living the lifestyle they preach that we should.

I share this not to brag, but in a way for others to understand where I come from. Some of you know some of this, and others may end up reading it for the first time.

I won't go into specifics, but my life is geared to give away the excess. Do I own some things which would be considered luxurious to some? Sure, but as much as I "own" I give back even more.

I'm talking more than just a monetary way of giving back. Much of my time gets invested into listening to the path young individuals wish to pursue for their life, let them discover the tools necessary for them to reach their goals, and eventually watch them blossom into young adults through their own self discovery and hard work.

Yet, my life exists on a different career plane than most who do similar work. I'm out in the literal frozen tundra, around a population that's less than 0.1% the size of the city of Cleveland, Ohio, and deal with a cost of living that's easily double what I would have in the "comforts" of an every day "normal" life.

What I do means the absolute world to me. I get to participate in a once in a lifetime experiences, and sometimes I do take that for granted. I appreciate my life path more and more each time I visit large society; my village shows me what's important in life.

By no means do I have it "figured out", but I strive to live the life my ideals point me towards. Do I wish to rule with an iron first and make everyone conform to me? No. Does it frustrate me when others fail to see the plight of the less fortunate, and argue "...well, if they only tried harder", then my answer would end with a resounding "Yes!"

I hope for empathy, compassion, and understanding to continue to insert itself into our political process. This last SCOTUS session renewed a sense of hope in me for the future of our country.

Thank you for that. One of the things my job has taught me is that everyone has a story to tell. And if my tone in my previous post sounded combative, it wasn't meant to be.

But my point still stands in that while I do believe your intent is well intentioned, the people that you are entrusting that vision to see to fruition (the likes of a Sanders) are only committed to that vision so long as THEY don't have to be the ones giving up or sacrificing.

Tip of the cap to you for not just talking but living what you preach...that I can respect..even if I dont agree with alot of what you say..I hope you havent taken anything personal with what Ive said to you...I actually enjoy debating with you..

I take nothing personal. Most of those with opposite political ideology of me usually agree with me when it comes to football related discussions.

We all grew up in different eras, and that idea keeps me grounded. I wish no ill will on any of you. Except for Tulsa...his state bored me to death on a drive I took this past summer

jc

Powerball Meme Mathematical Illiteracy Illustrates Bernie Sanders' Appeal

math is hard

The Bird Feeder Syndrome analogy has been around for years and under scrutiny for years.